>> that's all the time i hav at and the paycheck. for today, families jimenez, we'll see you back her tomorrow, 6 pm eastern for mor american voices. but for now i handed over to m colleague, ayman mohyeldin hello ayman. i'm >> sure you're like i, a he will cut this morning and here you are >> goodbye to that show. >> exactly, thank you my friend great to see you enjoy the best of your evening. good evening, welcome tool ayman, over the next two hours or bring you everything yo need to know about donal trump's statement that h expects to be arrested thi coming week. the legal, financial, political, and psychological angles to it all. we've got it all covered we're also gonna take you back to where it all started, 1 years ago, within allege affair and to figure out how w got to this point in time.

and will examine the stunnin revelations this week from another investigation into trump. fulton county has anothe recording of alcohol trump mad pressuring unofficial to overturn the results of th 2020 election. i'm ayman mohyeldin, let's get started. ♪ ♪ ♪ tonight, we began with the new that everyone is talking about for better or worse. this morning, donald trump posted on social media claimin that leaks from the manhatta district attorney's office indicate that he will be arrested this coming tuesday to be absolutely clear nbc new cannot confirm that claim. and at this hour, there's been no official announcement fro the manhattan da's office an no indication that charges hav actually been filed agains donald trump that, said there were majo developments this week and district attorneys alvin bragg 's investigation into trump'

role in the 2016 hush mone payment made to adult film star, stormi daniels on, wednesday daniels hersel met with prosecutors from th manhattan da's office, the sam day that homer - michael cohen finished testifying in front of the grand jury hearing that's bein hearing evidence in that case. here's cohen, a short time ago speaking with my colleague i'll sharpton. >> he's trying to threaten the american judicial system tha not just alvin bragg, but fani willis in georgia, washington, any court that thinks that they're gonna bring donald trump and. i'm gonna call for protests. this is who we as this is not aquatic wannabe this is a guy that doesn't wan to be president of the unite states, he wants to be our monarch, our ruler, differ that's who he is >> late left renee and d.c news report about local stat federal law enforcement and -- are preparing for th possibility that trump will be

indicted as early as next week before we get to my expert panel, i want to make one thin absolutely clear here. donald trump posted this morning knowing that the new media would make a big dea about this of course the possible arres of a former president is big news but on the show, we believ that he posted this informatio because he wants to control th narrative. we're not gonna lattimore. we're gonna have conversations throughout the next two hour on our terms, talking abou what really matters, and doing so with the caution an sobriety that it deserves. let's bring in our all-sta panel to make sense of this. all matthew dowd, the chie strategist for the busch taney presidential campaign, msnbc political analyst. susanne craig, investigate reporter for the new york time animus nbc contributor we danny cevallos, an msnb legal analyst and david corn the washington burrow to tha mother jones, and contributor, good to have all four of you with us. it's been one of those days.

so bear with me. there's lots to break down here i want to start with you michael cohen says that this i really all a fundraising opportunity for donald trump take a listen to this. >> not only does he want there to be another violent protests he's also looking to do th great grift, continue the grea graft, and obtain campaign contributions off of this. oh, they're attacking your favorite presidents and me $5, send me $10 it's all part of the great grift. >> broad question to you here, matthew, to start off, you reaction to what trump's pos and why you think he decided t try and get ahead of the narrative? >> well, all the second part versus trying to get ahead o the narrative because he doesn't want to be able to account. this is a guy that throughou his entire life has managed to slip, slipper, push, and can joel, yell, scream is way ou of accountability.

and now in the accountabilit is moving closer, and closer and closer to mar-a-lago, he's doing the same thing using every opportunity. i actually think slats about raising money, and more abou what happened in the advance o january six. he's trying, you already see i through some republica mouthpieces, who are saying wh are we doing this, if this could cause a problem. as if we should hold off o justice because donald trump i gonna push, pull people to d things they shouldn't do and i think he knows that. i think he knows that the sad thing about all o this, ayman, as he made benefi in the republican primary from an indictment. >> we're gonna talk about th political fallout of this in a moment but this is, handling get your thoughts on. that's alvin bragg, as expected, it is not commenting on trump' post do you have any sense of the chatter behind the scene through your reporting >>, while one thing that's

interesting, it was in the new york times today, this afternoon. is that there still a witnes to come for the ground jury on monday i think this is a flui situation. it doesn't mean that won't happen on tuesday. if the grand jury comes to a decision on monday that ther should be an indictment. they can move quickly. and do it tuesday. but potentially, we don't know how they're gonna handle b actual our rest of donald trump, if he does come and he's gonna need some noticed a common from florida they're gonna have t coordinate with as lawyers that's done in all sorts o cases. if the person needs to b physically on the, st. louis may do it differently becaus of the extraordinary nature of this bristol looking at a witness that's gonna be coming forward on monday. we don't know who it is. it could be a summation witnes from the da's office it could be at another perso likes stormi daniels could b coming and it could take a little bit longer we just don't know i have a feeling donald trump,

somebody may have called one o his lawyers. and told him he might have t be here on tuesday it could be where this started or he could've wanted to throw it out there on a saturday, se what happens we just don't. no >> walk us through what would happen next if in fact he's indicted next week? what might we expect procedurally >> procedurally, what normally happens and manhattan is you part to the precinct, you ge process there. then you go to central booking get process, there you wai around until your first cour appearance and that's not what's gonn happen to trump. there is no way. there are too many problem with secret service, and the fact that he has two goo protection of all times. you're not gonna stick women assault with a bunch of people even it's only for a couple of hours. this is gonna be negotiated, h will be treated differently. because he is a former president. heather security concerns. but otherwise, once he's process this case will proceed at the same glacial pace a criminal cases do in you county, and half for man years. unless they get specia treatment, in which case i moves up

and that's what we need to watch. for the big question becomes what do the major advanc happen, trial or otherwise relative to the election it's the key question. and we need to grapple with th four-year issue, that th framers never thought of, whic is what do you do, we know you can't prosecute the sittin president. what if you prosecute approach -- and that candidate becomes the president? the whole idea of unmuted even a president is if the presiden is the one person in governmen that if you arrest him you literally arrest the entir branch you can arrest the supreme court justice, you can arres the congressman. life goes on but the president you arrest h sits in a cell, you eras the entire executive branch. an interesting constitutiona -- >> legally speaking, w probably don't have an answe to some of these questions could the timeline of the tria be advancer that it conclude before it potential election day? is that something that peopl have talked about our discusse or considered? >> yes, judges have discretion but it might just be a trial calendar issue

of grappling with this too judges are still grappling wit covid delays every trial you delay, get backed up in the pipeline. can you prioritize a trial absolutely they are mechanisms for that judges have a lot of discussion so imagine that's what would happen here. they move it up to faster. but what of trump wants? -- wants to push this into th election and use it politically believe me, one where neithe he's gonna use this >> great point there. david, there's no evidence tha trump will be indicted o arrested but his comments as we mention they are newsworthy. how should the media b covering this without playin into can - control the narrative? i need to say he probabl posted that on truth social. not a lot of followers certainly not the millions h once commanded on facebook and twitter, and instagram but because it is him making that statement the media ran with that. and now it's all around th world. >> yeah, i think you reporte

within the context this twee this post did not come in vacuum a couple months ago h posted that he wanted to pardo all january six arrestees. and a couple days ago he basically said that they did nothing wrong. those posts indicate that this is a man who's not opposed t political violence he wants to even reward an protect the people who came ou and committed violence back on january six. when he then puts out a post today and violence of possible indictment an suggests that it's time to com out, hit the streets in protest, if not please do thi responsibly, he's alread indicated that he wants, he' in favor of political violence that helps ham i think that this should b seen, as another example of hi authoritarian impulses

and his willingness to g outside the law to prevent accountability , so we tend to get very worke up, often is we should, in a individual outrage from trump. but we need to look at the whole continuation of what he' been doing for a couple year now. and that's why i think thi post is very troubling, i don' think it'll lead to th violence of january six, because he has not organiz anything that happened o january six. but it's out there, we giving signal to proud boys and others, i want you in the street defending me because this is illegitimate >> matthew, to david's, playin from called on his supporter to protest echoing the languag he used on the run up to january six. which was organized. even marjorie taylor green said republicans shouldn't protest, your thoughts on this >> and whether or not they should protest

or - i hope, i would hope tha republicans are responsible bu if a president even thei president isn't indicted the allow the system to go i places like exposed to i america. i think we're in the situation where we have allowe presidents for the last 50 years to have no accountability i think it started with gerald ford's pardoned richard nixon, it open the door to othe people saying they're not gonn be able to be held accountable this idea that the sitting president can't be indicte isn't in the constitution, it' a rule that was done by series of attorneys general. i think that opened the door and if this, if we get to th point where anybody is allowed to be pushed back because of donald trump's threats where again, one step closer t the idea that we don't have presidency anymore we have in a top receiver. and that's what we need to kee our eyes focused on. >> suzanne, stormi daniels spoke with new york prosecutors, if he testifies to the grand

jury, could she add to thi case at this point >> well, it's a good question. and i think the grandeur eas been now looking at evidence for months now, they've been hearing various witnesses have common, and all of it goes to, what sort of evidence is out there that's not - conversation with somebody and they've been looking a phone records, they've bee looking at bank accounts, an stormi daniels may not even be called in, and if she did she' likely been mainly conversations that she's had with michael cohen, michae cohen's, other lawyers tha have been involved i'm not sure she'd be the wild common, i think she can add lot to the trial, but they called her and initially to se what she would say, previously she's met with attorneys fro the district attorney's office i think they've called in th main people that they want t have, that they wanted t ground jury here already >> panel, stick around

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with my expert panel matthew dowd, danny cevallos david corn how should the - you and i were just kind o talking in the commercia break. what would the actual lega charge be potentially agains donald trump what's the crime he's accuse of committing if this is i fact indictment? >> the theory everyone's hearing is falsifying business records in new york. the default is a misdemeanor but if it's done during th commission, further anothe crime mccann be bumped up to a felony this is where the da runs into a problem, if the theory o that felony crime is a election law violation, i thin the payoffs to stormy daniels, again, i'm a deaf defens attorney so take this with a grain of salt i might have som bias the theory of liability, her

election law violation is strange as it was six year ago. it's this, by michael cohe paying off stormi daniels, tha silence they got was a benefit to the campaign that wasn' reported it's not the typical electio law violation. for, example in the case o john edwards, to give you an example he wasn't convicted. is hey, he took a much money actual money, cash, whatever i was. the material benefit is money. it's very obvious. and this case, stephanie clifford, stormi daniels didn't give the campaign cas gave them her silence. >> we wouldn't have not, tha margie meant >> if you make that argument then everything that helps you is a contribution to the campaign that must be reported favorable law scar, edged the. things i know people out there are howling, saying that's not the same thing with the key is can th defense attorneys make it seem like the same thing to one juror? we may disagree but if reasonable minds disagree, i sounds like reasonable doubt and that's a problem for the prosecution.

the worst-case scenario fo alvin bragg's this, he charges the felony, it gets thrown out somehow by emotion, and alvi bragg's left prosecuting donal trump for a misdemeanor. i'm misdemeanor case in ne york county. i think that would be a real political problem for brag, an a political boom for trump >> david, you want to respon to what danny said, he's givin us the legal expertise you have a different take on why alvin bragg should pursu this case if in fact he' potentially indicting donald trump? >> i think right now it seem pretty clear that alvin bragg has got so fa down this road that it's almos inconceivable that there is no an indictment at the end o this asking trump to come in an testify, all the time he spent with michael cohen, over 2 visits, and really seems lik they think there is a case i'm not a lawyer, i will pla one on tv, i'm not up agains

danny. but the issue is that this is campaign action. that michael cohen was helping the trump campaign as a free was part of the campaign, by spending this money. would you be running kind notion of some kind. that's why this violates new york city campaign law everything with trump' unprecedented. this is sorted, if we just sit back for a moment. and think that the forme president of the united states who is now the leading candidate -- for the two major parties fo presidential nomination in 2024 maybe facing indictment. because he had his fixer pay $130,000 to an adult film star that's kind of amazing this is not what the founders, or any members of congress who wrote the campaign finance law had in mind. it's totally beyond what the even envision in the days of watergate.

it's novel, will make it harde for any prosecutor to do anything new, and different. i'd be surprised at this point brag doesn't feel confiden enough to proceed. >> i'll pick up on that poin for you. that david talked about. -- allen brag being so far down this road michael cohen spout our speaking to the grand jury thi week after trump turned down his ow invitation to testify. does that signal anything to you about the prosecutor progress here? >> david headed out of the par here in terms of where this is at it's very far down the road. one question i don't know th answer i wondered it, they wer far down the road on another case it seemed very strong that's the valuation case. this happens or donald trump will have a property and if he needs a back alone hilltop in and hill inflated i order to get the loan.

and if he's dealing with the irs, he suppresses the value of things they have a lot o information about that about false records that wer submitted to banks that case is been picked up by the attorney general in ne york, it's being brought as civil case, it's going to tria in the fall. and they were looking at tha and fairly advanced on, it h still made forward with that case but why the stormy daniel case picked up steam and the went ahead with that first, is a fascinating question i think we may name way -- if there is an indictment. and we can read the charges, read some of the evidence that they have, that they may hav picked up additional evidenc in the last few months that we don't know about but that's just one question hanging over this, mar pomerantz, one of th prosecutors involved i developing that case he resigned over all of this and has written a book on this it's worth reading if you're a

student of this. to understand it better. it's the one question i have we may learn about it if thi is now advancing to indictment we could find out some of the. evidence >>, mayfield aske politically for a moment speaker mccarthy this mornin promised to use the houses power, the people's house an all of the power that it commands to investigate the manhattan district attorney. this is a guy they didn't have to tweet anything out today, he's not an official indictment, there's no indictment no actua news, this is a former president on his social medi posting what he thinks is goin to happen. and the speaker of the house the person third in line second in line to th presidency, johnson, and say he's going to use the power of his agency, the congress t investigate the manhatta district attorney. why? >> i actually think what speaker mccarthy dead is far worse in the posting of donald trump, we've talked about ho -- >> i agree with you.

i think it's shameful. >> is encouraging, encouraging people to protest and try an threaten people so they don' take charges what speaker mccarthy did wa basically official government. the third ranking official i the united states of america trying to put his whole foot body, arms on the scale in order to get, a politica parties in front of has, s he's not, so he's not tried case, and not held accountable that to me is far worse, it' very frightening to me that fo all over accusations, al things about donald trump an his autocratic movement. that it seems like that viru that donald trump let loose. eight years ago. has now seeped into the entire body other republican party. for speaker mccarthy to do that, as you say, for no reason othe than to put his foot on th scale of justice and to try and prevent a forme president from getting indicte for crimes

it is far worse than donal trump's ravings of a mad man o social media >> i completely agree with you on that one, matthew david, i want to ask you about the public here, the years o news about donald trump. they've had a numbing effect o a lot of americans a lot of americans probably don't want this to go away, they want to constantl hear about how he's testing ou system and pushing the limit of our system to the brink how do you think, a historical like a potential divide, minde does happen what register with the american public? >> i think all the evidence in the last eight years, i'm sorr to say this is whatever happen in the indictment will b viewed by many people, and through the commentators on al sides, as through a political. lands and a tribal eye political lens and he's done a great job of setting up this foundation tha i told you, they're gonna come get me, they hate me, thes radical liberals, thes

democrats, they want to destro america, that means destroying me, which means destroying you as he talks to his voters. and that's how this will all play out not the substantial of pros an cons - i'll weaken diamond will pla out as a political act -- -- what matthew said a moment ago about speaker mccarthy and how he has politicize this republicans go on and on about the weaponization of government that is the best example of th weaponization of government by threatening a local official who is trying to go by the law by his view of the law, i thin this whole not make donald trump go way, this not mak people who like donald trump like them last, it'll just intensify all the feelings trial politics out there, an it'll for store publican party this is bad news for rhond scent is in some ways. maybe to rally round trump

even though, healed amanda this is the oath of loyalt he'll demand from al republicans. support man this, mccarthy already has. are you in the ring with me. >> i was gonna say i'm with you on. this i think republicans are all about projection when they're coming out an saying the weaponization o government, they're projecting that that's exactly what the intend to do with the powe that they currently have danny, let me play for you thi soundbite from donald trump' attorney in this, who is wit my colleague karim alber earlier this week. watch this defense argument. >> even if you put in your cap accord i'll use me and - i thought a car and i wrote, purchased a horse. that's inaccurate, that's a li maybe. but there's no crime there because this filing was not fo the purpose of influencing a election there wasn't something being hidden, and no obligation to disclose this to an election campaign committee at all >> does that legal argumen hold water >> for the election la

violation there is a point t be made there. it goes back to my analysi where i compare the classi election law violation, whic is i give you a bag of money you fail to report it, it' your campaign, you're th candidate. it's that classic. case the class of stormi daniels, is a lot more complicated than that you have michael cohe doing the painting, then he' reimbursed, do we know even if trump was the person actuals actually signing things he has notoriously as they described in the godfather, buffers, people that do is wor for a. so - his attorney may have a poin there. but it's also a point that the prosecution can weave into a crime. so, reasonable minds here coul possibly differ on whether the payments made to stormy diners war crime. but by themselves, hush mone payments are not necessarily crimes strangely enough if you're the one demanding the payments, th new maybe extorting a victim it doesn't appear to - >> really quickly, a smart mov

by his attorney to do that interview. and give away what a defense strategy might look like alvin bragg might have som insight into their thinking. >> probably not, but at th same time, when you're a attorney a lot of the times you may mak strategic recommendations to your client. they often don't follow a. i wrote a column about this on msnbc.com. if i can plug it, about this exact issue. yes, the rest of the panel i write stuff to, darn it. not as well as you do, but i d write things from time to time the key is here, sometimes you don't have a choice, sometimes the clients, as i want you t go out there, get ahead of this and all of the times you nee to say, yes sir. it's great to see you, it' been a couple years since i've actually seen you. suzanne, thank you so much matthew dowd and david corn, thank you. -- after the, break all the speaking with congresswoma judy chu, about this trump new and being the target of th rights new generation of

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>> all right let's talk abou mccarthy for a moment. no, not kevin mccarthy joseph mccarthy. in a piece for msnbc.com congressman duty to says tha she's been the target of quote the rights new mccarthy as i'm and not just from he republican colleagues, but fro white wing media outlets here's how congress -- type lance gooding spoke about congresswoman chu last month >> i think everyone, standin up for chinese communist party should be looked into, yes, question her either loyalty or competence i'm really disappointing and shocked, that someone like jud chu would have a securit clearance. and entitled to confidential intelligence briefings >> loyalty now, what could congresswoma chu have done to lose lanc

gooding's trust? she voted against creating a committee to investigate u.s china competition, which she feared would intensify anti-agent hate. for the record, 65 of he democratic colleagues also voted against that panel she also defended dominic nick -- trade interests in asia agains racist attacks from the right. so, lance getting believes congresswoman chu must b disloyal to the u.s. because she denounces anti asian hate never mind that goodin supported overturning the 2020 presidential election results. an actual act of disloyalty to our country. congresswoman chu says it best the rights ugly and fall sacculations build on th centuries long stereotypes tha chinese americans and asia americans more broadly, ar forever foreigners in their ow land democratic congresswoman jud chu of california joins me now

congresswoman, thank you for coming back on the show. great to see oh - we have a lot to talk about in terms of what we originall wanted to talk to about. that segment i just outlined i do want to get your reaction to donald trump social media post this morning, what do you make of this development >> i think that he's trying to incentivize the right to b even more sympathetic to him the fact that he would actuall announced the arrest himself makes me wonder if he's trying to do something similar to january six move, which is t get the supporters to be eve more for event in thei support. who knows what they will daryl >> when we get to your piece that you wrote o msnbc.com. you write in part, this ne mccarthy-ism combined -- racism and xenophobic of

the allegations which won' stop with ng and me, are downright dangerous. how dangerous are these attack for you personally, and for th aapi community >> i feel that lands getting put a target on my back by saying that i was disloyal and should be investigated as spy for china. it's outrageous, it' disgusting, it's downright racist because it is based o this forever foreigner stereotype that chines americans and asian american -- placed for decades but it is dangerous overall. and it comes on the heel o three years of anti asian hate when president trump calle covid-19 virus, china virus. we have 11,500 anti asian hate crimes, and incidents and wh knows where these accusation are being spies for china coul

lead it only fans the flames of xenophobia >> it seems it's become mainstream republican party. the gop in recent years ha been more focused on the sorts of culture wars, that thes racist rhetoric rather tha solving issues for the america people this racist rhetoric, i'd argu plays into the gop's main work has a whole, no? >> well, i think that thir evading society. and they're playing thei culture wars, that's clear i terms of what they're doin with the china selec committee. that's why i did vote agains the china select committee i thought it could increas enough phobia. and guess what, today. because it was a signal to people like lansing getting, that they could accuse me, and dominic ng, of being spies for

china. actually, they're not stopping there. the numbers that they're pointing out are increasin every day. including the latest ones bein the former mayor of our loca city and the former president of an esteemed committee group chinese -- benevolence so ca. they're pointing fingers, sits down scapegoating and what's really disturbing's histor could repeat itself. let us not forget now in japanese americans wer incarcerated it, didn't happen overnight. i started going after th leaders, and use that to isolate them several months later, japanese americans lost everything that they had in the camps. and it was based on an accusation of espionage by japanese americans, they're no a single case was never found. >> i'm so glad you bring u that point because the tropes of dualit

and disloyalty i think are rampant right now. we need to fight them ever chance that we get let me ask you about something that hits close to home to you district, and that's thi executive order that president biden signed this week, it's designed to increase backgroun checks he signed it while visitin monterey park, california, as mentioned 11 people were kille in a mass shooting there bac in january monterey park, is part of your district how important is this executiv order, and what did it mean to you that biden signed it while visiting your district >> while, i was so gratified that he came to the district we still have a hole that' gone through our hearts. because of the shooting, and the community had yet to heal. for the leader of the nation t come and console the familie of the 11 who were killed, a well as the nine who wer

wounded, and to console th whole community which is still traumatized, was very, ver meaningful he reflected on his ow experiences, and the victims families really appreciated it and, the fact that he had this executive order on gun safet was also very, ver significant. for instance, the shooter ma have been caught with a re flag law that is that he was mentally deteriorating, he wa accumulating ammunition, surel someone in the circle knew about it, i'm not sure tha people in the immigran community know that -- red flag law exists. so, in his executive order he is going for enhanced outreach to communities fo that and, also he's pointing to the fact that fema will go into

community when there's a natural disaster and coordinat resources. but there isn't such a thing for mass shootings, and yet th community is in utter chaos. there needs to be greate coordination of all th resources that are available and that's what he is saying i this executive order, -- >> congresswoman judy chu, thank you so much, i appreciat your time is always. >> thank you so much >> next, the 17 years of decisions, and cover ups tha brought donald trump to this moment warren a breakdown simparica trio is the first and only chew with triple protection. oh, fleas and ticks ♪♪ intestinal worms... wow heartworm disease, no problem with simarica trio. this drug class has been associated with neurologic adverse reactions including seizures. use with caution in dogs with a history of these disorders. for winning protection. go with simparica trio.

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♪ ♪ make your dream yo car...a reality.. mercedes-benz certified pre-owned vehicles are rigorously inspected to live up to the highest of expectations. >> to understand this moment that donald trump finds himsel in, you have to understand how we got here. so, we want to take you back i time to 2006 and go through th major actions that donald trum and his associates took to bring him to the precipice of possible indictment, startin with july 2006

according to an interview, stormy daniels would give to 6 minutes in 2018, daniels meets trump at the celebrity gol tournament in nevada she says he invited her to dinner and she met him at hi hotel suite, where they ha sex. daniels is 27 at the tim trump's 60 in may 2011, stormy daniel gives an interview to in touch magazine, describing her encounter with trump and exchange for $15,000 two employees later tell cbs news that the interview neve ran because michael cohen, trump's attorney at the time threatened to sue when the publication asked trump fo comment. and then, we didn't get to 201 and trump's run for president. in june of that, here kare mcdougal, begins trying to sel a story of an alleged affair she had with trump in 2016 2007 she retains attorney keith davidson, who approaches the national enquirer about possible deal. in august 5th, the nationa enquirer secures the rights to karen mcdougal's accounts fo

$150,000 but never publishes her story. and federal prosecutors late say the agreement was meant to suppress her story, so as to prevent it from influencing th election on october 8th, stormy daniels is now also represented by keith davidson, who's tells th editor in chief of the nationa enquirer that she's willing to go on the record about her alleged affair that news travels to michael cohen, and cohen negotiates deal to pay daniels $130,000 i exchange for the rights to her story and a nondisclosur agreement. on october 27th, cohen wires $150,000 to stormy daniels's attorney on november 8th, trump i elected president. in the same month he i inaugurated, january 2017, michael cohen seek reimbursement from the trump organization for that paymen he made to stormy daniels. then, we fast forward a year october 13th, 2018 - michael cohen acknowledges

making the payment to stormy daniels for the first time, bu denies being reimbursed an says it was not connected to the trump campaign they're both assertions he would like to recant on march 6th, daniels, who i now represented by attorne michael avenatti, sues trump and essential consultants ll in california in an attempt to nullify her nda, arguing tha the deal is invalid since trum never signed it. on august 21st of that year, cohen pleads guilty to eight federal charges of tax evasion fraud and campaign finance violations related to th payments to daniels an mcdougal and he later tells a federal court in manhattan that trum directed him to make the payments jumping to august 2019, th office of manhattan district attorney cy vance subpoenas th trump organization for records related to the payments. and a year later, in july 2020 the supreme court sides with

vance in a 7 to 2 ruling finding that trump is no immune from the da's subpoena. but it will take until februar 25th of 2021 before vance' office obtains trump's tax returns. on november 2nd of that year alvin bragg is elected as th next manhattan da. and that brings us to this year, 2023 in january, michael cohen meet with investigators from th da's office, a sign that alvin bragg's investigation is picking up steam at the end of the month, the new york times reports tha alvin bragg has convened a grand jury to examine th evidence in the hush money probe, and that gets us to thi month, march on march 9th, the da's offic invites trump to testify befor the grand jury four days later, on march 13th trump's lawyer says he will no be testifying before the grand jury that same day, michael cohen testifies before the grand jur for the first time march 15th, he testifies again stormy daniels meets wit

investigators from the da' office we don't know where this timeline will go next. but i have to bet donald trump never thought in 2006, 17 year ago, that when he was allegedl having an affair with stormy daniels, the actions he woul later take to keep that quie might get him indicted we will be right back. and no matter how much i paid, it followed me everywhere. the high interest... i felt trapped. debt! debt! debt! debt! so i broke up with my credit card debt and consolidated it into a low rate personal loan from sofi. i finally feel like a grown-up. break up with bad credit card debt. get a personal loan with low fixed rates and borrow up to $100k. go to sofi.com to view your rate. sofi get your money right. ♪ ...i'm over 45. ♪ ♪ i realize i'm no spring chicken. ♪ ♪ i know what's right for me. ♪ ♪ i've got a plan to which i'm sticking. ♪ ♪ my doc wrote me the script. ♪ ♪ box came by mail. ♪ ♪ showed up on friday. ♪ ♪ i screened with cologuard and did it my way! ♪

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investigation into donald trum is just one of several ongoing probes that threaten the e president and his troubles might be even worse in fulto county, georgia. this week, nbc news confirme that during their investigatio into efforts to overturn the 2020 election results in georgia, members of the fulton county special grand jury hear a recording of a phone cal between trump and georgia' then house speaker david rawlston during that conversation, trum pressured ralston to call special legislative sectio session to overturn --

back with me is matthew dowd and also joining the conversation, msnbc lega analyst and former federal prosecutor carol lam carol, i will start with you o this this follows, obviously, the infamous phone call that w have all heard 1000 times, the one to georgia secretary o state brad raffensperger it was recorded between him an trump, where trump infamousl recorded pressured him t overturn the results talk about what it means t have a second potentiall damning call to a differen part of the georgia government >> it means a couple of things first, it's obviously -- phone calls, recorded phon calls, are the best kind o evidence you can possibly have when you hear the defendants o the targets voice on the recording. it's especially important here because ralston passed away in november of 2022 so, he's not available as witness. but that won't prevent thi particular recording fro coming into evidence and so, when you have not on

but two recordings showing tha the former former presiden trying to influence not only the investigation, but the actual outcome of th investigation, it's really devastating evidence that -- it just plays very poorly fo the defendant in a courtroom >> matthew dowd, the four woma on the grand jury, emily kohrs -- told nbc that this phone cal lasted about four minutes. -- stop him from holding a specia session to overturn th election, essentially asked hi who would stop him from holdin that special session and according to kohrs, ralsto responded, a federal judge that is who. your reaction to this? >> well, we continue, as w have for a long period of time as we open up this box o donald trump, we continue to b amazed at the levels of whic he is willing to go up under and above any bounds of law an

ethics and legality in this in order to maintain power in thi in the course of this -- to me, all of this is sad an is despicable. i think it is the behavior i -- what offends me more, which think will offend more, othe people's, we have always known who donald trump has been. he has been fairly clear tha he is not an ethical person. what i think is what has faile us is -- one political party has enable donald trump in this, over and over and over again. there has been some instance where people have stood up and georgia is one of those. the secretary of state and the governor, to a small degree -- but this should have never got -- we should have never gotten to this point, where we are digging up this mess of donald trump. but for the fact that, along the way, he has been enabled over and over and over again and never held accountable b his own political party, who seems to refuse to put any

guardrails in place to prevent this from happening again. >> yeah, and that's a sad, thing i think, that someon like a donald trump can exis in a political ecosystem, think, is very distressing and troubling -- and it's unprecedented we use that word quite a lot with donald trump, carol and i wonder your thoughts o what might happen here - emily kohrs said that th special grand jury recommended indicting over a dozen people, which might include donald trump. walk us through what that woul mean, carol lam. if trump were indicted potentially, into differen jurisdictions at once in thi country -- >> right so, you are talking about th georgia jurisdiction and the manhattan jurisdiction these are both state prosecutions the grand jury construct i georgia is a little unusual. they have a special grand jury which is a grand jury that i heard all of this evidence and it has allowed them to focus on just this case for as long as they need to focus o it but they don't have the powe

to indict. and now the evidence is turned over to a regular criminal grand jury which, i think, i not an ideal situation because this second grand jury presumably, will not be hearin the testimony from the witnesses directly, but will in fact, be reviewin transcripts and such so, it's a knob construct. it's a construct that came about partly through the legislature and partly through case law so, it's not necessarily the construct that the legislature envisioned but that's what they have. so, if there is an indictment, if that indictment include donald trump, and if the manhattan da indites donal trump -- which, donald trump said, is going to happen on tuesday - he will have the unusual situation of facing tw prosecutions at the same tim in different states. and it's important for folks t realize that states are thei own sovereign. this is not run by the department of justice in washington they are their own sovereign with their own state laws, their own rules.