david pecker is not foreign to me. what he's talking about is not foreign to me, but i think for the larger public, to hear what really goes on, particularly with that kind of tabloid newspaper i think is fascinating. also, let's not forget, we are talking about a former president who is in court over hush-money payments, who has been found liable for fraud and for sexual assault, who could it be in washington for the immunity hearing from when he was president. this guy is going to -- has been spending more time in court than on the campaign trail to run for reelection. i think what makes this week and this case so fascinating is that we are watching this guy be held accountable for at least a sliver of what he has allegedly done. amna: in the new york case, he is now violated the gag order a total of 15 times. jonathan: and counting. amna: is there any way for president trump to be reigned in on that front? david: i think his entire administration tried to do that for four years and it didn't work. jonathan: no. amna