>> thanks for making time for ♪ ♪ ♪ the l'or barista coffee and espresso system. a masterpiece in taste us tonight, catch a man back giannis and d.c. saturdays at eight and sundays a nine. follow us on twitter, tiktok, instagram, all at eamonn msnbc. don't go anywhere. 58 years fly, the rise fall and revolution of hip of fashion starts right now on msnbc. and streaming on peacock. i'm -- in new york, tonight.

♪ ♪ ♪ >> a group swimming in the river, the harbor had a dark. you had to know which way the current was so you could walk out of there. we used to take a popsicle and throw it in the river to see which way the current was going. fashion is such that you have to pay attention to the current, it's always moving. i can't control that river. just see which way the current is going and then you dive in. when you talk about fashion, you have to talk about hip-hop. >> the style of hip-hop has always been more progressive and cooler than anything else in the industry. >> hip-hop is a culture, it's about music, it's about fashion, it's about art, it's about

entertainment. >> it's colorful, it's exciting, and it's telling a story. it's fabulous. it's ghetto fabulous. >> if he was going to determine the future. look what we have today. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> growing up in new york city in the early 70s and 80s was a very exciting time. >> it was electric. it was powerful. it was totally graffiti on the trains, it was kids saying we are here, this is who we are. it was a place where we were

expressing ourselves, and finding ourselves. >> you go up a 120th street, or you go down to the village on main street, it is like a fashion show. >> back in the day, hip-hop in fashion, the street was your one way. hip-hop club culture was our early internet, because that is how we communicated, that's how people saw what you are wearing. >> have saved my life at a young age. this is where you live, this thing called hip-hop was being created at the time. we don't really understand, we were at the forefront of it, but it made us feel good and kind of connected everybody together. >> there were a couple of rap acts out, but nobody had equipment. nobody had money for equipment in new york city. it is very costly. and then there was the blackout. >> at 9:34 last night, it all went black. streets, homes, hotels, theaters, restaurants, and the

blackout hit manhattan. >> the next day, miraculously, everybody had equipment to become djs. i'm not sure how they all got that equipment during the blackout, but that just spread, and before you know it now we had this culture where you did not have to be able to play an instrument. you are able to be poets of what was going on in your world. what started in the bronx was hip-hop, made its way into the queens, and out of the small little area of new york city, came out, i don't know how many hip-hop artists. salt and pepper, tribe called quest, lost boys, onyx, 50 cent, general. >> one of the biggest things that made hippo culture resonate is that it was not asking for permission from anybody. it was just being 100% unapologetically itself. >> when a kid picks up a

microphone and talks about what he or she has witnessed, and what he or she wants to see in the world, everyone can relate to that. they were trying to solve a lot of the inner city problems by saying that when we get together, and we want to settle a beef instead of fighting, why don't we have musical battles, which are break dancing. this crew is better than what that one. it started to take on fashion because if you're doing when males, you can't have pants that are baggy because they're going to hit each other on the bottom. you have to taper the pants and bring them in. graffiti was an area to, marking territories. then it went to the close, the clothes influenced the music, the music influenced the clothes, it was a very symbiotic relationship between all elements of hip-hop. >> when i think of hip-hop, i think of doing it differently. i think that customization was one of the truest and purist

forms of that in fashion. >> he was a lot of competition at a young age to look fresh and different. kids used to make fun of you a, lot good-looking, old sneakers, that's what kind of inspired us. >> i was already in the parts listening to the doj's, but what we didn't have was a place to go and buy the uniforms. we would go to the stores, buy things, and manipulate. it would tear them up and make it our own. >> i remember one day, as me and my friends were competing with each other in fashion, i thought about my dad's -- i want to make an outfit a little bit baggier than what we were wearing at the time. he was like, no problem i got you. he loosened up the legs, make the outfit a sick exactly how i wanted it. when i wear that day one, and one was like, that's cool, would you get it from? we started making clothing, i started selling to my friends. one thing led to another and people started to come up to me

asking for these outfits. street where into pop has always been about being braggadocious. aspiring to be the best, aspiring to have everything that you want in life. >> t in life. >> no... cashbacking. word. we're talking about cashbacking. cashbacking. cashbacking. cashback like a pro with chase freedom unlimited. how do you cashback? when moderate to severe ulcerative colitis keeps flaring, put it in check with rinvoq, a once-daily pill. when uc got unpredictable, i got rapid symptom relief with rinvoq. and left bathroom urgency behind. check. when uc got in my way, i got lasting, steroid-free remission with rinvoq. check. and when my gastro saw damage, rinvoq helped visibly repair the colon lining. check. rapid symptom relief. lasting, steroid-free remission. and a chance to visibly repair the colon lining. check. check. and check. rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tb. serious infections and blood clots, some fatal; cancers, including lymphoma and skin cancer;

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♪ ♪ ♪ the l'or barista coffee and espresso system. a masterpiece in taste - harlem, new york isoffee the hollywood of fashion. hollywood of fashion. harlem was always the opulence, for coats, big hats, leather jackets, that entire stuff. >> how are you doing, brother? how y'all doing? we are going to the crossroads of the culture world. 115th and harlem, that's where my first store was opened up. i opened the boutique in 1982. >> my story was right here.

nest park avenue, we were all up and down this on the east side, we had the stores over here. right here. >> when people saw me with nice clothes on, they didn't know i had bats in mid building, that i could look under my sink and say hello to my neighbor. you know? all of those things vanished once you put on some nice clothes. >> dapper dan started to take the louis vuitton, gucci, those types of logos. he started to make custom seats for cars, clothes, -- >> obviously without their permission at the time. >> i said wow, if they got excited about themselves, then i can have them walking around looking like luggage. i can make more money off them symbols than i was with the crocodile, alligator suits, all of that. i started teaching myself about textile printing. that's what gave birth to what we see today, and who i am

today. if ralph lauren gives you one pony, i give you a bird. nothing that you could wear states more clearly that you have arrived then having one of those big band logos all over your body. >> the way the dapper dan used luxury labels at the time was controversial. all of the brands felt like he was stealing, copyright laws against using the brand logos in a way that they didn't approve of. to me, it was his way of saying look, if you guys don't want to be part of black culture, you guys don't want to put some of these rappers on and help them, dress them, and have them be part of the conversation, even though they are needing the fashion conversation. >> the luxury brands were like, hey, this guy is taking our prints and using them in a way that we are not happy about. >> the raid.

oh god, the raid ran me underground. >> he gets busted by sonia sotomayor, of all people. >> wonderful lady. she was doing her job. she came there and rated me, i had a fenty coat, black on black, with f's all over it. they did a cease and desist order, and while i was out of town, they raided all my facilities. i had 2000 square foot factory on a 120th street. i did three story building on 100 when you history, and 365 days a year, 24 hours a day. it never closed. all of that, all of that was gone in an instant. >> i stayed ahead of the curve. i didn't knock off, i knocked up, they weren't doing their best stuff. i went into the underground, kept making close. and that's insane, 45 years.

>> back then, no clothing companies at all were paying attention to hip-hop artists. as a matter of fact, a lot of clothing companies did one are the populous to make clothing. if they start wearing their clothing, they might deter the original crest or. >> there is a moment when black people were tired of getting credit and do, and money to all of these brands that were then ashamed of us. i think there came a turning point of wanting to create for our own. that's how it began. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> the progression of hip-hop fashion and brands can be traced pretty linearly when you think about the 80s. you think more about people like dapper dan, shirt kings

different boutiques that were really community based and neighborhood based. when you started getting into the 90s, when hip-hop was really starting to come into its own, become more commercialized, you start seeing brands like food, cross colors, mecca, carl can i. >> he had a whole different customer, a whole different vibe. we carved out a whole nation that nobody saw coming. here's a part of who we were. we single-handedly changed the fit in a direction of young men's fashion. our small was rough lawrence extra large. we figured out that we have to get exposure. we were home watching the tv one day. we saw these wrap videos on mtv. like, you sure get to these guys, what is he wearing? he needs to be wearing our clothing on their. we contacted everybody out is that we saw in envy mtv doing a video to connect with them.

keep in mind back then, dudes no social media, no internet. everyone was glued to the tv. >> we weren't going to be able to sell everybody everything, but we wanted to be consistent with what was going on in the market. we would miraculously get the designs ahead of time on the colors that nike and a lot of the other brands would use. when that new burnt orange sneaker came out from nike, magically there was a hoodie with the same exact color available for you. >> trying to build a business where you can produce on a level where you can fill those orders was very challenging. >> port damon, once saw him in coming in with fabrics, trying to go up tonight into is looking at me like oh my god, what have we gotten ourselves into? >> i got turned down by 27 banks.

i said to my mother, i got turned on by 27 banks. she said, i didn't know 27 banks existed. my mother goes out to get 100,000 dollar loan on my house. i turned my house into a factory and all of a sudden i realized that $100,000 is now $500 because i was paying for rockets in 90 days ahead of time, a pink rich machines, salaries for staff, i was shipping. it is about to be homeless. if i didn't deliver all of those clothes. >> those were not business problems that the mainstream brands were facing. they had a built in infrastructure for how to do this. >> good old mom, one last idea. she put an ad in the newspaper, 1 million dollars in orders need financing. 33 people called that, at one of them was a company called same-sex textile division. they said we will manufacture and deliver your clothes, you need to sell $5 million of clothes in three years to do the deal. i did the deal with sampson, i sell $30 million worth of clothes and three months.

>> energy feeds energy. once we started making my own, we needed to see, more we needed to feel more of that. we needed to be more of that. >> one of my favorite moments in hipaa fashion is when ll cool j recorded the gap commercial. more of food, and nobody noticed. >> gap goes and asks him to perform this commercial and write the actual copied lyrics. they didn't have anybody that really believed or loved hip-hop enough to know what fubu, for us, bias, meant to us. he said can i wear this hat, he would never take his head off. he was wearing can go most of the time. they were probably happy that they weren't going to be promoting can go, or have that piece of tape on it. he puts in the room, -- >> gee ap gritty.

>> this is a clear form of rebelling within the system. the gap did their analytics and find out that the target market they were trying to hit increased 300% because the kids thought that they can get fubu at the gap. >> how easy is this? ♪ ♪ ♪ shelves smart enough to see, sense, react, restock. ♪ so caramel swirl is always there for the taking. it's easy to get lost in investment research. introducing j.p. morgan personal advisors. hey david. connect with an advisor to create your personalized plan. let's find the right investments for your goals okay, great. j.p. morgan wealth management.

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with chase freedom unlimited. (background chatter) how do you cash back? - welcome to fresh fly and fabulous, 50 years of hiphop style. - we birthed this idea several years ago >> we birthed this idea several to not only celebrate hip hop in itself years ago, not only celebrating hip-hop, and itself, this monumental occasion, but they have of style. carl was really designing for himself and his, friends realizing that there was a need for a bag year silhouette. this particular vest was when worn by tupac. >> tupac notoriously -- i'm going to be in your ads, i'm going to rock your stuff. no charge. >> i was like, to pop, how much

would you charge me to do an ad? he sits down and gets really quiet, it felt like he stayed quiet for an hour. i'm thinking to myself, dam, i should've asked him. he looks and says, yo, i want charge you for nothing. you're black, i'm not going to charge you for nothing. it's just the way he was, he wanted to support the business. he knew what we were faced against, he knew how competitive this fashion ship was. >> it is intentional, making sure that i was there. i think everything was the fact that i see what i want the world to see. he said it is important because -- not that many people knew that the head of it was a woman. she didn't want it to be perceived as a women's line, because she designed for men. >> when we started, being an entrepreneur was not sexy. people are, like are you crazy? and then on top of that, being

a woman. you know? it was definitely a men's world, totally. never done this for validation of others. i do it for my community, but i also do it because it feeds my soul. and committed to the process and my purpose. >> another important american brandon hip-hop is tommy hill figure. snoop dogg is really excited by the brand, and so they gave him clothing. he wore this piece on snl in 1984. >> a very important moment for tommy jeans. because at that critical moment, the saw tremendous uptick in sales. that is direct correlation between the power of hip-hop and artist, in the brands. >> people like tommy hill figure, some of those early mainstream brands that started to embrace hip-hop culture.

they were the connector for them, how it became a global phenomenon. >> they hip-hop community embraced me. they understood fashion, they understood the vibe. they are creating it, recreating it with different silhouettes in a way that they wore the clothes, where they wore the clothes, quincy's daughter was working for me as my stylist. she, said you have to meet my girlfriend, alia. we weren't doing women's clothes then. we took immense clothes and retailers it to fit alia. then we put her in an ad campaign. >> i've got tommy jeans, what else? he's not my dad but i've got tommy jean's. >> i know those pictures of tommy and alia -- it was bag, he is cool, not trying too hard. it just aligned perfectly with who she was already. >> it was viral, now it went

viral then. >> hip-hop is building. everyone's taking notice to hip-hop fashion in this culture. right? young white kids are, like embracing our music more and more and more. as a young lawyer could embracing the music, has it created a crossover effect in fashion. whatever rappers we're wearing, that's what they wanted to wear. >> department stores have had an interesting relationship with three. whereas the beginning, they were hesitant to participate in anything involved in the street. >> we have a larger hill to climb, because we are interpreted as definitely not fashion. we're looked at as a trend. >> when i initially went to a lot of the bigger stores, those big department stores, i got resistance, such as take the hang tag off. i was like why, weathers for african americans on there. we don't want those type of people in our store. or we don't feel like dealing with a lot of shoplifting or shoot outs in the store.

>> i think back in the days, they didn't have the guts to take a chance on hip-hop. they never thought hip-hop would last. >> is he posted to step into its power, and started to have known stars. tupac was a star, lol, biggie, they became style icons. the department store started taking note that there is an emerging customer base for these designs. >> you have relations representing black people, buying something that we would like, that we can wear. >> they go into the stores, they want to see those products, they want to shop those because they see that they want to emulate who jay-z represents to them. was that customer comes into the store, once -- retailers don't want that register to start bringing. >> 1996, 1997, we went from 3 million to about 100 and change in 98. they brought up the licenses right around 98 or 99.

we were grossing about 300 and $50 million. >> in the late 90s, you still had the fubu, carl can, is april walker, really driving the culture. then also, the mainstream brand stepping in, baby fat, these kind of brands that would set the tone for this great explosion and hip-hop fashion. >> i met my first husband when i was very young. she had a line called fat farm. she wanted to get more into fashion, we started to discuss a women's line they would be like a counterpart to fat farm. what was sexy was the girls wearing the boyfriends varsity jacket. i thought that women and their

fashions should be so much more. >> hip-hop's fashion. fashion, they go hand in hand. i'm inspired by hip-hop, and music in general. i'm trying to find that role. that is my world. >> camera and baby fat created so much space for women to feel part of everything happening in hip-hop culture. i love her, i stand her so much, she's incredible. >> she was the blueprint, she brought a sexy element to it that wasn't there before. as trying to make a place for myself, speaking for where young women were at the time. sexy and dynamic, i wanted to be bigger than life. did we say that there is not an as that that baby fat cat was not on? did we say that there was not a girl or woman that didn't have baby fat? however she looks, whatever her color, whatever her shape, it was something that i brought to the table.

so, yes we really did create a movement. we built it into a billion dollar brand. ali luxury at that time was seeming to shine a lot of what we did. it was street where, or are in fashion. i never understood why it was called. that i never knew. is it because of who made it? is it because of who buys it? is it a black thing? what is that? i think a lot of people like to use the word urban, and it's more so that you can spot it when you see, it because it is bold and brave, unapologetically black. i think that's the point. >> you have to be able to call it something, right? i'm not mad at all of these publications giving the name. >> you name it. >> fly. i just say what's fly. whatever name the young people have for it. you know all of that. it went from jiggy to fly to that's lit.

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ng bling,ca may be able to help. >> much more than bling bling, the hip hop economy transcends radio, television, film, the hip-hop transcends television, film, fashion, and more, making cashiers catching all around the world. >> evan understands have fit hip-hop fashion equal sales, equals money. everything was embellished. everything had diamonds and pearls. dripped in gold and silver chains. everything was like larger than life. >> then everybody started jumping on to it. >> every rapper suddenly has a t-shirt line, every designer is trying to have some sort of hip-hop element, which usually equals some horrible graffiti font on a t-shirt. it becomes this great

oversaturation of elements of hip-hop culture. >> anytime you have any form of true self expression in our, once corporate america finds out how they can seize it, make money off of it, they do. >> in street, where authenticity has everything. i believe that the tipping point was when everybody realized it was a commercial opportunity, and once ambition is money, that's the level of the craft, everything changes. >> you look at your data, 5 to 7 years >>. when urban brands aren't doing as, well they just say they want to be done with everybody. the process is totally moving in the other direction, -- >> i think it's a heartbreaking business if you're not prepared for it. it's like any other art form. you really need to be in it and know why. i think that we are all very young, and i think we were all

very green. >> i think a lot of the brands that started were started by creatives who maybe did not have the greatest business advice. and business acumen. >> i don't think enough of us got that memo in time. whether there was enough time before corporate america came in and said, we can take this, and they did. >> hip-hop and the luxury sector have had a very complex relationship from the start. over the years, you saw that change, you saw the luxury brands understand hip-hop's power and influence, and how they set style trends. >> seeing it confidently as a point of inspiration is fine, as long as the black creatives are being credited and brought into the company, not that we brought this person in for a capsule collection, or that we

wanted to design those sneakers. >> that's four to 2017. gucci's runway show, they seem to design down the broadway it looks very familiar. >> the famous diane dickson. there is a mahogany mink with louis vuitton sleeves. gucci covered that piece and took it down on the runway. >> when it came down the runway, people obviously became aware of the fact that somebody along the lines had put this up as information, did not realize that that was credited to somebody in the black community that they really loved and cared about. >> it is the shot heard around the world. >> the internet spoke, and gucci had to answer for it. >> which he reached out, but maybe throughout all the years, i said no, i don't trust what

was happening. i said, if they want to work with me, come to hollywood. i'm kidding. the joke. they came. i was like, oh, are they serious? well, i have to be able to continue what i'm doing. that should be able to create. they said okay. i said i have to be home, they said okay. everything, they said okay. it scared the hell out of me. as that, they gave me until the end of the year. they sent me a. >> we are at dapper dance, the italian this is a historical moment because this is gucci comes to hollywood. gucci partners with dapper dan. so, shall we start with the tour? >> i think that it was a big turning point. i think it was a cornerstone moment.

unfortunately, on the shoulders of this very complex history, because for better or worse, it's solidified that importance. >> here is one of the collective pieces in the partnership that i did with dapper dan and gucci. >> the idea of gucci even bringing him in really is the fact that so much in culture has changed, and also that people have now realized that if you don't give black designers credit for the work, but people will not support the brand. >> we gain nothing and we get bath mat and walk away. we have everything to gain. when gucci came and got me, louis vuitton had to go and get virgil. a phenomenal talent. >> with all bmi age hiring virgil to do louis vuitton, i

think they could not deny that there was a street explosion coming to the luxury world. >> virgil's ascendancy, the way that he thought, and the way that he understood fashion, street where, style elements, style history, was happening at a moment in time where the mainstream fashion world knew that they needed somebody in the position of leadership that had all of that. >> he knew what he was doing inherently because he had the vision. i think the success of them was the date where tapped into what people actually wanted, not just what luxury brands predicted that people wanted to wear. >> when i say luxury brands

have seen over the years, if this is a multi billion dollar business, and it gives them credibility. if i invite you to the show, but you in the front row, running some down with the coop. it's the doesn't mean when you look at the boardroom, how is that reflected? how are we there? how are we impacting the decisions? >> there is a line between the brands appreciating black culture and then them co-opting culture in a sense of what they do behind the scenes the changes thing. if you're only thing is bringing in a black person for six weeks and that the rest of the team isn't inclusive, i think there are going to be problems inherently. >> to sum it all up, i have people that look like the, people think like the people you served. >> even though they might have turned their nose up at us, every step of the way, they were emulating what was going

on in our hoods, our neighborhoods. >> other people would always be using various elements of our lifestyle, street style, turning it into a high fashion thing. >> you may say, they turned your their nose at us, they do, and still to this day. but there is always some aspect that i feel was being robbed. >> people said street where wasn't getting past the 90s. there is the end of it. now all of the fashion, the top designers, took all of those silhouettes, took a lot of those oversized teachers, took that look good at these to do. they took all of those things, toning down the colors a little bit, make it a little bit different. put it on the runway, do some ads with it, try to make it, oh, look at what we've created.

you can create anything. you're just re-mixing what was already there. pop, the music, the culture, the artist, the vibe, that controls fashion. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> welcome. we are celebrating 50 years. hip-hop fashion. tonight, we're going to honor the pioneers, that lays the trail of amnesia and ready to wear when none of them wanted us on the runways. our community made that fashion happen. i'm so proud to be here, to celebrate 50 years in this culture that is unified us, made some of us rich, inspired

the rest of us. you're not ready, can i tell you, can i just tell you? let the drip begin. >> hip-hop fashion is endless. >> hipaa fashion has become almost 11 glitch unto itself. i think it says what it has said from the beginning. we don't need your cosign, we don't need your permission to look a certain way, or be a certain way. we are going to be ourselves, we are going to use fashion, and what we look like to communicate that. aren't >> hip-hop fashion has had many names, from urban fashion to help a fascist, history where. it's fashion, it's a force to be reckoned with. >> we created all of the best of the best, your favorites favorites. we did that.

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but it made us feel, good connected everybody in the community together. >> welcome back. i'm jermaine lee. you've been watching msnbc special to -- the rise, fall, and revolution of hip of haitian. the film chronicles the evolution of hip-hop style, bold reflection of an emerging art form it is just like the music. remakes's existing trends, leaves a lasting impact on the broader fashion industry. now we head to three innovators featured in the film, who have the visual is that a -- he is known as the godfather of urban, where the founder of the clothing brand carl can i. he's also the brains behind one of the most iconic jean silhouette of the 1990s. april walker is the founder of one of the first street where brands, walker where. working with many heavy hitters in the industry, including tupac shakur and ll cool j. the keto back is a journalist and author that has published

numerous works on public culture. thanks for joining us. april, in the film, you talk about the rich history of customizing looks. let's take a listen. >> when i think of him, i think of doing it differently. i think the customization was one of the truest and purist forms of that fashion. what we did not have was a place to go and buy the uniforms. we would go to the store, we would buy things and manipulate, and, it tear them up, make it our own. >> april, the practice of sampling and re-mixing these different styles to create something new. is that a foundational part of the fashion connected to hip-hop? >> i think that it's self expression first. and then hip-hop as a culture has a way of big expressing

itself differently. that is where the fashion element come from, or re-mixing, or changing it. it really came from lifestyle. addressing things that we were feeling, maybe not saying. >> and it felt organic. >> it was very organic. it is what we felt inside, out painting it, creating it for the world >> charles, in the film, we're seeing brands like food to, and here are you and vicky talking about building those brands. >> back in the day, hip-hop and fashion, the street was your one way. hip-hop club culture was our early internet. >> we contacted every have how artist we saw mtv doing a video, on connecting with them, because keep in mind, there is no social media, no internet. everyone was glued to the tv. >> carl, talk to us about the synergy between the young black artists creating the music, and

also young artists themself designing the fashion they were wearing. >> basically, i felt like hip-hop is representing hip-hop culture. we wanted to be the brand to represent the artist. we felt like a lot of artists weren't using those ads. we just looked at them as consumers, we wanted to change the game and make sure we can own our brands, control the fashion as well. that is the whole thing, not actually that -- and asking the question every day. yes i can. >> and you are all coming up in the same environment. certainly a reflection of each, other but were you in the same spaces? >> same spaces. i wanted to be rapid reckoning. a lot of my friends told me, that it was a little bit of b. i was, like i can't wrap, and i can -- this kind of what inspired me and made those things happen. >> vicky, what do you think about the synergy, the energy, the reflection of the music of the fashion coming together? >> i always say, this tree was the runway. the clubs where the internet. entrepreneurs, like carl, april,

fubu, cross colors, and they were the kids that were watching and seeing what was going on. they saw a certain denim style, the need to wear your denim a certain, way fit over timberline's. the kind of jackets they were wearing, the way they were wearing the hat. to be in those spaces, to grow up in those neighborhoods, in those communities, and then to build the fashion to serve a young hip-hop world that was about to take over things, it was really powerful. it is entrepreneurship in its purest form. >> carl and april, you to have known each other for a very long. time where we sit, today you look back over the past decades, to where you are now, where the music, is the fashion, what do you think? what do you make of this journey we've been on? >> i think the journey has been amazing for everyone. to turn tables and microphone changed all of our lifestyles. ginger, lives give us something that we gave our own, they could go either dead design

things fashion wide, been there since day one. and it's great times. >> i agree. i think that would not have imagined this. we were really starting from this self expressive mode. now to see this multi billion dollar industry that's been created on the culture of hip-hop, that cultural currency is priceless. >> to turn tables and microphone, here in new york city is born. you pass the decades, so much, have you filed a change? what do you think about the next 50 years? where do you imagine the music in the fashion? >> the style, of the new york, the worldwide, right now the number one street brand internationally, 25 foreign countries. ten stories in japan. this thing is bigger than just the united states. i see this growing bigger and bigger, the opportunities are still out there for us to go

out there and make things happen. every day, just ask yourself the question, can i go there and answer that question? yes i can. >> you've been studying the stuff, what do you think in the next 50 years? >> i think the to echo carl, it's bigger than just the music, bigger than wrap. this is now the dominant culture of the world. to see the culture of what it started from to where it is now intersecting with the luxury world, the do yours, vuitton -- if you see them talking in the front row of every important fashion show, and driving this global mechanism of capitalism that we have. that, level also not knowing where it started. we remember to support brands, those creators of where it came from. it truly is where it is now. i think that it's only going to

get bigger and bigger. >> april, when you think about this new generation taking over from the groundbreaking designer such as yourselves, are we in good hands throughout the next 50 years? within this generation? >> they had tools we didn't have. they had lessons learned from us. and so the actual energy that will be created from this will be very interesting, because technology is going to tell the story with the activity as well. >> thank you. thank you all for joining us. and thank you for watching this special presentation of 50 years fly. you can check out the msnbc podcast wherever you get your podcasts, new episodes out every thursday. i'm jermaine lee, keep it right here on msnbc. >> tonight on the mehdi hasan show donald trump's next big legal legal hurdle. the georgia election investigation might be the most open and shut case of the mall and indictments could be coming