some are true, and some are false. >> the president has been very clear that all forms of battery

against women. >> he hasn't said that. and disgusting, right. but you haven't talked to him today. >> i think we need further explanation. >> i don't know who knew what, when at this point. >> let me pause you there. why? >> well, chuck -- >> why come on here -- if we don't know the tick tock, how can you defend any of this yet? >> i think talk about the chief's departure is much ado about nothing. >> if, in fact, that is the case, that is the exact opposite of everything i've heard from people inside the white house and also several people very close to president trump. >> for the president of the chief of staff to give that person the benefit of the doubt is probably a very normal and human reaction. >> a breakdown in the most basic process of vetting people for -- who do the most sensitive jobs in our government. >> the president will unveil his vision for the long-promised infrastructure plan today. >> the injection of funding for new investments and money to help speed up repairs of crumbling roads and airports. >> but the trillion and a half dollar proposal is likely a

nonstarter, even within the president's own party. >> only problem is, there's no money in it. >> the states are very skeptical, as well. how are they going to come up with this money? it's putting a lot of the burden on to the states. >> you need to put some real federal dollars behind infrastructure. >> that's going to get us nowhere near the kind of money that we need for the big capital investments. >> trump's official budgets, like the one today exists in some parallel universe that is never going to happen and bear no relation to reality. >> president trump moved late friday night to block the public release of a classified memo. >> the president doesn't want you to see these facts from the fisa application, because it completely undermines his claim of vindication. >> so we said, take it back, work with the fbi. clean it up. and we'll release it. >> right now, we still can't ensure that the vote is accurate or not changed. >> one thing that could damage this nation terribly is having a national election where the outcome is unclear, because we got hacked. >> let's just say something

really quick. so while the white house press person said the president has always been very clear that there is no place, there is no tolerance whatsoever, that's simply not true. the president has not been clear. do i need to remind you, he said vote for roy moore. he said bill o'reilly, he should sue those women. he's a good guy. in 1998, he said bill clinton was the victim in the monica lewinsky situation, so president trump i invite you to make it clear. thus far, you haven't. >> i'm going to go through some of those examples in a few minutes. the white house in full defense mode in the wake of two former staffers resigning over accusations of spousal abuse. >> top officials are defending the president in public who appear to be sympathizing with the men accused. those officials are also trying to defend chief of staff, john kelly, under fire for how he handled allegations against former white house staff secretary rob porter. axios reporting, saying he offered to resign tuesday after the first story was published.

but some senior white house officials urged him to stay and fight. the "new york times" reports, when kelly told staffers friday morning he removed porter less than an hour after learning about porter's true situation, quote, most of the staff appeared incredulous. one person said several people in the room knew that time line kelly had p kelly had presented was false. absorb that for a second. people who report day in, day out lead to he was lying about the time line. the white house is insisting trump has full confidence in kelly, despite reports trump is looking to replace him. >> so i want to pick up on what you just said about the president not being clear in his support of women. in fact, i think the opposite is true. i think he's been clear on the other side. the white house -- >> an invitation is open for him to be clear. just think about it. rob porter, while he said good things about him, he hasn't even acknowledged those two ex wives. >> let's talk about this. the white house is saying the president has been clear.

that he thinks violence against women is disgusting. but he does have a habit of defending men who are accused of hurting women. let's go down the list, compiled by the "new york times." he said this about rob porter. it's obviously a tough time for him. he did a very good job. we hope he has a wonderful career. he then added, quote, he says he's innocent and i think you have to remember that. remember this part. rob porter has denied the allegations, but remember this part about what donald trump said, because it's going to come in usefully in a minute. after another staffer resigned over domestic abuse allegations, donald trump tweeted on saturday morning, people's lives are being shattered and destroyed by a mere allegation. some are true, some are false. some are old, some are new. there is no recovery for someone falsely accused. life and career are gone. is there in such thing any longer as due process? trump defended, as stephanie pointed out, former alabama rn senate nominee, roy moore, who was cussed accused of misconduc teenage girls. he says this has never come up.

he totally denies it, and you know, you have to listen to him also. sounds similar to what he said about rob porter. trump defended bill o'reilly after the "new york times" reported he settled sexual harassment claims with five women. trump says, quote, i don't think bill did anything wrong. i think he's a person i know well. he is a good person. >> may i interrupt for one moment? and the president would have no way of having first-hand knowledge of what bill o'reilly did with those women. so already, it was beyond reach for the president to tell the "new york times," he's a good person. you might -- the president might have very good relationships with rob porter, with bill o'reilly. >> both things could be true. you could know bill o'reilly well. rob porter could be a good guy. but you're right. he doesn't have first hand knowledge of these things. bill o'reilly, by the way, continues to insist he has done nothing wrong. trump criticized the women accusing former fox chairman, roger ailes, saying, quote, some of the women complaining i know how much he has helped them. to stephanie's point, both

things can be true. and now all of a sudden they're saying these horrible things about him. it's very sad because he's a very good person. >> and roger ailes is the head of the fox network, may have helped those women, he may have helped them build their careers, but he also could have created a toxic work environment and environment that fostered harassing behavior. >> so the president likes to create a binary relationship with these things when, in fact, they can both be true. and by the way, after a reporter accused former campaign manager corey lewandowski of grabbing her and bruising her arm, he said of the reporter, she was running up and asking questions, she wasn't supposed to be doing that. he then said, how do you know those bruises weren't there before. let's not forget about what trump said about more than a dozen women who have accused him of misconduct. he said these people are horrible people. remember how binary the person gets about it. you're either good people or horrible people. these people are horrible people. they're horrible, horrible liars. so to that point, the president

isn't really in a position to change his view. if he changes his view about the others, he may have to answer things himself. >> it also just speaks to -- remember, this is the highest office in the hand. this is the white house. these are issues that the white house shouldn't be facing. as far as due process goes, i'm pretty sure the fbi was working on this. and decided to not give rob porter security clearance. >> joining us now is andy card, former white house chief of staff and msnbc political analyst. andy, thanks for being here. there are a couple issues here. one is the president's statements, which we can dispense with for a moment. but john kelly's role in this. he was somebody who the country and many people hoped would be a stabilizing force in that white house. but time after time after time, we've seen john kelly on the wrong side of things. i cannot forget what he said about florida congresswoman, fr frederica wilson. he came out and lied to reporters about something she d. the video came out, exonerated her and proved he was lying. i'm beginning to think we've got a very serious john kelly problem in this country.

>> first of all, i support john kelly. i think he's doing a remarkable job, and it's a very tough job. i have great empathy for him. it's not just sympathy. it's not theory. i have great empathy for the job that the chief of staff has to do. and i think he's doing it pretty well. his job is to make sure that the president stays focused and addresses the realish us america has to face. and we've got some real challenges. obviously, domestic abuse is never good. it's not right. and we shouldn't call it out. and, you know, rob porter is a very able person, but he evidently was involved in something that was outrageous and not justified. and it was appropriate for him to leave the white house. with john kelly, he serves at the discretion of the president. they call it the pleasure of the president, as everyone does in the white house. so ultimately, it's the president has to decide whether or not john kelly stays or doesn't stay, and as long as he's there, i want to support

him and help him do the job he's got to do. because he's got a tremendous responsibility to help the president meet his obligations. >> andy -- >> challenges in israel. we have challenges in north korea. >> but you're sort -- >> focus on those. those are the real issues. >> people who are experts at this like you, there are very few people who know this like you do, don't share your view on this. >> well, they haven't had the experience. i've had the experience. >> listen, i want you to listen to john kelly's words himself and let's reevaluate this on the other side. >> and a congresswoman stood up, and in the long tradition of empty barrels making the most noise, stood up there and all of that. and talked about how she was instrumental in getting the funding for that building. >> i would tell you that robert e. lee was an honorable man. he was a man that gave up his country to fight for his state, which in 150 years ago was more

important than country. the lack of an ability to compromise led to the civil war. and men and women of good faith on both sides made their stand where their conscience had them make their stand. >> there are 690,000 official daca registrants. and the president sent over what amounts to be two-and-a-half times that number to 1.8 million. the difference between 690 and 1.8 million were the people that some would say were too afraid to sign up. others would say were too lazy to get off their as but they didn't sign up. >> okay, andy, i'm not going to claim i understand how difficult the job is. i understand how chaotic and the massive responsibility. and the fact that with all the issues we have going on, whether it's in the middle east or north korea, you're not alone. there are senior members of the gop who have said, let's just let john kelly do hiscix job.

but do you listen to those things john kelly has said or the way he handled the rob po porter situation, handling the most sensitive information and have access to the president, someone who didn't even have fbi security clearance. all of that is a-okay? there is not someone more suited for that position? >> well, first of all, you don't know the whole story. i don't know the whole story. >> good point. >> i do know he serves at the pleasure of the president. and so it isn't the american people don't hire john kelly. the president hires john kelly. and he's got a responsibility to help article 2 of the constitution do the job that is personified by president trump. and that is an awesome responsibility. and he should not be distracted by some of these other things that are being said about him. he does the job very differently than i did it. i was trying not to be very visible as a chief of staff. i didn't go out and talk very much, but he does it differently. >> i'm not asking john kelly to defend the president or his campaign, you know, paying off

an adult film star. i'm asking about john kelly's own words and actions. we're not creating these distractions. these are his actions. >> well, there are only two people that can decide whether john kelly is in the job.&;fañ the president and john kelly. as long as john kelly has the job, i want to support him doing the job, because i know how hard it is and how important it is for a chief ofihvxy staff to dor job to help the president. and i don't want the white house to be distracted in doing the real job that has to be done by the president. >> okay. >> and a lot of these other things are distractions. >> all right. so let's talk -- >> do the job of protecting america. >> the media isn't creating these distractions. you've got a white house filled with people that don't have -- >> talking about them over and over again. >> we have an obligation to, andy. >> you also have an obligation -- the president also has an obligation to pay attention to what's happening in israel right now and with regard to syria and iran. he's got to pay attention to

what's happening in north korea as they get closer and closer to having nuclear capability and a delivery -- >> no debate with us. you know that. >> are you saying we should ignore the fact they have rob porter in the white house, people beyond rob porter, who don't have security clearance -- >> rob porter is no longer in the white house. so now you have to focus on who is replacing rob porter. >> we didn't know this problem until it came out. we didn't know rob porter had these allegations. >> that's the way it is. having been there and watch people go through security clearance problems, and yes, in every administration there have been some security challenges that related to personal activity. and i know that. they're not all in the public domain and they're not out there for public debate. that's part of the job of a chief of staff to focus on that and make sure the president gets well-served by the people around him and that the people there don't damage the reputation of the institution. the institution of the white house, the institution of the presidency, and they're there to

help the president do his job. >> don't you think what he's doing is damaging the reputation of the white house? what about the frederica wilson comments? he has not apologized for that. he lied. it was proved on tape he lied. >> john kelly is also a man who gave his son so this country could enjoy freedom. >> two important things. i think john kelly has done amazing things for this country. his son gave his life for the country. two things can be true at the same time. he may be really good, and you may empathize with him because you've been in that job. in the end, he may be hurting more than he's helping. >> well, that's not for you and i to decide. that's between john kelly and the president. john kelly may have tendered his resignation and the president may have said i don't want to receive it. if the president says i want your resignation, john kelly will be gone. those are the people who will make that decision. >> understood. okay. so i respect -- >> i respect the job he has to

do. >> you're right. it is the president's job to decide. it's also our job to question these things, right? so we should be questioning these things, and the president, john kelly can make their decisions as they see fit. >> you can question it. but ultimately, the decision is the president's or john kelly's. and maybe mutually. and as long as john kelly is there doing the job, i don't want him to fail. >> andy, thank you for your time, as always. >> we agree with you. we 100% want our country to succeed. we want our leadership to succeed. we would say, it is our job as the free press to get as much information out there. because especially as it relates to the rob porter situation, the more we learn, the more it was a white house who didn't want us to necessarily know. >> i just don't want them to take their eye off their responsibilities. too many people have painted themselves in a corner. if you're going to paint a room, start at the two stand corners, keep your back to the door and paint that way. that way you can get out. >> i'm with you there. >> andy card does know about

these things, he's a former white house chief of staff for george w. bush, served in the reagan and george h.w. bush administrations, as well. >> we talk about the job, this man has done it, and it's not an easy one. andy, thank you again. president trump unveiling his $1.5 trillion infrastructure plan. emphasis on the plan. unclear where the dough is coming from. we're going to hear from the president any moment and tell you which problegrams will be c to make this happen. and details from the rest of the 2019 budget just delivered to the hill this morning. we're also keeping an eye on markets this morning. started out really strong. 1% higher. we'll have much more on this. what's happening in these markets, what you have to think about. should you be breathing a sigh of relief or be ready for more volatility. you're watching "velshi and rhule" live on msnbc. ere are op. ere are op. like an "unjection™". xeljanz xr. a once daily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra for whom methotrexate did not work well. xeljanz xr can reduce pain, swelling

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welcome back to "velshi and rhule." president trump previewed about an event happening now. after stupidly spending $7 trillion in the middle east, it is now time to start ion vesting in our country. the plan was touted by administration officials as a $1.5 trillion effort, but the white house now admits, only $200 billion will come from the federal government. leaving the rest to fall on state and local governments along with private companies. >> listen, that's a brilliant tweet, the president put out. many americans hear that and say, what? $7 trillion to the middle east? let's invest in our country. the spirit of that is a great

comment, especially wone on the campaign trail. but let's get down to business. where is the money coming from? and let's take a look at how exactly the u.s. rates on infrastructure today. according to a report card from the american society of civil engineers, the united states, we need to go to summer school, on transit. the u.s. scores a d-minute us. that's buses and subways that move people to and from work and monorails that help us get to airports. 35% of transit tracks are not in good repair. our roads? they don't fare much better. getting a rating of "d," one in every five miles rate indeed poor condition of the national highway system. america's bridges graduated at a c-plus. more than 54,000 bridges across more than 54,000 bridges across the country rated deficient according to the american road and transportation builders association. that is almost 10% of the bridges across the country.

the top grade goes to rail, pulling in a "b," solid. the rash of recent train accidents remind us, safety remains an issue on the rails. and remember, most rail lines go over at least a few bridges at some point or another along their route. overall, u.s. infrastructure scores a d-plus. and as any parent will tell you, a d-plus, that doesn't get you any tv time, especially when millions of lives and a large chunk of american commerce depend on these grades every day. and if we wanted to fix it, the asce says it would take more than 4.5 -- wait for it -- trillion dollars to maintain and upgrade all of it to an acceptable grade. that includes ports, solid waste facilities, aviation, dams and drinking water. all of which scored similarly, sun acceptable rating. >> so there we have it. that is the situation. there is nobody who can argue we do not need infrastructure help in this country. joining us, senior managing director of the american society of civil engineers, casey

dingess. i assume you heard what stephanie just said. you can agree we need a infrastructure plan. what's your initial view, notwithstanding the fact we don't know the money is there to do this, of the way the white house is putting forward this plan? >> well, it's excellent to see presidential leadership on this issue. that can be incredibly helpful. this is a complex issue, it's taken us years to get into this, it will take years to get out. there are some good aspects we can see in the president's proposal. certainly expediting permitting and project decision-making is a good idea. there is some already going on at the regulatory phase from previous bills. that should go forward. there's probably some more improvements we can still make there. having a single lead agency on certain aspects of infrastructure, whether that's the department of transportation on transportation-type projects or the corps of engineers on

inland waterway type projects, also a good idea. some of his work force issues in training also an important consideration. but then that kind of gets us back to the funding issue. >> right. >> one thing about the numbers you put up, that $4.6 trillion in total infrastructure needs over ten years, $2.6 of that is being met through current revenue stream. so what we like to focus on is the $2 trillion debt or gap over ten years. so that translates to $200 billion a year. so if you take the president's number of $1.5 trillion, that would equate to $150 billion per year. so that's getting three quarters of the way towards the number we have identified. but not quite all the way there. >> got it. and assumes that we're actually going to get that sort of money they're talking about. they're proposing something that isn't funded at the moment. >> it is great to get this focus, about you what do you think about the way the proposal is set up? the federal government puts forward a portion but then a lot will rely on private investment and state and local governments.

do you see that as a good plan? >> you know, it's a good first step. public/private partnerships are certainly going to be a bigger part of the future in terms of u.s. infrastructure development. but at this point in time they're a relatively small percentage of the infrastructure projects. so even if that were to double or even triple, still the preponderance of infrastructure needs are still going to come from traditional user fee concepts that have been tried and true for many years. i'd like to point out that the u.s. chamber of commerce, certainly not a left wing business organization by any means, has advocated a 25-cent a gallon gas tax increase. the gas tax has not been touched in the united states in a quarter century. we support that concept. that would generate close to $400 billion over ten years. which would certainly be -- we would get some considerable traction in getting this thing going. you know, this is -- i think we have to be flexible as we go through the legislative process. i think this is a legitimate first step to be made. but congress is going to have a lot of work to do on this.

and i will say, i'm not hearing a lot of strong support out there. i think there's perhaps a level of uncertainty, since some of these concepts are new. >> let me ask you this. >> new is not a bad thing. >> no, i am so in favor of this, casey. we have been talking about getting the government on top of this. it's hard, because we're worried about where the money comes from. steve scalise, congressman, i won't play what he said, but basically he was saying that the permitting process is a big part of the problem. when you look at places like india, where it can sometimes take 15 or 17 years to get both permitting and court cases settled to build a major road, is it correct to say the permitting process in the united states for major infrastructure is longer than it should be or more onerous than it should be? >> you know, it needs to be a thorough process, especially as we look to the future and trying to build more sustainably, and have resilient infrastructure projects, withstand the impacts of climate change we're experiencing, especially in

coastal environments. so there are important considerations. but there has to be a way in this country where we can get all the stakeholders involved in a project up front, all the social impacts, economic and environmental impacts, get those issues on the table up front and then have a more streamlined process going forward. but also there are a number of less complicated infrastructure projects that need to be done out there that are not going to be tied up in this kind of permitting or regulatory review process. >> casey, good to talk to you. thanks for the work you guys do at the american society of civil engineers to at least let us know how serious an issue this is. >> thank you both. >> for sure. right now at the white house, president trump is unveiling that very infrastructure plan. we're going to bring you his remarks any minute now, including the latest details. and next, we're digging into trump's immigration overhaul on the big bargain chips like dreamers, the wall, family reunification. we're going to break down the biggest immigration rifts.

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on his way home from the winter olympics in south korea, pence told the "washington post" this new position is, quote, maximum pressure and engagement at the same time. nbc news has confirmed the post report, but a white house official clarified the u.s. still holds the stance that north korea mudst denuclearize. vladimir putin is investigating a passenger plane crash that killed all 71 people on board. the flight had just taken off from moscow, heading to another russian city when it crashed on sunday. workers have recovered both flight data recorders. and the flu is killing about 4,000 americans each week. right now that's 10% of all deaths in the united states. according to the cdc. the death toll is expected to grow in coming weeks as flu activity is still rising. the cdc says it is the worst flu season since 2009. >> and as of today, the maker of oxycontin, purdue phrma will

stop making the pills. they are facing lawsuits across the country. officials are working to restore power in puerto rico today after an explosion at an electrical station caused a blackout. the outage hit several major cities, including the capital, san juan. no word on what caused the blast. but it's another setback in efforts to restore power five months after hurricane maria. and the senate is expected to take a huge step on immigration reform, opening a free form debate. republican senators released a version of president trump's proposal as legislation last night, and it could be considered this week. >> now, the proposal provides a path to citizenship for 1.8 million daca recipients. it sets up a $25 billion trust fund for a wall and other border improvements. realoe indicates more than ooh,0oo 50,000 visas and limits chain migration, which is officially known as family-based immigration. president trump claims a single immigrant can bring in virtually

unlimited numbers of distant relatives. but for fact-sake, what is he talking about? >> president trump is calling for a complete overhaul of america's immigration system. he wants to gut family reunification, which he calls chain migration. that's the policy in which individuals sponsor family members who imgrate to the united states. white house officials would have us believe that legal immigrants are going around, sponsoring dozens of second, third, fourth cousins. the way they tell it, they are taking jobs away from native-born americans. but that just isn't the case. first of all, there are real limits on who legal permanent residents can sponsor for immigration. under current law, green card holders can only sponsor their spouses and unmarried children to join them in this country. u.s. citizens have a little more latitude. along with their spouses and children, they can also sponsor their parents, siblings and even grownup married children.

but their cousins and grandparents are still out of luck. the u.s. also caps the number of family-based immigrants each year at 500,000. and while that might sound like a lot, it gets broken up into tiers. for all u.s. citizen sponsors, the number of siblings admitted each year is capped at 65,000. for married children, it's just 23,400 a year. on top of that, there are caps imposed on countries of origin. there are waiting periods of up to 15 years to process an application for family members from india. 19 years for those coming from mexico. 23 years for families from the philippines. in fact, the process takes so long that the number of family members still waiting their turn has jumped to a whopping 4 million applicants. at that rate, it would take an awful awfully long time to build that chain the president keeps referring to. no matter how you slice it, we are not allowing in virtually unlimited numbers of distant relatives. fixing our immigration system is hard enough. but lying about the facts on the ground won't get us any closer to a solution.

>> for fact sake. that was some information for you. joining us now, gorges khobar, senior director of services at kasa, an immigrant advocacy corporation with more than 90,000 members in three states. george, hogan giddily has only positive things to say about the republicans' bill, the one they put out earlier today. take a listen. >> it's a very encouraging start to the day. because everything in the president's framework is laid out in this bill. and it's not just a lasting solution for daca. it is the things you mentioned. you have to build a wall. and the president has been very clear, what he wants are those four pillars and something short of that i doubt will reach the president's desk and see the pen for signature. >> okay. we know this is never going to be all or nothing. so are immigration advocates willing to accept the path to citizenship for dreamers, even if they have to accept the end to the diversity visa lottery

and limits on family migration? >> i think it's important to remember where all this started, right? first of all, it was the trump administration who manufactured this crisis. we had a daca program that allowed folks to stay in this country with work permits that were thoroughly vetted. these were individuals who had to come forward for background checks, pay a fee, et cetera, et cetera. and now he arbitrarily cancels the program and uses it as a bargaining chip to try to basically create -- manufacture again his wildest anti immigrant racist-warped dreams. this is a failing administration who is putting forward principles in their negotiating tactics that are really based on limiting the people that come to this country from certain countries of origin. he wants to change the face of our immigrant community. he's trying to reduce the number of people coming into this country from countries of origin

that people of color that originate from there. we're talking about eliminating programs in which -- that are the only path to entry to the united states from countries such as -- the african continent. we're talking about -- again, eliminating these programs, eliminating what it means to be a citizen. >> but george, i'll just interrupt you. i hear you. we're on the same side on this one. but what exactly -- what's the difference between what is good and what can be had? >> i mean, ultimately, what we want is democrats to step up and create real solutions. we actually had -- >> but what are they? what are reasonable solutions that the white house could potentially go for and that you could stomach? like, let's get real. not idealistic. >> sure. but i think it's important to fundamentally remember what we're trying to accomplish. we're trying to fix the dreamer issue, right? we want to make sure that dreamers are allowed an opportunity to permanently remain in this country. and succeed. we're trying to make sure -- >> yes, so what does that plan look like? what could you propose that

would work for dreamers and work for this white house? >> ultimately, it's a responsible fix, right, that in exchange allows these individuals to remain in the country. give them an opportunity to become legal, permanent residents. allow them an opportunity to become real citizens, real naturalized citizens after going through a number of steps. right? they have -- they're already an extremely vetted community. and what needs to happen is them to really acknowledge the fact that they have been in this country legally over 20 years. they should not be used as a bargaining chip to try to accomplish some of these ridiculous ideas, some of these border wall -- it's just unimplementable. >> a lot of democrats said we c the border wall, but if it gives us what we need, we'll do it. but the dreamers we have spoken to say, you guys have got to step up and get us a deal. this is our last chance. if this goes beyond march 5th, when john kelly says we're not

high on the list of people to be deported, a lot of employers will let go of their dreamers if they're out of status. >> absolutely. and there was a "washington post" article yesterday, noting an increase in the number of people that have been deported with zero criminal history, right? we know if you give i.c.e. additional resources and you give -- you spend additional resources into interior enforcement, these are the results you get. you get people being deported from this country that have zero criminal background. what we have to make sure, again, is acknowledge why we got into this situation in the first place. right? dreamers and a fix for tps cannot be used as a bargaining chip, ultimately, so separate families and to arbitrarily try to implement a vision of a warped administration. >> i hear you, george. but they are using it as the bargaining chip. that's the reality for every dreamer we've talked to and probably you have. they know that as much as it insults them and it's wbad for the economy and americans don't support it, dreamers have become

bargaining chips. it seems like their leverage is in question. >> well, one thing we've got to realize is, again, the latino and immigrant community is composed of over 70 million individuals in this country. there is a demographic wave coming in the next few years. in the next 25 years, we will be a majority/minority country. that has huge ramifications for the long-term political survival of both parties. this is what this means right now. they will be judged long-term on how they react to this situation. we will look back on this moment and really realize who is -- who is really supportive of the immigrant community and we will see repercussions from these decisions many years to come. >> george, good to talk to you. thank you. >> thanks again. any moment now, we're going to be hearing from president trump. he'll be unveiling his long-awaited infrastructure plan. it is an effort that's going to

cost at least 1.5 trillion bucks. >> they say. but they're not putting up 1.5 trillion to do it. >> no, the white house says $200 billion will come from the federal government. the rest will fall on local governments and private companies. sounds like a good plan. the question is, can it actually work? show us the money. we're going to bring you his remarks as soon as we get them. the number three official in the justice department has resigned. we'll look at current÷7%ussian interference in this year's midterm elections and why virtually nothing is being done >> i am honored. i am proud. but most of all, i am so

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welcome back to "velshi & ruhle." breaking news on the resignation of the number three official at the department of justice. >> on friday, news broke that rachel brand, the third in line at the department of justice, is stepping down after only nine months on the job. if the president were to fire the deputy attorney general, rod rosenstein, which people have talked about, brand would have taken over the russia investigation. part of her decision, nbc news is now learning. meanwhile, as the 2018 midterm elections get closer, it is unclear what, if anything, federal, state and local officials are doing to protect our elections. on the heels of news that at least a few of the 21 states targeted by russia had their voter roles penetrated. and remember, when offered the opportunity to reup our sanctions against russia -- >> the president didn't take it. even though congress wants him to. >> let's bring in nbc news national security and intelligence7d3% reporter, ke l

ken delaneyan. robert mueller, many people say, let him do his job. but if rachel is out, it leaves rod rosenstein. we know the president and his squad have attacked rod rosen stein over and over. >> yeah, i think it depends on who replaces her, stephanie. one thing it does say for sure, department of justice is not a very pleasant place to work right now, especially in the upper echelons. my colleague, julia ainslie is out with new reporting this hour that shows that rachel brand has been unhappy in her job for months and expressed concern to friends that she felt overwhelmed and unsupported. there are a number of senior positions that aren't filled at the doj. and she was concerned she could end up in a supervisory rollover the russia investigation which is not a place she wanted to be at all, giving the incoming fire

that would entail. so she began negotiating -- these jobs at walmart, that takes a long time to negotiate that job. that didn't happen overnight. so now she is leaving to become the general counsel at walmart. >> why wouldn't she want that role that role that provides supervisory over the russia investigation? couldn't one argue it's one of the most important jobs a human could have right now? >> well, sure, but constitutionally, i guess, not everybody is suited for the kind of incoming fire from your own president and from conservatives and republicans because she, after all, is a conservative republican legal scholar. also, it's not a role she's ever done before. >> let's talk about the elections. are we -- you and i were talking about it last week. there's more and more information about states that have been penetrated. voter rolls were not affected that we know of yet, but we don't know. the point is that it looks like hackers got some access to our voter rolls. are we doing anything to fix that? >> yes.

dh shr dhs is doing some things with states. as we discussed last week, there's no leadership from the oval office on this, and it's not clear that some basic things are going to be done in time for the election. for example, every state should have a paper ballot backup to their electronic voting system. that's not the case in many states. every state should make sure they're not connected to the internet and there are no ways in. there doesn't need to be much to reduce confidence in an election. voter rolls change or manipulated in a few key swing states or countiesing really thr -- counties could really throw the system into chaos. >> ken, good to talk to you as always. >> you bet. and president trump is unveiling that new infrastructure plan at the white house as we speak. as soon as we have his remarks, we're going to bring those to you, including his promise to rural america. remember, much of president trump's base is rural america, where infrastructure needs are big. >> let's take a quick look at the stock market. a wild couple of weeks. it's probably not over yet. we're going to talk about why

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liberty stands with you™ liberty mutual insurance. all right. we're back now on "velshi & ruhle." . >> for those who have seen your 401(k) take a big hit, some positive news this morning. the dow is up 323 points, building on friday's 300-point gain. the broader markets are also

higher. the s&p 500 is up. the nasdaq is up. we're now in a full positive swing, but the issue that's got people so concerned is the swing. >> the volatility, right. this follows last week's wild ride. if you want a description of volatility, there it is on your screen. the dow plunged 1,175 points on monday. it was the biggest one-day point loss ever. then 560 points higher on tuesday. then down 19 points on wednesday. even that was a crazy day that was down hundreds and up hundreds. then closing down 1,033 points on thursday, and finally ending the week with a 330-point rally. you can be excused for feeling a little uncomfortable or queasy looking at a market like that. >> but unless you are a market professional, those kinds of swings will make you sick. joining us now, my dear friend, editor of the economics. all we know so far. all right, you explained this by saying there are two competing

stories, and the truth is rooted in data. walk us through it. >> yeah, so when markets are this volatile, basically there's a news story and people are uncomfortable with what the news story might mean. we think markets are paying attention to data. they're not. we're all human creatures who need stories. there are two going on right now. here's one. there's wage growth, wage growth drives inflation, inflation causes the fed to raise rates faster, that makes debt more expensive. everything is normal again. yay, things are good. i'll see you guys in a year. that's a possible story. there's another one going on, which is a little less comforting. that is for a very long time, the u.s. has been able to borrow without much of a cost at all. in fact, that cost has been sinking. so the one market indicator we should be watching right now is what it costs the united states to borrow money for ten years. that has been rising and has been rising very fast. now, that could just be about inflation, but here's the but

and here's the scary part of the story. it could be that maybe we can't borrow cheaply for the next ten years. that's a problem. we're paying attention to treasury auctions right now. we don't normally do that. >> all right. so brendan, one thing that a lot of people are worried about, people who don't follow the markets all that clearly, is they associate, particularly because of the last recession that we had, down markets with some underlying problem that could trigger a recession. >> like the subprime issue that was bubbling underneath the markets. >> that's not there now. we don't have any underlying issue. we could have a recession because we might be due for one. >> but that was like a volcano that exploded all over the planet. >> that was a jungle variety recession as opposed to garden variety. >> no, guys, you're absolutely right. all the underlying economic data looks good. when we look at debt, it was the debt that we saw among consumers before the last recession was housing debt. it was home equity loan debts. that's not what we see right now.

there is -- debt is rising. in fact, we're saving less as a percentage of our income than we have for a long time, but that tends to be student loans and car loans. if that goes bad, it's a problem, but it's not a problem like losing your house. so you're absolutely right. more broadly, almost all of the economic data is pretty good. we are seeing wage gains right now. the real problem is there's underlying longer term problems. we have much lower percentage of people in the work force than we have for a long time. that is a long-term problem. it was happening under bush. it was happening under obama. it's happening now under trump. we haven't fixed that. >> that's because long-term problems these days are only met with short-term solutions. brendan, thank you so much for joining us today. >> thanks, guys. want. >> and thank you for watching this hour of "velshi & ruhle." i'll be back at 3:00 p.m. eastern. >> i'll see you tomorrow at 9:00 a.m. eastern. check us out on social media and connect with our

show @velshiruhle. right now we hand you to our friend and colleague andrea mitchell for "andrea mitchell reports." >> and right now on "andrea mitchell reports," blaming the victim? president trump coming under fire for his response to the domestic violence accusations against a top aide, questioning the womens' claims in a tweet and in the oval office. >> it's very sad when we heard about it and certainly he's also very sad. now, he also, as you probably know, says he's innocent. i think you have to remember that. thin ice, the white house mounting a full-throated defense of chief of staff john kelly, but is his future still in question after a series of white house scandals? >> he has full confidence in his current chief of staff, general john kelly. >> does he still have confidence in general kelly? >> absolute confidence. >> i think it's much to do about nothing. and breaking the ice. after a deep f