let not your heart be troubled. the news continues. greta van susteren is live to go "on the record." take it away. tonight, uh-oh, president obama uses the e word -- extortion. >> you have never seen in the history of the united states the debt ceiling or the threat of not raising the debt ceiling being used to extort the a president or a governing party . >> there is no interest on our part in shutting the government down. >> harry reid says we don't want the government open. >> the republicans are out here using extortion and blackmail methods saying if we don't defund obamacare we won't do routine things of government. >> we are interested in stability and fairness. funding the government for a full year period of time. >> congress's most fundamental job is passing the budget. congress needs to get it done without triggering another

crisis. without shutting down the government or threatening not to i pay this country's bills. >> my goal is to keep the government open and protect our constituents from obamacare. >> 43 presidents, 232 years the to pile up the first $6.3 trillion in debt. this president in four and a half years has almost doubled that amount. >> the debt ceiling being used to extort a president or a governing party -- to extort a president or a governing party. >> there should be no conversation about shutting the government down. that is not the goal here. >> the president is threatening to shut down the government. >> you heard right. president obama accusing house republicans of extortion the. former senior adviser to president reagan pat buchanan joins us. >> good to see you. >> the president feels there is extortion over the debt ceiling. >> my response is harvard law professor ought to read the constitution of the united states. the power of the purse is given

to congress. the power to tax, the power over debts. what congress is doing is trying to use their power to take down a piece of legislation that was badly drafted which is going to damage the country uh and which the american people do not want. i admire congress for standing up and using the tools and weapons the founding fathers gave out in order to do something good for the country. >> they are trying to use what they have. the president may be cornered on that. they may be using their power to get him to do something. >> political leverage. you have done a little bit of law, greta. it has a connotation of criminality. that's why the word got attention. >> he's using i it loosely. >> i don't think so. >> i don't think he's accusing them of a crime. he's using it politically. >> i agree with you. the congress has a right to do this. i'm glad to see them making the

effort. do you know what congress should do? i think last summer they should have passed a continuing resolution for state, defense, justice, cia, homeland security. passed it and sent it to reid and said, look, we don't want these agencies involved in a spat in october. let's pass them now. get them done and battle over the this. >> congress may want to call him a hypocrite. when he was a u.s. senate he declared america had a debt problem and a failure of leadership. he's changed his feelings when to raise the debt ceiling. >> he voted with the democrats, purely politically on that. look, the t debt ceiling battle. we had something like 40 debt ceiling votes or something since

1983. some cases you had three in a couple of months, i think, back in 19990. you can use this. let me agree with those that say, look, we have to pay our debts, no doubt about it. the idea of oh using these weapons and tools and these arguments in order to gain something. at the end it's good for the country. >> there is a big fat lie here. i will tell you what it is. the reason we are having the fight on the debt ceiling is because thoos political leaders have not led. they have not been good stewards of the economy. if they focused on waste, were good at administering the government we wouldn't have to raise it. they have failed their jobs. >> there is no question about that. you know, the leadership. i would take mr. boehner and mr. cantor and others.

the leadership has not really led. the first thing -- >> president obama is right up to his eyeballs on this. >> not only on this. on the budget and on obama care. you take the amnesty thing. the leaders are for that. take the syrian war. they signed onto that. 3/4 of republicans in the house are ready to fight. they need leaders to fight. >> one of the problems of obamacare besides people complaining about the cost of it. every time the president gives exemptions he's raising the costs. somebody has to pay for it. he's up to his eyeballs. >> you say the situation is getting worse. i admire congressmen looking for a way to stop this and till it and go back and do it over again. i think they got the national interests of the country at heart and of the party and the people. some of the other folks say

don't do that. we would be hurt politically if we take a stand, step up and fight. people will react against us. you lose every time. >> you're fine, i'm fine. anyone over the age of 40 is fine. we can't keep raising the debt ceiling every time we need money. i'm surprised young people aren't taking to the streets, protesting how terrible this country is being managed financially. let me bring you to the president's foreign policy. remember back in 2008 then presidential candidate obama promised to improve america's image overseas. >> we will improve our moral standing in the world. we will once again lead the world. not just militarily but diplomatically, economically. >> during his first year in office president obama receive ed a nobel peace prize.

five years later as we see what's happening with syria, russia, egypt, owe friends in the uk saying no to a strike in syria and even brazil's president dissing president obama saying no to a state dinner at the white house in october. has the president made america's standing in the world worse? >> no question american influence is diminished from what it's been and from the days we won the cold war and george h.w. bush had the world behind him to throw the iraqis out of kuwait. when the president of brazil says i don't think i'm coming to a state dinner, mr. president. >> i think it's one of the worst. that's pathetic. everybody wants a state dinner at the white house. every nation. the president of brazil is so upset because nsa is spying on her and on brazil she says i'm not coming. if that's the clincher in terms of telling what the world thinks

of us, one of our oldest allies. >> my guess is she's standing tall in brazil. the people probably said, good for you standing up to the american s. it's a problem we have had since 2000. we have said we are the be-9/11 lent nation. we see further than others. the exceptional nation. a lot of people see america as behaving like a moral and political tutor to the world. the sheriff of the global vig. they are saying enough is enough. get the message. >> if we were good at it. that's the problem. we haven't been and vladimir putin had to bail us out of a mess with syria. who would have guessed after the soviet union fell in 19 # 1 and now we have putin. we are leaning on putin to rescue us from a problem. >> who got us into the problem? do you know where we got into the problem? president obama said assad must

go and my red line is this. they moved the chemical weapons around, use them, that's it. he made these ultimatums and had nothing to back it up. assad said i'm not going. there is confusion about who used the chemical weapons. it's now the finger of suspicion pointed at i assad's army at least. he does nothing and frankly the russians bailed him out. >> did you see what former secretary of defense panetta and gates said? >> they were tough on him. secretary panetta said if uh i don't draw a red line you have to do something about it. simply uh because president obama drew a red line in the sand on syria doesn't mean the congress of the united states should authorize the a war on syria. maybe h he ought to stand down. george bush said the world's worst dictators aren't getting the world's worst weapons.

what about north korea? >> when obama ran for president he drew 90,000. now even angela merkel won't stand behind us. that's another one. >> we ought to stand up for ourselves. tell the germans we have 25,000, 50,000 troops in germany. bring them home. tell the germans to man up, defend yourselves again. >> that's good. they should man up over there. syrian president abar al assad sits down for an interview with fox news. here is part of the interview. >> this is so important. let me follow up on one or two points and move on. again, no conditions. you will agree to the plan to destroy your chemical weapons? you put conditions on this in the past week or so. no conditions? >> the only condition that agreement will entail and propose and provide. now we are going to discuss the

details with the international organization. i don't i don't have all the details to discuss it with you, no. i'm not the expert to have special. when we join agreement as syria we are always committed to those agreements. >> people say this is just a reduce, just a game. experts say it will be difficult to get rid of chemical weapons, especially in a war situation. that this is buying you time. >> even if you don't have war it is difficult. even if you have all the requirements afforded by every party it takes the time to get rid of. >> you say it could take years? >> as i said, we don't have experience in that regard. i i heard it takes about a year. maybe a little bit less, a little bit more. >> a last key element to the

u.n. report and while the u.n. inspectors didn't lay blame or place cull pablt for the attack, there are many experts interpreting this report, some i have spoken to in the last 12 hours that say this attack hooks firmly like an atam from your government. >> sarin gas is called kitchen gas because anybody can mix it. >> they say it is very high quality even that used in iraq by saddam hoo sap. >> anybody can make sarin. we know all the rebels are supported by government. any government with such chemical material can hand it over. >> experts say they have tracked nothing like this. there is a ton of sarin gas. it is launchers, rockets, a whole fleet which happened to be

in your basements. >> it cannot be possible. you cannot use sarin beside your troops. you don't use wmd while you are advancing. you are not being deeffete, not retreating. the whole situation was in favor of the army lt we didn't choose it when we had bigger problems last year. third, when they talk about any troop or unit that used this weapon, this is for one reason because chemical weapons can only be used by specialized units. the whole story doesn't hold together. it is not realistic. no, we didn't. in one word, we didn't use any chemical weapons. >> pat, if the end of the story is no chemical weapons though the president was clumsy in how he handled this, perhaps

president putin had to bail him out. doesn't he get credit for this long term if that's the product here. >> my guess is we won't get all the chemical weapons out any time soon. even if he starts. i think assad will use this to, b quote, extort concessions from the united states and elsewhere saying, look, for me to get them out we have to stop this bloody war. you have to stop helping these rebels. you have al qaeda and the rebels. we have to have a truce, some kind of oh deal where we can have peace. that way we can get the weapons out. that's what will happen. i think the russians -- >> is that a bad thing? >> bottom line is i don't want al qaeda in power in syria. they will use any weapon they can get and the sanctuaries there to attack america. >> you would rather have assad? >> he and his father worked with

george bush in the gulf war. >> but he gas people. >> did he? this is the thing. if the united states has solid interepted evidence by phones and everything we hear that they were preparing this -- >> the u.s. said that. >> we have to the put it on the table. nobody has said they have proof that assad made a call and ordered it. >> he's the head guy. >> the main guy. >> this is his unit. even if we didn't catch him saying h he did it uh, if he's the main guy. >> here's the thing. we got it back to gadhafi blowing up pan-am 103. >> and we sent the guy home to die. another -- >> if the we got it and know who the military is we say, okay, you say uh you didn't do it. here is our intercept. here are the generals and officers who were the ones we believed used it. you may not know it.

turn him over. if you have that evidence -- >> we gave him a chance to look the other way, walk into the sunt set? >> there are evil people all over. it is not the business of the united states to go around like wyatt erp in the global village and take down every bad guy. he's done terrible things. but greta, how do we advance the interest of peace and of the united states by attacking syria and killing a thousand people and have women and children on aljazeera and the other networks across the middle east the next day? how does it he help us? >> i don't think it helps us at all. it's a very ugly, horrible situation. a lot of lousy choices. >> let's stay out of it and prevent the worse choice. >> thank you. now to tonight's hot button issue. what do you think about the

interview with bashar al assad. use twitter. we may use your tweet. use # greta. straight ahead, we are just getting new information into fox in the irs scandal. you will want to know it. it just got worse for the irs. also a kidnapped teenager found alive. tonight a search under way. who are police looking for and why? that live report from georgia is next. and senator rand paul has a secret weapon. what is it and how does he plan ♪

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>> reporter: she lived just around the bend. the fbi is covering every piece of evidence in that house. it is an active crime scene. here's what we know so far. at 2:15 a.m. tuesday morning, a call goes out for prowler in progress, police respond. they say two african-american male males dressed in black, armed with handguns entered the back of the perez home. this is the cul-de-sac. the tree line gives the robbers cover of darkness and woods. once inside, the robbers encounter her mother, maria, ivana and her 15-year-old brother. there was also a family dog. the robbers demanded money and jewelry. when maria told them they had

none the family dog was fault and ivana was abducted without explanation. the two men fled in a gray dodge or chevy sedan. they would have thread this way. it was the cul-de-sac and they had to exit this way beginning her very traumatic 34 hour journey. the robbers would have had two choices. you could head south to get to conyers or head north to lead you to the highway. conyers is 25 miles as the crow flies directly east of elwood, georgia. we believe they would have gone north. google maps gives us a number of different ways to go. only one truly takes about 25-30 minut minutes. it is almost exactly 25 miles between elword and conyers and gone highway 20 east because that would have been the shortest distance. our gps shows less than 10 miles until we get off of i-20 east

headed to conyers if indeed this was the route the robbers took, the fastest direct route they could have taken. once in conyers, they clearly were going somewhere. we are told the location a residence by authorities. so at some point they would have been on residential streets just like this one in conyers. 34 hours after being abduct ed she is recovers here in conyers somewhere. authorities won't give us the exact location but we know it was a residence. two men are in custody, one described as a career felon, the other a mexican national. those two men do not match the men in the police sketches. those two men the robbers route we just showed you, they may still be at large but ivana perez is somewhere safe tonight with her family. >> we go to jonathan.

>> hi, greta. first the good news. this young girl is home this evening and we saw welcome home balloons who came out to wish her well. >> she looked relaxed. she looked tired and shaken up. she looked pretty good. >> reporter: she was abducted from her home early tuesday morning. her mother told authorities to the men broke in demanding family jewelry and when they had none, one man abducted the dog. they found them 25 miles east of atlanta and arrested a 29-year-old jackson of atlanta on charges of conspiracy to

commit kidnapping and 41-year-old rodriguez of mexico on immigration charges. police say these two men are separate from the two abductors the mother described to police. authorities say they're still looking for the two men in these police sketches and say there may be more arrests in this case. here's where it gets complicated. my colleague says the kidnapping victim's mother, maria, was arrested in a marijuana sting last year along with one of the kidnapping suspects, american national juan rodriguez. the charges against the mother in that marijuana sting were dropped. the girl, we look at this kidnapping case. the girl is home but the investigation continues. greta. >> jonathan, thank you. for more on how police rescued

the kidnapped teen and what they know about the suspect, clayton county police major johnnie robinson joins us. good evening, sir. cuddle you tell me something. they were saying the mother of the kidnapping victim may have been arrested last summer. what can you tell me about that? >> at this point, the investigation is still ongoing. we have not done any criminal backgrounds on her yet f. that will be later. at this point we don't know if there have been kidnaps. our main priority is the rescue of that young girl. >> who are you looking at tonight? >> we're still looking for the two suspects you already have the sketches on, both those

suspects and asking citizens not only of macon county if you have information on these suspects, to please contact the police department or in clayton county, contact the clayton police department. it is imperative to get them off the street. >> what did ivani say after she was taken home, did she give you any connection to the kidnappers at all or what they said? >> basically, without giving too much at this time because we are still looking for two suspects, she was treated fine, did not show anication of being harmed. she said she basically did get some sleep and other than that, was treated fine. >> did she say she knew her kidnappers? >> no, she did not know the kidnappers. >> so she'd never seen them before or anything else? they were brand new to her? >> yes. at this point, she had never

seen these two individuals, however again we are still looking for two more and at this point we are not sure where the investigation will take us. >> did the mother say why she thought her home was targeted for this home invasion? sn>> no. she had no idea. she was inside asleep when she actually heard someone trying to come in the back door. is there no indication how her house was targetsed. >> was it breaking and entering or do you think the kidnappers were let into the home? >> the kidnappers forced their way in through her back door. at that point the mother was trying to get the kids in a closet and the suspects came upstairs and found them in the closet. once the dog started barking, they shot the dog and grabbed

the child and took her out of the home. >> thank you, sir. >> thank you. stunning new information, the irs scandal you will only see hear. what the top irs and treasury officials really know about the party and more importantly when did they know it. those answers you've never heard before but will next. how mu protein

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in engineering... and technology. and now our latest creation breaks one more barrier. introducing the cla. starting at $29,900. ♪ this is a fox news alert. new documents ex posing what top officials knew about the irs targeting scandal and exposing when they knew it. jim jordan joins us. >> good to be with you. >> what is the new information you have? >> the administration said all along we didn't find out until may of this year when lois lerner gave her speech. jay carney said we learned when the inspector general unveiled his audit. we have documents now -- and we didn't get them from the irs. they are dragging their feet. we got them from the inspector

general. we have documents may 30, 2012, a year ago. due to the sensitivity we are providing information identified during the planning of the audit. they briefed doug schulman, steve miller, the top people at irs and said this. exempt organizations director lois lerner was informed of criteria that specifically targeted applications using the words tea party, patriots and 912 project. may of 2012. >> just on the timeline, five months before the 2012 election. >> no kidding. we would have liked to know the information. >> and this is the phony scandal. the president is quite demeaning about it. continue. >> president said he didn't know about it. no one in his administration uh knew until spring. irs was briefed in may.

more important ly we have an e-mail from michael phillips to russell george, the inspector general. he says this, you asked for this information for the secretary's meeting on monday. treasury secretary tim geithner. there is a meet ing held on monday, june 4, 2012. very first bullet point. briefing for treasury, greta. says this. applications for tax exempt status. certain organizations were targeted based on the organization's name or political beliefs. right there. we think the treasury secretary himself was in the meeting. we think the idea. uh you knew in june of 2012. don't give us this phony scandal stuff. oh, shazam, we didn't find out

until lois lerner gave her speech and the inspector genre elised the audit. people knew in the spring of last year. >> this is hard to get these documents. we are learning more. were the lawyers involved? >> the irs at the treasury. lawyers knew? >> oh, yeah . general counsel for the irs. >> i would are fer it to the bar. >> great idea. >> the bar will do an investigation. when the bar is all over you, i would rather have the police chase me ethan the bar. >> let's be honest. treasury secretary geithner, secretaries meeting on monday. it is called the secretary's briefing. let 's get tim geithner. >> subpoena geithner. >> i'm with you. >> get him in front of the committee and ask him under oath. did you know about this in june. if you did, why didn't you say something? >> will the speaker go with it.

you don't correct a problem. they used the term sensitivity. >> i would comb his prior testimony to see if he should have answered that the question specifically . under oath to see if it called for that. anyway. thank you. >> thank you, greta. >> it gets worse for the irs if you can believe it. usa today uncovering new documents. targeting groups that used anti-obama rhetoric or emotional statements and one of the groups, the association to reduce the national debt. the founder joins us. good evening, sir. you believe your group was targeted? >> our group -- the name of the group appeared in the list. that's the information we are receiving. that's my understanding, yes . >> what is your group? >> we are the association to reduce the national debt. we are a group of citizens

concerned about our nation and the future and the welfare of the economy for future generations. we wanted to get together. just to let the leaders of the country know we are concerned about the debt situation. we would like them to get action to pay attention to this and correct our financial path. >> is there any sort of indication, any sort of records you have that the irs lawyers, not just employees but the irs lawyers who are aware of the fact that you had been targeted? >> i don't have specific information other than the fact that typically according to the irs website, cases are assigned within six months. my application has been pending over two years. i didn't hear from the irs until the it broke on the news immediate i can't. they haven't really contacted me at all.

>> i applied in june 2011. i haven't heard anything yet. >> it's a cumbersome application to get tax exempt status. i assume it takes hours. >> the process is very long. if i recall correctly the irs's own document, the form anticipates 40 hours to complete the document which we did and tried to be very transparent about what we were doing. clearly it falls under tax exemptions. >> have you ever published anti-obama rhetoric with inflammatory language or used, quote, emotional statements? >> absolutely not. we have been careful to avoid statements toward one side or the other or any other side. >> >> so you think you have been unfairly targeted by the irs?

>> i don't know. in over two years it's unusual. particularly for such a simple application. it's highly suspect, i would say. >> thank you very much for joining us. >> thank you very much. >> coming up, colorado flood waters forcing thousands from their homes. ♪ ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] ultra rugged phones from sprint. buy one, get four free, and $150 credit when you swih your business line to sprint. the pioneers in push-to-talk. trouble hearing on the phone? visit sprintcaptel.com your business line to sprint. i'm bethand i'm michelle. and we own the paper cottage. it's a stationery and gifts store.

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describe it. >> greta, it's -- i hate to disappoint you. this is the quiet est night at the boulder municipal airport in a week. we have quiet winds. it was interesting today. the sheriff announced there is a list of missing that went from hundreds down to four today. we have turned the corner in boulder county. so success fful we are sending some of the helicopters back to bases at fort carson. we are probably going to send the rest home tomorrow. they will be on alert at fort carson but no longer located at the municipal airport. most of the high clearance vehicle s from the national guard. we had 45 here at one time. we are dropping down to six here in boulder. we actually don't anticipate we'll need to use the equipment tomorrow. >> you don't disappoint me.

you did the opposite. the best news i have heard all day. i have been looking at pictures of colorado and i spent time in new orleans for hurricane katrina. i have seen how mean water can be. that's the best news i have heard. we had six people die is the loss of life number. i i'm surprised there weren't more. this is great news. i'm happy to hear it. people ready to go. home, the ones that can go home. >> in boulder county, the west in general , i can't tell you how many are in the shelters now. so many people had relatives and other friends and family. people are being well taken care of. the first responders from the military, we're happy to be here.

we are being told to go home. this is the highest calling we could be doing in the national guard in the military. serving in the homeland taking care of our citizens. >> i have seen it many times and the national guard is terrific. i know what you mean about how it is the highest calling. it's fun. everybody i know who gets a chance the to work and help like that walks away from it saying what a great experience it's been. good news in colorado. it's getting better. thank you very much. thank you to your colleagues out there. thank you, sir. >> i will pass it on. thanks. straight ahead, senator rand paul has a secret weapon. paul has a secret weapon. what is it and will he use it -yeah! go, angie! -wo-hoo! [ sound fades ] at a moment like this, i'm glad i use tampax pearl. [ female announcer ] tampax pearl protects better.

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>> greta: okay everyone it's time to hash it out. new buzz about the 2016 presidential race. senator paul tweeting vogue reveals my secret weapon. snagging a profile piece in the october issue but it's wife, kelly ashby stealing the spotlight, "vok voeg" calling her charming and we asked your thoughts on the interview.

here is what you had to say. tweeting must be a psychopath to sit there with a straight face, could be a great poker player. and not sure what to believe, my family in syria wants him to stay in power. and andy tweeting pinocchio. and no more guns in starbucks guns not welcome in stores but stopped short of wan banning them altogether, taking up ads saying guns are no longer welcome in their cafes saying the chain is not antigun, noting customers carrying a gun will be still served. twitter lighting up with the stance on guns here is what some of you posted. penny tucker tweeting if people don't like it they zront to get coffee there and michael hill tweeting how is unwelcome anything other thn a ban? does this include cops? and

marie tweeting great, now only criminals will have guns and will know just where to go. and this is what we call a great escape. huffington post tweeting if this dog's name isn't hue deany, it should be. the dog's owner set up a camera trying to figure out how the dog kept going out. the video racking up hundreds of thousands of views in one day. that is a clever canine. now, it's your time to hash it out with us. coming up, negotiator or master manipulateor? you want to see it tonight. you will, next. geoff: i'm the kind of guy who doesn't like being sold to. the last thing i want is to feel like someone is giving me a sales pih, especially when it comes to my investments. you want a broker you can trust.

a lot of guys at the other firms seemed more focused on selling than their clients. that's why i stopped working at my old brokerage and became a financial coultant with charles schwab. avo: what kind of financial consultant are you looking for? talk to us today. nice car. sure is. make a deal with me, kid, and you can have the car and everything that goes along with it. [ thunder crashes, tires squeal ] ♪ ♪ so, what do you say? thanks... but i think i got this. ♪ [ male announcer ] the all-new cla. starting at $29,900. help the gulf when we made recover and learn the gulf, bp from what happened so we could be a better, safer energy company. i can tell you - safety is at the heart of everything we do.

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she took an early spring break thanks to her double miles from the capital one venture card. now what was mrs. davis teaching? spelling. that's not a subject, right? i mean, spell check. that's a program. algebra. okay. persons a and b are flying to the bahamas. how fast will they get there? don't you need distance, rate and... no, all it takes is double miles. [ all ] whoa. yeah. [ male announcer ] get away fast with unlimited double miles from the capital one venture card. you're the world's best teacher. this is so unexpected. what's in your wallet? >> greta: she may only be in preschool but the un may want to hire her, take a look how she negotiate was her father

to buy her a toy. >> adella you have 14 or 15 at home. you don't need more my little ponies. >> i do. >> no. you don't. >> yes, i do. >> why? >> because. >> because why? >> because -- . >> what if i told you we're not getting anything today? >> it's -- if we don't get any hoarseys i won't be able to love you anymore. >> you won't love me anyone? >> i'll only be able to love my mom? >> that is it. you're not going to love me anymore because i'm not going buy you any my little ponies? >> yes. only mommy. >> you're only going to love mommy? you're making me sad. >> that is why i only like mommy now. >> greta: that is your last call.

we're closing down shop. thank you for being with us tonight. october 7th, 7:00 p.m. eastern. until then, good night from washington. hello, everyone. she's the head of the yearbook committee. it's 5:00 in new york city, but who's counting? as the blitherring talking head, i have a rule. i worry that a victim's family might be watching with a hate hearing a jerk like me going on and on and on about the villain mainly because for villains the closest thing to being remembered in a world where it's so easy to be forgotten is to do evil, especially had "rolling stone" gives you a cover. let the authorities deal with the demons, and they are. say it's m