10/27/14 10/27/14 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] >> from pacifica this is democracy now. line.e is the bottom patients can beat this disease and we can beat this disease, but we are to stay vigilant. we have to work together at every level, federal, state, and local, and keep leading the global response because the best way to stop this disease and keep americans safe is to stop it at its source in west africa. >> as the world health organization says the official death toll from ebola has reached nearly 5,000 in west africa, debate grows in the united states over quarantining health care workers returning from the region.

a doctors without borders letters just back from sierra leone is being held in isolation in a new jersey hospital despite showing no signs of having ebola. she says she's going to sue over her treatment. we will speak to a nurse just back from guinea and economist jeffrey sachs of the earth institute at columbia university which has a team in guinea. we will also speak to john hopkins university professor nancy kass about the use of experimental drugs to treat ebola patients. all that and more coming up. welcome to democracy now, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. the governors of new york and new jersey are facing federal pressure to reverse new quarantine rules on medical workers returning from west africa. under the policy, arriving passengers with the risk of ebola exposure will be placed in

a 21 day quarantine. illinois hasn't limited a similar policy. white house officials lobbied new jersey governor chris christie and new york governor andrew cuomo over the weekend, saying the rules would discourage workers from joining the ebola response in west africa. on sunday night, new york governor cuomo announced a slight easing of the restrictions, saying the workers can be quarantined at home. at a news conference, andrew cuomo said he is try to balance the need from -- containing the ebola with the protection of new yorkers. >> i understand some people may believe the 21 day home quarantine is a burden. i would ask for their cooperation and understanding. remember what we're trying to balance. we're trying to balance aid to protection and the public health of new yorkers , and addressing the fear and concern of new yorkers. >> under name -- a nurse named kaci hickox became the first

under care worker quarantine. she is then placed in an isolated tent inside a newark hospital, despite testing negative for ebola. she is brenda fighter 21 day quarantine in court, saying the order violates her constitutional rights. the world health organization says nearly 5000 people have now of 10,000ebola out known cases. but the actual death toll may be significantly higher in guinea and liberia, in sierra leone, the three worst hit countries. on sunday, the u.s. abbasid or to the united nations samantha power kicked off a visit to west africa in guinea. >> i want to say to the guinean people on behalf of president obama that we stand with you and we will be with you to the end until we have ended this horrible epidemic in your country. together, we can beat this epidemic. we are beaten every ebola epidemic in history, and we will do so if we dramatically

increase our involvement and our engagement. virus is now threatening ivory coast, which shares a border with guinea and liberia. the world health organization has sent experts to ivory coast formali dapper care possible outbreak. more on the ebola crisis after the headlines. kurdish and iraqi forces have made gains on the islamic state with the backing of u.s. airstrikes in iraq and syria. the strikes continued over the weekend with dozens of attacks in the cross-border area under isis control. the iraqi military regained control of a town south of baghdad while the kurdish peshmerga ousted isis fighters in the northern town of zumar. u.s. and british forces have formally ended combat operations in afghanistan's helmand province. on sunday, the nato occupation handed formal control of helmand over to the afghan military. british defense secretary michael fallon said afghanistan is poised for a more stable future.

>> there is a better chance of a more stable future in afghanistan because we have the government there of national unity and an army that is supported by the local population represents all parts of afghanistan. you don't have the sectarian divide that we have seen in iraq. and an army that has are ready proved itself over the last couple of years. that it is prepared to tackle the taliban and some of the more difficult areas of north helmand, therefore, there's a greater chance that afghanistan will be more secure. >> helmand is the center of afghanistan's drug trade, housing more than 80% of the poppy growth used for heroin. the new york times reports "the taliban have never been stronger in [helmand]," claiming large areas around government centers and rural districts. the handover comes amidst the deadliest six-month period for afghan forces since the war began 13 years ago. the handover also marks the end of british combat operations inside afghanistan, while around

10,000 american forces will remain. in egypt, 23 pro-democracy activists have been sentenced to three years in prison for rallying against the government's anti-protest law. the activists took part in a june demonstration calling for the release of political prisoners and the annulment of a law that only allows government-approved demonstration. the group includes yara sallam and sanaa seif, deemed by amnesty international to be "prisoners of conscience." a palestinian-american has been killed in the latest shooting of a young teenager by israeli forces in the occupied west bank. the victim, 14-year old orwah hammad, was shot in the head in the village of silwad. hundreds of people marched saturday after his funeral. the killing comes days after a palestinian man slammed his car into a group of israelis in jerusalem, killing an infant and wounding eight others.

that attack followed the running over and killing of a five-year old palestinian girl by an israeli settler in the west bank. the israeli military ruled the death an accident. brazilian president dilma rousseff has won re-election in a runoff vote. it was very close. on sunday, rousseff defeated pro-corporate candidate aécio neves with just over 51% of the vote. two people were killed and three severely wounded on friday when a student opened fire at his high school in washington state. the shooter was identified as 14-year old jaylen fryberg, a freshman. he opened fire in the school cafeteria before taking his own life. one girl died at the scene, while another girl succumbed to her wounds on sunday night. three others remain hospitalized, two of them in critical condition. a female teacher has been credited for preventing more

deaths as he tackled the gunman. there have been over 75 school shootings since the newtown massacre that left 26 dead in december 2012. in california, two sheriff deputies were killed and another wounded friday by shooter wielding and ar-15 assault rifle. the suspect was arrested after a police chase. new details have emerged on the captivity of several americans and other westerners by the islamic state in syria. the new york times reports the hostages were subjected to months of psychological and physical torture. according to freed survivors, the six american and british male hostages were subjected to the worst abuse, because of the militants' political grievances and their governments' refusal to negotiate a ransom. the american journalist james foley was subjected to the worst treatment, undergoing mock executions and repeated waterboarding. foley was among four people -- another american and two brits -- executed in beheading videos since august. a number of european hostages

have been released after their governments paid a ransom. the u.s. says its policy of not paying ransoms ultimately protects more americans by making them less valuable targets. amnesty international is calling for an investigation of potential human rights abuses in the police crackdown on protests in ferguson, missouri. in a new report, amnesty says police committed violations in the weeks that followed the killing of unarmed teenager michael brown. amnesty researcher justin mazzola said the militarized crackdown raises major concerns. >> they came out in a presence that only served to intimidate. they used tactics such as these of tear gas, rubber bullets -- rubber bullets, oftentimes when it was not justified, concerning what was happening on the ground at that point in time. then you had local officials imposing policies restricting people's rights to actually go

out and protest, whether it was the imposition of curfew, the imposition of five second rule , people had to continue walking, designated assembly areas where there is a free speech zone within ferguson, but anywre else you have to keep walking. and these all go to show that basically, there needs to be a national review both of use of force policies as well as policies of protests. separate report, the advocacy group pan-american said their calling on the justice department to investigate the police crackdown on journalists covering the ferguson protests. they have compiled more than 50 cases of press freedom violations, culminating the arrest of 21 journalists. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. >> welcome to all our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. the world health organization said saturday nearly 5,000 people have now died from ebola out of 10,000 known cases.

but health officials say the actual death toll may be significantly higher in guinea, liberia and sierra leone, the three worst hit countries. the virus is now threatening ivory coast which shares a border with guinea and liberia. the world health organization has sent experts to ivory coast and mali to help prepare for a possible outbreak. on friday a two-year-old toddler in mali died after contracting the virus in guinea. meanwhile here in the united states, hospital officials say the first ebola patient in new york, dr. craig spencer, is in serious but stable condition. spencer recently returned from treating ebola patients in guinea with doctors without borders. as part of his treatment, spencer received a plasma transfusion from nancy writebol, an aid worker who contracted the deadly disease in africa and survived. >> on friday the states of new york and new jersey announced they would automatically quarantine medical workers

returning from ebola-hit west african countries. a nurse named kaci hickox became the first health worker isolated under the rules. she arrived at newark airport. she was placed in 21-day quarantine in a new jersey hospital after returning from sierra leone. hickox has threatened to fight her quarantine in court arguing the order violates her constitutional rights. during a phone interview on cnn, hickox disputed governor chris christie's assertion that she was "obviously ill." >> i heard from my mother last night come who called me, concerned, who said governor christie just said in an interview that you are "obviously ill." frustrating to me. first of all, i don't think he is a doctor and secondly, he is never relayed eyes on me. really, i have been asymptomatic since i have been here. i feel physically, completely

strong and emotionally completely exhausted. the for him to say i'm obviously ill, which is even a strange thing, what does that mean? someone to find that for me because i don't the guy quite understand what obviously ill means. i'm here to tell you that i am completely fine physically and eing held here is -- >> that was nurse kaci hickox on cnn. public health officials and the white house have criticized the plan by new jersey and new york to quarantine health workers saying it could impede the ebola fight. on sunday new york gov. andrew cuomo softened his stance and said people quarantined in the state who do not show symptoms of the disease would be allowed to remain at home. >> to talk more about ebola, we are joined by carissa guild is a nurse with doctors without borders also known as msf. she just returned from guinea

last week where she was helping to respond to the ebola crisis. in 2012, she worked with doctors without borders in the congo to address an ebola outbreak there. welcome to democracy now!, carissa guild. before we talk to you about your return from guinea, if you could talk about the treatment of your theow nurse, talk about whole issue of how kaci hickox is being dealt with right now. she arrived at newark airport and taken from there. ultimately, against her will, placed in 21 day quarantine. she now says she is going to sue over her treatment. >> i think it was a decision that was made that was probably not well thought out. like everyone has things saying, there is a lot of -- has been saying, there is no evidence she is at risk to anyone in the whole country.

i obviously don't agree with her being in quarantine. i think monitoring your health, like we are told to do every ebolae cannot give anyone if you don't have symptoms. she does not have symptoms. it was not a well thought out or rational decision. we will see what happens. >> could you talk about what happened he you when you came in the country, when you returned on your last trip from west africa? >> i just returned back last week and i came in and i went to jfk and they brought me into a room and monitored my temperature and i didn't have a temperature, so basically, i just went home. i follow the daily rules of doctors without borders where i take my temperature every morning and send an e-mail to the department of health and let them know i am feeling fine. i think this is less of a problem and what we're talking about with ex-pats returning and

not treating them well in the united states and ex-pats having ebola here in the united states is not really the issue. i think the issue is much more talking about those 10,000 people have contracted the virus. talks can you talk about what you found in guinea? talk about your time there. >> there a lot of problems in guinea right now. the first time i went was in april. i have seen the progression get worse and worse with the virus. basically, reaching its capacity where i was where the whole outbreak began and we ended up having nearly 100 beds in our facility. right before i was leaving, we were discussing about what we would have to do if we had to turn patients away. patients were coming from long distances. we were worried we would not have enough capacity to treat and isolate the cases. there needs to be a lot more work and help going there to help get this under control. >> what do you think will be the

impact of what has happened to kaci hickox on the other caregivers, thinking about going to west africa and doing their part to be able to stem the spread of ebola? >> i am hoping that not every state makes this decision. hopefully, the decision gets reluctant oh it will not have too much of an impact. -- it's relook that so it will not have to much of an impact. also known as plenty of other countries that would be happy to have me for 21 days after i came back and would let me hang out at home and not be in a hospital . hopefully, the decision will get looked at in it won't have an impact. it would be really unfortunate -- it is unfortunate for her. she went to help for this ebola crisis. there is a lot of suffering over there. a lot of people who are really scared. homeo have her welcomed like we're welcoming her back is not the best face of america.

>> how did you protect your self? how do people in guinea protect themselves, both in committed these were people have ebola and in the hospital where you worked? >> we were using the personal protective equipment. when we were in the center, the the treatment center, we were very well protected with the yellow jumpsuit on and two pairs of gloves and hoods and aprons -- everything you see on tv. we were very protected inside the treatment center. the treatment center is response to ebola. the part that is important is the training in the community and doing outreach and going into the villages and speaking with a lot of people and teaching health workers. we were protecting ourselves basically by keeping distance with patients or the population, keeping a distance and washing your hands. chlorine is everywhere, everywhere, everywhere. ofdoes not make the risk

zero in their plenty of health workers in guinea who have areen sick, but there precautions to take. i felt pretty confident i don't have ebola and i did not get ebola while i was there. >> i want to go back to kaci hickox, the doctors without borders nurse, who is placed in a 21 day quarantine in new jersey after she returned to sierra leone. on sunday, she called in to cnn and this is part of her conversation. >> we have to be careful about letting politicians make medical and public health decisions. and all of the evidence about ebola shows if you are not symptomatic, you're not infectious. it is really inhumane. from one of the most difficult months of my life. i am completely [indiscernible] one can say if i will develop ebola or not in the next 21 days. most aid workers who come back will not have ebola. so to quarantine everyone in

case, when you cannot predict who may develop ebola or not, d the make me stay for 21 days , to not be with my family, to put me through this emotional and physical stress, is completely unacceptable. , talkingas kaci hickox to cnn. what about the issue of politicians making decisions that really should be in the hands of medical experts and scientists? >> i guess i don't have too much to say about that. i agree that ebola is a medical problem. it is an outbreak. it should be the hands of people who know what they're doing and you understand how the virus works and how to protect yourself. it is a pretty tricky virus. there are very specific things that we are ready no work. there are people who know those things. i would trust those people over someone making decisions who is less informed. >> what is most needed in guinea where you were?

what were people must calling for to do with the ebola crisis? ofin guinea, there's a lot fear. i've seen as spread quite far. it started off in one sector. when i was leaving, we were having cases come from very far away. the whole right half of the country, which means people were waiting until the end. they were being sure these people had ebola. they were putting them in ambulances for 10 hours. they were sending them to our center for treatment. they were arriving very late. sometimes you would open up the amulet store and number three people who were still alive and one or two people who had died along the way. there's a lot of effort in building treatment centers make -- making access to care bigger and doing outreach and training staff workers and health workers and how to detect cases of ebola, putting labs to make sure we know where ebola is. there is a lot to be done there right now. >> carissa guild, thank you for being with us, it nurse from

doctors without borders. she just returned from guinea last week where she was helping to respond to the ebola crisis. she is come back to this country and is in cape cod now. when we come back, we will go to jeffrey sachs, a leading economist and the director of the earth institute at columbia university. and we will speak with dr. nancy kass about experience all drugs dealing with ebola. who should get them, who doesn't get them? stay with us. ♪ [music break]

>> this is democracy now!,

democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. >> to talk more about ebola we are joined by jeffrey sachs, a leading economist and the director of the earth institute at columbia university. sachs recently authored a piece headlined, "we don't need an ebola czar." the earth institute is working with the government in guinea to battle the ebola epidemic, and is holding a conference today titled, "the ebola crisis: what it means for west africa and the world." we're also joined by nancy kass is a professor of bioethics and public health at john hopkins university. her article in the annals of internal medicine is called, "ebola, ethics, and public health: what next?" welcome to both of you. would like to begin with you. the subject of your recent article, could you talk about that? >> that was a very specific point that i think president obama should be backing up

israeli ebola leader tom frieden, the head of the cdc, rather than appointing somebody who obviously lacks the necessary knowledge and experience to head in a bowl effort. this was politics. modest point.f it is not really at the center of the fight against ebola per se, but it was in response to the real disgraceful show in congress when congressman who know nothing and had been cutting the cdc budget for ,ears, then when afterfriedan one of the worlds most experience leaders and public health. rather than the congressman asking, which they should have, what can we do for you and dr. frieden to help ensure a quality their high horse, they start making accusations,

stupid statements and i thought the president should just have come out and said, stop it, we have highly experienced leader of the world plus most important public health institute, let's get on with it. and forcefully, he appointed this fellow ron klain. i don't know if you'll do something useful. i hope he doesn't do something just to add to the confusion. jeffrey sachs, as a leading economist, we got a note from jubilee usa saying right now guinea is spending more on death and public health. sierra leone, library, spent together nearly 200 million dollars a year on debt. imagine with that money could do for funding health care in their countries and what it could do or could have done to help stop the ebola even before it started. they point out in 2010, the was passed a law supporting debt

relief for haiti after the earthquake. what about doing the same thing with these countries? do you think that would make a difference? you have a team in guinea right now. >> a year ago, i tried to raise funds for liberia for community health workers before the ebola epidemic had started. and the answer from all of the international agencies was, oh, there's no money here. liberia is not much of a priority. come back in the next funding cycle and so poor. there is a fundamental principle both of decency and common sense, which is, we should not lead people anywhere in the world bereft of the basic functioning primary health system. and it is clear as day we do that with hundreds and minds of people, especially in rural sub-saharan south africa. the attitude is, what difference could it possibly make? who cares? which is both shameful from an

ethical point of view, but absurd from a practical point of view. this is in exactly the first epidemic and it does not going to be the last one we face. it is a similar region, by the way, where aides began some decades ago and spread to the world from the forest did regions of west africa. we are so irresponsible in thinking it somehow is decent implausible for impoverished people to have no access to health care. what you heard from the msf nurse and her wonderful testimony just a moment ago was the essential question on controlling an epidemic is the ability to identify people for potentially infected, test them. if they are infected, to move them safely to a facility where they can both get care and be isolated so as to not spread the disease to others. this is a logistical problem.

it is a resource mobilization problem. it is not the highest science. they be the highest science to produce a vaccine or new medicines quickly, but the basic to public health strategy [indiscernible] testing, isolation, treatment is a workable and will be a successful approach if the resources are mobilized to do this. we're scrambling like nothing because the resources weren't there at all, because international community did not sound an alarm as ebola spread, thinking it would just fade out on its own, as it had even earlier epidemics, but instead, it was a wildfire and now it is putting throughout the region and to other parts of the world. trucks were also joined by dr. nancy kass, professor of bioethics and public health at johns hopkins university. professor, what is your reaction

as you are hearing of what is going on here in the united states in terms of the treatment of caregivers who come back from west africa? and also, the disparity between federal policy and now some of the local states that have adopted their own policies? >> thank you for including me in the conversation. kudos want to first give others like and her. they are the heroes. i think something there is no harm in putting this kind of isolation or quarantine the people like her when she returns. out thei want to put point pretty forcefully that there are pretty significant harms. obviously, there are harms to thatnd we could hear through what you played from ms.

hickox herself. first of all, there are some significant messaging that goes out to the american public when an official says, the only thing safe to do is keep people locked up in a tent when they arrive. it turns out that is an inaccurate public health as such. we've known about that for a long time. we need to give the public clear and accurate information consistently. this becomes a confusing message because the public health people are saying, take her temperature. we havee symptomatic, to isolate you and give you care quickly. if you're not symptom at it, it is ok. by putting this out, it is a very confusing message to the public. the other concern is that all of our state public health authorities have something that had for more than 100 years called the police power. it is a critically important type of power for public help to have. it allows public health to close

restaurants when they're dangerous, to lock up animals when they're dangerous, and even in extreme circumstances, to confine people if there is a risk. but ethically, we always have to be assuring the public that we will only do that when it is necessary. it isng police power when not necessary, is a very troublesome approach both to how our government is working and to the public health messaging to the public. , can you talkass about external drugs? the anger that has been white health care workers in africa right back care, given the external drug of which there doesn't seem to be any left of, and they survived. and who lives and who dies? who gets these drugs? did they say their lives check out -- save their lives? how do you make decisions about

these drugs being available, why they weren't available, why they are in the corporate sphere made available by corporations and not governments? >> that is a great question. i want to emphasize we have no idea whether the z-mapp is what saved can't brantly's life and nancy writebol's life. they received the best supportive care available. what we've seen from other people who have been brought the unitedntries in states, supportive care is what people really need. if you get sick with ebola and now vomiting a lot, having diarrhea a lot, you need supportive care. we did not do a trial with them for understandable reasons. , thankfully, they have survived, there is no way orknow whether or not z-mapp the serum they got from people who were ebola survivors were in any way responsible for their recovery.

now it is really important question to figure out who gets access to the experimental kind of medicine. it certainly is true that when people like ms. hickox or ms. country,off to another they're certain commitments we make to them as sort of the international people who go and come back. themke commitments to give the best protective equipment, but not everybody locally has. that wethem commitments will fly them back, take care of them, pay them during the recovery period and give them the best care possible. the fact or certain kinds of privileges given to the first two people who were in infected and they brought back, is not, to me, necessarily problematic. that is a really different question than, how do we figure out whether these experimental drugs work? certainly, right now, the best

interventions are those that dr. sacks mention. we have to figure out whether the vaccines were treatment's work. uncomfortable as that may be, we are going to have to be doing that with larger numbers of people, with people who are sick in terms of treatment, and it looks like they're not working dramatically well, we're going to have to make some hard acisions about whether to do randomized trial were some people get the treatments and some people don't. has know that jeffrey sachs to leave. what your team is doing right now in guinea? >> the basic approach of getting this under control, as i have described, is identifying potentially infected individuals , either through contact tracing of those who have come into contact with the earlier ebola infected patients, or the people who develop symptoms that are

suspicious, even if they weren't on a contact list. getting them quickly tested, getting them safely taken to a treatment center in the event they are ebola-infected, and then having appropriate supportive care, as you just heard. well, building that from almost a matter of weeks, is the real challenge. the problem with an epidemic is it doesn't just stand still. it is a chain reaction. it has geometric growth. in the case of ebola , a doublingperiod or in other words, the time to double the number of cases roughly every three weeks right now, so this is an absolutely ferocious race against time where the resources have to come from the outside

the natural terms. much of the common has to be flown in. it is a massive logistical problem, a social problem, obviously, to enter into communities that are scared, fearful, without traditional the health teams. and to find, of course, the people and train them that can do the safely. so this is exactly what we're trying to focus on. every aspect of this -- one of the key points that we are quickly trying to bring to bear is information through smartphones carried by front-line workers who can quickly put in information about a new patient, what kind of contact, with the symptoms are, get the information flowing so that there is a logical chain of support of testing of transport and arrival at a clinic of

contact tracing. and we are working around the clock right now with the programmers at developing new ebola applications, working with services, telecoms providers, with the president's team, and of course, with a bunch of international agencies and with msf. at the scramble is phenomenal. if you can see how much work turned upside down by a few cases in the rich and populous united states, think about the thousands of cases that are roiling west africa right now with all of the impoverishment and the just google challenges. it is a very practical minute to minute problem where speed is of the essence. , i would likeass to ask you about the world

response in west africa, particularly, the u.s. response. this whole issue of how the military is being used and being able to get their to set up centers for treatment, but yet we're still having problems in terms of the medical -- the provision of the number of mobilized they can be so quickly, even by the world health organization, the united states, or other advanced countries. >> clearly, we need different kinds of people on the ground. what gets the most politically listed the people providing direct care in this -- publicity of the people providing direct care. that is really important. my understanding is that it has been slow for a variety of reasons. the united states, finally, ultimately committed that 3000 people would come to the department of defense, that

was a good thing. the department of defense has the logistical know-how for operations like that to be moved quickly. unfortunately, my understanding are not 3000 people there yet. it is been very slow to mobilize. and despite the amount of work that msf is doing, and they really been remarkable heroes from very early in this epidemic, long before the united states, the reform too many patients. we need more health care workers. does there are far too many patients. we need more health care workers. i have a colleague at john hopkins that was training helping to train 1000 health care workers from the democratic republic of congo. congo has experience with ebola from past outbreaks. sendwere willing to health care workers to liberia.

interestingt is that we don't tend to cover as much as of the outreach that he was describing. and until we have enough treatment beds, what is really going to make a difference is all of the public health outreach. states or the united in west africa, what has ultimately stopped epidemic's from spreading in the past. unfortunately, you can have people who don't have quite the same sophisticated skill set to participate in that kind of or that piece of the response. issue ofkass, on this drugs. are you designing trials for drugs? drug.ample, the z-mapp how the government support getting out there or should a particular drug be the one that is used? what i do for a living, i'm not the one designing trials. there are people designing trials. my understanding is there are a

variety of drugs that are being considered. the each have different sorts of histories. i think the real challenge is how they're going to be tested. if it turns out a drug is genetically effective, for example, you give it to 10 people who are really sick and none of them recover or 10 of them recover, you don't need to do a randomized trial. if it turns out to give it to 10 people and six or seven people recover, it is a little bit harder to tell whether that was the drug or whether they would have recovered anyway. so to some degree, my own view is you can start to do some initial rollout, give it to everybody. if you see a dramatic result, he go-ahead dear pretty excited. if you don't see dramatic results, you may need to do a more adaptive design to start to move into some get it and some don't. it sounds inhumane, but we will know much more quickly whether or not these new drugs work or if they don't. >> dr. nancy kass, professor of

bioethics at john hopkins university, thank you for joining us. her article is called "ebola, ethics, and public health: what next?" also, thank you to jeffrey sachs . he recently authored, "we don't need an ebola czar." offered -- offering a conference today called, "the ebola crisis: what it means for west africa and the world." when we come back, mumia abu jamal response to a new law that pennsylvania has just put into effect. stay with us. ♪ [music break]

>> "ebola in town" by the liberian musicians shadow, d-12 and their friend kuzzy written earlier this year to raise awareness about the disease. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. >> we turn now to pennsylvania, where republican governor tom corbett has just signed into law a bill critics say will trample the free speech rights of prisoners. the "re-victimization relief act" authorizes the censoring of public addresses of prisoners or former offenders if judges agree that allowing them to speak would cause "mental anguish" to the victim. the measure was introduced after one of the state's most famous prisoners, journalist and former black panther mumia abu-jamal delivered a pre-taped commencement address for graduating students at vermont's goddard college earlier this

month. the speech was opposed by the widow of daniel faulkner, the police officer who abu-jamal was convicted of killing. >> the american civil liberties union of pennsylvania has criticized the new measure, calling it "overbroad and vague," and unable to "pass constitutional muster under the first amendment." we spoke to mumia abu-jamal on the phone last week about the new law. he was speaking to us from sci mahanoy in frackville, pennsylvania. >> how are you, amy? >> it is good to be with you. can you talk about where you are right now? describe your surroundings as you speak on the phone to us. >> as you can hear the i'm in the open area of half of a block. there are about 45 men sitting around playing cards, playing dominoes, playing chess,

talking, some are reading, some watching television at a distant corner. this is population. block out phase, were you are out of your cell. >> so you are back in the news because of a bill that was just signed by pennsylvania governor tom corbett that would limit you ability to speak after just give a commencement address, the taped commencement address, to goddard. can you respond to the signing of this ill -- bill? >> i think is quite extraordinary that unconstitutional tom corbett, former attorney general of the state of pennsylvania, as governor, would sign into law a law that he knows is unconstitutional.

>> this call is subject to monitoring. >> moreover as the governor, and as an attorney, and a member of the bar, he had to take a sworn oath for both offices. and that oath was to protect and defend the constitution's of the commonwealth of pennsylvania and the constitution of the united states of america. by signing that bill into law, he has violated both of his oaths as governor and as an attorney. as i said, he knows what the law is. he knows about snyder versus phelps. i'm sure you cover the case of the church that when around to .unerals let's say, harassed people's families. they were burying their veterans and they would have signs within eyesight of the families burying

their dead. when to the supreme court because there's a similar law passed against them. every court they went into found it a violation of the first amendment, including the united states supreme court, which the firsto one that amendment free-speech protection shielded these church members from tort liability for and to chill and flexion of emotional distress. this is something i know unconstitutional tom knows about. it gives you a sense when these officials, these legislators, these governors, these elected officials swear on a bible to up in of, andfath violatei itc wase such freedom. >> this is what governor corbett said in expressing his support for the new law. >> citizens are entitled to an

array of rights, from free travel to free speech, convict felons in prison because they abused and surrendered their rights. and nobody has a right to continually taunt the victims of their violent crimes in the public square. talks your response, mumia abu-jamal? >> he knows that is ridiculous both in law and in fact. i never taunted anybody. as you know, as a journalist, i've early talked about the -- i'm really talked about the issues. most of the people who voted for this bill, whether there were legislators or senators of the governor themselves, they never heard that speech. i invite them to hear it and madness that tom said. i called him unconstitutional. here is proof of that. again, the united states supreme court in simon & schuster versus

new york crime victims board held the acts of that state agency in the legislation that enabled them unconstitutional, and this, i believe, was the full court, nine to one. this was in 1991. in my own civil history, you remember me calling you and then coming up and pulling a wire out of the wall. >> who pulled that wire out of the wall? a guard. i was talking to you. i believe it was 1996 were around that time. we were having a discussion. it was live. all of a sudden, the phone went dead. i saw out of the corner of my eye, a correctional officer where my line was plugged into the wall, and he pulled it out. i could not believe what i was looking at. i was like, hello, amy? it just did not make sense.

it did not make sense to me that he did that. but of course, that was shortly after the publication of "live from death row." the department of corrections upctioned me, gave me a ride , and we went to court about it. .he case is preserved in that ruling, the third circuit of the united states court of appeals said i have a constitutional right tow rite. if i have a constitutional right to write under the first amendment, then don't i have a constitutional right to read my writings? >> mumia abu-jamal, maureen faulkner is quoted in the paper after governor corbett signed the bill, which is being called saying only to hear him during a commencement speech on the radio, it rips open a scab.

well, i feel sorry for her. thingsst people hear that disturbs them, they change the channel. she can change the channel. man,wrote a bill for one and they admit that, i'm told, in their discussions in committee. they wrote a bill based on a false reporting of what was discussed at a school that i am an alumni have. i attended and graduated from the college. i was invited by the staff and the students and the administrators to talk to my college about what it meant to get an education from goddard. i did that. and if the constitution doesn't protect that, in a protects nothing. if the constitution can be used

against one, it can be used against all. orid not take an oath affirmation to support, protect, defend the constitution of pennsylvania or the united states. i don't have to. but of the many people who did, they know they're violating it by signing this law. , nominated be the head of the civil rights division in the justice department, but because of the case he was involved with at the naacp legal the naacpnd, a case legal defense fund brought and won, he was barred. senators citing your name. explain what happened in your response to it. >> i can't really explain what happened because -- >> subject to monitoring and recording.

>> i never met the man. i never discussed anything with a man because i never met the man. acting head of the naacp after john patton had died. he was placed there so -- because he was acting head, he was on my brief. i don't know the man. i saw him in the newspapers. to be perfectly honest, i did it recognize his name because had never heard the name until he got to the papers. this was a man who had his life shredded because of the money fop to buy ande intimidate others and to violate their ioaths.

you can say he did not have a constitutional right to become the head, but he was the choice of the president. and i presume yet good reasons to choose him. himdo use my case to deny that opportunity, is a tragedy to this man and to his family.a. again, i never met the man. i know who he is only from seeing him on tv or in a newspaper. from what i have been told, what i have heard, this was a fine and distinguished lawyer who came from an impoverished background, fought hard to get into college and fought very hard to get into law school, and devoted his expertise as a vote and help people work for people civil rights all across the country. really have a few

minutes, but i want to ask what it is been like to move from death row to the general population. well, there is no day that goes by that i don't think about the brothers and sisters because there are women in pennsylvania, on death row, the brothers and sisters who are still on death row. is so profoundly different from their 24 hour experience, that it is hard to connect the two. let me leave you with this. there is a case out of the eastern district of virginia prieto case, virginia rolled it was unconstitutional. they rolled locking people up

that long, holding them in confinement just because they have a death sentence, is a violation of the constitution. i wish that pennsylvania would live up to the constitution, not just in my case, but in prieto and all the minute women who are in death row in pennsylvania who should be in general population like everybody else. >> you write many commentaries from among them about war. what is it like to watch war from your jail cell? have 30 seconds remaining. >> it is not much different. it is horrifying and terrifying and it speaks to me of the kind of impending destruction of the empire. peac,n't bomb people for you can only bombe them to death and a war. it is painful. it is terrifying. it is all of those things, and it could be better. >> that was mumia abu-jamal, mahanoy in sci

pennsylvania. for a copy of today show, you can go to democracynow.org. this saturday night, i will be speaking in oslo, norway. you can check democracynow.org. democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now! p.o. box 693 new york, new york 10013. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

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