he was a true patriot. he said find your own way. my way was to fight for a country that hadn't learned yet he needed to fight for me. but that it would. he's tell me growing up i have full confidence where we are going isn't only better than where we have been with the best on the planet. that's why people want to come here. i felt closer to him, both of my parents, really, and i love this country so much i love even more now understanding we don't always win, we spent a lot of blood and treasure but the biggest you can ablate on the planet we left a mark on vietnam, please watch the series of dropped on fox nation this morning. you will get your patriotism and give. >> what an carmel man. >> your father was protected by the armor of god and the shield of faith. thank you, everyone here is "america reports." >> mr. trump directed me to use

my own personal funds from the home equity line of credit. to avoid any money being traced back to him that can negatively impact his campaign. >> he kept on saying over and over again 10-20 times i swear to god, bob, i don't have anything to donald trump. >> trump is a con man. he asked me to pay off an adult film star with whom he had an affair. >> he said specifically and i cross-examine him on this this was my idea. >> i was extremely proud to be personal attorney to the president of the united states. i did not want to go to the white house. >> when he was elected he took the whole trump's inner circle to washington with one exception. michael cohen. they left him back in new york. michael cohen was very unhappy about that. this will deftly get reversed but after the election probably

if he gets convicted and that's what they want. >> sandra: former president donald trump's defense team getting other crack today question the prosecution's star witness and former trump lawyer michael cohen. it comes after cohen's former advisor costello offered a blistering statement accusing him of lying in court. that is where we find ourselves at the top of the 1:00 hour and the east coast to hello and welcome everyone i'm sandra smith in new york, john gray to. >> john: we are missing on washington, comeback, i'm john roberts in d.c. this is "america reports" paired proceedings in a lunch break for the next hour and 15 minutes robert castillo work for the southern district of new york and advise coming back in 2018 after being hit with federal charges. costello testified on capitol hill yesterday and sworn he had "nothing on trunk" and had that he took care of the stormy daniels payment himself. >> sandra: will the defense use this to their advantage in that courtroom?

we have a team of legal and political experts with us throughout the next two hours. >> john: for us to go to senior correspondent eric shawn life stomach live outside the supreme court is going to the lunch break. eric? >> so far has not mentioned robert castillo but in the cross-examination has been trying to shred michael cohen's credibility and has been doing that by using cohen's own words against him. the former president's lawyer and fixer he was confronted in his cross-examination by the litany of lies he has admittedly told through the years. being told he has not only lied under oath before and not under oath repeatedly so that the jury should not believe anything he says about donald trump now. cohen has admitted he lied to a federal judge, lied to congress, lied to his bank when he opened a shell company, lied when he used his home equity loan to pay

stormy daniels, lied in the robert mueller russia investigation, and lied about seeking a pardon for president trump. he also lied to the jury on monday when he put the blame for stormy daniels' deal squarely on the former president, which seems to contradict exactly what you just heard from lawyer robert costello who says cohen told him six years ago that trump had nothing to do with the stormy daniels payments. did not even know about them and that cohen arranged for the whole thing secretly so that milani would would not find out. so far in court todd blanche today has not brought that up in the cross-examination. he is been because of turning on trying to show cohen has been in his view of motivated and exact ohmic resentment of trump vengeful because he was not offered a top position at the white house when his boss moved from trump tower to the oval office. cohen admitted he was disappointed when he learned that previous had the job of

chief of staff but he insisted he wanted to be at the new president's side solely as his personal attorney. perhaps trying to show the journey to mike geary the fact that cohen may have had a personal decision in this to try and get back at trump for not offering him a top job in bringing him along with anyone else to the white house. got so bad at one point that cohen also acknowledged he had trouble getting tickets to president trump's inauguration. so that his own daughter texted him that trump and his people, she said, are walking all over you. john, back to you. >> john: i'm sure he did not like that a whole lot. eric shawn for us outside the supreme court. eric, thank you. tender? >> sandra: let's bring in jim trusty, gray tabby on the program they are on break we will see this trial resume probably at the top of the hour 2:15 p.m. eastern time. i want to play out the sound from the former president this morning as he was entering the courtroom calling this biden's trial, listen. >> at least we are getting the

word out but it is very unfair i would like to be in these various states where i should be campaigning like anybody else. this all comes out of the white house and the department of justice. this is all them. in fact a lead person from the doj is running the trial. so biden's office is running this trial. this trial is a scam and it shouldn't happen. >> sandra: those of former president's take what is your take? >> a couple of things on the plane the president made there is a core fact that's a little problem here which is the doj, the number guy had been back and forth between letitia james' office alvin bragg's office and the department just as he decided to go back to alvin bragg's office as the right hand of alvin bragg in three weeks late of indictment comes up. so that is not necessarily a smoking gun but that is certainly a red flag where there is an issue there about it all

on main justice. as for the trial, i don't know if you know the fear of colonization because the government never had to give it at this point. and all sorts of extraneous information coming out all those negative factors coming together is still going well for the defense. gravitated into something that i said to be the defense strategy which is make it about cohen's credibility which is a gift that keeps giving. >> john: and cohen's credibility todd blanche has been showing his hostile to the president and able to lie about anything it took in furtherance of his own career and how did he think he's done that front? >> we'll be great from the inside watching it minute-by-minute that's where you really get a feel for how does landing but i would say this. it seems to be very structured across he seems to be spending a lot of time on bias which is a huge part of the story. is moving into the area of

undeniable lies convictions for perjury, lying to special counsel i think you may move toward the end for the illusions of grandeur. : wanting to be the attorney general, god help us. at one point of view or know with movies like tom cruise of going after jack nicholson and you can't handle the truth and perry mason to put it back where there is devastating cross where the witness folds and says you are right i murdered so-and-so. in real life, that is a mistake. it doesn't happen at least here you what you have to do is set up a closing argument. i think what i am seeing so far is todd is being disciplined enough to ask tight questions where cohen can't make speeches. that's the measure of success. get this done my concessions, forced him to look like a weasel he is but don't give him the opportunity to make a speech at your expense. >> sandra: when we are watching from the outside we want that instant gratification, where they are going right now. like when we watch the tv version of this. bob cust albeit interview from

this morning we played a little bit of it, jim, this is more from him and that interview. michael cohen monetizing himself, listen. >> this guy is saying i will lie, cheat, steal, do whatever i have to do, i am not going to jail. he did go to jail. who do you think he blames for that? and why do you think he names his most recent book "rebound?" i mean, quite frankly, he is using this to monetize himself. because this is the only way this guy can make money right now. selling books and teachers and trinkets and being the ultimate anti-trumper. >> i wanted your reaction to that. >> i got to meet and talk to costello yesterday we were testifying on the hill and i have to tell you, i went from the camp of do not call anybody in the defense case, don't give the government anything that helps them even unintentionally, make it about cohen now i am in my statement and say put costello on because he is a

great rebuttal. you are not really planning on a true defense, you're putting on a rebuttal to the ceremony but think about it it's a guy who knows cohen well, they would say that the guy won't know the truth unless it hits him in the eyes and he is rebutting some of the accounts and stories that cohen gave this jury so the classical bottle and the character testimony about what a dishonest guy he is. >> john: in terms of a rebuttal if they were to put them on the stand is a good possibility costello may say. >> you did this on your own? >> on my own. speaker did donald trump have anything to do with a question mark no perry did get the money from gone from? is no. from any of its organizations? no. from anyone connected to donald trump? no peers where did you get the money? i took out a heloc loan against my properties. is about to do that? he said i didn't want anybody to know where i got this money. i didn't want wanted to know, i didn't want my own wife to know. >> what is interesting is what

costello was saying there, jim, is basically the same thing that cohen told everybody who was willing to listen back in 2018. but he is cohen's former attorney and testifying in congress. if he were to bring that story into the new york city courtroom, it seems to me as though there will be a very big case of he said/he said for the jury to weigh. >> and the government has the burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt they are hedging and hedging their bet on the sky. i have to say this guy has been a lawyer 51 years, costello he is an impossible to deflate new york lawyer, he would be devastating on the witness stand. there is no cross-examination that will shake that guy for a minute. and its rings true his stories about cohen will ring true. if i'm on that team i am saying look, everyone else is back we have one witness coming and then we go read in -- >> john: do you think? >> i think is a good chance they will end there will be a real fight from the government saying

oh, this is not directly on point but it is directly contradictory in the open and end testimony but honesty. >> sandra: gray tabby want today. >> john: appreciate it. break in the action right now the new york versus trump trial as the defense team continues to chip away at michael cohen's ability, kerri urbahn up next on dismantling a week case up next. >> they are not approved essential elements of the crime that is at hand. what they have done is create a lot of noise and a lot of distractions for the american people, given you some solution stories. and we'll come to you with a replacement you can trust. >> vo: schedule free mobile service now at safelite.com. ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪

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testimony dialing on cohen's previous lives including what was told under oath while also leaving in on cohen's desire for revenge against his former boss. kerri urbahn is our fox news legal editor it was todd blanche's -- it was his job for the defense to try to take: mike cohen apart to get them to look in the jury's eyes like someone who cannot you believe that every te opens his mouth he is likely lying. how did he do on that front today? >> he has extracted three themes throughout the cross one, like you said come history of lying both under oath and not. two, a history of blame shifting. apparently speaker has blamed everyone besides himself or all of his troubles including the bank come his accountant, his business partner, of course donald trump, federal prosecutors, and just about

everyone else. number three, he was unhappy about not being included in donald trump's inner circle in the white house when donald trump went to washington and was not happy he was not invited or it was difficult for him to go to inauguration. the exchange was pretty testy just before we broke for lunch let's see what it is like when we go back inside. >> sandra: this will continue. if i could just roll sound on more of this interview from bob costello earlier today on whether or not he will testify. i wanted to get your reaction to this. >> i have not been subpoenaed. whether i will be called to testify it has not been decided yet. it probably depends a lot on what will happen a day in court and what would happen on redirect by the district attorney's office. i mean if i were in todd blanche's shoes, that's the analysis i would make. >> sandra: i suppose we don't know what we don't know and there could be some surprises there. kerri? >> yeah, he is right. if i were todd blanche i would be thinking the same way.

after we see how today goes and it did not end with just a cross, the prosecution's office will have a chance to do redirect and then the defense team could do recross, we redirect, reread cross and this could go on sometime. it remains to be seen and the testimony i believe was remarkably compelling given cohen told him donald trump that cohen i'm sorry, donald trump knew nothing about the stormy daniels payment and then that cohen had done that completely on his own and he also told bob costello's that he would do anything to stay out of jail. as we know once he was sentenced that's when things changed and shifted for cohen as far as what he publicly said about trump and went from an extreme version of love to a an extreme version of hate. one has to wonder why. >> john: suggestion there from i guess costello is that cohen said he would do anything to stay out of jail including dropping a dime on trump buddy

didn't have the dime to drop so he never did it. kerri and the time he spent in the overflow room contemplating this entire trial you've come up with some ideas on how the closing arguments might go, what do you think? >> yes, so if i were presenting closing arguments out hit the three following points. the first is establishing, again, what this case is about? falsifying business records and there is still no evidence that donald trump knew exactly how these payments to michael cohen reclassified by an accounts payable person in trump tower and an internal ledger. number two, that the classification of legal expenses in that book is accurate. michael cohen continue to operate and hold himself out as donald trump's personal attorney throughout the entire time he was getting paid. doesn't it stand to reason that he could be receiving reimbursement for previous expenses while also be receiving

a retainer because he was still his personal attorney? and three, this is where i think this goes to the heart of the jury, and you want to appeal to their motion, that if the jury does not agree with those two points what they will have to do is make a life altering decision for the former president of the united states based on the testimony of a man who has lied for years, has a history of blame shifting, has made millions of dollars off denigrating donald trump, and was disgruntled about leaving the white house. is that really what they want to do here, especially because the only thing that michael cohen has testified up to this point is that he and allen weisselberg had a conversation about a repayment plan in front of donald trump so the jury even then would still have to make the leap that that conversation included how this is going to be classified in an internal leisure. >> sandra: kerri if i could go on with public opinion of what is playing out with the latest fox news poll and talking about

the former president's behavior related to this new york case a poll released just yesterday. do you think trump did something illegal, an article but not illegal, or nothing seriously wrong? less than half say they believe anything illegal took place here, 46%. those that believe something unethical happen but not illegal, 25%, those who believe nothing seriously wrong happen, 27%. will be interesting, carrie, to see how this changes, if at all, as the trial continues. >> that's right. one thing i've been saying all along is sleazy and dirty does not equal illegal. the prosecution has been trying very, very hard to conflate that in the jurors mind. i said before i dealt with this at doj. there were people often frustrated with the attorney general bill barr because he was not prosecuting the people they wanted him to. often i have to defend in the court of public opinion saying i understand it feels wrong, it

doesn't feel good, it looks bad but that does not equal illegal. there is a standard to prove and hear it's beyond a reasonable doubt and the prosecution is the one that has to carry that burden, not the defense. >> john: carrie it'll be a big afternoon after he gets on the stand thank you for sharing your thoughts with us we will again soon. >> sandra: thank you, kerri. the defense's cross examination of cohen is set to resume a short time from now. florida republican congress meant mike waltz is at the courthouse. he tells us why he thinks what is happening right now is insane. wrong, and looks like what happens in corrupt countries like venezuela. b1 plus house lawmakers making a resolution against merrick garland. 11 the justice department, david? the house meeting right now and we spoke to attorney general garland earlier today to ask him about this. i will give you a hint he is not

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>> john: the house committee are going against merrick garland for refusing to turn over audio of president biden's interview with special counsel robert hur. the move comes at the white house continues to block the release citing executive privilege on david spunt live at the justice department. david come the attorney general has already released the transcript of the interview so why not the audio? >> we just found out about this a few hours ago the executive privilege keeps president biden from turning over that audio and risk potentially an embarrassment for him and his reelection campaign and keeps merrick garland from being criminally charged for being held in contempt if he is indeed held in contempt. right now the house judiciary committee as i speak to you is meeting to discuss what is called a markup of the contempt fighting it out about three

hours, have not come to a resolution yet. this all deals with the interview that president biden did within special counsel robert hur back in october. girl and is subject to the content vote in two committees, garland and his team have sent multiple times he is not turning over the audiotapes of this interview between biden and her from last october. it's part of my documents found at several biden properties including his delaware home. the attorney general already turned over the transcript to congress and it contains the same information. watch. >> so recordings are necessary. transcripts alone are not sufficient evidence of the state of the president's memory. frankly because white house has a track record of altering the transcripts. >> this morning i asked garland to react and what he has to say about the executive privilege claim, watch this. >> we have gone through externally lengths to ensure that the committees get responses to their legitimate

requests. but this is not one. to the contrary this is one that would harm our ability in the future to successfully pursue sensitive investigations. speak of the house oversight committee was supposed to meet at 11:00 today which has been pushed to 8:00 p.m. tonight because several of those republican members are at the trump trial in manhattan which we have been covering all day today. if this passes these committees this contempt it goes to the full house floor, that would be up to speaker mike johnson who today was noncommittal and said there are many different things going on to what it is not clear if and when it would go to the full house floor but executive privilege legally protects attorney general garland, that's how the doj sees things. john? >> john: it's one thing to read about another to hear it, thank you. >> sandra: john it is day two of cross-examination for michael cohen but two questions remain for the defense. will trump's attorneys call any witnesses? and will the former president take the stand?

our next guest is at the courthouse initial support governor, congressman mike waltz. thank you for joining us what do you think? and you answer either of those for us? >> i will not get ahead of the defense's strategy, sander, but i can tell you cannot just take a step back and tell you how surreal it was sitting in that courtroom seeing the president of the united states, the commander and chief in a courtroom that deals with petty criminals and a crime where he hasn't even been charged, with the key witness i'd even forgotten how much cohen had lied. i had forgotten about intelligence committee where he lied about russia, russia, russia and then lied about lying later on and then lied to the judge when he pled guilty for lying. so thing was surreal and i think it takes me back to places i've served, africa, south america, the middle east, where

weaponizing a judge and judicial system against a political opponent is normal. where you run for office, you lose, you expect to get put in jail. is this where america is going? i just never thought i would see that firsthand with my own eyes what i saw today. >> john: you know yesterday at the of government subcommittee, robert costello who at one point was michael cohen's attorney testified. he had a long conversation a couple hours in length with michael cohen about all of this business regarding stormy daniels, the nondisclosure agreement, the payments, because at the time cohen was facing serious legal troubles and looking for a way out. and if he could drop a dime on anybody's, costello says, to get out of those legal troubles he would've done it. but that b3 didn't seem to have anything in his pocket. listen to what castella said in and then review this morning with bill and dana. >> he kept on saying over and over again 10-20 times i swear to god, bob, i don't have

anything on donald trump areas i even said to him, michael, think about this. isn't it easier to cooperate against donald trump if you have truthful information then it is to kill yourself? the answer is obvious. that was his moment in time if he had something truthful to say i'm willing to cooperate. but he did not take that. >> john: castella was saying that cohen was up on the roof of the regency hotel and thinking about jumping off because he couldn't face the legal troubles ahead of him. but the fact that someone like robert costello who knows him well and is willing to testify under oath and congress to all of this comes up with something that is completely contradictory to what cohen has been saying, how does that strike you? pico well, that was his testimony to congress just yesterday. i would love to see castella appear as a defense witness saying my former client is lying yet again and has every motivation to do so's because he is enriching himself on podcasts

and tv shows and networks and everywhere else. but cohen is a serial habitual liar is one thing, john, the thing that just continues to jump out to me as a judge who has no issue with his daughter making tons of money literally on this trial as a political operative that has democrat members of congress as her client but then himself that contributes to democrats. you contrast that in florida judges won't even take a photo with me or any other politician. i know a judge who is married to a county commissioner and won't even go to events with his wife because he does not want to be seen in any way as anything but objective. but up here in new york i guess that's okay and i fear we are going to have to spread of this weapon is abo weaponization. and he will fight it off but senators slinging around

indictments and our entire democracy is in trouble. >> sandra: we hear your concern and we sense your urgency. i saw a tweet from you this morning, congressman, where you alluded you would be standing alongside the president you said in this tweet and his family at what you called a "sham trial" and you lamented it's a shame our country has fallen to this place were new york democrats have weaponized the courts to interfere with our election. he next said president trump will beat this and we will send him back to the white house this november. he, the former president, this morning as he was walking to the courtroom, he shared his concerns that he is not out on the campaign trail. what do you believe the impact is the longer he sits in that courtroom and is not out there campaigning? >> actually and this is what historians look at is the sad irony of all of this. it is helping him. i think politically the american people see right through this and we will continue to remind

him, that's why myself and house conservatives were appear saying what president trump constitutionally or unconstitutionally isn't allowed to say with this gag order. we will mind them that biden's number three official in the department of justice is not down in washington, d.c., in the doj he is sitting right here in the courtroom a couple of feet from president trump periods this is election interference at its worst and a weaponized to doj. biden's number three justice officials right inside that r room. >> john: on the subject of you and other folks in new york that microphone stand across the street seems to be an audition stage for people who might be considered for vice president or potentially for other positions if trump wins reelection and i know you are down and mar-a-lago with a bunch of other potential vice presidential picks at which the president said this.

>> oh, full-screen i'm sorry. it talks about you saying "a man that knows more about the military, what i want to know about the military i call him." trickle questions are you ready to change your voter registration and give up her seat in congress to be the vice president or would you like to be selective? >> i want to get president trump elected and i mean that. it's the worst of the worst in washington people start measuring curtains carry meaning to talk about swing states, turnout, and getting him elected to save this country but i will say this. do you remember just a year ago the mainstream media was saying nobody would like to work with president trump he won't be able to get anybody in his cabinet or vice president, look at the amount of republican talent, serious thoughtful individuals standing up on that stage with him that are fighting for him that believe in his policies and vision for this country. i think that is the statement that came out of that mar-a-lago

picture. >> sandra: can you narrow down the list? do you happen to know who is top pick for him? >> again, a lot of people wanted and president trump being president trump is going to -- you know, may be like "apprentice" rate up to the convention. and that is okay because at the end of the day this was the failure in the promise in the primary that you get all the policies we say we love and are good for the country without the leader. and as i said before you don't get apple without coke. you don't get spacex without the lawn and you get america first policies that we badly need was in washington without president trump. so this is what we are all getting behind. i think there is plenty on stage where he says let's make this country great again they are going to salute and move out.

that's what you do us a call to serve. >> john: congressman thank you it was a pleasure to talk to you. >> sandra: thank you. >> john: are repeat liar with an ax to grind us how they portray michael cohen and the latest of questioning. he will be back on the stand and may be 15 or 20 minutes or so. what we expect after the lunch break coming up next. >> every single review every legal style i have been able to read it says there is no case, there is no crime, it's a disgrace that was allowed to happen.

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lady who is live outside the courthouse here in new york city. what is your biggest takeaway from what you've heard so far as we expect this to be underway shortly? >> hi, sandra. todd blanche is really taking his time in painstaking detail to establish this record of cross-examination that michael cohen is an angry liar who is motivated by money and is out for vengeance because he is angry about not being taken to the white house to be part of that and president trump's inner circle. one thing that was mentioned earlier this morning on cross-examination that i am curious we will visit later are questions about robert christo end. he as you know is a lawyer who was at one point given advice and counsel to michael cohen before cohen pled guilty to his own indictment. and costello's account of his relationship with cohen is important because he says cohen

said trump had nothing to do with the stormy daniels nondisclosure agreement. which of course is completely contradictory to what cohen is now testifying about in the criminal trial which is trump knew about the stormy daniels nda and approved of it. there were questions just a couple ahead of the break this morning. we broke for a 15 minute restroom break and when we resumed questions about costello did not pick up again. very curious to see whether or not todd blanche will pick up on that later this afternoon as we get underway because there are open questions whether or not costello could possibly be called as a defense witness. court resumes around 2:15 p.m. and we are breaking orally around 4:00 p.m. for a general commitment so not even clear we will get finished with cross-examination today this may carry through monday. center? >> sandra: lydia who with the latest thinking. >> the good news is the polls are through the roof. one came way up in north carolina, way up in

georgia come way up in nevada, way up in arizona. overall way up. by five, six, seven points. >> john: new poll showing president trump leading over president biden with the strategy backfiring over democrats. breaking it down for us soon. and indescribable comfort. save up to $800 on select adjustable mattress sets at stearnsandfoster.com i brought in ensure max protein with 30 grams of protein! those who tried me felt more energy in just two weeks. -ugh. -here, i'll take that. woo hoo! ensure max protein, 30 grams protein, 1 gram sugar, 25 vitamins and minerals. and a new fiber blend with a prebiotic. (♪)

>> john: as donald trump wraps up the third week of his criminal trial in new york city the race for the white house remains a close one. latest fox news poll shows trump with a narrow one point advantage over president biden. columnist mary catherine hamm joins us now. that w was a head-to-head race, let's look at the numbers when you put the other third-party candidates in it gets further apart by an a quarter percent, trumpet 43. rfk with 11, while two jewels time with terkel percent. trump seems to duty might be doing very well. they could flip the other way but at the moment he is pretty consistent. >> this is the thing if you have to be in either candidate's shoes which would you choose? i think the obvious answer somewhat improbably because many of these polls we have seen recently with "the new york times" siena poll with the battleground states they are in the field while this trial is happening. the idea this was going to knock

him down a peg doesn't seem to be playing out and may go the opposite direction for some people. in this fox news poll if i'm not mistaken the number of people who think he's being treated unfairly has gone up slightly since the last also not as dramatic as some of the battleground states we have seen in other polls but this is a consistent sort of momentum is in trump's favor. i'm not sure the biden team's are coming. >> sandra: mary catherine i will ask you a question that our website at this morning is that biden support around minorities is thin hoping some of these may come home but our recent survey shows biden receiving 72% support among black voters which is up from 66% in february but it is still lagging behind the 79% that he was garnering before the 2020 election. mary catherine, what do you see happening here? >> this is a very tricky number to pin down because you are not

sure are these voters going to come home? in 2020 when you look in april versus november many of those minority voters were in a similar place and many of them did come home. the difference is you four years of economic underperformance to put it mildly those voters out responding to and i will reference these siena poll because they have been doing a lot of this work for years in that particular demographic that shows nonwhite voters both college-educated and noncollege-educated dropping off and sometimes turning towards trump. i think those who view themselves as more moderate and ideological don't turn that way because their chief concern is the economic doldrums that have been affecting them and the inflation stuff that has been causing so many problems. >> john: there is an interesting data point in head-to-head race over time if i could bring this up when we put it on the screen, biden now in the had to head trump has remained very steady and take to back and forth between 50 and 49

but look at the change in biden's numbers. it seems as though trump support is very heavy. it really varies for biden, why do you think that is? >> i think the performance or flexon biden. right? you wonder if this is a change election and if it's a change election that puts biden in a difficult situation because despite that he has been president before he still has a blend of a change agent which may appeal to people. there is this interesting segment called the double haters or as double dislike-ers 6% in 2020 that didn't like either but it's now 13% and those in this pool seem to lean towards biden which could be counterintuitive but those are the folks that trump's needs to be talking to in order to win that undecided segment because he has a lot of people in his camp and both teams have their respective base release meltdown. the enthusiasm for them is another issue. >> sandra: to that point, mary

catherine, many are wondering how is this way so close when you look at who many voters see as the top candidate to handle some of the top border issues right now including immigration and economy, those mostly favor donald trump. how is it so close? i mean you have to say just because they think donald trump may be best to handle those problems, they won't automatically vote for him. >> yes, i think that's the problem they need convincing. i think we saw this problem in 2022 were so many voters sided with republicans on what are republicans cared about the same issues they did and whether they trusted them to act on those issues and yet you did not see the red wave materializing. that partially because of candidate choice. trump i think does have work to do particularly in this double haters demographic, it 87% disapproval biden and don't think he is handling the economy well but they need some convincing to see trump is doing a better. >> john: a very interesting trend which is troubling for biden i am sure which is people

who were never trump, big-money donors as well, are now becoming never biden. it seems to be israel and his policy towards israel that really surrounds all of this. we have talked to a lot of jewish students over the past few weeks and one of the jewish students told us recently that they voted for biden in 2020 but they can't bring themselves to do it now. so when you take a look at that end of the erosion in jewish voters, the erosion in the arab american and muslim american community what is that say about biden? >> conventional wisdom would tell you voters don't vote on foreign policy but i think the domination of afghanistan withdrawal end of this move which signals he is not in control on the foreign policy stage and he might be adding chaos to the world instead of normalcy which is what people were promised spells problems for him. if drew or she usually democrat and heavily donors are leaning against him because of the smooth there is a whole mother

demographic that is pro-israel thee and not jewish and the other is pro-america that does not like what they are seeing from the other side on this issue and stomping on american flags or israeli flags and you can speak to those people because this is a domino effect from the afghanistan withdrawal and throughout his foreign policy failures that people are connecting the dots on. >> sandra: mary catherine hamm, great to have you on today. >> thank you very much. >> john: appreciated. >> sandra: approaching the top of the new hour and a live look at the courthouse where very shortly we expect the defense's crocs examination of michael cohen to resume paired we expect the former president to enter the courtroom shortly we have martha maccallum, john escobar, brent killed me, shannon bream, and mercedes colwin and more all coming up.

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narrator: please, don't wait. call, go online, or scan the qr code below right now. [music playing] >> john: live look at the supreme court were any moment how we expect to see former president donald trump walking you through those doors into the courtroom, michael cohen will be back o