united states. really, if you wanted to know what was going on, mika, in the chris wallace interview and the impact that it was having on donald trump and the impact it's had on donald trump's presidency since march, all you had to do was read on and see, you know, joe biden's quote, the past six months have proven again and again it's donald trump that doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to covid-19, when it comes to the coronavirus you can't believe a word he said, it'll be easy to say that's what he's going to say because he's running against donald trump for the presidency. fortunately for republicans in the senate and donald trump, the overwhelming number of americans believe what joe biden is saying, and don't believe what donald trump is saying in the same newspaper, a growing number of americans disapprove of the handling of the pandemic, they found that only 38%, only 38%,

approve of donald trump's handling of the worst health care crisis in over a century 60% disapprove that is up 7 points. and all you had to do was look at the president, confused, rattled, angry -- >> very rattled. >> -- ignorant of a pandemic that has been with us since march. but republicans are now saying -- republican governors are now saying, republican senators are now saying he's lost interest in it, he's ignorant when it comes to the basic facts of it and they've given up talking to the president of the united states and many of them now call mike pence, hoping that maybe he can do something for them because donald trump is checked out when it comes to a pandemic that's killed almost 140,000 americans.

mika, i know we're going to talk about this too but what is really angering republican senators right now who are in trouble is the fact that trump is trying to continue to cut funding for testing and contact tracing. >> think about that. >> at a time when our economy needs that the most, our small business owners need that the most, at a time our airlines need that the most, at a time restaurants need that the most at a time when schoolteachers need that the most he insists, as he has since march, that this country continues to fly blind and the american people have overwhelmingly turned against him in fox news polls in "the washington post" polls, in nbc news polls, in every poll out there. >> because the american people are paying the price and it's also waiting to politics for three seconds why

joe biden keeps saying it doesn't have to be this way. because it didn't. it was the worst weekend yet for new cases of the coronavirus in the united states. according to msnbc news data, the u.s. added more than 206,000 new cases over the past three days, including a record 75,000 cases on friday. indiana, kentucky, louisiana, south carolina, all broke their single day records for new infections yesterday and in that interview with fox news' chris wallace, president trump repeated his long-standing frustration with higher levels of testing across the country. >> sir, testing is up 37%. >> that's good. >> i understand. cases are up 194%. it isn't just the testing has gone up, it's that the virus has spread, the positivity rate has increased. many of it is worse than it was.

>> many of those cases are young people that would heal in a day, they have the sniffles and we put it down as a test. many of them, don't forget, i guess it's 99.7% are going to get better and get better quickly. if you go back to the news, even your wonderful competitors, you see cases are up cases are up, many shouldn't even be cases. cases are up because we have the best testing in the world and the most testing no country has done what we've done in terms of testing we are the envy of the world they call and say the most incredible job anybody has done is our job on testing because we're going to shortly be up to 50 million tests you look at other countries they don't do tests they do tests if somebody walks into the hospital, they're sick, really sick, they'll test them then or in a doctor's office but

they don't have massive areas of testing and we do, i'm glad we do, but it skews the numbers. >> i'm going to do you a favor because i'm sure a lot of people listening right now say trump is trying to play it down. >> i'm not this is serious. >> 75,000 cases a day -- >> show me the death chart. >> i don't have it -- >> the death chart is 1,000 cases a day. >> it's all too much it shouldn't be one case it came from china, they should have never let it escape, let it out, but it is what it is. look at the numbers in europe -- >> the cases are 6,000 in the whole european union. >> they don't test like we test. >> is it possible they don't have the virus as badly as we do >> it's possible they don't test we find cases that heal automatically. in a way we're creating trouble. certainly we're creating trouble for the fake news to come along

and say we have more cases we did something no one has ever done, not only the ventilators where we're psupplying them all over the world we're doing a testing program. >> i don't know where to begin, so many lies in there, ignorant statements he's talking about a pandemic that's going to kill -- close to killing 140,000 americans. it's now killed twice as many people who died in vietnam when he said in january only one person had it from china and soon they were going to be gone, then in february he said it was 15 people who had it 15 in the whole united states. and soon it would be gone. in march said it was going to go away magically by april because it was going to be warm. he continues to lie to the american people, continues this magical thinking and all the while more people died at the beginning, it was more people

died of the pandemic that he said was magically going to go away than 9/11, then it was more people died than in the afghanistan war, then more people died in the iraq war, then more people died than in world war i, this is continuing and he is still playing dumb i think he's playing dumb. but i don't know where to begin, jonathan he says the united states is the envy of the world. we're a basket case. we're a laughingstock. we can't even go to europe we can't go to canada. we can't go to the bahamas the bahamians government this weekend said americans stay away because you're such a basket case who would ever believe that the country that has been home to half of the nobel prize winners

for science since the 1950s would so badly fumble the worst pandemic in a century that even the bahamas is saying, listen, sorry, america, we don't want your money that bad. and, of course, he's wrong about testing. we're not the envy of the world on testing we're terrible on testing. mortality rates? jonathan, how does he continue to get mortality rates wrong how does he say we're the best in the world when johns hopkins continuously shows we're one of the worst in the world, we're the tenth worst in the world for countries with populations over 100,000 people that's a lot of countries. if that's too confusing for people who want to be confused, for people who are purposely confused about things as simple

as masks, then jonathan let's strip it down to this. we are a country that has 4.5% of the world's population. and yet, when it comes to deaths, deaths, people in the ground, people cremated, people gone forever, not people that have sniffles and are going to get up and go, people who are dead, americans who are dead, we account for 25% at least of all coronavirus deaths in the world. donald trump, under donald trump a country that has 4.5% of the world's population is responsible for over 25% of the world's deaths that doesn't have anything to do with testing that doesn't have anything to do with charts. i know this guy is proud that he can identify an elephant on a test -- >> for dementia? >> yeah that's for alzheimer's

patients we'll get to that. does he think his supporters are so stupid he can keep insulting them every day or is he really this confused? >> joe, welcome back the president long ago crossed the line from trying to paint an optimistic picture of what's going on to what is now willful ignorance. credit to chris wallace who did an awesome job on this interview which was taped friday in a sweaty rose garden let's say what it is, the president is wrong on the facts repeatedly he's misrepresenting and lying on statistics. mortality rate, he had aides try to get paperwork to prove he was right, he was not. the mortality rate is higher in the united states than he lets on and a lot of people still suffer greatly. it's not just the sniffles

are there some people who are asymptomatic or have middle cases, sure. there are others who get it and survive and after weeks or monthsstill don't feel like themselves testing is another one, the united states is not the envy of the world in testing testing has improved but it's nowhere near enough. we're seeing backlogs that have grown in recent weeks, testing centers in places like washington, new york, los angeles, a month or two ago would take two or three days for a result, now seeing two weeks which defeats the purpose because the virus could have run its stretch. that story captured in "the washington post" how governors around the country, republicans, trump allies have grown frustrated with him, feel the president has given up on

managing, fighting the virus only focused to try to push the economy open, schools open even though there's no guarantee there's funding to do that safely in fact, he's threatening to withhold funding from schools to open up the way he wants to. dr. fauci, there's perhaps been a truce in the west wing's war on dr. fauci in the last week or so, he's still sidelined the republicans want a return of the coronavirus task force briefings to talk to the public. they just don't want the president being involved we're seeing the president reshuffle the chairs on the deck of his re-election campaign. we're seeing him flail for a consistent message on why he deserves another four years when the virus is surging in states led by trump allies. >> and in states he has to win, arizona, texas, florida, these

are states where it is exploding. and kasie hunt, there are republican senators in colorado, montana, maine, kentucky, who are at risk right now, who are talking about another relief bill from the same washington post story the trump administration has up ended talks over the relief bill by trying to block billions of dollars for states to conduct testing and contact tracing, angering republican senators kasie, we have been saying this since march, people who don't have to brag about passing an alzheimer's test have been saying this since march. if you want the economy to grow, test, trace, isolate, treat, get people back to work that can go back to work he continues to say, let's

reopen the economy but at the same time saying, let's stop testing. let's fly blind. let's send people into small businesses and into restaurants who are sick that will make them shutdown again talk about the frustration that is growing on capitol hill with republican senators who as "the washington post" are reporting, are giving up on this president because he continues to do things that not only -- >> kills people. >> -- undercuts the economy, under cuts the re-election campaign, but could kill small businesses and kill people >> joe, republicans that i talked to over the weekend simply can't believe this is where they are again this is something that's happened over and over again on other issues throughout. they want to get something done, the president has something he's seen on tv, he seizes on it, tries to kill it testing is now that thing. he we know watches hours of tell

sbri -- television and the number of coronavirus cases are going up he seems to think it's because the tests are out there. he's focused on the coverage not the policy that will fix this. republicans are saying we need more money for testing yes, our election seats are at risk but we're losing our constituents, it's spiraling out of control this is the only way to fix it but they are looking at the white house and saying, what are you doing? are you going to upend this chance or rather i should say are you going to up end this necessity that we try and do something about this they wanted to be here on the other side of this they were willing to try to be optimistic about the economy's ability to reopen and actually get better over this time. their re-election hopes depend on it, the long-term health of their communities depend on it there was perhaps not even going to be this bill at all

but things are so bad now that all of these republican senators are looking around saying we obviously have to spend -- we expect the mcconnell plan to be north of a trillion dollars, the number of times i've covered trillion dollar bills that easily pass a republican congress you know how likely that is but it speaks to the dire nature of the situation and the way the president is managing this is stunning to the republicans who made the bet we'll go along with him, stay in the room, have a bigger impact if we do that, don't criticize him, that is really coming back to bite them right now. >> let's show more of this president trump continued to attack joe biden's mental acuity during his interview on fox news yesterday challenging the former vice president to take the same cognitive exam, it's for -- it's an exam for people with

alzheimer's take a look. >> in the fox poll they ask people who's more competent, whose mind is sounder? biden beats you in that. >> tell you what, let's take a test let's take a test right now. let's go down, joe and i will take a test. >> i took the test, too, when i heard that you passed it -- >> how did you do? >> it's not the hardest test the last picture, and it's an elephant. >> see, that's all misrepresentation. >> that's what it was on the web. >> it's all misrepresentation. yes, the first few questions are easy but i bet you couldn't answer the last five questions, they're hard. >> one was count backward by 7 from 100 >> you couldn't answer many of the questions. >> what's the question >> i'll get you the test i guarantee you joe biden could not answer those questions i answered all 35 questions correctly. >> oh my god

>> i actually -- i had to look -- >> this is staggering. >> i had to look at the test again because this isn't the first time the president has bragged about passing an alzheimer's test this is for people with dementia and alzheimer's, they give them this test and we have the man running the most challenging job in government, not only in this country but probably anywhere across the world, bragging about being able to identify a lion, a camel, and he says the last questions are tough -- >> really? >> -- really tough the subject has to repeat them in the four word order these numbers, 2, 1, 8, 5, 4 now here are three numbers you have to repeat backwards 7, 4, 2. 2, 4, 7.

here's a really -- >> those are hard. >> here's a tough one, too draw a clock for ten past 11 ten past 11. you see, this was actually -- and this is us i think it was. this was the mom -- >> the show. >> -- had alzheimer's because she couldn't draw a clock. >> he's saying the last questions are hard, our president. >> here's the last six questions that he said are so hard come on. again, trump supporters, look at this test. he thinks you're so stupid that you can't google this test you can. you've got a google machine. go on your google machine. this is your president who has the nuclear codes who thinks

because he passes this test and passes the last -- he says the last questions are tough are you ready for this what is the date today what month are we in what year is it? what day is it what place are we sitting in right now? where are you sitting, mr. president? what city are you in right now the president of the united states believes that joe biden, because more people believe that actually joe biden's mental acuity is donald trump's in the latest poll. donald trump continues to brag about taking this test reverend al, i just don't -- i don't know where to begin with this but this isn't the first time he's bragged about being able to

identify a camel or what a lion is and telling chris wallace you can't pass this test you can't draw a clock you can't tell us what city you're in. that's what the president of the united states actually brags about to try to make us feel better about the man who has nuclear codes, to make us feel better that he's somehow with it and this is why voters are wrong for thinking, actually, joe biden is sharper and has more mental acuity than the sitting president of the united states, because he could draw a clock and he could tell chris wallace what city he was in. >> it reminded me, at that point in the interview, that chris wallace had left the rose garden where he was interviewing the president and was visiting an old man in a nursing home trying to convince him that he was still cognitive in terms of his

cog n-- cognitive skills. it went from laughable to pitiful. >> it was pitiful. >> to sit there and try to convince chris wallace that he was somehow up to where he should be because he could identify things that were very simple, you start then being -- you start being pitied and to think this man is running this country and is in charge of the military and in charge of real decisions becomes frightening. when you think about the fact that he wants to reduce this to taking a test that he thinks is hard the real test is going to be in november who can run the country. and as one who spent time in my life meeting with both donald trump and joe biden that's not a contest. i think what donald trump is forgetting is his niece told us he had someone take the s.a.t.

test, there will be no one to take the test for you in november, mr. president. >> we're talking about the test this morning because the president keeps bringing it up he keeps bragging about passing a test for alzheimer's patients. looking at the politics of this, you have the party of lincoln, which i know donald trump didn't know it was the party of lincoln, he keeps acting shocked it was the party of lincoln, saying can you believe, nobody knew this was the party of lincoln before that's like saying nobody knew henry ford started ford motor company. but if you're a republican senator, and you're watching the republican party go up in flames, and you're watching this president slashing funding for testing and contact tracing and you see that governors have

given up calling donald trump and are now talking to mike pence begging him for help, including greg abbott in texas, is not now the time to save yourself because donald trump cannot be saved. is not now the time to declare your independence and fight with democrats to do what you can to slow down the spread of the coronavirus and get small businesses running again >> joe, you would think so i'll be honest, i agree with rev that some was sad, some was humorous when we get to the point the president's main campaign slogan is i'm smarter than a fifth grader, i can identify animals on a piece of paper we should be concerned. when you look at some of the governors they doubled down, brian kemp, lieutenant governor of north carolina they're suing cities and municipalities to fight over things like masks i think what concerns me as the

death toll increases we're at the point where 1% of the u.s. population has coronavirus, we're at a point we're trying to force baseball players and basketball players and football players to put their life on the line to entertain us that you still have republicans who want to back this president want to back him despite the science, the destruction of small businesses, the long-term health consequences that generation x and millennials and gen z's are going to be facing, i'm concerned the alarm bell have not gone off louder and unfortunately only because polls aren't votes there are republicans that think no matter how bad the polls look now, a campaign of voter suppression, attacking black and brown people and joe biden will be enough for donald trump to win this fall. >> we haven't talked about the fact that donald trump said

twice, brushed away chris wallace's question twice on whether he would accept the results of the election -- >> yes. >> -- that is what dictators say -- >> that's probably the news. >> it's beyond what a lot of dictators say, they just steal the elections. donald trump now saying he's not going to accept the results of the election that he can't tell us whether he will or not. we'll get to that next, mika >> that was the big news. >> it was a disturbing interview. but you look at the spread of the coronavirus and donald trump's kidding himself if he thinks only a hard core group of people want their children to return to school this fall i want my kids to return to school this fall, because of underlying conditions they may not be able to there are a lot of parents with underlying conditions who may not be able to send their kids

back to school if the coronavirus, if the spread of it is not slowed. not only is he not doing anything still, he's been getting it wrong since january he's been getting it wrong for over half a year and 137,000 people are dead because of it in america >> yeah, and he -- >> but he's still doing it and putting at risk, again, the reopening of schools across florida and across the country the small business owners panicking that they're having to shutdown again in certain parts of the country larger businesses. this is a health care nightmare and this is a business nightmare and a large part because donald trump hasn't been able to have a disciplined, focused approach to this disease and instead, lies about numbers,

lies about testing, lies about mortality rates and trashes dr. fauci. >> it didn't have to be this way. this was easy to not botch and it was botched and had it not been botched we'd be more comfortable sending our kids to school absolutely 100% had things been done right and had it been mitigated like other countries we'll get to that part of the interview. still ahead on "morning joe," a lot. house speaker nancy pelosi will be our guest as the white house tries to block new funding for testing and tracing literally that's what they're doing. plus, who are these unidentified federal forces grabbing protesters off the streets of portland and hauling them off in unmarked cars. we'll talk about what's happening in that city but first to bill karins for a check on the forecast. this is my only opinion

yated map. this is what we call the misery index, when you talk about the humidity and how gross the air feel we get to the miserable category when we get to the orange it's miserable from philadelphia, new york, down to d.c., this is as humid as it gets from the middle of the country to the east coast. that's why we have the heat advisories and warnings up because at night we haven't cooled off that much and then the sun comes up and the temperatures skyrockets. philadelphia is under a heat warning, the norfolk/virginia beach area is under a heat warning. we have a chance to hit 100 degrees in washington d.c. for the first time in four years and it will feel like 109 in the shade in washington d.c. look at atlantic city, that's gross, 110 new york up to about 103

areas to the southeast continue to feel warm, too. the week ahead, chance of storms in the middle of the country, by wednesday, we cool off in the northeast. and if you want the reward, that's on friday in new england and the northeast. the humidity comes down and the temperatures also but in the southeast you know it's summer you have until september to get your cool down washington d.c. today we hit 100 degrees today for the first time in four years, there's a good chance you're watching "morning joe," we'll be right back. ♪

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biden wants to defund the police -- >> sir, he does not. >> look, he signed a charter with bernie sanders -- >> it says nothing about defunding the police. >> it says abolish

let's go get me the charter, please. >> all right so that led to an interesting exchange where he had a staff go out and get the highlights from that 100-page compact that the biden team and the trump team -- rather the biden team and the sanders team had signed and he went through it and found a lot of thing that is he objected to that biden agreed to but couldn't find any indication, because there isn't any, that joe biden sought to fund and abolish the police. >> painful. >> what's interesting is twice during the interview with chris wallace he stopped the interview and asked for help and was proven wrong we were actually when it comes to mortality rates we are the tenth worse on the planet. and then, in this case, he talked about defunding the police, language that's not in

there. language that joe biden and every other major democratic national leader in positions of authority have all condemned and yet he stops the interview twice to get help and he's wrong both times again, what message does that send not only to voters but to senators who understand their political careers are coming to a quick end if they keep following this guy over the cliff. >> how confident can you be with a president who in an interview is like can i phone a friend here's again, the problem. i think you have a lot of republican senators out there, they don't have anything else to run on except for donald trump's personality. they can't run on the economy, on management, on security, on our national reputation, so they have to run on the cult of personality. if i'm martha mcsally, corey

gardner. they are trapped with this sort of -- this terrible anvil which is the trump administration and they're going to go down with it what i think again is going to be really, really key is what ends up happening to these governors, because the governors have more time are they going to be brave enough to not just campaign to "the washington post" and the "new york times" but to publically break with this president and say i am going to have to engage in this coronavirus management in a way that's different than the president. look at brian kemp in georgia, you have the cdc there, why listen to trump when you have the experts in your own back yard the senators have no choice but the governors have to show independence the voters will respect you if you save their lives and not your political career. >> we've seen it with governor mike dewine in ohio, high approval ratings it would be one thing if these

senators could look back and say, you know, he's -- he seemed like he's been governing in a crazy way in the past but it ended up well for republicans but that's not the case. from the earliest moments of his presidency we've been seeing election results almost unanimously, talking about suburbs in philly going democratic for the first time in 100 years. virginia, a political earthquake with democrats just completely stunning republicans not only in constitutional offices statewide but also in the legislature with the house of delegates, 2018 a remarkable landslide the biggest landslide by vote total in american history for democrats while republicans in support of donald trump lost

time and time again. of course, if you're in certain pockets you can be protected, whether you're on the far right or left, but in states like colorado, montana, maine, north carolina, even kentucky, we're seeing -- and i guess mitch mcconnell that's why mitch mcconnell has crossed donald trump on one issue after another when it comes to another, supporting dr. fauci, supporting masks, separating himself as much as he can from donald trump when it comes to the coronavirus. you wonder why other republican senators aren't starting to do this because this doesn't end well for people who follow donald trump over the cliff >> don't they want to save lives? it's the bottom line it's science by the way, in that interview, trump defended people who still fly the confederate flag and indicated he might veto the

stimulus bill if it has a provision to rename fort hood -- >> you said it's a matter of issue of freedom of speech but in the case of the confederate flag there are a lot of folks who say these were traitors who split this country, fought this country in large part to conservative slavery is the confederate flag offensive? >> it depends on who you're talking about, when you're talking about. people love their flag, it represents the south people like the south. i say it's freedom of many things but it's freedom of speech. >> you're not offends by it? >> i'm not offended by black lives matter either it's free speech we can't forget the north and the south fought we have to remember that,

otherwise we'll end up fighting again. fort brag is a big deal. we won two world wars. no one knows general brag. we won two world wars were go to that community where fort brag is, go to the community and say how do you like the idea of renaming fort brag, what are we going to name it name it after the reverend al sharpton what are you going to name it, chris? tell me what you're going to name it. we we won two beautiful world wars that were vicious and horrible and won them out of fort brag all of these forts that now they want to throw the names away and i'm against that most other people are -- >> wait, we won two world wars because fort brag was named after a confederate general who was a lousy military general

reverend al you continue to live rent free in donald trump's head, he brings you up again he underlines a larger point he doesn't understand in 240 years there have been quite a few black military heroes he could name the base after. let's start with the first chairman of the joint chiefs, colin powell, he fought honorably in vietnam and for this country for years you could maybe chappy james the first four star general in the united tuskegee airman or you can the first -- the first casualty of the revolutionary war -- >> black man. >> shot down by british troops

at the boston massacre he's had a monument up since 1888 this is not revolutionary thinking, but for donald trump, he has no idea it would never occur to him to name that base after a black war hero >> and you're correct, from chris padox to powell. we're looking at the real racial thinkings and feelings of this president. because to suddenly say that the north and the south fought, they fought over slavery they fought over enslaving people just on their race. this is not a fight that happened as a cultural side show, this was about human bondage and he acts like we're to celebrate that and say it is

part of the nation's story it is and it's a sad, despicable part of the nation's story and to say it's free speech, it's free racist speech to hold up a flag of people saying we want to see people based on their race to be treated as property and to equate that with people fighting against criminal justice problems, police brutality, it shows again it is another way there are fine people on both sides there's nobody in our movement that's waving a flag of supremacy that if they did we'd denounce it, that the confederate flag is a flag of supremacy. so he continues to have this kind of bigoted view of race in america. let me add this point of fact. we did not name these military bases until the 1900s. and many of them in the 1940s.

brag did not fight in the world wars brag was a confederate general fighting to overthrow the united states government and the union. he's not saluting people that fought the world wars. percy sutton fought the world wars he's saluting people that fought the confederate war, general robert e. lee was the head of the confederate army that wanted to overthrow the union and take out abe lincoln and a federal sympathizer did end up killing the president of the united states, abe lincoln. so let's not confuse who these bases are named after. >> and when you talk about the confederate flag i've talked about over the past few months that over the past 25, 30 years a lot of people in the south their views of the confederate flag have changed. we were wrong from the start but a lot of views have changed.

but what is so staggering is that even in the south, even in the south the majority of white southerners believe that the confederate flag is a symbol of racism more so than southern pride. this goes to what i've been so confused about over the past four, five, six months why the president continues to choose the 80/20 issues. where 80% of americans are on one side and 20% of americans are on the other side. and he continues to choose the 20% side maybe 20% of americans still look at the confederate flag and say, hey, this is a sign of southern pride. >> seems self-destructive. >> it is so self-destructive, it makes no sense, attacking nascar, attacking a black nascar

driving, accusing him of a hoax, talking about wanting the confederate flag wanting to fly over nascar races and then, of course, these statements, again i just don't understand it. >> at the town halls over the weekend, president trump announced plans to eliminate the affirming fair housing program arguing again democrats like joe biden want to destroy the suburbs. >> he wants to abolish the suburbs if you think he wants to hurt the suburbs by putting low income, far left bureaucrats and the bureaucrats are going to put people into the suburbs. they're going to bring people, eliminate single family zoning they want to eliminate single family zoning, bringing who knows into your suburbs. so your communities will be unsafe and your housing values

will go down so the affh is a dy sas e, it's been a disaster, it's ruining the suburbs, destroying the suburbs. it's bringing down values of houses and it's bringing up crime. and i will be telling you for maybe about the first time, that i'm eliminating the afhh people are surprised to hear that, but we're eliminating. when people work hard to live in a community, we shouldn't destroy that community. >> jonathan lemire, this is staggering that those words it's mind blowing this is george wallace, it's 1968, he's using the same code words as george wallace in 1968 about putting certain people in the suburbs, destroying the

suburbs. this is all talking about black people moving from the inner cities to the suburbs. it is so transparent, this is a man along with his father had to settle a case for housing discrimination in the early 1970s. and he'sreverting back to that in public. he is saying outloud what obviously he has been thinking inside of his mind for 50 years, and it is staggering because, again, he's with 20% of americans while he scares the hell out of those very people in the suburbs who see this as clearly racist the president is leaning heavily on issues of race, much like he has done with the calls of law and order, the protests we've

seen in the nation since the death of george floyd. there was a small percent of people who got violent and looted and he suggested they were mobs. here again playing upon white fears about black families living in the suburbs, and this confederate flag issue is one most republicans don't want him to touch certainly there's no outcry of support from republicans on the hill saying to him to make this an issue, certainly not to defend the confederate flag. it's been the opposite advisers have told him let this go this isn't going to help us with the suburbs that are so vital this november. jason, i want to get you in on this the president has said on this and others he has promised executive actions in the next week or two on the suburbs that's where he feels there's something he's going to do give me your reaction here, as joe said, we're going beyond

code words it's clear what thepresident i trying to transmit to his voters but also seems one that would be a political loss is there a scenario that could go over with white voters or is this the president doubling down on his shrinking base? >> this is doubling down on a losing strategy. trump has been losing the suburbs since he got to office, he lost the suburbs in 2018. he should want to do anything that makes the suburbs a happier place. here's the thing about the program being missed this is not about bringing outsiders to the suburbs this is about bringing working class people from the cities into the suburbs for better schools so he's attacking the very constituents that e had claims that he cares about one way or another. this is a symbolic fail, a policy fail and a racism fail. i have to say this because when

the president talks about these sorts of things in his move beyond code language and talks about the confederate flag what he's missing, there's been a sea change among white people in america when it comes to race. we've seen white america is beginning to realize in general that racism hurts white people too. you can't have a president who feels okay with family separation and attacks muslims and hispanics, he'll take that same rage and bigotry eventually to white people and that's why he's losing. and ultimately that's his biggest loss this fall because he's losing larger percentage of the white vote to joe biden. >> kasie, the thing is, you look at the polls again, none of this is working none of the racism is -- the racism is hurting him more in the suburbs. his so called plea for law and

order is not working if you look at race relations, biden up 58 to 33% that's an important issue post george floyd look at crime and safety from the president who talked about unleashing vicious dogs on protesters and going after them harshly and looking at what he did on june the 1st. but he had his forces and barrs' forces go in and beat up peaceful protesters so he could holds up a bible in front of a church even on crime and safety, lying about joe bidenday in and day out and chris wallace caught him in a lie, he's losing 51 to 40%. not to be a simpleton but let me go back to the fact how can republicans look at these numbers and not understand that the president's racism and that the president's fear mongering is backfiring on him, backfiring

on them and backfiring on the republican party >> joe, if you pick up a copy of the "new york times" today, the headline about this breach between the president and the frubl party is right there on the front page because it's gotten so bad that they can no longer escape or ignore it if we're going to talk about the suburbs for a second, let's not forget that the suburbs have gotten more diverse in recent years. let's not think of it, you're ignoring a t llot of americans you don't consider that reality. but also this seems to me to be a play for the group that if we were able to put up the numbers of what women, particularly suburban women, think about this president on all of those scores, i guarantee you the gap would be enormous. and that is, you know, what this coded language has historically been -- the racist language, i

should say, has been designed to do is strike fear into the hearts of people over these issues these suburban women are exactly the people who, a, have been oe offended by the administration across the board, starting in 2018, especially with the children in cages one of the true break through moments for a lot of the voters i was speaking to in 2018 and there are people who watched what happened to george floyd and went out into the streets and protested along with many others this has been such a dramatic change you mentioned philadelphia i grew up in the philadelphia suburbs and i'm close with a lot of elected officials there used to be a republican area, 2018 a number of those members of congress lost to your point, school boards that have been republican for decades and decades are switching hands because of donald trump so i don't know what he's

talking about in terms of these suburbs but they are not with him and it doesn't strike me this message is something that makes a big difference. >> there's just potentially one explanation, joe, and that's that he doesn't care and doesn't plan to leave, which is something we've talked about in a lot of conversations, that election better be insured up, mail-in balloting better work, it better be clear because there are many that believe he won't stop at nothing and he won't leaf. coming up we'll remember the late congressman john lewis. find your keys. find your get-up-and-go. find pants that aren't sweats. find your friends. find your sense of wander. find the world is new, again. at chevy we'd like to take you there.

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in general, not talking about november, are you a good loser? >> i'm not a good loser. i don't like to lose i don't lose too often.

>> but are you gracious? >> you don't know until you see. it depends i think mail-in voting is going to rig the election. i really do. >> are you suggesting that you might not accept the results of the election >> i have to see look, hillary clinton asked me the same thing. >> no, i asked you the same thing in the debate. >> there is a tradition in the country, is that peaceful transition of power and no matter how hard fought a campaign is, that at the end of the campaign, that the loser concedes to the winner, not saying that you're necessarily going to be the loser or the winner but the loser concedes to the winner and the country comes together in part for the good of the country, are you saying you're not prepared to commit to that principle >> i'm telling you i'll keep you in suspense. >> she never accepted it. >> i agree can you give a direct answer you will accept the election >> i have to see i'm not going to say yes

i didn't last time either. >> welcome back to "morning joe," reverend al sharpton is with us. and joining the conversation we have msnbc contributor mike barnicle, editor of the new yorker, dave remnick msnbc contributor jonathan k kapart and author of the john lewis biography. joe, right there i thought was one of the big pieces of news that came out of the interview of course, it was interesting and disturbing to hear his answers, interesting to see he was so rattled and he was so scared there was a look on his

face i think we have never seen before, i haven't. and he was rattled by the questioning. and he couldn't answer the questions alone. but that answer, that's the answer that i think is the issue moving forward and how do we keep our election process secure and safe and we don't allow a corrupt president to undermine it. >> and how do we make sure that the 240-year history of peaceful transition of power continues in this country because right now we have a sitting president who appears to be, if you look at the polls, appears to be most likely on his way to a defeat, if those polls hold out. saying he may not accept the results and, in fact, has been building up to not accepting the results for months now with his ridiculous statements about

mail-in voting something that he does, his parn press secretary does, his family does the preparations are under way and you look at the general election matchups, joe biden ahead 55 to 40%. he's getting crushed in the knew washington post/abc news poll. he's getting crushed in a series of swing states. you have a president, make no mistake of this, you have a president who for three and a half years has been pushing the boundaries of constitutional norms, who's been seeing what he can get away with, who's been claiming to have ultimate power because of a bizarre reading of article ii of the constitution of the united states he sent his people out on sunday shows to say that the president's authority cannot be

questioned and this is how he's behaved and you look at what he did on june the 1st, where he cleared protesters and tried to get the military to stand by his side, that politically blew up in the face of political leaders. but he tried, again, he and barr tried to push the boundaries to be shoulder-to-shoulder with united states military in a situation that did grave violence to the separation between military and civilian control of the military. and you look at what's happening in portland and you wonder is this all a dress rehearsal here is an ad that was put out recently, this past weekend, by the lincoln project. take a look. >> this is how it starts a president out of control as polls forecast his downfall

this is how it starts. in a small city far from the beltaway, shadowy men, no badges, ids, dep tieszed by a so called attorney general snatch people off the streets without a warning or warrant, paramilitary units shove them in unmarked vans and drive away and when the protesters put their hands in the air, they're assaulted with clubs and fists this is how it starts. faceless enforcers say you don't have the right to protest. now trump's bureaucratics are promising to send their thugs everywhere your town, your neighborhood this is how it starts and how freedom dies unless we stand up, unless we speak out. unless we demand justice register and vote november 3rd,

because if we don't, we know how it ends. >> this is how it starts the president of the united states saying he's not going to accept the results of an election and then doing a dress rehearsal on june 1st that went terribly now continuing that dress rehearsal and portland and by the way, just for the record, that ad was not put together by a bunch of left wing members of the aclu. that ad was put together by people like rick wilson who have been called every name in the book by liberals that work in places like the aclu, is a hard-core right wing republican extremist. those are republicans that put that ad together and rightfully are asking what

every small government conservative in america should be asking what's going on in portland, what's going on with the president who's talking about abusing executive power in a way we haven't seen this week. talking about expanding his power just by a signature. and again, not accepting the peaceful transition of power david remnick, again i underline the fact that the advertisement was put together by people who have been called right wing republicans their entire life to prove a point. whether you're a liberal, conservative, moderate, marxist, whatever you are, you should be concerned by portland where uniefu unidentified police officers in unidentified cars are grabbing

people off the street and driving them off this is not how america works. >> you look at the ad and you might want to giggle at it a little bit but i remind you, look at the tape of the debate with hillary clinton three and a half years ago, and maybe some people thought it was show business, he was saying i may or may not accept the results of the election, you'll have to wait and see, that this was part of his kind of "apprentice" like show business. these were authoritarian instincts that some of us were talking about years ago and were laughed at and now what would surprise you about donald trump is there anything he could do at this point, joe, that would surprise you what is it we don't know at this point about him? very little. when he now talks to chris wallace, i may or may not accept

the election, we should take him seriously, take him at his word in the perverse sense he gives it he is capable, it would seem after this experience, of almost anything while the lincoln project ad may seem a little bit over the top to some people, that could never possibly happen, really? look at the evidence is he really incapable of not accepting the ballot in november if it's closer than 15 points in particular, and it's very likely to tighten up as elections do. what is it he's not capable of that's a question we should all be asking ourselves. >> let me answer that question right now. he's capable of doing anything >> and he will do anything. >> yes, yes, he has proven over the past three and a half years that he's capable of doing anything and most importantly, mika, he will do whatever he can get away

with that's why i think people in government, people out of government, the brightest minds in this country have a new task. and this is a time when the candidates, both major candidates start talking about transition teams and talking about who's going to be running operations inside the white house. i think the best and brightest minds in government and out of government now have to start using their imagination. now have to start thinking outside the box. now have to start preparing for something that we haven't had to prepare for. and that is, how does our government -- how does our military, how does the secret service, how does -- how quickly do the courts respond to a sitting president who is defeated at the ballot box and refuses to leave

because this is something you and i have debated for some time and i said the president would leave. you have said he would not >> no way. >> if you take the president at his own words from yesterday, doesn't know not so sure. if you look at what happened on june 1st in lafayette park and look at what's happening in portland right now, this is a president who is pushing the boundaries of his power in ways that few presidents have ever before. >> we've been watching him for years now muddy the waters of truth. you see him in the interview trying to muddy the waters of truth when it comes to coronavirus deaths when it comes to anything asked, he works on creating his own narrative and brands it and tweets it to tens of millions of people and uses his platform to stir up not just hatred and racial animus but his story of

being victimized by everybody else this is frightening behavior, john meacham i'll go to you, we talk about how strong our democracy is, but isn't the question right now how fragile it is -- >> absolutely. >> -- and how much this president has been able to do that is corrupt, breaking norms, that has created the deaths of tens of thousands of people because he's botched the response to the coronavirus and not taken the advice of his own cdc and his own top scientists the list could go on for three hours, the show would be off the air and i would still be talking. he has been practicing to push through stop signs every step of the way. at some point our democracy, i don't think it's overstated, is at stake do you disagree? >> it's the most fragile of things it's a human institution

it requires the disposition of heart and mind for all of us or a sufficient number of us to invest the rule of law with actual efficacy. this is not -- the american nation state is not some clinical thing it's all of us the nature of a republic as it is the sum of our parts. and so, i don't think it's overheated at all. and i would argue, historically, that when you say this is how it starts, leaving the unclear, which remnick would never let in the magazine, it's not only a start, but it has happened to connect to the things unfolding over the weekend, what do you think john lewis and his comrades were fighting in my native region and joe's. they were fighting a

totalitarian state with state sanctioned violence. the state of mississippi designed a thompson tank, a special armored vehicle with mounted machine guns so they could take out more demonstrators if they had to john lewis lies now in a coffin scarred by a totalitarian system that existed the day before yesterday historically speaking. so, of course, this could happen because it's happened before and this is not some elective morning left wing outrage, right. this is -- it's a rational way of assessing the facts and the facts are, we have a president who bullies, who is about power and not principle in any way. and i think one of the great

questions is and i don't know the answer i'm embarrassed to say, what's the enforcement mechanism of the electoral college, right what's the chain of command? the continuity of government that will actually enforce this? america has worked from adams andjefferson in 1801 with a certain common consent that we would follow the rules where is that common consent now? >> how remarkable you talk about jefferson. in your extraordinary biography of thomas jefferson, the book begins with jefferson wondering in 1800 whether this country, this young country would survive the constitutional challenge that it faced. and here we are, you know, 200 years later, 220 years later, concerned about what's coming

this fall. why? because the president continues to say he's not going to accept the results of the election, or he won't commit to accepting the results of the election. and reverend al, john meacham brought up a man who was the conscious of the congress, a man that you and i were both fortunate enough to call our friend, to call our colleague, john lewis just speaking of three hours, there aren't enough words to say in three hours, to talk about how this man, how we stand as a country on the shoulders of this giant. this man, who dedicated his entire life to the rights of all americans being able to vote, a

man who, as nicole hannah jones wrote, said -- talked about black people have been the perfe perfecters of this democracy in our age, no man fits this bill no more than your friend and my friend john lewis >> one must always remember the reason he became the conscience of the congress is that when john lewis walked into the house of representatives, on his body bore the physical markings of the movement he had been beaten as a freedom writer in 1960 physically beaten. he didn't study the freedom ride he was a freedom rider he was beaten on the edmund pettus bridge in selma, alabama.

and he went and translated into legislation becoming a member of congress he was 11 years younger than martin luther king so he was part of -- he and jesse jackson, they were the younger part of the king movement. and i was 15 years younger than them we became the guys who learned king from john lewis and jackson and them, we were too young to know king. we learned king from them. i was born in the north they were in the south. they had to reprimand us about language and you must remain nonviolent, which we were. but even in your language you can't be too roughneck which we tried to do in the north we learned it from john lewis. because he was so much of a self-sacrificing person we took it from him because how do you argue with someone who was beaten for your right to vote. who bled for your right to be treated as a human being who was black lives matter

before the slogan. and i think that is why he meant so much to this country, black and white, and probably, joe, i've shared this with you, probably one of the highlights, if not the highlight, was to walk across that bridge that he was wabeaten on, halfway across that bridge i looked at john lewis and said, here's the man that made this man the first black president possible i don't think i could ever have a moment like that again he paid the price for all of us, yet he was the most humble man you would ever meet. most people in public life have egg have ego and all of the arrogance he never showed any display of

arrogance. this last march right before the pandemic we had the annual march across the edmund pettus bridge, the commemoration of bloody sunday he was suffering from pancreatic cannecer. as we got halfway across the bridge to our surprise, john lewis got out and he got up on a ladder and spoke to us i will remember the last time he was on the bridge alone, i was holding him up, helping others hold him up as he spoke alive the last time on the bridge. and it became important for me as i thought about it that past weekend, we held him up that last time because he's been holdihol holding us up for 80 years >> john lewis talked about moving forward, not giving in to

hopelessness and keeping the dream alive. he lived that, and you actually got to be with him in washington d.c. for that remarkable black lives matter march there and a remarkable moment when john lewis came out with the mayor of washington d.c. and he got to see an emergency awakened. >> thank you for showing those pictures of him standing on the b of black lives matter that stretches for two long blocks headed towards the white house but a real poignant moment happened about ten minutes before that when congressman lewis arrived and we went to the top of a building on the northeast corner of 15th street and k street from above watching this angel, watching this lion of the congress, this leader of america stare out and look down

over black lives matter plaza to be able to see all of it from above on a cloudless day was just before 7:00 a.m., washington monument you could see in the distance the white house you could see in the distance and watching this to reverend al's point, this humble man who bore the brunt of a country that didn't want to see his dignity and his patriotism and who fought for it, who literally bled for it, who was beaten over the decades just to make this country live up to its ideals and here he was in what we know now was the final stages of his life in a mask wearing a 1619 baseball cap and looking down on a plaza on pop art on the street that represented a whole lot of things

represented the present day anger and frustration of the american people over what happened to a fellow citizen at the hands of police. but also for him, it just showed the cyclical nature of history how when he was beaten at the foot of the edmund pettus bridge he was fighting for voting rights and now, there he is 80 years ol old looking out over a plaza that represents the anger of americans to allow those to live and congressman lewis didn't view this as some sort of repudiation of his work that all that marching and the beatings were for not he saw that as a hopeful continuation of the work he started. and the last interview i did with him, i asked him what advice would you give today's

protesters because they are going to grow frustrated and grow disappointed by some of the setbacks coming. he said, you have to give until you can give no more if there's one thing we know about congresswoman lewis and h -- congressman lewis and his legacy and the life he lived, he gave until he could give no more he was giving until he left us late friday night. >> he certainly did. john meacham, the closer -- you know this is a historian, the closer you get to many subjects you cover the closer historians get to subjects they cover, often you find a great man is not a good man upclose often you find a great woman is not such a great woman up close. john lewis called me his travel buddy because we always flew together from d.c. to atlanta a

couple times a week going back and forth to congress. i can echo what everybody has been saying. he was such a humble man, such a good man in a way that i must say so many historical figures, at least from what i've read and sometimes from what i seen upclose are not. tell us about the john lewis that you're writing about now. >> he is a -- he's an american saint. and i use that term absolutely adviseedly saints are not perfect saints are not saviors saints are sinners who lead exemplary lives of heroic vir which you and they're willing to die, suffer because of a devotion of an idea that emile rates the world around them. that is john lewis so from the latin, the christian

church has worked in this tradition for a very long time the idea is not original to me but i wanted to do this, because i am in no danger of becoming the kind of christian or the kind of american that john lewis was. he is exemplary, he's inspiration inspirational, he's illuminating but that doesn't mean he's perfect. i think one of the things we have to keep in mind here is, he -- not only is he humble, but he understood that what we have to do is put those things that we preach into practice. and he would not have been on that bridge, he would not have been on those buses. he would not walk into that bus station in rock hill, south carolina and be beaten by a

clansman who after barack obama won called john lewis and asked for his forgiveness. he was there because he believed of the gospel of jesus christ and the hope of the resurrect n resurrection he just was. that was the gospel he heard in troy, they used to go to church every couple weeks, they didn't go every week because it was too complicated because it was so -- life was so hard so every couple of weeks they would go he preached his first sermon as a teenager the first time his name was in the newspaper was in the montgomery advertiser, called the boy preacher from troy when he met martin luther king, king's first words were i want to meet the boy from troy because he recognized that this

was a fellow preacher. and i emphasize this because it's so easy to be cynical and dismissive of the kind of vernacular i just spoke in about religion, about faith because we live in a moment where so many people have suspended their critical judgment and their genuine and their allegedly genuine faith to follow a particular president if you want to see what religion in politics can do, if you want to see what a good person should do, encounter john lewis, not because he's perfect he could be prideful, he could be stubborn. he hated the fact that he lost the chairmanship of snck but you don't have to be a

saint, you don't have to be perfect, you just have to be better than the rest of us and that's what he was. >> mike barnicle, talking about the legacy of john lewis, i want to point to your piece, trump's failures are erasing the memory of america's greatness then i think of the sadness of the difference between someone like john lewis and president trump who brings things down to the lowest common denominator, who makes things worse and in his tweet, remembering john lewis, which came too little too late, there was a grammatical error or a misspelling, i wonder if he meant to do it, it's how bad things have gotten. >> it's quite a contrast there, those two men. john lewis is what america aspires to be.

donald trump is what america is slowly becoming. john lewis marched forward every day of his life toward equality for everyone, regardless of color, faith, elief, ideology, anything john lewis marched forward donald trump doesn't like john lewis' america donald trump is uncomfortable in john lewis' america. donald trump fights everything that john lewis stood for. he is intent, and has been for 42 months, in deconstructing america, stripping people of civil liberties, making sure that white americans especially know he's there to fight radicals in the streets of america, in portland, oregon, your town, that's what it's come to john lewis believed in moving forward with faith in this

country. donald trump has faith only in himself. david remnick, i think it struck me, you have an issue this week of "the new yorker" dedicated to john lewis' life and everything he aspired to be and did in his life but it really struck me today, 51 years after neil armstrong, an american, went to the moon because of donald trump, we can no longer go to the bahamas or europe or places like that that's what this one man has done. >> i would say the game is not over i would insist that the game is not over and that john lewis' message with us was to decent influences politics and optimism never be lost. john lewis lived in a time when black men and women had been given the right to vote.

there was an emancipation proclamation yet jim crow came along and destroyed that to such a degree he found himself battling for voting rights, passed through the congress and today we're worried about voter suppression, the vote stripped from men and women in places from michigan to mississippi so history does not go in a straight line. the edmund pettus bridge which we're talking about all the time is still named for a grand dra dragon of the alabama ku klux klan he was realistic about history if he could inherit that sense of fierce optimism with a realism about what happens in history that the first black president can be followed by a racist but with the full

knowledge that there is elections ahead of us, that's something deeply american and it follows in the order of what john lewis did, which is never, ever, ever give into despair i believe john meacham is a bit more of an expert on this than i am, but i think in the bible it tells us that despair is the unforgivable sin and that's something that john lewis never gave into till his last breathing day. >> that's right. david remnick and john meacham thank you both later we'll be speaking with speaker nancy pelosi about the legacy of her house colleague. and also karine jean-pierre has a great piece at "know your value dot com" from what we can all learn about john lewis' extraordinary life our next guest served his country overseas and here at home and he's now on a new mission. that's to protect the upcoming

election from threats both foreign and domestic former senator and defense secretary chuck hagel joining us now. he alongside 30 top leaders is urging congress for more federal funding to protect the u.s. voting system from national security threats and challenges amid the coronavirus pandemic. welcome back to the show it's great to see you. it's also -- >> thank you. >> -- great to see this initiative under way how concerned are you about the sanctity of our elections, mail-in balloting and what domestic threats are you concerned about? >> mika, joe, thank you for having me on on behalf of my former colleagues and friends who signed that letter, i would say to answer your question and following your interesting conversation you had the last few minutes, what this letter

that is going to the congress today represents is an effort to further preserve and strengthen the integrity, strength and credibility of our democracy, that's our elections everything starts at the ballot box. and we must ensure that there is trust and confidence in the american people about our system, about our elections, about a fair, secure, and safe election process and so we're asking the congress to, again, allocate funds, $4 billion is what the election experts believe to be distributed to all 50 states to help them ensure that credibility by giving them resources to provide for more staff, supplies, technology, to face the pandemic, covid-19, and foreign interference in our elections. they need that money because

they don't have the resources at the state level. so i don't know if there's anything more important than the essence of our democracy, and that's our election. so in a nutshell that's what that letter is about. >> mr. secretary there are a lot of warning signs, donald trump saying twice he's not so sure he's going to accept election results. you can talk about, of course, all of the efforts for voter suppression that we've seen time and time again in resent elections. but even look at the new york elections held three or four weeks ago and local races, i mean, some local races still have not been called up there. there's still congressional races up there, three, four weeks later. and you're just dealing with fraction of voters there that we're going to see that state and other states deal with just in the next three, four months

>> joe, that's right and that's a concern a big concern. and that's why these election officials in all of these local election districts across the country need the resources, the attention, programs like yours putting focus on the importance of the elections and the importance of securing these elections is really critical i might add this letter that i am a co-signer of, was signed by republicans and democrats, former cabinet members in both republican and democratic administrations, senior officials, like i said there's nothing more important than this effort everything your previous guests and you have talked about why it's so important to preserve this at this time. and i emphasize the bipartisanship without getting into blaming anybody for anything or commenting on

anyone's past conduct because we want to keep it bipartisan because that's the way the process should be, bipartisan. >> jonathan kay pajrnkaypart hax question. >> i want to thank you for taking my question your view and your thoughts on the use of unnamed, unbadged police that we saw here in washington in early june and that we're now seeing right now in portland, oregon, your view on that, and how concerned does that make you for the elections in november? >> jonathan, thank you i don't want to get too far-off track from our issue here that leads me down an alley of my own views on other things, but all related to our bigger topic

today. i am concerned about that for many reasons but that's not the appropriate role of our national security forces, and i would just leave it at that without going any deeper or wider into that subject. >> mike barnicle >> so mr. secretary, it's july 20th, the elections are nearly upon us, given the pace of the united states senate, where you served for a couple of terms, given the pace and the strong hand of mitch mcconnell push things he favors as opposed to what the majority might favor, isn't time running out on this project? >> it is these election officials in all the localities across the country need the resources now they have to order more postage, more supplies, protect the workers at polls this is all a different kind of election, because of the pandemic and because of foreign

interference in our election so they need resources right now. you're right, michael, we're behind the eight-ball right now. i understand that the congress should be dealing with the stimulus package here in another couple of weeks. the house has already, i think, put $3.5 trillion in its total stimulus package i think there's about 4 billion in there for this. the senate has to still work on it but it has to be done right now we can't wait because it takes time a lot of states are involved in technological issues to support their infrastructure as we continue to look at options here, we know from primaries and the problems we've had in primaries, as you have noted, that more mail-in, more absentee ballots are required. i might add, absentee ballots have been around since after the

vi civil war. the first time i voted i did it serving in vietnam two states deal only with mail in ballots, utah and oregon. this is not new. governors all over the country support mail-in ballots strongly because their states have been using it and it works. this all plays into the urgency of getting this done. >> former secretary of defense, chuck hagel, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning. still ahead on "morning joe," president trump defends his handling of the coronavirus pandemic saying he will eventually be right about the claims that the virus will just disappear. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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question, the cdc says if everybody wore a mask for four

to six weeks, we could get this under control. do you regret not wearing a mask in public from the start and would you consider -- will you consider a national mandate that people need to wear masks >> no, i want people to have a certain freedom and i don't believe in that, no. i don't agree with the statement that if everybody wears a mask everything disappears. dr. fauci said don't wear a mask, our surgeon general said don't wear a mask. masks cause problems, too. i'm a believer in masks. but i leave it up to the governors. some of them like the concepts of masks, some don't agree. >> while it's bizarre we turned mask wearing into something political. imagine if you're alien coming

to the united states, going place to place looking at the science, seeing who's wearing a mask you'd be amazed, how could it be something as basic as a public health action that we have very strong evidence the help seems to attach to people's political policy >> dr. francis collins on "meet the press" yesterday and before that the president on fox news with us now dr. dave campbell. let's put that aside we all know wearing a mask makes everybody safer. the president wants to cut into that question every single day i don't know why he wants to be destructive not only to his re-election campaign but the safety of the american people. any good news as it pertains to the coronavirus, dr. dave? >> mika, there is plenty of good news but it's put in spperspectv

with the realistic problems we're facing now with the surging numbers of cases of florida, the icus are filling up if not full in many jurisdictions and localities down here, especially miami. it's important to also look at the bright, hopeful optimistic side of this we've had six months to learn. we know that vaccines are not right around the corn er, mika they're coming sooner with more certainty than we had fought before so with the clinical trials moving along quite nicely with countries across the world working hard to developing vaccines, many different companies, many different countries, that's optimistic it is encouraging that we have learned as a country, finally, despite what we just heard president trump say, that face masks are valuable, the admiral just last week said that face

masks are one of the three thing that is can keep our economy open if 90% of people will wear face masks outdoor we know that to be valuable th therapeutics, drugs they're better than a few months ago. t months ago we have remdesivir being used, intravenous decksamethadone, and many more recovering from the disease, their antibodies are being used and improvements in testing. some not quite here yet but right around the corner with rapid, inexpensive saliva testing which could be used almost every day to give people the idea and knowledge about their testing status the day they're moving the house that's very encouraging. we have doctors really learning much more in the last six

months, especially the last couple months, about how to better manage the sickest of the patients in the icu with prone positioning, with the use of ventilators. so, there's a lot of good news despite the horrendously bad news that many cities are facing across the country right now, mika >> yeah, so let's go into, for example, florida, which is still breaking records every day, or at least surging every day in terms of numbers can you talk about what's feeding into those numbers and is it being spread primarily between young people how are young people faring? >> young people are clearly able to be infected they're clearly contagious and they are clearly spreading the disease to others. and to think otherwise never made sense and now it's being shown over and over again that children are

carriers of this disease and they're children, so they may not seem as sick, they don't get as sick, and they certainly don't die in the numbers we see in older people, but they get infected and they pass the virus to others. and it's the others that are more frail, more elderly, more at-risk with underlying diseases that are then going to wind up in the hospital, that are then going to wind up in the icus and some of them, unfortunately, will die, mika ing we're learning a lot more as we go. with school openings right around the corner, it's never more important than now to realize that kids can carry the virus and they can pass it to people in the home, they can pass it to teachers, they can pass it to principals, and the next thing you know, we delay this eventual resolution of the pandemic, which we all know it will come some day, but we don't want it to be far off into the

future, mika >> i'm hoping school administrators are listening to you. this is pretty basic science and they're struggling with their decision-making on their part, some of the schools. dr. dave campbell, thank you very much for be, on the show this morning let's bring in now msnbc's joy reid tonight she officially takes over the 7:00 p.m. time slot her new show "the reid out"debays with hillary clinton. congratulations. big kickoff tonight. two big interviews i'm sure you've been looking at the aftermath of president trump's pretty tough interview with chris wallace where he looked pretty rattled. what will you be looking at moving forward >> first of all, mika, thank you very much. thanks for having me appreciate you always. so, yeah, tonight is going to be a pretty big deal. we've got hillary clinton,

obviously, who was the nominee in 2016, so she knows what it means to face donald trump in an election, and joe biden who has that task now, and if he becomes president, will have the monumental task of trying to walk this country back from what i think a lot of people would agree has been a disaster, including on coronavirus just listening to your last guest, mika, if you think about it, by election day we could have 200,000 americans dead, and we still have not made progress enough for a vaccine that schools could be open safely in the fall so, i think the questions i'll have, particularly for joe biden, is how would you fix this what would you do? i mean, your first 100 days are usually the most productive for a new president, but this would be one hell of a first 100 days that he would face if he was and for hillary clinton, it would be, you know, give joe biden some advice on what to

face because hillary clinton did everything right in terms of winning the right demographics, winning the right margins among voters of color, close to it she didn't get quite as much as barack obama but there were all these outside forces, including russia, which is back. so, i think these two have a lot to say and they are just two of the very important guests we have on tonight. >> absolutely. >> so, joy, congratulations, first of all secondly, i'm just wondering about you starting this show, first of all, at an extraordinarily historic time, and second of all, following the death of a man to paraphrase what nicole anna jones said, was a perfecter of democracy helped take the promise of thomas jefferson, helped take the promise of other founding fathers of this country, many of

whom own slaves, and it was the scars were on john lewis' back and so many others to perfect this democracy, to fulfill this promise. of course, there's still a long way to go. but how do you remember john lewis tonight? >> well, you know, joe, and thank you very much. really appreciate you as well. you know, i've been thinking over the last couple of days since john lewis passed, and passed ours after c.t. vivian, who was another lion of the civil rights movement. probably the most submerses ive thing these two men ever did was to get old you think of all the martyrs who left not only their blood on the ground fighting just for the basic right of people who look like me to vote, but who didn't live past 40 you know, martin luther king, 39 medgar evers, 35 these were young, young men. the youngest of them, 11 years

younger than dr. king was john lewis, who was a radical young man. he was the one they had to sort of walk him back in the march on washington because he didn't go to washington to sing john f. kennedy's praises to indict him to say, you're not doing enough to keep black people alive you could do a lot more. what are you doing to save the people of birmingham and the people of selma? you know, this was a radical voice. he was the black lives matter kid of his era and for him to just survive. last night, i was obsessively watching the happy video where he's doing that dance to the song "happy" and i thought, that's subersive, for him just to be happy and just be a senior citizen, i'm like, thank god, you know

that was incredible. and then to be such a leader he was one of the reasons we have that incredible black history museum in washington he fought like hell against segregation, segregationist southern senators to make that happen and he bled for the right to vote that we still don't fully have because the supreme court gutted the bill. so, what i think about is not so much, you know, john lewis' passing being sad, it's an opportunity, i think this is god calling him and calling us to a purpose. there's something concrete that people like mitch mcconnell can do mcconnell put out a lovely, lovely statement, but mitch mcconnell is fighting right now even as we speak against restoring the voting rights act. why don't you restore the voting rights act, mr. mcconnell? he can come on the show. that's the question i would like to ask him how can you honor john lewis but not restore the right to vote, not give health care to the

people of this country, not support living wages like, that's john lewis' legacy. so, i think there's concrete things we can do that those kids in the street are demanding and they're going to keep demanding them >> and, of course, that voting rights extension passed in 2019, and the house has y-- has yet t pass in the senate joy, john said, never give into despair. i'm just wondering, what are your thoughts on how do americans, how do black americans, how do people who want to continue the fight of john lewis, how do they maintain his fierce optimism as david remnic said last hour, how do you combine that fierce optimism with the sober realism that it's a journey, it's a tough journey,

and he just says, keep at it, keep going >> you know, most black people i know are not herbally optimistic most of the time i think the word i would use is determined, because the bottom line is that black people in this country are owed recompense i'm sitting here overlooking central park, and it was a black town that was knocked down and destroyed so that white america could have this park black people gave up everything. we gave up our black wall street it was taken away from us. the amount that's been stolen, the amount of theft, the burglary of black life by police, that doesn't create a lot of optimism.

i have to be honest with you i call myself a happy cynic. i'm cynical because i've lived in america my mom lived in america when she came at an immigrant but not welcome as an immigrant. the reality is most black people don't proceed necessarily with optimism but determination we know this country can be better because it's written down and the founders didn't intend to include us, but they wrote it down and when you write down a principle and an idea, you don't have any control over who embraces it. and it just so happens that the black man and woman embrace that idea we saw that written down and said, yeah, we want that that thing you talk about, liberty and justice, every man and woman is equal no matter what their station this is not a country of oligarchs and people who are born into hereditary station we want all of that. until we have all of that, we're not going to be satisfied.

>> and the promise of thomas jefferson for white america was actually seized -- those words were seized whether by frederick douglass or martin luther king or whether by john lewis who said, okay, great, you know, we're going to take you at your word >> that's right. >> yes, let's apply american exceptionalism to the promise that you made that all men and women are created equal. okay, we'll take you up on that. and john lewis spent his life doing that joy, thank you. >> joy reid, thank you for being here >> congratulations we can't wait to watch tonight at 7:00 p.m. >> "the reidout" premieres at 7:00 p.m. >> what a show to start off with. next off, the president's handling of the coronavirus continues to drag down his

approval ratings we'll have the latest from that and the new numbers from fox news poll on which candidate the voters believe has the intelligence to be an effective president. plus, congressional republicans set to meet at the white house today to discuss another coronavirus relief package. will they go along with the president's efforts to block funding, testing, tracing and the cdc? house speaker nancy pelosi will be our guest a very packed 8:00 a.m. hour of "morning joe" continues right now. it's one person coming in from china and we have it under control. it's going to be just fine. >> when you have 15 people and the 15 within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero, that's a pretty good job we've done. >> i think we're going to be very good with the coronavirus i think that at some point that's going to sort of just disappear, i hope. >> i'll be right eventually. i will be right eventually up, i said it's going to disappear. i'll say it again, it's going to

disappear and i'll be right. >> does that discredit >> i don't think so. you know why because i've been right probably more than anybody else >> we're going to have a lot more of that coming up good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, july 20th. with us we have joe and white house reporter for the associated press, jonathan lemire nbc news capitol hill reporter, kasie hill, host of "politicians nation" and, reverend al sharpton, and president from morgan university, politics at the root, jason johnson joins us this morning wow, joe, good to have you back. >> yeah, it's great to be back >> anything happen over the weekend? >> my gosh, anything happen over the past two weeks yeah, quite a lot. i've got to say, though, the lead in "the washington post" about the chris wallace

interview yesterday really laid it out and the description by phillip rucker trump was physically rattled as he struggled to answer for his administration's failure to contain the coronavirus which has claimed more than 170,000 lives in the united states really, if you wanted to know what was going on, mika, in the chris wallace interview and the impact that it was having on donald trump, and the impact it's had on donald trump's presidency since march, all you had to do was read on and see, you know, joe biden's quote, the past six months have proven again and again it's donald trump who doesn't know what he's talking about when it comes to covid-19 when it comes to the coronavirus, you can't believe a word he said though, it would be very easy say, okay, well, of course, that's what he's going to say because he's running against

donald trump for the t presidency but unfortunately for the republicans in the senate and donald trump, the overwhelming number of americans believe what joe biden is saying and don't believe what donald trump's saying in the same newspaper, a growing number of americans disapprove of president trump's handling of the pandemic that new washington post/abc news poll we'll be talking about found only 38%, only 38% approve of donald trump's handling of the worst health care crisis in over a century 60% disapprove that is up seven points. and all you had to do was look at the president, confused, rattled, angry, ignorant ignorant of a pandemic that has been with us since march but republicans are now saying, republican governors are now saying, republican senators are now saying, he's lost interest in it.

he's ignorant when it comes to the basic facts of it and they've given up talking to the president of the united states and many of them call mike penc just hoping he can do something for them because donald trump is checked out when it comes to a pandemic that's killed almost 140,000 americans. mika, i know we're going to talk about this, too. but what is really angering republican senators right now who are in trouble is the fact that trump is trying to continue to cut funding for testing and contact tracing. at a time when our economy needs that the most. at a time when our small business owners need that the most at a time when our airlines need that the most. at a time when our restaurants need that the most at a time when school teachers need that the most he insists, as he has since

march, that this country continues to fly blind and the american people have overwhelmingly turned against him in fox news poll, washington post polls, nbc news/"wall street journal" pols, in every poll that's out there. >> because the american people are paying the price and it's also just waiting to politics for three seconds why joe biden keeps saying, it didn't have to be this way because it didn't. it was the worst weekend yet for new cases of the coronavirus in the united states. according to nbc news data, the u.s. added more than 206,000 new cases over the past three days, including a record 75,000 new cases on friday. indiana, kentucky, louisiana, south carolina, all broke their single-day records for new infections yesterday and in that interview with fox new's chris wallace, president trump repeated his long-standing

frustration with higher levels ofing across the country. >> well, sir, testing is up 37%. >> well, that's good. >> i understand. cases are up 194%. it isn't just that testing has gone up. it's that the virus has spread, the positivity rate has increased. >> many of those cases - >> it's worse than it was. >> many of those cases are young people that would heal in a day. they have the sniffles and we put it down as a test. many of them, don't forget, i guess it's like 99.7%, people are going to get better and in many cases they're going to get better very quickly. we go out and we look and then on the news -- look, if you go back to the news, all of your -- even your wonderful competitors, you'll see cases are up. well, cases are up many of those cases shouldn't even be cases. cases are up because we have the best testing in the world. and we have the most testing no country has ever done what we've done in terms of testing

we are the envy of the world and they say the most incredible job anybody's done is our job on testing. because we're going to shortly be up to 50 million tests. you look at other countries and they don't even do tests they do tests if somebody walks into the hospital, they're sick. they're really sick. they test them then or test them in a doctor's office they don't go around and have massive testing. it skews the number. >> i'm sure a lot of people listening right now are going to say, trump, he tries to play it down, he doesn't take it as serious -- >> no, this is serious. >> 75,000 cases a day -- >> show me the death chart. >> well, i don't have the death chart. i can tell you, the death chart is 1,000 cases a day. >> excuse me it's all too much. it shouldn't be one case it came from china they should have never let it escape they should have never let it out, but it is what it is. take a look at europe. take a look at the numbers in europe

by the way, they're having surges - >> 6,000 in the whole european union. >> they don't test they don't test like we do. >> is it possible they don't have the virus as badly -- >> it's possible they don't test that's what's possible we find cases, and many of those cases heal automatically we're finding -- in a way we're creating trouble certainly we're creating trouble for the fake news to come along and say, oh, we have more cases. look, we did something that nobody's ever done not only the ventilators where we're supplying them all over the world, we did a testing program, the likes of which nobody has ever done before. >> jonathan lemire, i don't even know where to begin. there are so many lies in there. so many ignorant statements. actually, he's talking about a pandemic that's almost going to kill -- close to killing 140,000 americans. it's now killed twice as many people who died in vietnam when he said, back in january only one person had it from china and soon they were going to be gone.

in february he said it was 15 people who had it. 15 in the whole united states and soon it would be gone. in march said it was going to go away magically by april because it was going to be warm. he continues to lie to the american people. he continues this magical thinking and all the while, more people died at the beginning. it was more people died of this pandemic, which he said was magically going to go away than 9/11 then it was more people died in a single week than died in 15, 20 years in the afghanistan war. then it was more people that died than in the iraq war. then it was more people died in world war i. this is continuing and he is still playing dumb i think he's playing dumb. but, jonathan, i don't really know where to begin. he says the united states is the envy of the world. we're a basket case. we're a laughing stock we can't even go to europe we can't go to canada.

we can't go to the bahamas the bahamian government said this weekend, americans, stay away because you're such a basket case well, such -- look at this who would ever believe that the country that has been home to half of the noble prize winners for science since the 1950s would so badly fumble the worst pandemic in a century that even the bahamas is saying, hey, listen, sorry, america, we don't want your money that bad of course, he's wrong about testing. we're not the envy of the world on testing we're terrible on testing. we're not the envy -- mortality rates. jonathan, how does he continue to get mortality rates wrong how does he say we're the best in the world when johns hopkins continually shows that we're one

of the worst in the world. we're like the tenth worst in the world for countries that have populations of over 100,000. that's a lot of countries. if that's too confusing for people who want to be confused, for people who are purposely confused about things as simple as masks, then, jonathan, let's just strip it down to this we're a country that has 4.5% of the world's population and yet when it comes to deaths, deaths, people in the ground, people cremated, people gone forever. now, people are sniffles are going to get up -- people are dead, americans who are dead we account for 25%, at least of all coronavirus deaths in the world. donald trump, under donald trump, a country that has 4.5% of the world's population is

responsible for over 25% of the world's deaths that doesn't have anything to do with testing that doesn't have anything to do with charts. i know this guy is proud that he can identify an elephant on a test >> for die mementia? >> yeah, that's for alzheimer's patients he's proud of that jonathan, i'm serious, does he just think his supporters are so stupid that he can keep insulting them every day or is he really this confused? >> joe, welcome back the president long ago crossed the line from trying to paint an optimistic picture of what's going on to professing what is now willful ignorance. credit to chris wallace who did a great job in this interview, which was taped on friday in a sweaty rose garden what the president says -- let's

just say, he's wrong he is wrong on the facts repeatedly the mortality rate is a good one, joe he claimed and even had aides try to get paperwork to prove that he was right. he was not the mortality rate is much higher in the united states than he lets on that also downplays the fact that that people who don't die from the coronavirus, a lot of them suffer greatly. it's not just the sniffles are there some people who are asymptomatic, sure are there people who have mild cases? sure there are others who get it and survive but it takes weeks and months and after recovering for months don't feel like themselves testing is the other one where the united states is not the envy of the world in testing certainly, though, testing has improved it's nowhere near enough we're seeing backlogs that have grown in recent weeks. testing centers in places like washington, new york, los angeles, wherest testing a a month ago would take two, three,

weeks. the virus could have run its course during that stretch this is a president and administration that seems to have its blinders on that story captured beautifully in "the washington post" how governors around the country, republicans, trump allies have grown frustrated with him. they feel like the the has given up on managing the virus and fighting the virus he's only focused on trying to push the economy open, to try to push schools open, even though there's no real guarantee there's enough funding to do that safely and, in fact, he is threatening to withhold funding from schools that open up the way he wants them to we're seeing again dr. fauci, there's perhaps been a truce in the west wing on dr. fauci he's still largely sidelined the republicans want there to be return of coronavirus task force briefings to talk to the president, they just don't want the president to be involved.

still ahead on "morning joe," we'll talk about the cognitive test that president trump claims was very hard you're watinchg "morning joe." we'll be right back. l speaking in addition to the substitute teaching. i honestly feel that that's my calling-- to give back to younger people. i think most adults will start realizing that they don't recall things as quickly as they used to or they don't remember things as vividly as they once did. i've been taking prevagen for about three years now. people say to me periodically, "man, you've got a memory like an elephant." it's really, really helped me tremendously. prevagen. healthier brain. better life. ♪ ♪ now is the time to support the places you love. spend 10 dollars or more at a

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president trump continued to attack joe biden's mental acuity during his interview on fox news yesterday, challenging the former vice president to take the same cognitive exam, that's for people with alzheimer's. it's an exam for people with alzheimer's. take a look. >> in the fox poll they asked people, who was more competent, who's mind is sounder? biden beats you in that. >> well, i tell you what, let's take a test. let's take a test right now. let's go down, joe and i will take a test. let him take the same test that i took. >> incidentally, i took the test, too, when i heard you passed it. >> how did you do? >> it's not the hardest test. >> no. >> the picture in the last spot and it's an elephant.

>> no, see, that's all misrepresentation. >> that's what was on the web. >> it's all misrepresentation. yes, the first few questions are easy but i but you couldn't answer the last five questions >> one was count back from 100 by seven. >> let me tell you and you couldn't answer -- you couldn't answer many of the questions. >> what's the question >> i'll get you the test but i guarantee you joe biden couldn't answer those questions and i answered all 35 questions correctly. >> oh, my god. >> i actually -- >> this is staggering. >> i had to look at this test again. this isn't the first time the president has actually bragged about passing an alzheimer's test this is for people with dementia and alzheimer's, they give them this test. and here we have a man run, the most challenging job in government, not only in this country but probably anywhere across the world

bragging about being able to identify a lion, a camel he says the last questions are tough. >> really? that are really tough. the subject has to repeat them in the forward order these numbers, 2, 1sh, 8, 5, 4. >> got it. >> now here are three numbers you have to repeat backwards, 7, 4, 2 2, 4, 7. >> wow >> here's a really - >> so, he says those are hard. >> here's a really tough one, too. draw a clock for ten past 11:00. you see, this was actually -- and this is us, i think it was this is when they found out the mom had alzheimer's because she couldn't draw a clock. donald trump is bragging to chris wallace that he can draw a

clock. >> he's saying those last few questions are pretty hard. our president. >> and tell time here's the last question, the last six questions that he said are so hard. come on. again, trump supporters, look at this test. he thinks you're stupid that you can't google this test, but you can. you have a google machine. go on your google machine. this is your president, who has the nuclear codes who thinks that because he passes this test, and passes the last -- he says the last questions are very tough. are you ready for this what is the date today what month are we in what year is it? what day is it what place are we sitting in right now? >> oh, my gosh. >> where are you sitting, mr. president?

what city are you in right now the president of the united states believes that joe biden -- because more people believe joe biden's mental acuity is better than donald trump's in the latest poll donald trump continues to brag about taking this test reverend al, i don't even know where to begin with this but this isn't the first time he's bragged about being able to identify a camel or what a lion is and telling chris wallace, you can't -- you can't pass this test you can't draw a clock you can't tell us what city you're in. that's what the president of the united states actually brags about to try to make us feel better about the man who has the nuclear codes, to make us feel somehow he's with it this is why voters are wrong for

thinking actually joe biden is sharper and has more mental acuity than the sitting president of the united states, because he could draw a clock and he can tell chris wallace what city he was in. >> it reminded me at that point in the interview that chris wallace had left the rose garden, where he was interviewing the president, and was visiting an old man in the nursing home trying to convince him that he was still cognitive in terms of his cognitive skills, that he was still able i mean, it was very -- it went from laughable to pitiful. to sit there and try to convince chris wallace that he was somehow very much up to where he should be because he could identify things that were very simple you start then being -- you start being pitied

and to think this man is running this country and is in charge of the military and in charge of real decisions because frightening. when you think about the fact that he wants to reduce us to taking a test that he thinks is hard the real test is going to be in november on who can run this country and one who has spent my life meeting donald trump and joe biden is not a contest i think what donald trump is forgetting his niece told us he had someone take the s.a.t. test there will be no one to take the test for you in november, mr. mt. coming up, nancy pelosi is standing by. she joins e thconversation next on "morning joe. ♪

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the financial help that congress afforded millions of americans because of the coronavirus could end this month if congress fails to pass a second round of stimulus the former chairs of the federal reserve saying not extending the supplemental unemployment benefits of $600 a week would be a catastrophe for the economy. the white house says president trump is expected to start

stimulus talks about senate majority leader mitch mcconnell later today. joining us now, house speaker nancy pelosi of california great to have you on the show with us. >> speaker pelosi, we're going to talk about that in a moment let's begin by talking about your dear friend john lewis. his passing and, i think john would say more importantly, the voting rights act that you all passed last year, that continues to languish in the united states senate >> that would be the appropriate way to honor john lewis is for the senate to take up the voting rights act and name it for john lewis. when we passed it before, we were in the minority, but we were able to write the bill and john lewis was very much a part of that. and i remind that at that time unanimous was in the senate. we had, perhaps, around 400 votes in the house

very bipartisan. we all walked down the steps of the capitol together, that it should be so difficult for them to take up the voting rights act is really hard for them to comprehend, but maybe now they see a path i certainly hope so. >> can you explain to americans why something that was so easy to do for republicans and democrats alike not so long ago and now met with such resistance by mitch mcconnell's united states senate? >> let's hope that it won't be let's just say, there's no way i can explain the behavior of the republicans enabling the current occupant of the white house to behave in the manner that he has behaved. it is very disconcerting to me as a mom and grandmother because they are endangering our children now by their cavalier attitude about sending kids to school and saying at the same time, somebody saying out of the white house, we're not doing anything more for testing and

the rest so, we're under a kind of -- don't ask me why the republicans do what they do, but i do know they can't continue in that way. we have to end this virus, that's what concerns me. i know people pay attention to his behavior and his whatever, but the fact is his behavior toward our children, his behavior to the health crisis in this country, his behavior to what it means in terms of people's lives, livelihood and the life of our democracy is what is very bewildering i have said that what he has done is going to be doggy doo stuck to the she of republicans for a very long time to come because they enabled him to do these bad things. >> so, "the washington post," phillip rucker wrote this morning in "the washington post" that the trump administration has further up-ended talks over the latest coronavirus relief bill by trying to block billions

of dollars for states to conduct testing and contact tracing, angering even republican senators do you believe there's a possibility that with more republican governors speaking out, with more republican senators behind the scenes getting angry, and some of them starting to speak out, that there could be a bipartisan compromise that would actually help business owners, help small and large businesses, help schools, help others know whether they can open safely or not with expanded testing and tracing that donald trump wants to block >> yes, we absolutely have to have that. actually, republicans outside of the congress, across the country. governors, mayors, county executives, elect persons and the rest in a bipartisan way, our health care workers, or transit workers, our teachers, our teachers, our sanitation

workers, all of those who are delivering service to people and that is to help them -- the states and localities with their cost of the coronavirus, both their outlays of money and also their lost revenue in a bipartisan way across the country, i have advocacy galore coming our way and hopefully to the republican senators as well. in addition to which, that's number one, honoring our heroes. secondly, open our economy, testing, tracing, treating, isolating, mask wearing, sanitation we know what to do we don't have a vaccine yet. god willing we will. i pray that that is the case but science is answer to our prayers and that's going to be a little while off in the meantime, lives can be saved. when we heard over the weekend that the white house was thinking about no more testing, that defied -- that goes beyond

ignorance. hopefully it was a mistake and they'll back off it because it is so very wrong but don't listen to me listen to the scientists, scientists, scientists, who have said all along, if we had been doing this, we wouldn't be in the fix we're in now and we must be doing it so matters don't get worse both in terms of the health and well being of the american people, the ability of children to go to school, and the opportunity for our economy to open up then we have money in the pockets of our american people as the third big pillar and chairs of the fed, everybody understands that the economy will only get worse if we do not -- if we do not continue to support working families in our country as we have done. now, everything i mentioned, republicans have voted for before not as much but, nonetheless, is not asking to go against their

principl principles and the president has signed - >> madame speaker, the stimulus discussion is one we can have, but i also wanted to continue to coronavirus and end up at the elections. given the fix we are in with this virus and given there are still hot spots across the country and resurgences of it, surges, frightening situations, people still dying, 12,000 cases a day on average in florida, for example, and the fix that we're in for reopening schools, so many problems, there's also going to be potentially a lot of people voting by mail, too frightened to leave their homes if we are still in the fix that we are in with this virus. how secure is mail-in balloting. the president continues to undermine it with his words saying that it's, you know, not accurate, that it's easily faulted by people and can be

corrupted in some way, even though most of the people in his administration have voted by mail, including him. and in the interview with chris wallace, he did not confirm whether he would leave -- whether he would accept the results of the election if he lost what do you make of that >> well, that's a loaded question there about coronavirus, what we do about it but the fact is, whether he knows it yet or not, he will be leaving. just because he might not want to move out of the white house doesn't mean we won't have an inauguration ceremony to inauguration a duly elected president of the united states and the -- i just -- you know, i'm second in line to the presidency just last week i had my regular continuation of government briefing this might interest you because i say to them, this is never going to happen, god willing it never will, but there is a process. it has nothing to do with the

certain occupant of the white house doesn't feel like moving and has to be fume raigated out there because the presidency is the presidency it's not geography or location so, so much for him. i wouldn't spend so much time on it that's a victory for him because then we're not talking about your first, more important subject, which is, what are we going to do to stop this vicious virus that is making an assault on our health, again, our lives, our livelihood and life of our democracy. in the heroes act we have $3.6 billion for vote by mail this is very, very important that's what it needed in our country and has bipartisan support throughout the country secretaries of state and other auspices under which elections take place are calling their sources. they don't want any barriers to it we have some additions we like, which is every register voter

gets to vote by mail with return postage paid, that those who don't want to can go and vote but in a safe way with a lot of time leading up and a lot of locations so that people are not crowded into it. this is simple when i say simple, we know what we need to do. again, ignore what the president has to say he doesn't know what he's talking about, once again, when he talks about any problems with vote by mail i was state party chair more than 30 years ago before i was a member of congress and we would win on -- joe knows -- well, it was before his time we would win on election day and the republicans would come raging in with absentee ballots. they know how to do this and they've done it for a long time. this is no longer a democracy

issue, this is a health issue. if they can't face that reality, all the more reason to get the money so we can make it happy in a healthy way for our country. the way our soldiers will, our overseas voters. >> yeah. you know, madame speaker, it's so funny you say that because this whole debate about absentee votes, mail-in votes has been so surreal because every -- just like you, in every time i'm walking around a room and a candidate's worried, as a republican, i would always have one question, have you got the absentee votes in? no i would say, just relax. i would ask throughout the night, have the absentee votes come in? when they came in, you knew whether republicans or democrats won or lost because the republicans always did better with absentee votes. we always did better with military votes mailed in we always did better with people who voted early. isn't it just bizarre that donald trump has taken a

republican institution that donald trump practices, his press secretary practices, his family practices and somehow suggested that everybody else -- if everybody else does what the trumps do in record number that it will be a rigged election >> you know, you use the word bizarre. that's appropriate probably mild. it is bizarre. >> but we have the money in the bill we did $400 million in the c.a.r.e.s. act, we had $400 million, so they have voted for this but now we need much more across the country for it and it's the wave of the future. i mean, for them to talk about this as if it's something so new. as you know, it isn't. but also it's a health issue now. people shouldn't having to be standing in line for hours they shouldn't have to be going into polling places that could

be, shall we say, not as safe as we might have thought them to be before so, this is a very -- how can i say this a very high priority for us. not because we think we'll win on the absentee ballot but because we think it's safer for the american people. >> mike barnicle is with us and has a question for you, madame speaker. >> hi, mike. >> madame speaker, you look great, as always you know, i would like to point out that thankfully, many americans do not have the virus. but most americans do have anxiety about the virus and its effects on their children. no one month so than the parents of school age children you're the mother of five children what are your thoughts on the reopening of schools in this age of the virus >> well, the mother of nine -- the grandmother of nine grandchildren who go from grade

school to college. and this -- look, think of sort of a lioness i'm okay you come near my cubs, you're dead just don't mess with the children and i consider all of america's children our children. so, don't be cavalier about our children to be in a classroom. these decisions may have to be made locally because of the rate of infection in certain areas, but they have to be made scientifically scientifically just something the president resists. science and governance this is what science tells us. this is what -- and governing, we should be doing both of those are foreign notions to him but that doesn't mean our children should be subjected to his notion mongering and what we have to do is, again, test, trace, treat, isolate. it's going to cost money we have $100 billion in the

heroes act of an education stabilization fund specifically for the coronavirus. so, we can -- if you're going to be spaced, you need more space and more teachers. you need better ventilation. this has clarity to it if you place a value on it. and that's what we have to do. we cannot take a risk with our children and the secretary of education said, well, children should be risk-takers. astronauts take risks, why shouldn't children what can you say >> madame speaker -- >> that's unbelievable. >> i totally agree madame speaker, president trump said there would be some sort of announcement or new developments on tuesday in light of the daca decision do you know anything about that? >> yeah. regarding a flurry of executive orders possibly on health care

anything you've been given the heads up on? >> no. the thing is if he decides to do something with daca after the supreme court sent his case away, not on substance but on process, and now he wants to come back with it. it's really a demonstration of his cruelty, his cowardess toward these young people in our country. i certainly hope he does not do that even for him, this is a new low. but i always say of him and the white house, they have a limbo contest going. they just have to see how low they can go. and to do an act of cruelty at the supreme court has spoken, announced a decision and we're only 106 days away from the next election why? except you're cruel, you're cowardly you're afraid. you're afraid of the future. so, i don't know what he -- well, i don't say in mind because what's that? i don't know what they're

cooking up in terms of health care one thing i think they might try to do is have a fake lower prescription drug thing. again, it will be show boat, snake oil salesmen it won't be what we need we want them to join us in lowering the cost of prescription drugs and we literally have to inbeing oninoe what he might say against that during the campaign he said he was going to negotiate like crazy about the cost of prescription drugs apparently like crazy means not at all but that's the way to lower the cost of prescription drugs so, maybe he'll try to give an illusion of something in that way. i hope it's a good thing i hope it's a good thing however, i don't know what he has in mind. >>. >> house speaker nancy pelosi, thank you so much for coming on. >> i use the term in mind sort of loosely

thank you all very much. look forward to be with you when we are observing the loss of our darling john lewis in congress, as joe knows, he always worked on the side of the angels and now he is with them may he rest in peace >> thank you so much up next, the late congressman john lewis in his own words. "morning joe" is coming right back introducing new voltaren arthritis pain gel, the first and only full prescription strength non-steroidal anti-inflammatory gel

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this morning, we are remembering congressman john lewis who passed away on friday after a months-long battle with cancer the civil rights icon and original freedom rider will always be remembered for striving for justice in america. here now is the conscience of congress in his own words. >> sometimes i hear people saying, nothing has changed. but for someone to grow up the way i grew up in the corn fields

of alabama to now be serving in the united states congress makes me want to tell them, come and walk in my shoes my name is john robert lewis i saw segregation. i saw racial discrimination, and i wanted to do something about it >> john lewis came from humble roots as the son of share croppers as a young man, i think he was chosen by god for leadership >> when i was growing up, i saw the signs that said white men, colored women, white women, colored men. i asked why? they said, boy, that's the way it is. don't get in the way don't get in trouble i got in trouble >> something deep down within me, moving me, that i could no longer be satisfied and go along with an evil system. >> i remember standing with president kennedy when i was 23.

i met dr. king when i was 18 rosa parks when i was 17 and all these people made me a better person. a stronger person. >> he organized freedom rides and sit-ins and voter registration drives. >> he is one of the most important student leaders of the american civil rights movement >> that wi wasn't concerned abot making history i just wanted to change things >> i have a dream. >> john was also one of the planners of the great march on washington >> brother john lewis. >> and was the youngest speaker to address the audience on that historic day >> we do not want our freedom gradually. but we want to be free now >> i had never, ever seen a crowd like that before never spoken to a crowd like that before. >> wake up, america! wake up! >> i was only 23 years old >> one sunday in 1965, he set out to lead a march from selma

to montgomery. >> john lewis led them out of the church on a mission to change america >> we came here to protest an unjust system, of denying blacks the right to vote. our country will never, ever be the same because of what happened on this bridge. >> we're marching today to dr a dramatize to the nation and to the world that hundreds of thousands of negro citizens are denied the right to vote >> it's fate and history coming together in a single place >> there are places and moments in america where this nation's destiny has been decided selma is such a place. >> we were determined. we were organized. we were disciplined. and we were committed to the way of peace the way of love. the way of nonviolence we were prepared to die for what we believed in

>> they stampede us with whips, sticks and horses. they tear gas us they turned our nonviolent protest into blood >> 50 years later, i don't recall how i made it back across that bridge. >> their cause must be our cause, too it's all of us who must overcome the crippling legacy of bigotry and injustice. and we shall overcome. >> congress passed the voting rights act >> the american people were ready for the congress and the president to act we made them ready >> all of the people should have a right to participate in the democratic process they all should have the elementary right to register and vote >> the voting rights act of 1965 has been the life blood of the

movement >> america and the world need more of what is in john lewis' heart. >> my philosophy is very simple. when you see something that is not right, not fair, not just, you have a moral obligation to say something, to do something, stand up, speak up, speak out. >> if not us, then who if not now, then when? it's a question john lewis has been asking his entire life. generations from now, parents teach their children what is meant by courage, the story of john lewis will come to mind an american who knew that change could not wait for some other person or some other time. >> it doesn't matter whether we are black or white, latino, asian-american or native american it doesn't matter whether straight or gay. we are one people, one family. we are one house

hi there i'm stephanie ruhle. it is monday, july 20th. and here of the important facts this hour. as we begin a new week, there's no sign the coronavirus is slowing down any time soon over the last three days, we saw another 200,000 cases reported pushing the total closer to 4 million people across this nation 141,000 americans have died. roughly equal to the population of syracuse, new york. the cases are jumping in states like kentucky and south carolina which set new records on sunday. cases are now increasing in 40 states nationwide and deaths are increasing in 25 of them hospitalizations are on the rise, particularly in places like florida, where more than 100 hospitals have completely run out of icu beds. and yet, with