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tv   Alex Wagner Tonight  MSNBC  April 9, 2024 6:00pm-7:00pm PDT

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prosecution. the presidents alleged criminal scheme to overturn an election and for the peaceful transfer of power to his lawfully elected successor is the paradigmatic example of conduct that should not be immunized, even if other conduct should be. i read that i was like, yeah, well said. >> absolutely. and their amicus briefs saying that including by our friend judge michael ludovic and other conservative jurists and legislators saying, you know what? you don't have to answer difficult questions where this might be a close case because this is not a close case. >> thank you very much, i appreciate it. that's all in on this to >>, alex wagner starts tonight. >> thank you for a great show. are you a man above the age of 18? do you live in arizona?
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have you joined your local criminal hunting posse? because it is actually required by law that men in arizona join a local criminal hunting posse, i'm quoting straight from the compiled laws of the territory of arizona from 1864 to 1871. every male person about 18 years of age who shall neglect or refuse to join the posse, that would be citizens of law enforcement committees by neglecting or refusing to aid and assist in taking or resting any person shall be fined in any sum not less than $80 nor more than $1000. so, join the posse or fork over maybe as much as thousand dollars. here's another law from the same compendium, on the sale of liquor to indigenous people. any person has been guilty or selling or giving spirit to slicker to any indian within this territory should be fine for the first offense, $25.
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totally racist, totally outdated, but again, that is arizona law, circa 1864 and here's another one on animal theft. every person who shall brand or deface the mark or brand of any horse, mayor, colt, mule, sheep, goat, or pig that is not his or her own property shall be punished by imprisonment in the territorial prison for a term not less than one year nor more than five years. now, if you are wondering, a shout is like a preteen. and do not deface its brand or you might find yourself in the arizona clink for up to five years those were the laws of the land in arizona in the mid- to-late 1800s. at the time, arizona was not yet a state. it would not become one for another five decades. but it was an important
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american territory. in 1862 the confederacy and the union fought for control of arizona and the union won at the height of the civil war, when states and territories like arizona looked something like this. dirt roads with horse-drawn buggies and only white men had the right to vote. in 1864, slavery was not yet abolished, and the question of whether the united states would remain united and free, was being answered in a war that wouldn't end until 1865 and would result in the deaths of more than 600,000 americans, two thirds of whom died from infectious diseases, not artillery fire, and that's because in the 1860s, doctors were still figuring out what germs were. it was not yet common practice for doctors to wash their hands before surgery or when delivering a baby. 1864 was before doctors knew
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how reproductive -- reproduction worked on a cellular level with the eggs and the sperm. and it was under those conditions where basic reproduction was still a mystery, where basic medical protocols were not in place and all men had to be part of something called posse comitatus, it was under those conditions in 1864 that legislators in the arizona territory past a near-total ban on abortion, punishing anyone who performed an abortion with up to five years in prison. today, arizona supreme court upheld that 160-year-old law. the court determined that the dobbs decision, that civil war era abortion ban is still in effect. the decision overturned arizona's already restrictive 15 week abortion ban from the year 2022, and it replaced it with that law from the
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antebellum period after dobbs, abortion advocates later said the supreme court ruling set the country back 50 years to the day before roe was decided in 1973 but in reality, states like arizona, have been set back more than 160 years, to the days before women could vote and before america outlawed slavery. in the wake of the arizona courts ruling, the state democratic officials swiftly condemned this decision. >> it is a dark day in arizona. the near-total civil war era band that continues to hang over our heads, only serves to create more chaos for women and doctors in our state. >> let me be completely clear. as long as i am attorney general of the state of arizona, no woman or doctor will be prosecuted under this
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draconian law. >> this is going to criminalize doctors for doing their jobs and it's going to have a devastating effect on the health and freedom of women in arizona. >> so now the question is what happens next. the implementation of this law will be delayed as the decision is appealed but depending on the outcome, pregnant women face a harsh new reality in the south because it's not just the women of arizona here, it's women seeking abortion access in places like texas, women who were already traveling to arizona to get that abortion care and now an entire region of this country could be going dark. 160 years after the civil war, we are witnessing a resurgent confederacy of antiabortion states . in arizona, choice advocates are already working to ensure that voters get a chance to decide this november
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on a ballot initiative that will enshrine the right to an abortion in the state constitution. the advocates have already collected 500,000 signatures, which is 120,000 more than they need to get abortion on the ballot and now, that vote will be more critical than ever. republicans have put the future of abortion access on the line, in a critical swing state in an election year. join me now is democratic senator mark kelly from arizona. senator, thank you for joining me tonight. you knew the complicated dynamics around what happens next better than most. we know the attorney general chris mays had said that she will not prosecute women or doctors who are involved in abortion, she was granted that right by the governor of the state. are you optimistic about you
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know, sort of women's prospects that they are seeking abortion care given that stipulation or does it matter? >> let me start, alex, by saying, that this is in unmitigated disaster for women in the state of arizona. they deserve to be able to make this choice themselves, not from a politician in washington, or the state supreme court and that ended today. let's be clear how this happened. this is because of donald trump, who he appointed to the supreme court, and ending roe versus wade. a law that was on the books for a decade. so this is a really bad day in arizona. to answer your question, yeah, i heard with the attorney general has said and that's certainly a positive thing but in 14 days, abortion clinics and health clinics are going to close, doctors are going to flee the state, and that puts women at risk.
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>> do you have any amount of optimism, you talk about the 14 day window about the appeals process, this, for anybody who is watching what is happening in the state of arizona, this is so appalling and so out of step with the modern era, that one wonders how in appeals court could let it stand but then the supreme court made the decision, so i just wonder about your level of optimism? >> not a lot, the supreme court has ruled they had some questions for the lower court. certainly here in the next 14 days, the 160-year-old law, this was 50 years before arizona was even, keep in mind, this legislation or this, this, law that's 160 years old, could send doctors to jail for just trying to help women and give them the healthcare they need. so, i want to be clear about this. this would not view the
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situation in arizona if donald trump didn't essentially call for roe v wade to be overturned. he talked about that yesterday. we need to find a path forward. >> it's the conservative judiciary. what is this due to the political dynamics in an election year, given the way abortion, whenever it is litigated at the ballot box, redounds to the benefit of people in favor of choice, what does this do for the broader dynamics going into november? >> i think the first thing we've got to be concerned about is the healthcare for women in the state. it's been hard already since roe was overturned. outspoken to doctors who provided women's healthcare who have left the state already, they've moved to nevada, they've moved on to other
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states, so the options for women have decreased, that's going to get worse with what happened today. we do have an opportunity in november to codify the right for women to make this choice on their own, to get the politics out of it. i hope that passes, i expect it will. i will be fighting for it. and we will look for other avenues to try and fix this between now and election day. >> senators are frequently expected to be boosters for their own states. and i wonder what you say to the residents of your state and those that are looking at your state today, about what has happened, this is the most draconian, regressive reproductive health bill, health law in the country, by a longshot. >> let's start with, elections matter, the election in 2016 certainly have an impact on
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women's healthcare in the state of arizona and other states for that matter, across the country the sea. with the election of the former president. we are going to make sure that joe biden wins arizona, and gets reelected, and from somebody who served in the navy for 25 years, we can right the ship. so elections do matter, there are ways to fix this. you know, not a good day for arizona but we also had a good announcement yesterday with the chips and science act grant money for the semiconductor industry. but today, you know, it was the opposite of that. it was a very disappointing day. >> senator mark kelly, thank you so much for your time. we appreciate it. i want to turn now to the white house press secretary karine jean-pierre. i know the president had a statement on this. he said this ruling was a result of the extreme agenda of republican elected officials who are committed to ripping
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away women's freedom. when republicans try and rip away women's freedoms, it doesn't usually go well for them. why are they so committed to this issue? >> look, it's a question for them certainly to answer but i want to just lay out what the senator said, senator kelly who was just on right before me. he laid out what this means for women in arizona. what we saw today it is wrong, it is shameful. it is dangerous, what women now and arizona are going to have to go through. there are 21 extreme state bands across the country, across the country. and it is because of what elected officials have been able to do. the started with the dobbs decision. the start with the overturning of roe versus wade. what we are seeing today in arizona and states across the
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country, is the republicans plan on abortion, and here's the thing, alex, they can't run away from it, they can't turn away from it or hide from it. this is theirs. the reason that we are in the situation right now, is because the former president put judges along with the help of senate republicans, put judges on the supreme court to overturn roe v wade, what was a constitutional right for almost 50 years, now, we have these types of bands across the country that takes it very difficult for women to get healthcare, they get turned away from saving procedures and getting life-saving procedures, they get turned away from emergency rooms, they are banning ivf in trying to criminalize doctors. this is they're doing. and so, they own this now and what the president is trying to do and you heard this in his statement and you heard him say this over and over again. they want to protect women's rights, women's right to make a choice on their own bodies.
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it is something that they should make a choice on. and so, we will continue to fight and say hey, you know what? we need to legislate this issue, make sure that roe v wade becomes the law of the land and you said something during the interview with the center, which is, every time, every time abortion is on the ballot, ohio, michigan, kansas, kentucky, california, vermont, every time it's on the ballot, the majority of americans vote to protect our reproductive freedoms. vote to protect a woman's right to choose. that's what we've seen. we are standing on the side of the majority of americans, and we are in lockstep with them and republicans, they don't seem to care what the majority of americans care about, making sure that our freedoms are protected. >> i do wonder, apart from urging americans to vote and exercising their democratic rights, and criticizing republicans for their decision
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to as the white house is, rip away women's freedoms, is there anything this administration can do to protect federal employees, military service members in arizona? is there any sort of you know, oasis, if you will, for reproductive freedom that can be established by the federal government in a moment like this? >> the president, on day one when dobbs was decided and roe was overturned, he cited two executive orders to do everything we can from the hhs perspective and doj to do what we can to protect women as they are just trying to get healthcare, make decisions on their own body but really the best way to move forward is to get legislation done. now, we are going to continue to stand with our partners, state partners, to do everything that we can, they are the ones who are on the front lines to make sure that women are getting access, obviously we will stand with
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them. we've got to get legislation done. and as i stated, every time, i can't speak to 2024, can't talk about an upcoming election as a federal employee so i don't want to get into predictions here but i can talk about what we've seen in the past, and as i mentioned, i listed out a bunch of states that have had an abortion ballot initiative in that election, in that election year and what we've seen is the majority of americans stand for protecting reproductive rights. so that's what we have seen and so, it is shameful that now in arizona, this decision that is made, we are going back to 1964 -- >> 18! not even. >> not even, 1864, and you did such a great job laying out what was going on during that time, and that's what we are, that's where we are right now. in arizona, so, this is a really horrific day, a sad day
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for the women of arizona but that's what we are seeing in many states across the country. and so, we have to stand with women across the country. we have to stand for our freedoms and that's what you're going to see from this administration. >> it's worth noting that republican lawmakers in arizona are currently blocking a bill that would protect contraception in the state. >> and in the dobbs decision we heard them, they said, that's what they were going to go after next. contraception. it wasn't just going to stop at overturning roe, and they've kept their promise. >> i know just really quickly, the republican party likes to call itself the party of family values and the president did something today that i know the white house once to talk about which is how we actually take care of our families as a country, as individuals.
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you want to talk a little bit about the moves that this administration is making on that front? >> when you think about the care economy, the president had an event to lift that up and he has done, really, the biden/harris administration has done transformational investment in healthcare, paid leave, and he signed the care plan which is the first piece of legislation that he signed into law. all of that is an investment in our childcare, paid leave and here's the thing, americans across the country should not have to make a difficult decision sometimes they do have to make which is, do they take care of their parents who raised them or do they take care of their child russian mark we should not have to make those types of decision so the president understands that and he's made those investments and what this will lead to as well is making tax cuts for workers, people who truly need a little bit of breathing room, a little bit of that dignity that the president talks about and what you see from republicans, republicans, it's a complete
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contrast. they put forward a budget, alex, that cuts medicare, social security, healthcare, paid leave, all of the things that workers, everyday people need. they want to do dramatic cuts to those really important programs and they do it because they want to give a tax cut to billionaires and corporations. that's not how we see how to move forward. the president has always been clear, he wants to build an economy that is from the bottom up and the metal out. >> any new programs have to be run under the 1864 test. were they doing it in the run up to the end of the civil war, if not, we are not going to pass it. thank you, my friend, for your time tonight. coming up, donald trump's attempts to delay his manhattan trial today got shot down by a judge in what may be a new land
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speed record. we will explain but first it was just yesterday the presumptive republican nominee said abortion was best left to the states and today, one of the state upheld an abortion law that predated the end of the civil war. we will discuss the republican plan to tackle abortion when the new york times janel billy joins me next. have suicida ts. problems, don't take if r are taking reserpine, tetrabenazine, or valbenazine. austedo xr may cause irregular or fast heartbeat, or abnormal movements. seek help for fever, stiff muscles, problems thinking, or sweating. common side effects include inflammation of the nose and throat, insomnia and sleepiness. ♪as you go with austedo♪
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today, arizona's highest court, for men and two women all appointed by republicans decided that when given the option of a 15 week abortion ban past two years ago and a near-total abortion ban past 160 years ago, they decided to go with the civil war era band. that follows the decision last week from florida's right- leaning state supreme court allowing a six-week bandit take effect next month in that state.
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and that really came on the heels of alabama supreme court that said conservatives scrambling when it ruled that embryos our children which in turn upended ivf treatment across the state. and yesterday, donald trump attempted to neutralize what is becoming a major campaign issue for him by saying he would leave abortion up to the states pay but today we saw yet again, what happens when abortion is left up to the states, particularly conservative states with conservative judiciaries, the outcomes are extreme and for most republicans, they are politically disastrous. joining me now is jamelle bouie new york times opinion columnist. yesterday a lot of people were saying, trump, his middle line, though i would beg to differ, is a good piece of strategy, that was monday, today, we see what happens in arizona and i just wonder whether you still think leaving it up to the states is a good strategy for him to pursue? >> i think it is the only strategy for him to pursue because a national ban is just so toxic with most voters but it it's also clear that leaving it up to the states is really leaving it up to the whims of
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in this case, a packed republican supreme court in arizona, so, that's what leaving it to the states means. i think voters, most people, are kind of aware of that, they can see that happening but as far as trump is concerned, not really any place for him to go other than oak, we have to leave it to the states. >> it seems like it's the harvest of the multi-decade project of the far right which is to inject conservative christian principles into the judiciary. you see them in alabama, these judges are in arizona, and florida who are on influential benches or in smaller areas in texas, who get to make these
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giant decisions, that have statewide import. it feels like the dog that cut the car, this is what you get. >> i think there's an interesting thing going on here where i'm not sure, conservatives, the project was we are going to capture the judiciary and through the judiciary, we will impose our preferred you know, social order, are preferred moral order on the rest of the country and that is going to require winning elections, but they never ran on this promise to do this but it's kind of a bait and switch. so i think the thing that conservatives and republicans are running into is it is one thing to win elections, it's one thing to be able to appoint the judges but you still actually do need some degree of popular by into your project.
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and that just doesn't exist. and, i don't think republicans or conservatives really know how to deal with it whatsoever, and a risk in the situation, like all of these gains they've made are reversed by the backlash against them. >> i wonder as a piece of political theater, because you know that trump doesn't really have any other space to play in but to suggest this be put back to the states. do you think, i mean, do you think that convinces the people it needs to convince because he certainly has the levers to and abortion nationally without passing a federal abortion ban, they could just go back to the comstock act of the late 1800s and decide to enforce that and no abortion medication can be mailed in the u.s. post. do you think it's suddenly a sort of nod to a different way about abortion, do you think generally this will convince the people that trump does not want to and it nationally?
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>> i think if he gets another term in office he will try and and it nationally, that's what the coalition behind him once and there's no evidence is going to push back against that. i think as far as trying to persuade the public that you know, i'm not going to ban abortion, it's one thing for us to recognize this in terms of politics but for the public to sort of believe that trump is not going to do it. i think, there's one thing going in his favor, and that is, people generally don't believe that donald trump has any particular personal problem with abortion. people believe, oh, he is totally a guy who's probably paid for an abortion, that's how people perceive him. and that perception really helps in terms of him trying to distance himself from republicans like ron desantis or mike pence, but the thing that is working against him is that every day, we get new stories of the horrors that
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happens when women cannot get access to reproductive healthcare. when they can't get access to abortion care and those stories resonate with people across the country. many people have their own stories, and trump can't escape that. also, democrats are clearly going to work very hard to remind voters and tell voters again and again, with trump's help, that trump is responsible for the state of affairs. he appointed the judges that overturned roe versus wade. he has been a loyal foot soldier for this cause of banning abortion. >> all rose -- all roads and at dobbs. jamelle bouie, thank you for joining me tonight. coming up, 99% of the $3 billion of money flowing into jared kushner's investment fund is coming from foreign sources but that should not alarm anyone, according to jared
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kushner. we will talk to ben rhodes about the real-world implications of that the first, it took a new york judge all of 12 minutes to throw out translates legal challenge. what happened in the manhattan criminal trial is coming up next. so goo ." makes my day. prevagen. at stores everywhere without a prescription. nothing is more important than family.
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he has been denied, again.
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to efforts by former president trump to delay his upcoming hush money trial in new york have been shot down in the last 24 hours. on monday, team trump asked for a delay so the trial venue could be moved out of manhattan, that appeal was denied in just two hours. and today, trump asked for a stay in order to challenge a partial gag order imposed last week by judge marshon. he took all of 12 minutes to reject that one. joining me now is kristi greenberg former deputy chief of the criminal division for the southern district of new york. you know, this is kind of like an obvious observation but how has this trial just stayed on track, what has the judge done that could be i don't know, useful to other judges in handling their own cases are what sets this case apart it's
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really full steam ahead. >> i think in one circumstance it's a discrete set of facts, and every motion that comes up, every time they try and through a motion his way, he rules on them very quickly he disposes of them quickly, he doesn't just sit on his hands like we've seen in florida, like in new york, he is moving things along and it's easy because some of many of these motions are frivolous and when you have a frivolous motion it should be easier to dismiss it. >> there seems to be a uniform new york judicial stance that like trump's attempts here are bogus, and it is widely accepted that they are bogus. >> this should take 12 minutes, right? this is oh, he has a first amendment right to attack the
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family members of the court and the district attorney, that such a laughable argument. you should be laughed out of court if you make that argument. >> there are some legitimate areas of tension between the prosecution and the defense. one of them is around a subpoena that trump's team would like to serve to mark pomerantz, the das office does not want, they want to squash this, basically. pomerantz is a real person of interest. can you talk to me about why and hot how he might be useful? >> so i actually don't think he will be as useful as they would like him to be. so a few days ago, trump's team served a subpoena without notifying alan bragg's team or even asking for authorization from the court to serve a subpoena on a third party, and served it just a few days ago and is asking for a number of things, and ultimately, mark pomerantz, when he was running this before alvin bragg came he was the special assistant district attorney running the investigation. you know, presumably he has a lot of information, email's, a lot of memos that he wrote. in his view of the prosecution
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but all of that was turned over to the da, when he resigned quite some time ago and as the da points out, look, we've talked to him and said, do you have anything on your personal devices, do you have anything that we don't already have an in their opposition to the subpoena, they lay out, look here's all the efforts we made to get him, here's his affirmation saying he gave us everything and there's nothing that he has that you don't already have. so again, i think the subpoena is not going anywhere for the trump team. >> i get the das office thinks that it has exhausted any potential evidence but pomerantz stands as a figure for those who don't believe that the bragg investigation is as credible as perhaps da bragg would like to believe that it is. pomerantz left in, what would you call it, there's long documented tension between him and da bragg's office over this
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case in particular. >> it feels like trump is trying to use them as a weapon to get under da bragg's skin? >> yes, their emotions about what arguments could be made, what evidence could be shown to the jury and mark pomerantz, his views, just like sdny's views, none of that is coming before the jury. the judge has already ruled over a month ago that all of that evidence is not permissible evidence that gets before the jury. and mark pomerantz, his issue with bragg was that he wasn't being aggressive or not. and now alvin bragg after that book came out, charge the case. so, you know i think the pressure points, yeah, where their interpersonal issues, probably, it seems like in just reading his book he's got a lot of digs at alvin bragg along the way but none of that is relevant evidence for the trial and i don't think any of that
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will be coming up but i agree with you, that is what they are looking for. >> needling. you talked about the jury, jury questionnaires went out today. there are no questions about you know, whether who people voted for in the 2020 election but there is questions about news media consumption and whether or not they consider themselves members of qanon or antifa. how unusual are these questions and do you feel like it's sufficient evidence to find out what channels someone watches and whether or not that gives an accurate window into things? >> those questions about where you consume your news media are pretty standard. any trial i had, we asked those kind of questions. these are interesting because it's do you also follow truth social, have you read pomerantz
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, the book, given how much there is out there about these facts already, it does make it somewhat unique and different from other criminal cases but i think the judge was right to say, who you voted for, what political party you are affiliated with, whether you have donated, those are questions don't bear on whether or not you have a clear bias. you could be a republican and still listen to the evidence, put aside who you think the president should be and be fair and impartial. that's a possibility. he's allowing for that in his questionnaire. >> there is evidence of people who are diehard supporters for trump, and we saw that in the e. jean carroll case, one of the jurors identified as somebody who listened to more right wing media consumption, and that was a unanimous jury in e. jean carroll's favor. it is possible. >> we will find out what
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happens in just a few days. coming up, what is jared kushner, what does he have to do with burger king? a lot, as it turns out. that is next. is next our mission is to employ people with different abilities. tiktok is allowing us to show what acceptance looks like. this is a community of just complete and utter love. it's the people that lift you up when you're down. people on tiktok do that on a daily basis, and i've never found a community like that ever. keep tiktok. >> tech: at safelite, we'll take care of fixing your windshield. but did you know we can take care of your insurance claim? that means less stress for you. >> woman: thanks. >> tech: my pleasure. have a good one. >> woman: you too. >> tech: schedule today at safelite.com. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪
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that's why i love my swiffer wetjet. it's a quick and easy way to get my floors clean. wetjet absorbs and locks grime deep inside. look at that! swiffer wetjet. burger king in brazil has a few things burger king and the u.s. does not like and you milkshake, putin made with
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brazilian cheese and jerry kushner, you heard me right, today the new york times reported that jared kushner's investment fund is now a major investor in burger king in brazil. now this deal does not just complicate kushner's relationship with the country of brazil because kushner's fund didn't actually invest in burger king's directly, what it actually did was team up with a subsidiary of the government -controlled sovereign wealth fund of the united arab emirates to buy brazilian burger king stock. his investment group affinity partners has been entangled with foreign interests since its inception when it received a $2 billion investment from saudi arabia's sovereign fund. thanks to great reporting the times, we have got an example after example of how trump's son-in-law's investment group isn't as problematic on the fundraising side but is also
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raising ethical questions about where it is investing. for instance, one might take issue with how kushner is working to complete a government-backed deal in serbia, where, according to a draft agreement reviewed by the times, kushner's fund would get a 99 year lease at no charge, so it could build a luxury hotel and apartment complex on the site of the former nato bombing or, one might take issue with his investment group negotiating the lease of a government owned island in albania, to build this luxury hotel. and if you think how much this the u.s. government really interact with the place like albania, anyway? and kushner's partner is a part owner of the israeli navy's only domestic builder of warships. because the u.s. providing israel with billions in military aid it means in donald trump
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retakes office he would be in a position to directly help or hurt his son-in-law's business partner. it is all not a great look. we are going to talk about what kushner's foreign ties mean for trump and american policy with ben roads after the break.
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her uncle's unhappy. i'm sensing an underlying issue. it's t-mobile. it started when we tried to get him under a new plan. but they they unexpectedly unraveled their “price lock” guarantee. which has made him, a bit... unruly. you called yourself the “un-carrier”. you sing about “price lock” on those commercials.
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“the price lock, the price lock...” so, if you could change the price, change the name! it's not a lock, i know a lock. so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that's uncalled for. . right after don sdoon left office, the office of the director of national intelligence released a report finding thatted vr the saudi crown prince ordered the murder of jamal khashoggi. the wealth fund then went against the objections of its own panel of risk advisers and invested in eye popping $2 billion in jared kushner's investment firm an investment that makes up a large percent of the 99 percent in foreign
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funding kushner received to launch his group affinity partners. joining me is ben rhodes former national security adviser under president obama. thank you for being here with me. as you look at it from i asort of foreign policy perspective, how does kushner's entanglement with mbs compromise potentially, i don't know, the foreign policy platform of his father-in-law who is running to be the next president of the united states? >> well, in a word entirely, alex. look, this is not subtle corruption that we are looking at. this is a guy jared kushner who had no expertise no qualification to be in the white house. while he was there, he made it his account to work in the gulf arab states. he basically helped lead the cover up for mbs, get him in from the cold after the murder of kamal khashoggi and the
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saudis didn't make the investment because they trusted in jared's investment expertise does anyone believe that $2 billion is based on an assessment is jared kushner is who you want to give your money to to make a return? no, what he can do for them if there is a second trump term and what we can take from that investment in a second trump term u.s. foreign policy in the middle east and around the world will be made with the interests of bin solomon in mind. >> he is cutting money from the cutleries who finance hamas and have a different role to play in the middle eastern conflict instead of israeli business some are in business with the manufacturers of war machines or at least the few war machines that are made in israel. do you think that complicates this in a way that neutralizes the issue?
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how do you see that the fact he is equally invested or they are equalled invested with him the qataris and the israelis? it means it's all for sale it is an action. this is how other countries work. more corrupt smaller countries wear the president's son-in-law is down the hall. what you have is whoever is the highest bidder gets whatever they want. except in this case, it's the global superpower, the united states of america. and so i think what you can take from what saudi arabia and qatar and other countries are doing they believe based on their experience with the first trump term and the expectations for the second that american foreign policy is for sale. and whoever comes in with the highest price get what is they want. >> and what is so clear in the reporting these relationships that kushner cashed outpost presidency were forged during the trump administration.
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as a former administration official can you talk to me how out of the ordinary that kind of relationship building is inside of the white house? >> well, i mean you could tell at the time what he was doing. he made it a point to work on these accounts. and, look, what is very clear here, is that jared kushner he chose certain issues to work on when he whats in the white house. he chose on issues in the middle east and the gulf arab states knowing that the pay out would be on the back end. and part is what is so grotesque is there's literally an impeachment inquiry going on now in search of a rationale that doesn't exist that hunter biden used his connection to his father to profit when joe biden was vice-president. and here we have the son-in-law had who worked in the white house, who collected $2 billion on the back end of his service. and now, he's got his
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father-in-law running for the president of the united states. this is not only unusual it's unprecedented putting a price tag on american foreign policy. it is a level of corruption that we've never seen and this is hiding in plain sight. 99% of his investors come from out of the united states that is saying that i'm set up an investment fund designed to get me and my family rich based on the fact that people are going to be purchasing influence in a second trump term, while rewarding jared kushner for services rendered in the first term when he ran interference after he murdered somebody an american a u.s. person a "washington post" journalist in a consulate in turkey. >> we will leave it there. to be continued. jared kushner not saying he is not going into service. ben rhodes thank you for your time. that is our showtime for the last word with lawrence

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