language about seeing a politicized case, which there is no evidence that it is. trump also has all of these people, kevin mccarthy, potential candidates, echoing his messages and the attacks to round desantis. he doesn't have that. >> michael, jen psaki, thank you so much to you both. jen psaki, new show inside with jen psaki, 12 pm eastern on msnbc, also streaming on peacock. that's our in on this wednesday night. alex wagner tonight starts right now. good evening, alex. wagner starts tonight. lawrence and rachel have bagel situation going with jen psaki's show on sundays.okq bag goals and@'■ cheese. so i would suggest you and i

come up with afá bloodyxd marry >> sounds good. >> putting on that television, hold us accountg thanks, chris. thank you for joining us this hour. all weekwtke1 we've been on indictment watch. wondering ifñi the case donald trump allegedly payingçó hush money to stormy daniels would result in the first indictmentw of a first u.s. president in the american history.wk c1 two pieces oflp news that sort made me?;■ wonderxd if there's competition for that historic ok first. which case on donald trump is the first criminal case brought against a first former president.t( u

into whether trump took classified documents with him when he left the white house and whether trump obstructed justice what's so important that thei] court of appeals in d.c. that it

couldn't wait onexd day and instead needed jack lpsmith's tm to stay up all night?çólpt( this is trump attorney cork ran. not only represented trump, his primary point of contact with the national archives and theok hise1 obstruction of justice no1 corcoran's lawyer forñ3[■ trump. back in june of last year, two years prior toht■ theñ search b mar-a-lago. trump's lawyers gaveñi a statemt to the doj.lp a diligent search had been conducted and all classified material at theokr beenxd returned. corcoran drafted that statement. twolp po months later, the fbi

now key part of thislp i,ñtáurt(urjz is how those documents got into lptrump's residence in the very first place and whether trump moving them there maytp■ç have beenq a attempt to obstruct justice.d the washington posti] reported last year, the doj gathered evide.be indicatedq that trump instructed people tov toxdñi his residence. once the doj got its hands on that footage it showed xdthat. people moving boxes to trump's personal residence shortly after his legal team learned of the w% subpoena. when i sayñ1 trump's legal team moving of thosefá boxes an attet to on strubt justice? with that in mind one of the

things that special counsel is reportedly interested is a phone call betweeq,urump and evan corcoran around the subpoena for thate1 video footage was firsti subpoenaed. all of thisi] trump lawyer evan corcoran in a very unique position. he may be a party to a crime. he might be whiting or çóunwittd at( pawn in trump'sçó÷ last month, yak smith asked the d.c. district court judge for approval tow3 dot( jç3"■ that. to force corcoran to cooperate with this investigation. abc news reported that the special counsel reported evidence that çótrump,ñr quote, deliberately misled his own

attorneys and evidence toñr sho that trump committed crimes.r on friday, a federal judge agreed with the special counsel. ordered corcoran to comply with the subpoena for his testimony and hand over a number ofçó records related to what the t,n trump's alleged criminal scheme. thosei]ñi documents with handwrn notes and invoices and transcriptions of a ouzi] recordings. the legal team representing trump appealed that ruling and that dispute is what led tow[ t smith that all-nighter last night.çó in smith's favor.sxd court rule/ friday's rulingok app

attornávi take effect. corcoran is set to testify on friday. the actual legal judgment remains underlp seal. á> i have never seen that.

>> how did you interpret that? >> the stakes are very high.ok there's something in those materials that the judgelp -- assuming she would review the uuár shet(xd ordered them to turn over -- that's typically howñi it goes.. something inñi those she decide was so high stakes and so important that it needed toxd b turned over expeditiously and the d.c. court of appeals agreed with her.ñi the entire case is under seal,e we don'tt( know whatxd that is. jack smith went through the trouble of trying to get these materials soñi the grand jury c seee1 themñ3[■ that reviewing a preparing for possibly l >> do you draw anyfáxd conclusi about the time frame on all of this? given thee1fá way they'reko■ mo

through it. >> it's fair to jfsay, you don' go after the formerñi president indictment.q nearly not as far along as they are theçó manhattan d.a. do this atñi$x■ advanced stage 1 investigation. >> kyle,xd for a moment, priore trump announcing he6z■ wasxd ruu for president the reporting we had especially if the washington postok was that, you know, the j was close to charging decisions in the mar-a-lago caseñi last t(

fall. now,ok obviously that didn't co to pass. specialxd counsel smith is appointed to run this. it's now march. months later. but we are as laura points out we're talking about the president's lawyer being q subpoenaed, goingeo2ujux" providing this evidence,e1 what yourçó estimation about what el we might expecte1 in terms of witnesses to be called,xd in tes of the work that remains on this case, to layman seemsi] pretty 1 exhaustive. >> what'sq happening in manhattan,ñi you have the documents case and you have fulton count[3 where trump is beingxd investigated f election.lyñi overturning the the thirdt( one in fulton count indictments could come any t(da.

&/=uq■ it. you're right, ñiattorney/client )!■xdlp at the t

go, the appeals process fá continues, right? kyle's saying that trump reportedly doesn't wan >> lpokqwell, keeping the appean can be riskyxd for smith. in the event that later down the line a court decides actuy these documents should not have come into evidence or gone before a jury and thexd whole thing gets thrown out that could be particularlyñi problematic fd him. even if they're allowed to e1 revie/di these materials they m ultimately use them in the decision they maket(q if they g forward vid#jf an indictment. >> let's talk aboutñr the materials, we're talkingq about notes, some personal audio recordings. >> we don't know what that is. >> but again, $■ judgeñi who's

examined this material is ékp(r alleged criminal scheme. she's putting trump andñr crimil scheme together. >> xdwhat's so weird,xw■ youlp e theçó crime fraud exception invoked the lawyer is in somelp cahootsñi with the client. in thisqç?dcase, she the judge suggested that trump actually misled hisçó own attorneys inr way, again theq contours of tha we'll have tojfçó report out, bs you said in your setup here we know part of the reasond 'teresting he draftsñr what turns out to be au >>f ioesxdq the statement,xd th

of centerpiece, the notion that the trump legal team says, you know what, guys,lp you got t( everything. what we know about that statement, evani@iorcoran draftd it,e1t( kristen bobb another la signs it. it suggests that,xdu s#q■ wantu i don'te1 knowe1fá becauselp th happening in secret, all under seal, we learn bits and pieces here and there, it's hard to

z what< ■ are the motiv here but one of the theories at least behind why thet( appeals court moved with such urgency was perhaps corcoran wasçó read to say what he knew and if they didn'tv we've seen this movie in añr certain wayfá and maybe corcora has a lot to say. >> that's a fascinating theory, laura. i wonder what you make of it. perhapsq 'c■he'sñi a cooperativ witness and they havefá tp get e material into thefá prosecutor' hand stat. >> ordered him to produce all these documents by you know "x"

date. theñr appellateñi court to get ahead oft( thatcq ruling, hadñi done expeditiously. we simplyçó don't know.l-;a%■ w. we'rexd working on. i think we just don$d■ know yet

that's a different threshold. t at's a different threshold. all smith uses the materials that he fought so harda5■ñr to >> we want+■ toçó highlightfá?; addition to the statement, 'c■i the phoneq call that trump make to corcoran allegedlyr same time the video footage. the concepts of that call will

be as great interest to all of us, especially to the department of ñrlpi]justice. laura, come back, please, all the time. >> this ist( not going away. >> kyle, thank you so much for your greatqi] reporting. thanks both of you for your time and wisdom and expertise. we have a lot to get to this evening including the role of the national enquirer in the hush moneyok scheme thatr upq making history. that tabloid also played a role in another nationaljfxdçó scand anotherturn affair and hush mons we'll have that when we come back.w3xd of quality coverage- go with the general. ah, these bills are crazy. she

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i'm about to rule the world. without your help the mushroom kingdom will be annihilated. let's-a go. i fear nothing. you're coming with us. [ grunting ] we're best friends. -but are we? destroy the mushroom kingdom!

it is on like donkey kong! [ boing ] woo-hoo! it was the summer$x of 2004. the presidential election was just around thee1 corner and everyone was waiting for democratic candidate john kerry to choose a running mate.r that wasa5■ when the new york p sc preu this front-page story.ñr kerry'sçó qchoice, demsd gefhardt hasr

the post got itok ñiwrong. maybe kerryñi should have listed to the post(a■ prediction. but kerry picked thisi] north kerry said edwards didn't measure up as vice presidential candidate. because seven years after kerry and edwards lost the '04 presidential election,q edwards becameqt( the first candidatei] ñr indicted. with his daughter kate by his side, john edwards took responsibility for doing wrong. but notjf for (_■ing the law. >> içó did not break the law ani never ever thoughtxd i was breaking the law.

if he knew thep,■ affair became public it would undermine his image as a family man and destroy his candidacy. >> no one has been charged eitherçó civillyxd or criminall with the claims that have been brought against senator edwards today. >> no one has ever been charged either civilly or criminally with the claims brought against senator edwards today. as far as national political candidates are concerned that claim is still true, at least for now. the world isw3 waiting tolpñr s manhattan district attorneyq bragg willlpçó bringq charges at donald trump.nb■i] thelp potential case against trp

is remarkably simí

similar pitfalls in the case against donald trump. not clear whether or not prosecutors will be able toçó prove thatw3 alleged hushokq mo payment constituted an illegale campaign financexdxd donation. i will ask the former manhattan% prosecutorq that veryx#tuqáurjz and a whole lot more coming up next.

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in december 2007, it was the national çóçóenquirer that broki very first story about a majorq candidate fori] president shellg outñilp hush money to cover5a■ extramarital w3u the candidate was john edwards and "the national enquirer" reported thatñi his mistress wa pregnant. the paper deployed everyq tacti ttj like these on the newsstands for the better part ofq year. inxd 2010 that coverage earned e tabloid at( pulitzer prizexd nomination. this story was clearly gold for the "the national enquirer." in 2016e1 the paper had a chanc to do itñr over again. a second major candidatee1u

and this time instead the wall street journal broke< ■ thewm+■ that david ñipecker helpedxd ca and killñr stories about trump d wa hush money payments to trump'sxi which brings us to this week. whether to charge trump for his role in thos=d hush money

do you think whatç!:uz could be seeing right now is alvin bragg trying to clean up ,÷h messa5■0t bob costello made at the beginning of the week. >> what'sñi happening is basicay a mini trial in thexd grand jur. which is unusual. they'refá usually bear bones, mh smaller amount of [çmevidence,

opening r examine, you're putting onjf ar bare bones caselplp to get over hurdle than at trial where you have to prove it beyond a reasonaclmñ doubt. this isn't the trial. this#d■ grand jury proceeding. i wonder if optics matter, too, because he was out theret(

speak ing to a pressfá availability. >> look, michael cohenr known -- manhattan d.a.lpp,■ kn who michael cohen is, he has a conviction for lying toçó congrs and other criminal convictions and he's e1flip-flopped. a point in timeq where he saida donald trumpñi hadw3 nothing to with this and nowçó xdhe's sa4= did. you havei] to corroborate what said. donald trump picked michael cohen, donald trump usedñi mich■ cohen and michael cohen saidt( wrote the book on how to do these criminal schemesi] that lawyers and others are doing with donald trump. donald trump picked somebody like that and as prosecutor you have to live whoever it is the defendant brings in as the witness, the person in the room who's going to ha6 the

evidence. i think alvin bragg had all of that corroboration lined up knowing that you woulda5■ have corroborate him. >> let's talkñi about the strenh of this caae,r we did a fair amount -- we treated everyone to the john edwardsñi history on this, righ how do see this case asñiw3 meaningfully different than the edwards case? >> this case has two legal issues, right, there's a, did it happen? can you prove it? michael cohen hast( theñ3[■ iss that he had.qsv4 b, is it legally sound?e1 so this case has bothxd of thos issues, in the john edwards cas? those issues, xdright, the john

and whether a federalok campaig counts as the crimet( that bump falsifyingfáe1e1 a business rec from a misdemeanor to felony. >> becausexd it's at( two-tiere■ process, people supposed -- ied yated thatçó the campaign finan piece elevatesfá it toc a felon. other potential crimesv cited that could elevateq it to felony? ñ155jjjy

why did they structure thew3 payments, there wereok 11 different payments, whyxdxd diq% structure them overt( timefá ify weren'tfá trying to hide it. then he was elected. you can make a strong argument that this was for the purpos

karen, thank youqñi so much for your expertise and your wisdom. >> thank you for having me. we have much more ahead tonight. yet another trial looming, a different one, not the ones we've been talking about, another trial looming ñ president trump, this one over serious allegations datingt( ba to the 1990s. plus, "the new york times" å$[(ort takes us insaqlq trump world as the former presidentlp braces for i]indictment. that's next.q by temporarily delaying ovulation—and you can resume your regular birth control right away. i've got this. ♪♪ my asthma felt anything but normal. a blood test helped show my asthma

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donald trump may be facing a looming criminal indictment which is bothw3 historic but al in the most trumpy way possible& it's business as usual. that's mostly because talk of ar possibleçó indictment has found the former president spendingñi his time doing what he does xd best. fund-raising off the drama. trump's campaign tells fox news that he's raised $1.5q million n the three days after hexd wente truth social took issue a rant over his possible rant. nbc news hasn't confirmedq that fund-raising number. his supporters arer

to his potentiale1 indictment. a conservative lawyer whoñilp represents severa÷r january 6th defendants tweeted thisu

the truth t(is, he probably --ñ most likely won't have u] perp walk, that sorte1 of thing, if he's arrested that sort ofxd thg will be negotiated by law sqenforcement and secret servic who will most likely want to avoid a massive scene and the other thing wild thing here,ym■ launched a very big pressureq çó campaign, you showed some of those really over the top campaignjf requests oran qm■ ñihe's gone on a5a■ tirade attacking theq manhattan d.a. and trump -- some trum#xd aides havei] convinced themselves an&3 spoken to the forler president about that the pressure campaign may be having an effect and thefá manhattan d. may walk away from an indictment and not indict thee1t( former president because of the pressure campaign trump isçó weighing. we've seen this before the trump white house convinced themselves that at( democratic house run b

nancy pelosi mightxd not indict him. they thought at the time they turned some dñm5iq%■ votes and that vote would go down, we knog that didn't happen the first time orxd the second time, and u know it's qunlikely hist( press campaign isd theñi manhattan district attorn■ >> my head is spinning with all of the things that you said. matthew, let's unpack the twilight zone in which the trumpland exists, that@ añiokñi signe1 of strength. how do you seet( a perp walk in this day and age as it pertains to donald trump if. >> alex, what funny about itt(iá it's só reflectionxdñi of how t

the sad news is, my fear is that at least ine1 the short term, among republican primary ñivote, his base, he would actually benefit from that. he may get an initial lift from that because he's going make it seem, you think i'm being persecuted +■i]xdit's0l■xd real persecuted. i think if yout( reallyfá give h serum to republican leaders even l■.=m

the fear he felt in 1973i] abou beingfá÷ñ arrested after the fi karim mall investigation into the doj's investigation intod trump and trump andfá their potential suit for housing discrimination. >> yeah, definitely. couple of things y$m■ true here. one,ñi trump is trying tot( mov this legal fightñi in manhattann to a political battlefield so that he can, you know, find a way to leverage this for his campaign moving forward, and to mitigate as much damage as possible. donald trump does not want to br arrested. he doesn't want tor òe■ see thatq-i infá social med. some of his postsw3e1 on his so media qwebsite.qr all capital letters, to the manhattan d.a., do the right thing. he doesn't want an indictment on hisq record. he's alwaysxd hadñi a certain f of beingçó arrested.çó

he has -- he's cultivated a lot of relationships with that dynamic underpinning it. folks who may be able toq help him if he got to the point of aó arrestw#ó orw3 an indictment. he made sure to keep themlpçó c. i'd like toxd jump back to the fund-raising, i do think that from what i'veçó seen in some pollinge1 lately, trump's base doesn't seem tonb■ be goingq anywhere. the biggestñi question i thaoz republican voters are going to him. he'se1 steadying his polling in

part he's been playing to smaller crowds, he's beenxd answering questions, he's doing more traditionalo$uv(e of campaigning, not fully, more than he used to. his response to this indictment is the kind of thing that is long turned offr republicans andq independents from trump and i thinkq that's the thing to watch, you know, the effect this could have moving forward. ñ for the record, i don't know aq lot of people who have an ongoing fear of beingñi arrested. interesting psychology right there. appreciate your time. thank you both for your wisdom we'll be right back. to hard-working muscles and joints, for all-day energy.

you could see nothing here. to hard-working muscles anor here., or you could see, everything that could be. go. baker tilly. [ engines revving ] fire 'em up! [ cheering ] you ready? let's do it. ready. i know you're ready. let's race.

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