>> election night in america, that can only mean one thing. the legend at the map. steve kornacki. >> you know, i'm a diva, honey, and that's what we do. >> here we are trucking. this is what it looks like when we do a news show from the road. >> picture today. >> you see gray. >> claccie. >> in brooklyn. >> if it's friday. >> you know it's time to fall back. >> hey. >> shout out to brooklyn and all the postal workers. find me on tiktok @arimelber. i've heard from some of you there taking questions. i send out my free writing and newsletter. connect with me. if the internet is not your thing, that's fine. i'll meet you back here at 6 p.m. tomorrow night. "the reid out" with joy reid is here up next. tonight on "the reid out" --

>> it was such an interesting experience because i had never seen him in person before, you know? you see someone blown up so larger than life on the media for so many years. to see them in person is very jarring and you get the sense that it's like, oh, this is just another guy. >> just another gia cording to a dismissed prospective juror speaking to vaughn hilliard. in day two, dozing don is warned about intimidaing jurors. trump's maga lackeys are freaking out whining that it's unfair that trump is required to be in court just like every other person who's accused of a crime. plus, the republican normalization of violent threats as senator tom cotton calls for violence against pro palestinian

protestors. we begin tonight at the end of the second day of jury selection in the criminal trial of former president donald trump. seven jurors have been selected so far, a salesman, an oncology nurse, two attorneys, an i.t. consultant, a teacher and a software engineer. 11 more needed. that includes six alternates. inside the courtroom donald trump again appeared deep in contemplation at times, or perhaps slumber, with his eyes closed and his tiny mouth pursed. but outside the courtroom the defendant attempted to try his case using his alternative facts. >> i would pay a lawyer and marked it down as an illegal expense, some accountant i didn't know marked it down as a legal expense. that's exactly what it was. you get indicted over that.

legal expense. that's what you're supposed to call it. >> a legal expense. almost like trump wants to ignore every single bit of context that was going on at the time. let's just take a moment to just remember what the so-called legal expenses were all about, namely attempts to quash stories about his extramarital daliances with women ahead of the 2016 election so as not to hurt his chances with the voters. don't take it from me. the manhattan d.a.'s office laid out the entire narrative at the filing of trump's indictment. the scheme began shortly after trump announced his presidential campaign in the summer of 2015. not two months later he was meeting at trump tower with his then personal lawyer michael cohen who was given a campaign email no legs and then national enquirer publisher david pecker to enter into a catch and kill where pecker would help flag and

suppress negative stories, particularly stories involving women from going public for the soul purpose of helping trump's campaign. that is precisely what happened five months before the 2016 election when pecker's company, ami, paid play boy model karen mcdougall $150,000 to keep her from speaking out about her alleged nine-month affair with trump, which overlapped the birth of his fifth child by his third wife. in a 2018 non-prosecution agreement ami admitted they did it so mcdougall did not publicize damaging allegations about trump, quote, before the 2016 presidential election and thereby influence that election. and it was just a month before the election when pecker alerted cohen about another potential woman problem, namely adult film star stormy daniels, who was getting ready to speak out about

her alleged affair with trump. and in case you forgot, which is hard to do, that was at the exact time when the infamous "access hollywood" tape was released with trump's claims of being able to grab women by the you know where and maybe even harder to remember given trump's spell over the republican party today, but republicans, including some evangelical leaders, actually began running from trump as a result of that tape if ever so briefly. and that brings us to why it was so important at the time that daniel's story not come out and why cohen paid her $130,000 out of his own pocket after obtaining a heloc loan under false pretenses to hide the fact that trump was reimbursing cohen, including from the oval office in 2017 for that reason. for those expenses cohen was

indicted for making a false statement to a federally insured bank as well as for two campaign finance violations. and in his plea he said he did so in coordination with and at the direction of a candidate for federal office, aka individual number one, aka donald trump. so, no, donald, those were not just legal expenses. and while you can continue to make such claims outside of court, once a jury is chosen, they will hear and see the evidence for what it is, and none of your rants in front of the cameras or late night social media posts will change those very real facts. joining me now is suzanne crag, investigative reporter for "the new york times" and msnbc contributor who was in the courthouse today. barbara mcquade, former u.s. attorney, professor at the university of michigan law school and msnbc legal analyst

and tim o'brien, senior executive editor of bloomberg opinion and also an msnbc political analyst. suzanne, i do want to start with you. the salesman, the oncology nurse, attorney, teacher, i.t. consultant, attorney. is this selection going at about the pace you would have expected having observed other trials? >> if you had asked me this morning, i would have said no. we started the morning and they were going through the questionnaires and it was going slowly only because there's 42 questions. and then we break for lunch, and it was very much -- the morning session was very much like you would imagine jury selection to be. i've sat through a number of trials. they go through the questions. you know, we hear people, what they like to watch on tv, what they like to read, do they have a dog. in trump's case they're asked if they go to a trump rally. it was long but it was moving pace. and then we broke for lunch and we came back and immediately donald trump's side came in and

said they had multiple objections to some of the jurors. and they had been scrubbing them at lunch, although we don't know who their names are. donald trump and his team are given the names as well as the government is, and they had found what they said were very troubling things on some of their social media. >> should i just -- let me stop you there. i want to read some of them. we've been seeing the notes going back and forth. i'm going to read some of these. some of them are jokes that were on people's social media posts. one of them was republicans projected to pick up 70 seats in prison. there was one that was described as a character from the simpson with trump's head in his hands. another showed trump and former president barack obama. a comment by the judge orange is what the new black meant. the third had an avengers united theme. trump invites the tide boys who died in a mining accident to the white house and the boys requested to return to their

cave. so basically trump was flagging things that looked like antitrump social media. >> right. if i was him, i would be flagging it, too. there were some more serious than another. there was a woman who i think was a teacher who lived on the upper west side. they had found a video on her social media that she had taken and it was -- looked like people celebrating trump's loss in 2020. and she had some fairly -- i thought fairly innocuous comment on the top. she was brought into the jury room. she was questioned about it and she explained why she took the video. she said she was out. she lives in new york city. she had gone out to do alternate side parking on the street, which i love, very new york thing, and she had seen this going on and she videotaped it and put it on her social media feed. the judge in that case refused to send her packing. there was a mixed bag. all of a sudden around 2:30, 3 we started to get what was looking like a jury together.

they got seven people they agreed on by the end of the day and the judge feels if it keeps going at this pace, two more days. the courts start tomorrow, two more days, but we could be in opening arguments monday morning. >> wow. >> yeah. >> barb, to me this strikes me as the sign that the system is still working because the fact is you don't want donald trump to have prejudice either for him or against him. in a fair trial you don't want someone getting on that jury that simply wants to put him in prison nor do you want a ringer to get on that jury who's getting on just for the purposes of trying to acquit him. so how would you assess how things are going? because it does seem that anyone who would be obviously sort of anti-trump is not getting on. how much do you think we should also worry about somebody trying to get on the jury to help him? >> you know, having a fair jury is very important, joy. it's also important that there be the appearance of a fair jury because we want at the end of the day whatever the outcome to

be here, that people felt confident in the system and that these people were fair minded, they didn't have a bias in favor or against the defense. they gave both sides a fair shake. the fact that they were able to agree on seven jurors already by day two is pretty remarkable to me. i think i give a good bit of credit to judge merchan here. he asked the jurors in a blanket way about whether they had biases against donald trump individually -- collectively and now they're going in and asking some individual questions. i think the social media scrubbing is absolutely appropriate. people may say they can be fair but if they have a presence on social media that have said anything other than that, nothing wrong with that. people have a right to engage in political activity it just might mean they may not be suitable for this case. it might create an appearance. could somebody secretly have a strong bias either for or against and secretly get on this jury? yeah. at some point jurors are sworn

to tell the truth in answer to these questions. they are asked a number of questions that lawyers are not looking at just what they say, how they say it, mannerisms, body language, a number of things. i suppose if somebody were really determined to get on this jury and had no digital paper trail of having said things strongly for or against donald trump, i suppose there's a possibility that somebody could sneak on. >> tim, that's obviously what he's hoping for, right? donald -- they're aggressively screening against anyone they perceive to be anti-trump. what trump wants is the other side of that. he wants somebody to essentially nullify. >> because he's doing everything he can, joy, to undermine the integrity of the judge presiding over this case in public, to undermine the solidity and utility of the judicial process that he's going through right now. because there's a very damning fact pattern stacked up against him. how the jury interprets that and

what kind of sentence the judge makes once the jury interprets it is still an unknown, but the fact pattern is damning for him at a familial level and legal level and i think he knows that. and the jury system isn't perfect. you know, human beings are biased, but it has worked pretty well for a very long time. it's better than the alternatives. when donald trump steps out, you know, on the sidewalk in front of the court room and uses every opportunity to go after the judge and go after the process, to me it's a -- it's a reminder of kind of the quiet heroism of the people who are in the courtroom making the process work, particularly judge merchan who has been threatened directly by trump. trump has threatened his daughter. there's gag orders that i think he routinely violates and merchan is moving the process along. he is i think incredibly well disciplined. i think he's evidenced in and of

itself of the quality of the judicial system we have in this country when it's working right. the other thing that strikes me is trump is also walking out on the sidewalks and calling for the release of the january 6th defendants. when he's sitti in a courtroom where, you know, the judges arrayed against him are election interference. and he incited interference. i don't think we should because he's polluting our civic institutions along with trying to defend himself. >> one of the ways he's done it, he did manage to do it, suzanne, the great rachel maddow did an excellent piece. when donald trump had control of the justice department, they're trying to make it sound like this is a case of nothing. william barr when he came in and became attorney general tried to eliminate this case and essentially eliminate michael

cohen against trump. this is from jeffrey berman's book who was the head of the southern district of new york. when michael cohen pleaded guilty our office continued to pursue investigations related to other possible campaign violations. when barr took over in february 20189 under jeff sessions he not only tried to kill the ongoing investigations but incredibly suggested that cohen's conviction on campaign finance charges be reversed. we've had interference with the system, suzanne, it wasn't by joe biden it was by donald trump's attorney general, william barr. >> right. and i think that's -- michael cohen can tell you a lot about that. you sort of wonder what the future holds if he is elected again. it's scary to think -- i think there was also another charge related to this that the fec was looking at trump and that charge was dropped as well. it's a small miracle this case has ended up in a courtroom.

>> to your point, tim, he also called michael cohen a rat, posted that after michael cohen did the right thing and came forward and followed the law. >> yeah. i'm sorry, laughing. he called michael cohen a rat. donald trump is chance cagney in a 1930s, you know, crime movie. >> yeah. >> there is this tragic comic and cartoonish aspect through all of this. you know, loyalty is a one-way street in donald trump's world. if anyone doesn't sing to his tune, he regards it as a betrayal. he's afraid of michael cohen. >> he should be. >> very realistic opening statements on monday. maybe witness testimony as soon as tuesday. i don't think the case is going to take that long. i think it might be over in just

a few weeks. >> fascinating stuff. suzanne, barb, tim, thank you very much. a sleepy start to trump's criminal trial kicking into gear today. we'll have more on how trump's allies are reacting to him being treated like any other defendant. "the reid out" continues after this. are you still struggling with your bra? it's time for you to try knix. makers of the world's comfiest wireless bras. for revolutionary support without underwires, and sizes up to a g-cup, find your new favorite bra today at knix.com

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out of poverty. stop the race to the bottom in the fast-food industry. and build a california for all of us. thank you governor and our california lawmakers for fighting for what matters. donald trump is not coping well with being treated like any other defendant. he went on another posting spree

on his social media grift screaming how his trial is an assault on america. his allies are falling all over themselves. >> elise stefanik called it a six to eight week show trial. she has her own reasons for bowing to the altar of trump. she's not alone. "the daily beast" interviewed 20 republicans and only had one issue with the prospective nominee being a convicted felon, the one of course being mitt romney. another wanna be trump vp byron donald went on news max with a message for prospective jurors. >> my plea is to the people of manhattan that may sit on this

trial. please do the right thing for this country. everybody is allow to have their political viewpoints but the law is supposed to be blind and no respecter of persons. this is a trash case. there is no crime here and if there is any potential for a verdict, they should vote not guilty. >> in addition to his allies in congress they're providing trump the self-soothing he needs. clay travis called for trump supporters in new york city to try to get seated on the jury and refuse to convict. as congressman eric swalwell pointed out, that is openly encouraging jury tampering. while donald trump is being told what to do, a perspective juror said he was a big fan of the apprentice while in middle school. joining me now is tony schwartz, ceo of the energy project. he co-authored "the art of the

deal" with donald trump. tony, thank you for being here. how do you think donald trump is reacting to the lack of being treated as a special boy. he's being treated as a normal person. how do you think he's reacting to that? >> in the way you're observing. i think he's really agitated by it. i think it's so -- it's such a rare moment for him, as you say, to be held in any way accountable and to be at someone's else's mercy that i think it's incredibly hard for him. and i think for all his powers of denial and numbing out and ways of avoiding feeling whatever it is he's feeling other than rage, i think he is deeply worried about the worst case scenario here. the worst case scenario could very easily happen. of course, that's a conviction. even more than that would be that he got jail time. i find that hard to imagine but --

>> yeah. >> -- it certainly could happen. i think that really, joy, to me the essence of this is how crazy what's happening is. i mean, we have a guy with dozens of felony charges against him in four or five cases. the evidence, i'm all for putting it before a jury, but the evidence in every one of those cases is so overwhelming. we're talking -- listen, we're not talking about whether or not this guy should be convicted, we're talking about whether or not this guy should be running for president. >> yeah. >> that should not even be a possibility. and it shouldn't be a possibility based simply on character. we can't have people like this running for dog catcher much less to be president of the united states. >> well, do you think that there -- you know, there was a

juror who did -- she got dismissed. being in the same room with him, it was sort of demystifying. she realized he's just a regular guy. in a sense do you think that that might be the coming down to earth that is needed? that those 12 jurors and those alternates will actually see trump for what he is, a cheater who cheated on his wife with multiple women, who did gross things, lied about it in order to win an election, and that that actually might be in a sense its own kind of healing? >> i mean, it could be. and i think the most demystifying thing may have already happened, which is he fell asleep in court. >> yes. grampy trump. >> that's not the sign of an amazing human being. that's a sign of an old man who can't keep his eyes open, and i say that as an old man so here i am. so, yeah, i do think it can be

demystifying, but let's be clear. this election is going to come down to several, 20, 50, 75,000 people in four or five states, and those people are the only one practically whose opinion matters. do i think those people are likely to find it off putting if he is convicted of a crime? i do. >> yeah. >> i do think if he is convicted that he will lose support and he cannot afford to lose any support right now. this is an incredibly equally divided country. it's miraculous to me that it is equally divided. >> same. >> it makes no sense, that 50%, but that's the way it is. >> yeah. i guess the other -- on the flip side of it, knowing him, the level of rage that he will feel if he manages to get back into the white house. one would imagine that any of those jurors whose names his

lawyers have, the judge, the prosecutors, anyone who's participated in prosecuting him, i think we can all anticipate what he'll do, right? >> yeah. i mean, i think you've hit on something absolutely essential. it's not that he's going to feel rage. he lives in a boiling pot of rage 100% of his waking life and he's almost awake because he can't sleep so the rage that he feels he's already made very clear what's going to come out of it, which is he is going to do everything on this god's earth that he's capable of doing to ensure that he is the sole power, that he is the dictator. his heroes are putin and mu musalini and loathe to say hitler. he will go after his enemies. he will do that with jurors if they convict him, politicians, people in the media and i

strongly suspect he'll do it with me. i've already said publicly that i'm leaving the country if trump is re-elected and i don't say that in some half -- i was going to say some half-assed way, i say it because i believe i like so many other people are in danger physically by his re-election if that happens. >> i think you are not off base in believing that. tony schwartz, you would know, as you know him. thank you very much. i appreciate you, tony. coming up. a republican senator encourages violence against pro-palestinian protestors blocking roads in states across america.

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on monday pro-palestinian demonstrators took to the streets, airports, bridges and highways. in chicago the action blocked the lanes leading into the o'hare international airport. in california and new york protesters blocked the golden gate and brooklyn bridges snarling traffic for hours while others chained themselves to drums filled with cement across interstate 880 in oakland. the right wing protest was swift and extreme. tom cotton is facing backlash for a post that encouraged people to submit violence.

>> if something like this happened in arkansas on a bridge, there would be a lot of very wet criminals that had been tossed overboard not by law enforcement but by the people whose road they are blocking. go they glued their hands to the car or pavement, well, probably pretty painful to have their skins ripped off and that's the way we would handle it in arkansas. i would encourage anyone who gets stuck behind criminals blocking traffic like this, take matters into their own hands. >> a u.s. senator adding for vehicular homicide calling on regular americans to forcibly throw peaceful protestors off bridges, having their skin ripped off. nothing to see here. he doubled down today. tom cotton has long had a thing for civilian crackdowns. in 2020 "the new york times" made the extremely bad call of publishing his op ed calling for

military action to suppress protests against police violence in american cities. it serves as a reminder of the legacy of racial terror. if you ever wonder how people could lynch people, listen to how people used to and still talk about black or brown people, migrants or the poor. think about the ease they will shoot a family of asylum, black protester or black child who accidentally knocked on the wrong door. look at our history. like how in 1957 per the zen education project mr. willie edwards jr. a 24-year-old black man was murdered by members of the ku klux klan montgomery, alabama. he was kidnapped from his delivery truck and forced to jump to his death. now in 2024 we're just supposed

to shove people off of them for causing traffic jams, right, tom cotton? the rhetoric is violent by design. the idea is to make protesting feel too dangerous to do with the pro-palestinian protestor becoming the new boogie man. that racist narrative fell apart in 2017 when the real boogie man was a white neonazi who drove his car into a crowd of anti-racist protestors killing a young white black lives matter protestor and injuring 35 other people. the right wingers didn't pause their war on protests then. it only got worse. several states are working to make it legal to hit protestors with your car and now the supreme court has dealt a stunning blow to protest rights in texas, louisiana and mississippi. three of the states with the largest black populations in the u.s. by effectively rendering organizers liable for any illegal act committed by protesters.

it's a frightening look at what we can expect in the future and trump is promising to make it worse, even suggesting that he intends to send troops into democratic-run cities if he's elected again. talk about the stakes of the election. and those high stakes are something my friend and colleague chris hayes knows plenty about. his new podcast is all about states surrounding each of the 2024 presidential candidates based on their track records as president and he joins me next. these underwear are period-proof. and sneeze-proof. and sweat-proof. they're leakproof underwear, from knix.

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they're ending the riots and lawlessness that has spread throughout our country. we will end it now. today i have strongly recommended to every governor to deploy the national guard in sufficient numbers that we dominate the streets. if a city or state refuses to take the actions that are necessary to defend the life and property of their residents, then i will deploy the united states military and quickly solve the problem for them. >> that was donald trump in 2020 just moments before police tear gassed lafayette square so he could hold up a bible he's likely never read and take pictures in front of a church he never attended. he was threatening to invoke the insurrection act. he didn't invoke it then but now

as he makes another bid for the white house trump and his allies, who are far from normal leaders like millie and more like the autocrats, are reportedly going to use this law starting on day one. joining me is chris hayes host of msnbc's "all in." talk about the stakes of the election. donald trump is already saying one of them is whether or not you can protest at all without being shot. >> yeah. i have to say, i had completely -- there's so much about 2020 that even us who work in this world where we are constantly reporting about it. are you better off -- >> which i love. completely love it. >> i had totally forgot about it. he said he was going to use the u.s. military. as you note, we have all kinds of reporting subsequently about his desire to do that. the fact that he kept bringing up the idea of shooting

protestors. this was a constant theme of his in multiple conversations and multiple people will attest to this. in multiple conversations he wanted to shoot protestors and asking why they couldn't do it. the records here -- the con see the of this podcast we're doing, "the stakes" is for the first time in 1992 you have people running against each other who are already president. you don't have to be wondering, i wonder what they would do. we've got it. we've got records. in this case, we saw it. he was only stymied by people like millie and others. he was very clear then and being very clear now about essentially using the military as a tool of, quote, in his words, domination over civil protest. >> the thing is i love that you're framing it in terms of the stakes, as you said. these two men have been president. the difference is it's likely joe biden will be similar to the way he is now if he's president

for a second term. donald trump will be donald trump with that same personality but with no mark millies. >> right. right. >> no normal people around him. he'll be surrounded as people who want to use him as a frontman. >> yes. they sell those electric scooters and they have the software in it where you can only go a certain speed and then you can go on reddit and take it off and people end up mangling -- end up in if the e.r. that's the worst case scenario, right? that those governors are removed, that the mark millie's aren't there. it's tom cotton as the secretary of defense and tkach patel running the white house. and i do think the record here, particularly in domestic policy is very clear. are rich people going to get a tax cut? that's the subject of this week. are they going to get a tax cut if trump is president and it's a

republican congress? yeah. that's not theoretical. >> right. >> it's the one thing they did the last time. >> that's right. >> it's also not popular. >> yeah. >> that's the other thing. a lot of this stuff, when you tell people, you poll them, remind them, these are not majority positions. >> well, i mean, the thing is -- and the tax cut -- i'm glad you mentioned it. when donald trump was at this ritzy fund-raiser at the hedge fund guy's house. you're wealthy. i got you a tax cut, i'm going to get you another one. yet he retains a populist image and his base continues to be white working class and some non-white working class voters. can you make sense of that? >> i never have been able to. the only way i can make sense of it is to take that category of trump voters and slice them up into the people that are the base, hard core republican party line goers and people who will determine the election who are 8% electorate, 5% electorate. they're the ones who back when

joe biden won by 7 million votes in 2020, that stuff mattered. you know, the fact that he was incredibly reckless about covid. the fact that the tax cuts polled were the least popular approval of donald trump until the aftermath of january 6th was the day that got signed into law. in that narrow sliver of people it seems to matter at the margins. >> tax cuts are important. they expire in 2025. >> exactly. >> they actually expire next year. there is a difference of opinion that joe biden, i'm not sure how much he's taking advantage of it right now. what do you make of his messaging on taxes? he's saying the very wealthy need to pay their share. >> if you look at the polling, i saw some polling that biden and the democrats have an advantage on taxes. that's never been the case. >> never. ever. >> education and health care. things like taxes, they're down. i do think the message is

sinking in. you see the president today in pennsylvania hammering on this. i think they understand it's fruitful, this kind of kitchen table stuff does matter to folks, particularly when there are like more than a trillion dollars on the line in 2025 or the expiration for some of the wealthiest people, including folks the 1500 wealthiest estates in america who have a lot of money on the line i don't think are particularly sympathetic heroes in the national political conversation. >> you talk a lot about how the trial in new york won't play in many ways the way trump thinks it will. i wonder if his trials in new york, which do show that the rich are treated different, like that is something you learn from this trial, this and the civil trial in which he had to come up with $175 million, which most peoplely it blurred to them. do you think that in some ways cuts against the message that trump is trying to portray and his self-portrayal? >> i think it does. i do think the verdict is going to matter more than the trial. >> yes.

>> ultimately if i had to guess. i do agree with you. generally when you're thinking about the trial, again, we sort of think about the most hard core folks. who are the people at the maga rallies? who are the people -- they're not determining the election. >> right. that's right. >> he's going to get millions and millions of votes and 42% plus, 43, 44. >> yeah. yeah. >> the occum's razor here is when you are under trial in court for felony, that's not good for your campaign. >> that's my take away. >> that's a hot take. >> very hot. >> cannot wait to hear the podcast. be sure to check out chris's special "why is this happening and coming up next, day 193 of israel's war on hamas. we break down the historical context and efforts to contain the fallout and prevent a wider

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for nearly half a century, iran and israel have engaged in a shadow war. this weekend iran launched a direct attack on israel, launching over 300 missiles and bringing u.s. -- bringing us dangerously close to world war iii. up to this point, iran relied on proxies like hezbollah, iraq, iraqi militias, and yemen's houthis to attack. it was set in motion by israel, whose military struck an iranian diplomatic compound in syria earlier this month. that attack killed 11 people, including two generals from the islamic revolutionary guard. an explicit violation of territorial sovereignty and norms. while israel did not take credit for the attack, it was attributed to israel. some have called it a political distraction for benjamin

netanyahu, who up until this weekend was under pressure from the international community over the ongoing famine in gaza, its failure to achieve its war objective, it's attack on the world central kitchen aid worker, and propressure from israeli protesters to seal a hostage deal. the 2015 iran nuclear deal, which had a diplomatic component, was killed by donald trump. a move that netanyahu openly campaigned for, including in the u.s. capitol. the death of the deal pushed iran even further away from the u.s. and europe and deeper into the embrace of russia and china, which have turned a blind eye to iran's nuclear ambitions. joining me now is the executive vice president of the quincy institute for responsible state craft. it's always good to talk to you, where do we stand now with no iran nuclear deal, really no relationship to build on with iran and this new state of cold war, near war between iran and israel. >> it's an extremely dangerous

situation, of course, and the united states has far less leverage over iran than it could have had had the iran nuclear deal -- had it remained in place or if biden had actually revived it, which he had a chance to do earlier on. you pointed out very correctly that this has pushed iran in the direction of russia and china. i don't believe the iranians will support russia and ukraine had it not been for the fact they had very little to lose because almost all trade, all connections between iran and the west have been essentially ended during the trump period because of this maximum pressure sanctions period. now we're in a situation in which we have to wait and see what the israelis do because if they retaliate against the iranian retaliation, we're going to be in a truly bad situation. particularly if it's an open attack against iran's facilities. >> and the frightening thing is that it does feel like all the incentives for netanyahu are to escalate the conflict, because

it has turned the u.s. attention away from the carnage in gaza and toward more sort of, you know, tough talk against iran. jake sullivan, the national security advisor, has said there will be new iran sanctions imposed within a few days on the missile and drone programs. it's turned u.s. attention back where, i would argue, probably netanyahu wants it to be. >> absolutely. so tactically he is benefitting from this escalation and enlargement of the war, but we also have to keep in mind, strategically this is the direction that netanyahu, as well as other israeli prime ministers, have been pushing the u.s. for the last two decades. i mean, netanyahu pushed very hard to try to get the united states to go to war with iran and was rejected both by the bush administration, by the obama administration, and believe it or not, even under trump when he tried at one point, trump pushed back against it. so this has been a long-term strategic objective for hip, and he may very well see this as the

best opportunity yet that he has to actually start a larger war that drags the u.s. into it. >> and where does putin stand in this? he is apparently urging iran to, you know, not escalate, which is interesting gwynn what he's doing in ukraine, but he seems to be a big beneficiary of all of this. >> just as you pointed out that netanyahu has benefitted from the attention going away from gaza, you can just imagine how much the russians have benefitted from almost all attention going away from ukraine, not just because of this last episode but because of the gaza war as a whole, which i think is another reason as to why pushing for a ceasefire early on would have been the strategic right thing to do. the russians are benefitting from this in many different ways. they're moving much closer to the iranians. it's not just about the larger political situation, it's also in terms of the manner in which they're testing various weapons and reverse engineering american weapons that they have gotten ahold of through the ukrainians

and actually have sent to the iranians for them to reverse engineer. >> very quickly, what leverage does the u.s., in your view, still have with netanyahu, with the israelis? >> i think it's absolutely clear that the u.s.'s leverage is immense. this retaliation was not designed to inflict damage but show what iranians are capable of doing. they got seven ballistic missiles through. but the vast majority of the projectiles that were shot down were shot down by the united states. israel could not have done it this way on its own so. the united states has tremendous leverage. it's time that we use it to put an end to this war. >> trita parsi, thank you so much. all in with chris hayes starts now. tonight on all in -- >> gettysburg, gettysburg,