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double murder case that ripped the nation. he ultimately was acquitted for the 1994 murder of his ex-wife nicole brown system and hurt his ron goldman. as someone pointed out last hour, he was found responsible for the death in a civil trial. this is "outnumbered." i am o.j. simpson hewitt michael ojo emily compagno. joining us today is cheryl casone, and former state department spokesperson under president obama, marie harf. and "fox & friends" carlo holse, lawrence jones. okay. first let's go live as we get more details because we've only known about this for about an hour. o.j. simpson is gone. >> he was many things, of football star and actor and also a killer despite the acquittal. in a few years later a conviction for kidnapping and

robbery. a celebrity anywhere he went. a restaurant a golf course he drew a crowd. a born communicator for all his faults, he had christmas, he showed that almost up until the day he died. he posted occasionally on twitter where he had almost 900,000 followers and here is a post from exactly two months ago. on the eve of the super bowl sunday. >> i want to say thank you to all the people who reached out to me. my health is good, obviously i am dealing with some issues, but i think i am just about over it. and i am back on the golf course. hopefully in a couple of weeks. >> he grew up in a public housing project and became a star running back and went on to fame with the buffalo bills and the first and one of the few to rush for over 2,000 yards in a single season.

after his career on the field he wanted to the broadcast booth. and he did ads very successfully. in 1975 "people" magazine called him the first black athletes to become a bona fide lovable media superstar. in 1994 he was charged with killing his ex-wife and ryan gauld meant. when most watch that trial it was of our time and he was acquitted after hiring the dream team of attorney. he was however convicted in a civil case in order to pay $33 million which he paid very little. in 2007 he was arrested for kidnapping and robbery of the sports memorabilia collector in las vegas and sentenced to 33 years and has been living in las vegas ever since on his nfl pension which the courts determine could not be touched by creditors. his death was yesterday, he was 76 years old after a battle with cancer. he lives five children. >> harris: thank you very

much. let's go into the case but some details that i did not heard before today, eric who covered the minor child. when you did prescribed the photos and the evidence in that case it bone chilling. >> hello. yes. i have been haunted by some of these photos i remember seeing them, it was shocking and revealed the savagery and violence of this double murder. thoughts are with nicole's family and with ron goldman's family. and the children that they have lost. if you saw what america did not fraudulently see him covering that trial was the autopsy photos. you cannot show those on television. they were bloodied and gruesome and exposed a savage and brutal crime of extreme anger and passion. nicole brown simpson's head was nearly decapitated. the knife was in her throat so

deeply it severed her voice box, it had hit her backbone. i remember seeing those photos and you cannot forget that. realizing that this was a crime of passion. it's not just a few of knife thrust, it was a complete -- it was horrible and a startling mass. we have the evidence of the blood drops that went in that scene -- that went to the white bronco. he had cut his middle finger, they were not small cuts but 2-inch cuts that matched the blood drops -- there was also blood on the bronco, and that was all there. it was all put together but we must remember it he was found liable in the civil trial but that one jury, that one time in 1995 decided that there was reasonable doubt for him not being guilty double murder.

the police were on trial in that case and there were some sloppy -- one of the detectives took the blood vial and it went off to the wrong scene -- so in respect, by and large, the legacy of o.j. simpson's trial -- often there's just too many people of domestic abuse in this country who do not get the justice they are deserved and are not taken seriously. they had said that trump said that he was going to try and kill her. there is a photo of the black eye he pleaded no contest but too often i think the legacy is domestic abuse is too often not justice for these type of cases in these country >> harris: let us just remember that the children who were young at that time in the

household of nicole brown simpson. eric, excellent reporting. thank you as always. >> lawrence: it is important to go back as a criminal justice major because we studied this case extensively, we go back too the moment in time of racial tension being at all-time high. you would think every case was treated by the merit of the facts but it wasn't there was the court of public opinion. we were at each other's throats and there were a lot of black people who wanted america to feel their pain and they use the murder of this young woman to celebrate outside of when he was found innocent in that case. but it also showed the criminal justice system in a new light and essentially if you had the right attorney and the enough money you could get off. so it wasn't fat for the whole world to see. o.j. simpson had some time to

make his amends and repair his image with american public that he he cemented his place in history in a negative way in 2008 when the book came out. "if i did a" of courses says with a little if if i did it. because of that moment and that book there was no sign of remorse and america continue to hates this man and rightfully so rightfully so. >> harris: the way it played out is so important, because the endorsements and his ability to be who he had been in society as an employed individual let alone a superstar -- and then he chose a life of crime that took people to prison anyway for nine years. >> marie: we idealize both stars and heroes, for good reasons many times and he was one of them. the first cell phone videos and now you see a much more private lives of the sports heroes but

this was before that. i am glad that eric mentioned the fact that this case brought domestic violence to the forefront. it told people that it could happen to anyone. the most well off woman married to a superstar, it could happen to anyone and it happened whether people realized. i really think that, at the time there was this cultural moment where we all remember where we were during that car chase. and what we had the verdict. as stated, he bought the best defense team and bought a not guilty verdict which was a travesty of the criminal justice system. and for nicole brown simpson and also ron goldman more than anyone. >> harris: this was an important name and he is also an important friend to fox news. the frantic lethargic who worked on the

autopsy -- doctor you are with us. >> hello high-risk it is good to hear your voice. >> harris: we did not see all the things that you saw as a journalist with the photos. you saw up close and get the autopsy and he opened our eyes today and reminding us how cory the murder scene was. >> yes. there was a lot of blood and footprints and other evidence that was around. when i and another doctor got there. but yes the bodies had been brought to the medical examiner's office is quickly. >> harris: what was your first reaction when you heard that o.j. simpson had passed away? >> i thought that he really had -- i thought he was a very

talented person and the outgoing person who was stuck in this -- stuck in the death of his wife and ron goldman. he was found not guilty in the criminal child because the prosecutor did not present the evidence sufficient to get a guilty verdict. and johnny cochran was a magnificent defense lawyer. but it breaks the question that o.j. simpson, whether he did cause the death because -- it wasn't proven at the trial. >> harris: allow me to ask you a question, i am curious, lawrence jones brought up the ratio and division in the country at the time, did you feel pressure from what was

going on as you had this extremely important job to figure out how nicole brown simpson died and who could have done it so on and so forth and also ron goldman. >> there were other people who could've done done it. yes. and bob shapiro, and johnny cochran and such, they were excellent lawyers. what happened was it wasn't proven. o.j. simpson wasn't inte intereg person because he was the early bird because of the color barrier where he was accepted in the black community and even more so in the white community because of his athletic ability and because of his commercials where he had very popular commercials, so people were

familiar with and more so than other black athletes. >> harris: he had done movies and so many other things by then. >> no, i did not feel adamant, but he was interested in picking that jury, and the relationship between the prosecutors and the defense attorney on how the jury was picked because they did have racial implications. >> harris: thank you so very much. it is it important to me to have your expertise with us. >> it was good to talk to you. i am sorry to hear about the death. >> harris: my mind goes to the family of these victims such as nicole brown simpson and her family and also ron goldman and

her his fami. i wonder what they've been put through without the domestic violence in that home. >> the less that i feel in this moment is the enduring loss of nicole brown simpson and ron goldman. >> emily: i feel nothing new for the last today. allow me to point out the shape of the trial and we talk about the purchase of the attorneys and whatnot. going back to that time, nicole brown simpson had kept notes and her diary where she detailed incredibly tragic circumstances of being beaten and traumatized and harassed and also stocked by o.j. simpson. it was ruled inadmissible to court. she called five days into a shelter or seeking help and advice. it was also ruled inadmissible in the trial. prosecution was introducing seven consensus of stalking out of the two years that he had

been subjecting the cole brown to they presented one. by the jury was pulled after the trial they told the media that they felt that the domestic abuse issue was "a ute elite not a of time" it was called a domestic discord. the media took it and ran with it and i must point out that a woman in 1984 they confirmed that a woman is beaten by a man they know every 15 seconds. that statistic remains and more women are killed by the people they are trying to divorce and her abusive husband et cetera, before they are able to escape with their lives. and nicol nicole brown simpson s another example of that. they are so much more i could say, everyone talks about the fact that nicole brown simpson then to arrest o.j. simpson but they didn't. the failure was catastrophic and

multilayered. there's not enough time in the shelter describe exactly how. >> harris: we should not talk around the issue. it was privilege. he was a star. he got special treatment. we will be moving on. more "outnumbered" in a moment.

>> harris: new this is never ending. inflation is skyro rocketing acs the u.s. people are struggling to make ends meet. the prices of everyday items like bread or butter or eggs or more everything we eat is up double digits. forcing hardworking americans to make sacrifices as a result. or the ones they have continued to make the sacrifices since president biden got into office. a study found that there is an alarming number of americans who

are skipping meals just so they could afford to live in their homes. it is no wonder voters are not so excited about president biden's very cold economy. >> he has been it disastrous for the economy. >> i agree. >> donald trump policies on the economy would've been be better. is there anything joe biden could do or say? between now and the time you vote that would make you feel differently about feeling that his policies would not be helped for your economy? or have you decided that his policies would be better, donald trump's, for the economy? >> he is in denial of what is happening. >> he is gas letting everyone the process. >> harris: that was on msnbc. he is bringing us together, everyone agreed on screen about

how they felt that this economy is bad for them. president biden however dismisses concern and defend his economy here he goes. >> we have dramatically reduced inflation to down to almost 3%. we're in a situation where we are in a better situation than when we were when we took office. when inflation was skyrocketing. >> harris: okay. that is not true. it was 1.4% in january of 2021. so we start off with something that is not true and we go from there. >> there are a few things he said that are not truly and i have the numbers. we looked at w what the presidet said versus what the reality people are feeling. in january 2021. inflation was at 1.4%, and yes it jumped to 9.1% but now we're sitting at 3.5%. but overall prices, everything you are paying for your shelter and food and groceries -- 18.9%

from when he took office to now that is the overall jump. >> cheryl: that is one thing. but wages have not kept pace with inflation that is the other important part. he said that workers are rising faster than prices. bailey true -- in fact since he took office, average earnings after you factor in inflation is down 2.5%. >> harris: that doesn't add in fruit or energy as you've just said. so hope that is it? because that's where we put most of our money. people are putting basic groceries on their credit card and they have abandoned that under donald trump. how is it compared to being in the pandemic? it is worse now. >> cheryl: the headline does include shelter and food and energy prices. so wall street is looking at the core number but forget the core

number. americans are feeling the headline number, that was the big story yesterday and we have people today talking about wholesale that was higher than expected. and it's only going to get worse. >> harris: so what is president biden selling? >> lawrence: i do not know. i don't have his last name and i cannot just work for a energy company with no experience. [laughter] we worked paycheck to paycheck growing up. and make things work with the little that we had. if you have family members or friends who live in real america who are not wealthy you are feeling the heat as well because in my family, when one person was struggling someone stepped up to help everyone else out, but the president is going around the country right now hosting these kitchen table sessions. but do you open up the refrigerator or ask the people how much milk is costing them or how much egg is costing them, it is one thing to talk to the

american people but if you are not having these real conversations you cannot make policy that reflects their lived experience. >> harris: as you were talking, emily something just hit me with a different image eat then we. we saw donald trump doing what he always does who hangs out with people and may pick up a tab for a person here or there but he bought people food yesterday. and that is diametrically opposed to what we are seeing with president biden. >> emily: allow me to point out as well that the united way operates the people who provide economic assistance, they have reported a search under ththis administration where people are making too much to be eligible but are feeling catastrophically under asset or do not have enough. aat this point, 36 million americans, 29% of them are above the poverty line, the false one

that the federal government has drawn but they feel the pinch and the squeeze and their savings are going up and they need help. the kelis helpline saying that they need help but they are told they they are sorry and they art eligible. people are feeling pain right now but according to this administration people are doing fine but they are not. >> harris: marie harf, when will we get up the clinton moment? i feel your pain? >> marie: this is top for the team. there are so many facts here. when democrats and the biden team took office, we were on the edge of a recession because of covid and eventually a year later because of the war in ukraine. they did raise interest rates to give us the soft landing but we haven't tipped into -- other countries are having horrific inflation -- so this is what i am saying. there are things that the team did that prevented this from

being worse, that is a hard sell to voters. part of the reason voters are still paying more for a lot of good such as meat or poultry, companies are making more than what we are -- >> harris: that is not true. >> marie: let me finish. we have corporate profits across the board. people are making profits, so this is a hot political one because they are doing a lot of the right things in the economy but it is hard. >> harris: the operations are costing more. >> this is the report i did this morning. this includes wages and other pieces of the real estate. all of it. >> lawrence: they are still trying to recover from the pandemic as well. we did ship business is down, so we are all recovering. but he claimed to make it better and he did not make it better. >> harris: he did not say

build back and be better in quite some time. democrats in the media keep trying to build donald trump as a great threat to democracy. we will get into it. who is really the threat to democracy? rs, four years, or thirty-two years, like myself. one of the benefits that we as a country give you as a veteran is your eligibility for a va loan. not 80 percent but 100 percent the value of your home and that's what you can get at newday usa. (restaurant noise) introducing allison's plaque psoriasis. she thinks her flaky gray patches are all people see. otezla is the #1 prescribed pill

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policy! find out if you're sitting on a goldmine. call coventry direct today at the number on your screen, or visit coventrydirect.com. >> emily: democrats in the mainstream media cannot stop calling donald trump a threat to democracy. time and time again we have heard them repeat the same phrase over and over. take a listen for yourself. >> what do you think constitutes the primary threat to freedom and democracy at home? >> donald trump. >> donald trump is telling us that he wants to be a dictator. and if we have learned one thing about this man, believe him. believe how crazy he is. >> there is no dog whistle, he is a gigantic man who was barking. >> he said objectively

speaking and factually speaking, he makes it a greater threat tot marcus lee then joe biden. >> he undermines and unravels the rule of law and the other is that he weakens and unravels core democratic institutions. >> emily: did he really? donald trump have been busy on the campaign trail and visited chick-fil-a yesterday online. he treated people to chicken and milk shakes. appealing to voters with a campaign strategy and argued a personality trait of meeting people and meeting voters where they are watch this. >> tonight i am buying 30 milk shakes and some chicken. this is good. i have a lot of money and everyone can get rich right? >> we took care of those colleges.

>> i don't care what the media tells you, we support you. >> l lgive you a hug. >> emily: that isn't genuine. so the question for you is the biden administration has said that campaign strategy and communication strategy is meeting people where they are. that's why they declined the super bowl interview but here we see donald trump is the one who is actually meeting people where they are. >> marie: both candidates are going to talk to a lot of voters. i do not know that joe biden will go to a chick-fil-a, but to return to the segment, i am not prone to hyperbole there are a lot of republicans i would be happy to have as a president, because i feel like they would support the fundamental underpinning of our country and our political system. i do believe that donald trump is a threat to democracy.

i was in washington when we were there on january 6th, and he try to overturn a democratic election. i have heard him say things he wants to do, i try not to be hyperbolic about things, but i see what he has done and said and i genuinely believe that he is a threat to the democratic underpinning of our country. and i do not say this lightly. >> emily: he said that when he is president again he would enforce the laws and the southern border and restore law and order are those threats to democracy? >> lawrence: e emily, i have to address the threats to democracy. it is rich when the democrats talk about the threats when they are weaponize and the court system. take the legal system here in new york when it comes to real estate, every single real estate mogul in new york does the same thing that donald trump does. but they are using the court system to go after it. they know this but do not care.

they say not to worry because this is only because of donald trump. you have the federal case right now when it comes to a subpoena where they have peter navarro in jail for not obeying what congress said was the rightful subpoena, and made biden supported judge calder not saying this is rich. you are using the same rule against this case to say that you do not have to go to a newly elected body that you have a subpoena? you have a plane issued but didn't do anything fire at the d about to serve one year in prison and thousands of dollars in funds. you have the pro-hamas caucus stopping legislation every single day that are stopping the meetings of congress. doesn't matter which god you are praying to? again, i know people do not like donald trump and that is okay you do not have to agree with every political candidate, but to use the court system to get

after the republicans just because you don't like them that's the threat to democracy. >> harris: you are absolutely right, i had the senator on who was on the senate side yesterday when they stormed a cafeteria. two days ago -- he said the action was illegal and he supports protest but what they did is illegal. what he said is by the way they came back today. they did their illegality and then broke the law even more. the anti-israel and some of them may even have been pro-hamas. quickly, donald trump has never been charged with anything that happened on january 6th, let alone convicted of it. >> marie: he has been charge for that. >> harris: what you said is you acquitted it for where your friends which happens at the capitol. let me make it clear that those are not the charges against the former president not that he's there ever been at the

conviction. his supporters to do so. but america gets to go to the polls and we get to figure out what they feel and how they think. but right now they are hurting and their voices are going to be heard in november. >> emily: coming up more blue cities are pushing for reparations on the taxpayers' dime. one democrat says that black people should not even have to pay taxes. coming up next. i got the power of 3. i lowered my a1c, cv risk, and lost some weight. in studies, the majority of people reached an a1c under 7 and maintained it. i'm under 7. ozempic® lowers the risk of major cardiovascular events such as stroke, heart attack, or death in adults also with known heart disease. i'm lowering my risk. adults lost up to 14 pounds. i lost some weight. ozempic® isn't for people with type 1 diabetes. don't share needles or pens, or reuse needles. don't take ozempic® if you or your family ever had medullary thyroid cancer, or have multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if allergic to it. stop ozempic® and get medical help right away

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a step farther. congresswoman jasmine crockett is suggesting that all black people should be exempt from paying taxes as a form of reparations. here it is. >> one thing that they propose is black people not pay taxes for a certain amount of time because that puts money into your pocket and that is one of the reasons that we argued that reparations makes sense. because so many black people, not only do you owe for the labor that was stolen and were killed and all those other things, but if you do the no tax thing, for people who are already struggling and are not really paying taxes in the first place, it doesn't really -- >> harris: we have just been explained to. >> this debate has been going on for quite a while. it is becoming more national, i was looking at two different arguments and the estimated range of what it will cost on a

national basis to pay reparations is anywhere from ten to almost $19 trillion. and we are sitting on $28 trillion as a nation and get right now. >> harris: more than half our debt? >> yes that is what the overall cost would be. if these discussions came to fruition. it was the original sin, but we cannot afford this right now. there are other ways we can find ways to do so as a nation to give out reparations. but this is not the way. financial payment is not the w way. >> marie: i think that when we look at evanston's program, very narrowly tailored to help with housing and equality, it did things like taxpayers to address long-term segregation.

that's a long tailored -- speech or what about poor white people what do they get? >> marie: what i would prefer to reparations is to fix some of the long-standing problems that still exist and how would the federal government programs that are on equal not just with a bass boat with class and with economy and a whole number of things. some of these programs are tailored narrowly and bacon big benefit to several communities. >> harris: high tide raises all boats. that is what donald trump figured out and that's how he lowered black unemployment to the lowest it's been in 50 years. >> lawrence: black people do not need blue liberal still rescue us. we are hardworking people, a lot of us didn't have it easy, but we are willing to do to work every single day and we have been doing the work. the number one small businesses in the country is black women.

i think what would behoove as emily would say -- [laughter] what the liberals need to do is to remove some of the barriers that are blocking the progress of black americans. they prefer the teachers union when he becomes education or regulation when it comes to businesses, imagine your ancestors are going through slavery, but then now the government wants to take 6% of that. you would not need preparation if you fix that. >> harris: the high tide helps everybody. we are in this together. >> i don't think anyone should pay taxes because we are not even getting our moneys worth. we are not safe, i am just kidding -- >> harris: oh, yes, of course. [laughter] okay. coming up. what if we could all just switch

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>> o.j. simpson death from

cancer at the age 76. we are here to reflect, plus inflation running high and president biden says a rate cut is still coming. white house and prepped pentagon press briefings are coming up as tension in the middle east flair. joining us live on "america reports" at the top of the hour. >> harris: more on the top story from today, o.j. simpson passed away after a prostate cancer battle is what it was reported, he was 76. we are hearing now from the father of ron goldman. one of the victims of the double murder trial that o.j. simpson was charged with and then eventually's acquitted. he told the daily mail on the phone that the only thing that i have to say today is that this is a further reminder of the loss of my son. a further reminder of my son's

murderer and a reminder of the many years we have missed ron goldman, his death as a reminder that they were murdered by o.j. simpson. i am not going to react to my thoughts about him dying. i have nothing to say about him. my response will not be about o.j. simpson's death, but about his loss of my family son, or the loss of my family son's life by hand. there was a bit of a typo there. jane is now is kim, you see her here on the couch, and also a friend of nicole brown simpson. i would imagine this day as fred goldman has said, joining us by phone now, everyone is thinking of the victim who knew them. >> indeed. it is good to be with you, with this unfortunate story. but i will tell you i was at a very date charity event last night in the news broke to a few of us and he went through the event like wild fire.

there was a collective sigh of relief. and i say that with all respect. for those of us who did no nicole brown simpson, a group of four men who were around her for all of the men who were around him and also for our city as a whole and the race relation. there is just this collective sigh of relief. >> harris: i have to ask, from what producers were telling me when they were getting you on the phone is that you had some things he wanted to say about your friend nicole brown sim simpson, you knew her and what it was like to be around her. >> i knew her through a few of my own dear friends. we were in the room and script together and she was always a life of the party and she was so much fun and she was a great mother. and what many of my girlfriends who are very close to her said is that they spoke so highly of her and how she was so strong

and wanted to keep her family together. and wanted to protect her children. and i think she was gone far too soon. >> harris: what if you kept up through the years about chi children? >> they went under the radar here. probably very wisely. i have a son that was on the west side, we lived one street away from o.j. simpson and nicole brown simpson's home. i would drive by her condo every day going to the grocery store and bundy. but they kept a very, very low profile. and i feel like there was also some type of reverence for the kids from the media. and from family members who are protective. let's just not get them involved. >> harris: let's think the lord for that. some grace and some normality if it were even possible for these

children who know and saw who only knows what during the marriage with all those because of domestic violence before the death. thank you so much for coming in and giving us your perspective. >> thank you so much and i love all of you at "outnumbered." >> harris: we love you back. more "outnumbered" than just moment. i thought i knew a lot about our irish roots; i was surprised to learn so many more things. there's the family name. 1892 wow. that one here is the boat they came over on. yes. wow. every day, veteran homemeowners are calling newday to pay off credit card debt that's been piling up. many were shocked to learn they've been paying 22% on their credit card balances.

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>> america bringing you breaking news box, keep it where

it is it's where you will see it all live this afternoon at 1:30 p.m. eastern and a half hour press secretary karine jean-pierre will face questions at today's white house press briefing always a spicy. she plays a mean game of dodgeball. i'm sure they will hold her down. 2:00 p.m. eastern the state department is set drooled a briefing with spokesman matthew miller end at 2:30 p.m. eastern pentagon press secretary patrick ryder will brief the press and to questions. again, keep it right here on fox news channel for all the live events we are monitoring for you. breaking news when it happens. as you know, we've covered from stem to stern on o.j. simpson so far more and more as we learn more reaction to his death thank you for watching, here is a miracle reports. "america reports." >> sandra: we will cover the use events live one of the most infamous and divisive figures of the past three decades has died, o.j. simpson passi awaway at the age of 76 afte