037/23 03/17/23 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> family detention is inhumane, but acceptable, and has no place in a just society. the evidence is crystal clear. detention under any circumstance harms people. amy: almost 400 immigrant and human rights groups are urging the biden administration not to reinstate my grip family

detention. we will speak with two of the organizers. then as we continue to mark the 20th anniversary of the u.s. invasion of iraq, we will look at a new documentary about the father of julian assange and his fighter for his son. >> i urge the department of justice to drop the charges. >> the maximum jail sentence is 155 years because he published the truth. >> how does it feel to be the father of such a controversial figure? amy: we will speak to julian assange's father and brother. did we look at the cost of the iraq war from civilian casualties to soaring pentagon budgets. all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. wall street's largest banks have

moved to prop up the ailing san francisco-based first republic bank after the sudden collapse of regional banks signature and svb last week sparked fears of a financial meltdown. bank of america, citigroup, jpmorgan chase, wells fargo, and -- will each make $5 billion in uninsured deposits into first republic while seven others will deposit a further $10 billion. the federal reserve reports wall street firms have received about $300 billion in emergency lending over the past week, roughly half what the fed loaned banks during the 2008 financial crisis. on capitol hill, treasury secretary janet yellen sought to reassure the senate finance committee over the stability of u.s. financial markets. >> i can reassure them members of the committee that our banking system is sound and that americans can feel confident that their deposits will be there when they need them. amy: yellen defended the biden

administration's decision to allow all depositors at svb and signature to recover their assets after the banks collapsed, using money from the federal deposit insurance corporation. that's despite the fact that over 93% of assets at svb and signature were not insured by the fdic. under questioning from senators, yellen admitted smaller banks that fail might not get the same treatment. the united nations says there is encouraging momentum in the effort to end the eight-year war in yemen. u.s. and saudi officials said iran has agreed to stop arming houthis in yemen as part of the recent china-brokered deal to restore diplomatic ties between saudi arabia and iran. here in the united states, senators chris murphy and mike lee introduced a bipartisan resolution this week that would require the u.s. to report on saudi human rights abuses with the goal of ending u.s. arms sales to the kingdom. the humanitarian catastrophe in yemen has left over 17 million people in need of assistance.

the polish president andrzej duda said thursday his government will ship four soviet-era mig fighter jets to ukraine, becoming the first nation since russia's invasion to meet ukraine's request to deliver warplanes. following that announcement, slovakia's government said it would transfer 13 fighters to ukraine. finland, the netherlands, and other nato members are considering similar transfers. in geneva, the u.n.-mandated independent international commission of inquiry on ukraine said thursday russia has committed wide-ranging war crimes in ukraine, including possible crimes against humanity. erik mose is chair of the commission. >> the commission has concluded the russn authorities have committed numerous violations of international humanitarian law and international human rights law in addition to a wide range of war crimes, including the war

crime of excessive incidental deaths, injury, or damage, willful killings, torture, inhumane treatment, unlawful confinement, rape, as well as unlawful transfer and deportation. amy: china's foreign minister said thursday he called his russian counterpart to urge a diplomatic solution to the war in ukraine, warning the conflict could spiral out of control. the warning came as china announced president xi jinping will travel to moscow early next week to hold talks with russian president vladimir putin. australia has agreed to purchase 220 tomahawk cruise missiles from the united states at a cost of nearly $1 billion. the u.s. state department approved the sale thursday just days after president biden formally announced plans to sell nuclear-powered submarines to australia in a bid to counter china's influence in the indo-pacific. the biden administration is

threatening to ban tiktok if its chinese owners refuse to sell their stake in the u.s. version of the hugely-popular video sharing app. tiktok has been the target of increasing scrutiny by some lawmakers who say it's a threat to national security and that its owner, beijing-based bytedance, could use americans' personal data. on thursday, the u.k. became the latest country to announce tiktok would be banned on government devices following similar bans by the u.s., canada, and the european union. in the occupied west bank, israeli forces killed four palestinians, including a teenager, in a raid on the city of jenin thursday. the deaths bring the number of palestinians killed by israeli forces this year to at least 83. the palestinian authority and israel are scheduled to hold security talks in egypt over the weekend, which will include officials from egypt, jordan, and the united states.

fresh protests erupted across france thursday after president emanuel macron bypassed parliament and invoked executive powers to push through a highly contested law raising the retirement age from 62 to 64. macron took the drastic step after it appeared he might not have the necessary support in the national assembly. lawmakers booed and sang the national anthem while holding up protest signs and signaled macron could soon face a no-confidence vote from opposition parties. massive protests and prolonged strikes have rocked france over the past two months as union leaders vowed to keep up the disruptions. this is a teacher speaking from thursday's protests in paris. >> it is proof that presidents party is the minority in parliament but he is also a minority in public opinion. the responsibility is on the president. after he refused to have dialogue with the union, he decided to pass this law by force. this law, which is unfair and a

popular, will result in people working more to get less. amy: in the united kingdom, unions representing medical workers, including nurses and paramedics, have agreed to a tentative deal on pay raises that would recover ground lost to inflation. union leaders hailed the deal as a historic victory, capping months of rolling strikes by thousands of workers at the national health service. about 100,000 civil servants and others, including junior doctors at nhs, remain in a long-running dispute over pay, pension, and job security. meanwhile, the u.k. government says it has agreed to intensive talks on teacher pay and classroom sizes with an estimated 200,000 teachers in england and wales, who hit picket lines this week for a three-day strike action. teachers were among tens of thousands of people who marched through the streets of london on wednesday. >> i can't sit back and watch educators decimated. it is not just about teacher pay , but funding for schools. our children deserve better than this.

they are our future. amy: in greece, riot police deployed tear gas and sound grenades against protesters thursday as workers held a general strike amid ongoing anger over last month's rail disaster that killed 57 people. the strike grounded flights, halted public transport, kept ferries docked, canceled classes, and left public hospitals running with emergency staff. rail workers say government neglect and privatization led to the decay of the train system. back in the united states in east palestine, ohio, newly released data shows soil in the -- shows soil at the site of the norfolk southern train derailment contains levels of dioxin -- a highly toxic chemical that can cause cancer -- hundreds of times higher than what's considered safe. that's according to the guardian, which had the data reviewed who said the levels of dioxin found in east palestine were extremely concerning, even if they're below the federal cleanup threshold. the findings also disputed remarks made by epa administrator michael regan last week when he told congress the dioxin levels were very low.

in 2010, when the epa found dioxin poses cancer risks, the agency tried to have those limits lowered but the obama administration kept the higher threshold in place. in rated news, two trains operated by bnsf derailed in arizona and washingtontate thursday. in washington, cleanup teams were deployed after some 5000 gallons of fuel leaked onto the -- into the swinomish tribal reservation. north dakota's supreme court ruled thursday the state's abortion ban should remain on hold while a lawsuit over its constitutionality is resolved. north dakota's anti-abortion trigger law was supposed to take effect once roe v. wade was overturned, but a lower court temporarily blocked it last summer arguing abortion rights are protected by the state constitution. the legislation makes it a felony to perform an abortion, with limited exceptions in cases of rape, incest, or medical emergency. and "the los angeles times" announced thursday it will no longer use the word "internment"

to describe the ma imprisonment of 120,000 people of japanese ancestry during world war ii. it will instead use terms like "incarceration," "imprisonment," or "detention." it's the latest step taken by the paper to rectify the harm it caused during the war when it called for the incarceration of japanese and japanese americans. "the l.a. times" issued a formal editorial apology six years ago. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. this week nearly 400 human rights groups are urging president biden not to reinstate thcontroversial practice of migrant family detention by immigration and customs enforcement, or ice. this comes amidst an intensified crackdown on asylum seekers as his administration prepares to phase out the contested trump-era title 42 pandemic policy used to expel over 2

million migrants without due process at the southern border. on trsday, a woman named beatriz o was held in the first ice family detention center in artesia, new mexico in 2014 spoke at a protest in washington, d.c. >> this detention causes irreparable trauma, especially when you have children who are growing anplaying in a place where no one should be. people are asking for asylum come to this country fighting for our lives. it is a human right that we all have the right to access. i could be here for hours and i hear so many of -- that i saw when i was in detention.

and still under thisrocess o so many years, the system is created to traumatize us and to violate our human rights. amy: family detention was first used by ice under the obama administration and was continued by president trump even after doctors contracted by homeland security's office of civil rights and civil liberties found the practice subjected thousands of families to abuse and trauma. in 2017, democracy now! spoke to dhs whistleblower dr. scott allen who described conditions at the artesia family detention center. pbably th mt poigna examplese docunted is we looked at weight. i pulled the charts of every child and look at their weights

and was surprised to see a significant number of children who probably at the facility -- arrived under what were not gaining weight, which is what you would expect. they were losing weight, which is a really disturbing marker that we did not expect. amy: that was 2019. this comes as "the los angeles times" announced trsday it will no longer use the term "internment" to describe the mass incarceration of tens of thousands of japanese-americans during world war ii. instead they'll use the words "incarceration," "imprisonment" and "detention." 80 years ago, the los angeles times" actually campaigned to detain japanese americans during the war. it published an official apology and a 2017. for more, we're joined by two guests who are among those saying never again to family detention. mike ishii is the co-founder of tsuru for solidarity. his mother was incarcerated at the so-called camp harmony

holding center in puyallup, washington state and then in camp minidoka in idaho during world war ii. also with this is silky shah, executive director of the detention watch network. when president biden first came into office, he pledged to end family detention and pursue just, compassionate, humane immigration policies. during the very sharp -- drawing a very sharp contrast between what he planned to do as president and what president trump did. >> it is wonderful to be here with you. he is doing the truth is biden on the campaign truck, democrats under trump, were politically supportive of immigration. that is how they put themselves out there.

they very much said we don't believe in family detention or separation. the complete opposite has happened. many of the trump europe policies stayed in place for a very long time and title 42 continues. i think this push to say now we are going to consider reinstating family detention is largely because title 42 is going to end in may and they are saying, well, in every way they don't want to support migrants at the border, support people seeking asylum. so they are reinstating this policy believing it will deter families and politically show their anti-immigration. they believe that is what they need to put out there. in every way the biden administration has faltered and is going against all the promises that they made on the campaign trail. amy: can you talk about the organizing going on right now? nearly 400 human rights and

immigrant rights groups have come together? >> yes. absolutely. there has been a long effort to end family detention going back to 2006 when the bush administration started detaining families at hutto. obama offended that practice there but brought it back in 2014. they're constantly have been so many groups working to end family detention at the local level and the federal level or humanitarian organizing, grassroots organizing. we have had a really big win at the berks family detention center which has been in use for 20 years. they finally ended the practice of family detention thereby cap the center open for women but just earlier this year they stopped detaining people there altogether. it shows the power of organizing, the power of us getting to the place of where we are seeing the end to detention at certain facilities and a reduction of detention for the

first time in 40 years. for the biden administration to go back and say, well, we're going to detain fellas again is a blow. but the reality is nearly 400 groups came out and said they don't want this. so many people even in the administration don't want this within ice. nobody was to do family detention and a lot of it is just them playing politics and saying we are going to do this because they are worried about people seeking asylum. they don't want to offer support to those. this is their way of saying we will treat families horribly and tell them not to come. amy: are other guest is mike ishii.

in 2019 after five japanese-american elders and survivors of u.s. concentration camps demonstrated outside the fort sill army post in oklahoma, where the trump administration planned to indefinitely detain 1400 immigrant and refugee children. >> our elders have stated publicly they are willing to be arrested in defense of the childr -- >> can you describe what is happening now. >> they are wanting to remove us. we have been removed too many times. if that is what it comes to -- >> why don't you people understand? >> we will stay here. >> what do you people understand? >> we understand the history of this country and we are not going to let it happen again. amy: mike ishii you are there with others. you are protesting again against family detention. talk about the background, your own family attained during world

war ii and why you are so concerned about this biden shift. >> thank you, amy. it is nice to be back here again. the japanese-american community is still healing the multigenerational trauma from that forced removal, separation of families, and detention. what we recognize is that in the united states, there is an intersectional history here of always targeting communities of color and immigrant communities with this kind of violence. it has been important for japanese americans who were basically silenced by that experience during world war ii to step forward and assert our voice instead in solidarity with people who are being targeted currently because we know the harms that come to people. that is why we showed up at fort sill. that is why in the years since

then that we have formed a national organization, fighting along with detention watch and many other organizations on the ground, to stop the expansion and the normalization of incarceration of unaccompanied migrant children and now, unfortunately, it looks like they're going to bring back family detention. amy: i am wondering your response to the "los angeles times" thursday announcing they will no longer use the word " internment" and instead talking about "incarceration, "imprisonment," and "detention." what did it take for the paper to get there? >> i would say there has been a campaign for over 50 years from my community to challenge the euphemisms of the united states government when it targets communities of color with racist

policies. so during world war ii, they called it internment camps. that is factually incorrect but it was used as cover to not say that they were imprisoning people. for instance, they called immigrants aliens and they called citizens not aliens. we are challenging that in this moment, you can call it a processing center or intake site but these are detention sites. detention, no matter what you want to call it under another name, is detention and is wrong. amy: last month, silky shah, the biden administration proposed a new policy that could block tens of thousands of people from seeking asylum at the u.s.-mexico border. it would force migrants to seek protection in mexico or another country they passed through on their way here. they would be able to ask for asylum in the u.s. only of those previous claims in another country are denied step unaccompanied children would be

exempt. your response to this policy? >> it is devastating to see how far this administration has gone to the right on asylum. the truth is, for many, many years, both republicans and democrats have a partisan strategy to push for deterrence at any cost, which is why obama brought it back in 2014. that opened up the space for family separation to happen. him doing that, everything that is happened since the clinton administration has been prevtion through deterrence, consequences at the border that includes turning people away, not giving them the right to asylum, incarcerating people, and prosecuting them for just seeking asylum for coming to the border. i think in so many ways, what we are seeing with this administration is you would hope after the trump administration we would see this is not how we

want to be as a country. that we want to support people, protect people, care for people. instead, this administration is going ba on that and saying we are going to continue to do the same things. i think the asylum rule that is coming up is essentially a ban is a response to this administration having zero vision on immigration and specifically a lot of people needing safety and seeking safety right now. because of title 42, they waited to end title 42, it took on a life of its own and they kept it in place for so long that now they're scrambling to find something else to put in place when title 42 ends. amy: in 2016 the united nations human rights office warned the detention of children can be devastating for a child and is not the legitimate response under international human rights law. you're going to end here with mike ishii.

all of the groups involved right now, do you have a sense or a number of whistleblowers, to say the least, speaking out during the trump era, although there were whistleblowers from within the government and you have a sense you can stop this biden shift? >> amy, we are in a very troubling moment right now. this is an administration that campaigned on protecting children, on calling out the harms of the trump administration and yet there replicating those policies. what we have seen a fort bliss, the largest of these detention sites were unaccompanied children, is four whistleblowers have come forward alleging sexual abuse, physical abuse, children under suicide alerts, rotten food, lack of medical attention, and certainly terrible mental health issues for these children. this is the state of child detention in the united states. and the young center issued a

report in 2022 noting children exhibit signs of trauma inside of detention sites are then written up and these writeups are used to punish them. a lot of them are being stepped up to secure facilities -- these are not -- these are juvenile prisons. immigrant children taken from detention sites into juvenile prisons. this is not going in the right direction. amy: mike ishii, thank you for being with us tsuru for , solidarity, his mother was incarcerated at the so-called camp harmony holding center in washington state and then in camp minidoka in idaho during world war ii. and silky shah is detention watch network's executive director. coming up, we look at a new documentary about julian assange 's father, his fight to free his

son in prison for exposing u.s. war crimes. back in 30 seconds. ♪♪ [music break] amy: "juegos y miedos" games and fears by gaby moreno. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. as we continue our coverage of the 20th anniversary of the u.s. invasion of iraq by looking at the imprisonment of wikileaks founder julian assange for

exposing u.s. war crimes in iraq and afghanistan and beyond. julian has spent nearly four years locked up in london's notorious belmarsh prison, often called "britain's guantánamo." he has been held there as the u.s. government seeks his extradition to face espionage and other charges. if extradited and convicted in the u.s., julian faces 175 years in a maximum-security prison. in 2010, wikileaks gained international attention after publishing a trove of classified documents leaked by former u.s. army soldier chelsea manning. included were numerous accounts of war crimes in iraq. one video released by wikileaks showed a u.s. helicopter gunship in baghdad slaughtering a dozen civilians, including a reuters -- two reuters step. reuters photographer namir noor-eldeen and his driver saeed chmagh.

wikileaks titled that video "collateral murder." this is an excerpt. amy: julian n democracy now! in april 2010, a day after wikileaks published the collateral murder video. >> when we first got it, we were told it was important. we had no other context. we spent quite some months looking closely into this and the more we looked, the more

disturbing it became. this is a sequence which has a lot of detail. i think in some ways, covers most of the bad aspects of the area war in iraq and what we must be able to infer is going on in afghanistan. these are not bad apples, this is standard actice. you can hear from the tone of the voices of the pilots that this is another day at the office. these pilots have evidently and gunners have evidently become so corrupted, morally corrupted, by the war that they are looking for excuses to kill. amy: that is julian assange and a washington, d.c., studio right after he released what they called collateral murder video. i later interviewed julian assange in 2014 about wikileaks releasing the iraq war logs. at the time, he was living inside the ecuadorian embassy where he had sought political asylum.

we sat together there. >> october 2010, which in some ways has been one of our best analytical works. we worked together with not just other media organizations, but a number of statistical organizations to work out what the kill count was for iraq, and combining with other figures, and we ended up with more than 100,000 civilian casualties. in fact, 15,000 new, completely undocumented civilian kills. and documenting u.s. involvement and approval of iraqi torture centers within the police and many killings of civilians at checkpoints and some political issues and so on. and that produced a number of inquiries and has fed into cases that have been taken by iraqis,

and that has now ended up with an icc filing, international criminal court filing, against the british military. amy: that was one of several interviews i did with julian assange inside the ecuadorian embassy in london only traveled to interview there. that was in 2014. well, in a moment, we will be joined by julian's father john shipton and his brother gabriel shipton. they are here for the opening of a new film about john shipton's struggle to free his son. is titledithaka." >> he was the daing of the left. all of a sudden, he's of puppet of russia. >> im julianssange's fatr. >> julian assange is arrested. >> one of e mustard ties and

coroversial gures in custody -- most notorious and controversial figures is in custody. >> i urge the department of justice to drop the charges. >> maximum jail sentence of 175 years because he publish the truth. how does it feel to be the father of a controversial figure knn around t world? >> what are yotalking about on it on a regular basis? >> if julian is extradited to the united states to face these charges, he will be the first, but not the last. >> collapsed underhe strai

cook i am done. -- >> i am done. >> what's at stake? if he goes down, so will journalism. amy: that was the trailer of the new film "ithaka." it was produced by julian assange's brother, the filmmaker gabriel shipton, who joins us in washington, d.c. come along with their father john shipton. we welcome you both to democracy now! gabriel, talk about the name of this film "ithaka." >> well, it is named after a poem. it is a poem that john would listen to while we were traveling around the world advocating for julian. it sort of a grounding, inspiring poem that talks about

the journey and not the destination and we chose the title because it is really about when you're fighting for a cause bigger than yourself or for an unachievable goal, you have to live every day or just put one foot in front of the other and that is what "ithaka" is about, their friends you make along the way, lessons you learn, things you see that keep you going every day in this fight to free julian assange. amy: gabriel, you were a film maker already and then this hits your family. can you give us the latest, what this hitting your family is? what has happened to julian and the latest state of affairs? he has been at the belmarsh prison for four years? >> that's right. april 11 will be four years in

belmarsh maximum-security prison. he has one final appeal application in with the high court in the u.k. all of the papers, all of the documents were submitted five months ago and the high court is still deliberating whether to hear this appeal or not. this is further evidence this then legal veil that is hanging in front of julian's persecution, he remains in a maximum security prison, not convicted of any crime. he is held there solely at three west of the u.s. doj. the prison has 800 inmates. 20% of whom are convicted murderers. julian is in a cellblock with these people. he spends most of his days isolated in his cell.

it is a dire situation for julian. i have to compel people we have to act to free him now. amy: i want to turn to a clip from "ithaka" where john shipton talks about visiting him at the belmarsh prison for the first time. >>, talk about the day -- >> i do't really remember. what i remember is he got arrested so i came here and went and saw him -went and saw julian in jail. anyway, he was in a very bad way. >> how was julian assange? >> he lost about 10 kilos. under a lot of stress and pressure.

sorry. >> were yoable to give him a hug? >> yes >> how was that? >> pretty moving, as you would expect. tough fo him. >> thank you very much. >> i said, i will be back. i won't stop coming until you can come home. amy: that is john shipton just outside belmarsh after seeing julian inside for the first time he is joining us from washington, d.c., just before he heads up to here in new york with gabriel for the film's showings in various theaters around the u.s., will be there tonight. i will be doing the q&a with

john and gabriel. john, talk about that moment seeing your son, what this means to you and having a film about your decision to travel the world to garner support for julian assange. >> good morning. well, you know, it is a bit heartrending when i went in and saw julian and he was wobbly. was still in what the prisoners call hell, which t prison governor calls theealth wing. it is plied within the prison where the prison isolates those considered ill. julian was considered so depressed that he had to be watched 24 hours a day to

prevent any self-harm. he had lost a lot of weight. usually, you know, julian is a very strong minded man. he never asks me for anything. but at this stage, he asked could i come and give a hand -- could i come and work at getting him free from the circumstances. that was about 3.5 years ago. that is the circumstances. actually, will be four years in apl. since then, we have built a worldwide movement come every single parliament in the western theater, the united nations, the council of europe have involved themselves, and every single major civic organization in the

united states -- aclu, human rights watch, 27 and all -- have involved themselves, great newspaper outlets have written a letter to merrick garland asking the charges be dropped course,ublisherhave written, as julian is a publisher, all publishers realize this prosecution has brought a chill to the capacity to analyze policy and capacity to print that analysis, so thereby, to inform the public. amy: newspapers that have called for his release, "new york

times," "the guardian" " der spiegal." i want to go back to a 2010 "meet the press" interview with then vice president joe biden. abc host at the time david gregory qutioned ben about assae. >> should the united states do something to stop mr. assange? >> we're looking at that right now. i am not going to comment on that process. >> do you think he is a criminal? >> if he conspired to get the classified documents with a member of the u.s. military that is fundamentally different than if somebody drops in your lap, "here is classified material." >> othersay thiss akin to the pentagon papers. >> i would argue it is closer to being a high-tech terrorist.

amy: a high-tech terrorist, gabriel shipton. that is now president biden. he said that as vice president on nbc "leave the press." that seems -- "meet the press." that seems to be common from buying to the former director of the cia pompeo. your response and what since you're getting from inside the biden administration right now on this extradition request? >> well, this was an extradition prosecution that was pushed by pompeo and the trump administration and now under the biden administration, it continues on so the biden administration is owning this prosecution at the moment. and their continuing pushing forward with it most of national

security doj fighting julian's obligation to appeal. see their pushing forward with this prosecution. what we are saying and what john was talking about in this worldwide movement for freedom of expression has grown up around the fight to free julian, and that is now coming into the congress in the united states. congresswoman rashida tlaib has a dear colleague that is coming from the progressive caucus and we know there are four other congresspeople signed on from the progressive caucus so we are really seeing some movement in congress from the democratic side. as well as republicans like longtime supporters of julian. we are hopeful this sort of pressure will help the justice

department come help merrick garland really have a look at this trump air prosecution that criminalizes what journalists should be doing every day, publishing without fear or favor. they need to have another look at it and really come to the conclusion that "the new york times" and the a cell you has that this is a threat to press freedom -- the aclu has that this is a director press freedom. amy: john shipton, you are julian's dad. does he hold out hope? >> i'm sorry? amy: do you hold out hope for his freedom? >> yes, most certainly. i use the word "faith. every second, every minute, devoted to continuing. it benefits, first of all,

julian come and secondly, our family. thirdly, all of those people who believe in the great artifact of the united states constitution, the first amendment, whereby he can freely read, frey comment, and as a consequence of that, building an understanding of the government policy or the cultural and social movement. it is just absolutely vital. it was first discovered or first announced by goodall, who was -- first announced by goodall as a global problem. goodall was the attorney who fought on behalf of "the new york times" back in the pentagon papers. also i would add, the support of

daniel ellsberg has been stalwart over the last 14 years. the last time we were here, he invited us into his house. it is with considerable sadness, gabriel and i received a note from daniel the other day that he would be leaving us soon. amy: meaning he has announced he has pancreatic cancer and doctors say he has months to live. i want to thank john shipton father of julian assange. ,and gabriel shipton, jillions rather. gabriel is the producer of the new documentary film "ithaka." it will be screening tonight at the new plaza cinema on 67th street the upper west side where i will be doing a q&a.

you can go to democracynow.org for a list of showings. coming up, we continue to look at the cost of the iraq or from civilian casualties to soaring pentagon budgets. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "oh! my mama" by alela diane. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. as we continue to mark the 20th anniversary of the u.s.-led invasion and occupation of iraq, we look at the many costs of war from the civilian casualties to soaring pentagon budgets with neta crawford, codirector of the cost of war director at brown university. she is author of a new report titled "blood and treasure: united states budgetary costs and human costs of 20 years of war in iraq and syria, 2003-2023."

she is also professor of international relations at oxford university and author of the book "the pentagon, climate change, and war: charting the rise and fall of u.s. military emissions." today she is joining us from montréal, canada. welcome back to democracy now! if you can start off by laying out what you found as you looked at 20 years of u.s. invasion and occupation of iraq -- i say going right here today because thousands of u.s. soldiers are still in iraq. >> that's right. so in 2002, the united states had a discussion about the cost of possible war in iraq and the possibility of civilians and others being harmed. the estimates then work right low, between $50 billion or $300

billion would be the total cost, if you casualties and the war would be contained in over quickly. what has happened over the last 20 years is that thousands of u.s. service members were killed , about 5000 u.s. service members and many contractors. and in addition, hundreds of thousands of civilians were killed. 7000 by the u.s. in the beginning. iraq descended into civil war shortly after the u.s. invasion. in addition, many millions were displaced. millions of people are still

displaced internally and also as refugees in the region. now, in syria, when the u.s. intervened in 2014, it's when ongoing syrian civil war, many more people were displaced and injured by bombs. what we also see is even in the places where the fighting has stopped, civilians and other people like health care workers have been injured by unexploded ordnance which have been left in the wake of war. the story continues. it is not over. it was not quick or easy and certainly was not cost-free. amy: so i want to ask you about the costs of war right now as we look at your report, which

includes a table that shows more than 2000 civilians were killed by u.s. coalition airstrikes in the first month of the iraq war alone. again, the u.s. invaded iraq 20 years ago sunday, our time sunday. it was march 20 and a arete, -- march 19 in iraq. >> the u.s. began airstrikes actually before the war began and a small number but in the first month of the war, about 7000 silanes were killed by all means by the u.s. coalition, more than 2000 killed by airstrikes. this is part of what was called in the shock and all strategy. the idea was that if united states bombarded erect, hit

vital infrastructure and leaders, that the iraqi military would collapse, that they would surrender. of course that did not happen. but there were many civilians killed inadvertently by airstrikes that went astray. this is always the case that civilians are harmed unintentionally. and of course, the airstrikes continued. the first month of the war was quite in particular intense. amy: 2500 u.s. soldiers are still in iraq. if you can talk more about what the u.s. is even requesting now. i mean, we're talking about the was returning to significant military operations in iraq and syria in late 2014 in fighting that was undertaken they said to remove islamic state from the

territory. the work continues with a nearly $400 million budget request from the biden administration this month to counter isis they say. >> that's right. the united states believes if they leave, isis some other militant will come back. right now the idea is to maintain a presence there on the border and also in syria to make sure isis cannot recover and take more territory. now, of course, in the period after the invasion, there were no militants terrorists in iraq, and that is what we knew then. the reason for the war in 2003 was supposedly to get rid of weapons of mass destruction which were never found because

they had already been dismantled. but isis and other militant flocked to iraq in part to push back the united states coalition and to try to free iraq from what they saw as a foreign occupation. the birth of isis is in part due to the u.s. invasion in 2003, and isis spread in the region and took over large swaths of territory which then had to be retaken. it was a very intense fight. the united states remains there to do that, as you say, at request of nearly $400 million for next year. amy: professor crawford, why did you include syria under the cost of war with iraq? >> quite simply because when isis took this territory, they

did not take it just in syria, they took it in iraq. the reason why president obama said the united states needed to be in this fight was because the democracy the united states hoped to set up and support in iraq, the government was at risk of a large parts of the territory near syria were taken. so the united states began been barred meant -- bombardment of isis and try to take territory back. they destroyed much of what had been rebuilt followinghe 2003 invasion. this is why it is included because it is of a piece the entire were effort is premised on fighting isis, which was in both countries. it's called operation inherent resolve and that is the point, it is about syria and iraq. amy: finally, your new book "the

pentagon, climate change, and war: charting the rise and fall of u.s. military emissions." it related directly to a rack. >> it is about u.s. military missions from the 19th century to the present. but part of the emissions from the iraq war capulet to be about 100 million metric tons from 2003 to the present. amy: right. the connection between climate change and a war for oil? >> well, it takes fuel to fight and the fight for fuel has been in large part u.s. foreign policy since the 1980's. the idea is to make sure the

fuel is available and in part so it is available for warfare. amy: professor crawford, we will do part two and post it online at democracynow.org. neta crawford is professor of international relations at oxford university and co-director of the costs of war