vice-presidential candidate paul ryan firing up crowds about reforming government spending programs. but public unions are firing back. not about the medicare plan. but his plan to make government workers kick in more for the retirement so taxpayers pay less. thousands of federal retirees are collecting six figures in their golden years. is the ryan plan the right. this is bulls and bears . bulls and bears this week. we have gary smith. and to bin smith and jonas max

ferris. and sarah flowers. todd, let's get going. ryan pension fix, the right for taxpayers. >> it is. and also the responsible plan. you are looking at 21,000 federal retired receiving a lifetime pension in the six figure range and some are receiving 200,000. what does that mean for taxpayers? >> we are looking at a two trillion dollar short fall. that's what ryan is coming out with. he's doing the right fiscal thing and getting back lash for it. >> the average pension is 35,000 and federal workers already have a pay freeze, is this fair? >> here's how it is not fair. 5.4 percent effective pay cut for average workers, for some of us that may not be a lot. but someone who is making average federal salary less

than 70,000. we are talking about thousands that are not going back in the economy. school supplies not being bought and new computer not bought and money not going in the economy that is bad for us all. >> gary? >> sarah is right f. we are just talking about salaries. unfortunately we are not. we are talking about pensions. pensions for the public sector compared to the private sector are 50 percent more. we now have a new trillion dollars. i forget the exact amount. two trillion of unfunded pension liability in the federal level. clearly the math said asking federal employees to kick in five percent are unfair considering that the pensions are 50 percent higher than the private sector. >> look at that as compared to the compensation. federally employees make less

than skill would people could. and dea agents, fire and police that keep us safe. >> sarah, this is tobi, that is a nice thought and would have applied 10 years ago. but if you look at numbers over the last 36 months. lawyers and judges. judges can make more money. but almost every side is in a higher rate . you have to include salaris and pensions. because of the pension plan is guilded. the idea of matching our income with out come and with our liability is something that we have not had to do. we just borrowed trillions of dollars to plug the hole. that time is coming to anebbed. this is the ultresponsibility which makes me fall over this guy to actually bring this point up. >> smart voice, jonas. >> it is 20,000 federal

workers have 6 figure. that is a small section. they are doctors and make money and high pensions and it is not outlandish. in general there is a lot of pension underfunding in the federal and state and corporate level . taxpayers are on the hook for all of it. all of the pensions across the board including federal need more money. they are not earning enough to make good and taxpayers are there . everyone has to kick in more to shore up the pensions including federal workerings >> actually the private sector is facing the problem as well. and companies have their own solutions for this. >> that's right. they buy out the employee. it is a cheaper component for a businessman to buy out the employees rather than a lifetime amount of money because people are living long yer added health care cost.

federal government on the pension side. we are talking about billions of dollars. 70 million a year that we have to fund to keep the pension money and account up there. 13 billion in added health care costs it is a continued epidemic for the federal government because it expands. we have seen in the last four years continued to borrow and this is what we have to do now. >> everybody is making sacrifices, why not then federal workers? >> because they are simply they are lined out in the ryan plan not fair to the workers and they are not apple and ocs. >> what is not fair? >> when you look at 70 percent of those currently enrolled in the pension plan. old style . pension plan and they don't get social security benefits the way the private sector would. >> it is not clear that social security is going to be around, but go ahead. >> it is not clear.

but listen, i would opt out if i had a chance to opt out of medicare and social security and be in the government plan. i would take the government plan any day of the week. the other part you are missing here i think. we can go out and float a 100 year bond and buy out these guys and we are paying two percent interest rates. i am all for buying that money. that would save two trillion a year as we get to the maturing standpoint. i think ryan was soft pedaling. buy them out >> gary b, go ahead. >> i think it is interesting that the left all along made the arguments that "millionaires and billionaires" should pay their fair share and obama asked for a 4.5 percent of the two percent of the population that is in that. but when it come to the other side of the coin and asking the pensioner and government

employees to kick in theirs. oh, no, no,y no it is not fair. you can't have it that way. >> are they really rich pensioners. >> those on social security, social security is a huge pension fund for everyone else. you reduce in the private sector for whatever reason. you still have social security income and not have that and take a hit on your federal pension is a double hit. that was your only pension. the buy out concept sounds good on paper. you put an offer out to buy the pension it is a lump sum payment. all of the people who smoke and bad health and are going to come forward and take the lump sum. it could cost the government more. >> that is a lot -- come on? >> not the greatest. >> private sector we would love to have these pension. years of getting a gold watch and great pension don't exist. here in the federal government

you can take any job you want and you are guaranteed money. jennifer talk body a pay cut. sarah, i am sorry . putting money back into and they are contributing to their future. just like a self employed businessman putting money in the social security. >> it is not the federal workers fault that the private people lost their pensions. >> that's not the point. talk about millionairings, if you have a million in a bank today and best cd rate you are making $40,000. they are paying 120,000 . that is like three or four million in the money paying you cd's. come othey are actually millionaires. >> thank you, that is the last word. thanks, guys. >> perfect examples of the kind of leadership and experience that you need at a time like this. >> he is a decent guy. >> he looks for way to find common ground.

>> greatest diversity and talent. >> of course, they were talking about neil cavuto and upcoming coverage of the rnc and dnc conventions. kicking off live from tampa on monday. right here on fox news and 8:00 p.m. on fox business. neal covering it like nobody's business. because it is not red or blue to him. it is green. watch it and profit. unemployment in 44 states, rising . now the white house pushing a new infrastructure plan to get americans working. but will it work? so we have ongoing webinars and interactive learning, plus, in-branch seminars at over 500 locations, where our dedicated support teams help you know more so your money can do more. [ rodger ] at scottrade, seven dollar trades are just the start.

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>> and i am jamie colby from america's news headquarters . medicare front and center. and congressman paul ryan hitting critical and republican pick for

vice-president . speaking for villages and guess who is by his side, his mom. and mitt romney is in massachusetts and making stop in new hampshire. the president defending the medicare plan and critizing ryan and romney . at the same time going out to idaho, wildfires are continuing to rage. they are racing closer to the towns ands are asking residents to pack up and go. it could reach the towns in the next 24 or 36 hours. i am jamie colby. keep it right here on the fox news channel. most powerful name in news. >> government reporting. joblessness rate rising in all but six states. president obama is ordering to redistrict half billion in unspent earmarks to repair road and bridges . he said it will get americans

back to work. but gary, will it work? >> brenda, it hasn't worked in the past. let's put it that way . so if the definition of insanity is bla, bla, blaand expecting different results that's what we have here . the associated press which is no friend in reality of the right studied the first 10 months of obama's spending on infrastructure and road highways and found zero gain in local employment. it was verified by independent economist. cbo and department of transportation has study today and congressional research service studied it and all found the same conclusion, brenda, infrastructure spending has no affect on unemployment. it might have a negative affect on employment. to think it is now going to work is silly and a waste of money.

>> sarah, give us an example of how it did work. we had a trillion spent and didn't change unemployment, >> we have seen private sector growth. one side of the equation is not enough to get the whole job done. transportation jobs and build railroad construction are short-term jobs and not jobs that last forever. if you are a guy looking for a job right now, that's a good job. >> tobi, it is a rough thing to support here. i would go with mr. obama who in a casual statement asked about shovel ready jobs. he looked at the camera, shovel ready, i sort of messed up there. we know for a fact we have a 15 trillion economy and 473 million is a tear drop in the ocean of the spending of one day in this government and economy.

unfortunately not being cynical here gary has the facts right it can't and won't and gets absorbed. >> i love it when you wax poetic like that. that is beautiful. >> todd, it seems that the long-term versus short-term. once the money is spent no more jobs. >> i like the idea. look, the private sector is not hire we know about the macro and unemployment issues. and i think it is a great idea. this money was earmarked back in 2003 to 2006. and now implement and yes, it is a short-term temporary job. you have to be doing something private sector is not doing anything. >> jon as, a half billion. >> it is money already pent. you know, it is, look, if you build a road and you borrow the money to do it, you are going to create jobs. it is going to make jobs but

if you have driven by a road project, there are not thousands on the road. there are a few hundred people at best. and it is not large enough. and it is a mile. and the job is. we'll start this three years ago and have to be hundreds of billions of dollars. we didn't do that. that was not the stimulus money we got. that's why we don't want job construction and it is little too late and too maul and that's the bottom line. >> according to the economic school of thought. break a dozen windos tonight . then we would have jobs all over the place. >> we already have broken windows and investing in road and bridges is good for the long-term economy. >> i don't know about that and great for the long-term economy. you have to have jobs. too many people are collecting

unemployment. >> okay. >> you need something. >> that's got to be the last word. that depth clock will tick past $16 trillion. democrats are calling to prevent any talk of the one plan that has it back wards in the presidential debate. neils had the answer in the bottom of the hour. and major u.s. companies issuing two different looks on the u.s. economy. who has it right. we report, you decide . i knew it'd be tough on our retirement savings, especially in this economy. but with three kids, being home more really helped. man: so we went to fidelity. we talked about where we were and what we could do. we changed our plan and did something about our economy. now we know where to go for help if things change again.

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>> a very mixed financial outlook for companies on the front lines of the economy this week. target and home depo and walmart on the optmistic side. john deer and staples and dollar tree out with a negative read. >> last three you mentioned. economy stinks right now. look at earnings growth quarter over quarter only three percent. a year ago 12 percent. companies are not making enough money. >> and sarah, what to tell you about the economy? >> we are not out of the woods yet but thingings are getting better. you look at those companies and you have to think about who is spending dollars in the store. and upper middle class feeling freer to get rid of a home in their house or room in their house and people in the lower part of the economy. they are just not feeling security. >> all right. gary b. there is a different direction than just up and down. >> it is side ways and that is

what you are seeing here. some companies are reporting good and some bad as you know. and that reflects uneasiness. and not pervasive negativism. we can speculate. but we don't know what is going to happen with taxes and health care and what is happening with the election. there is a lot of uncertainty . people are trying to feel their way through and we have relativelily high unemployment and housing prices haven't budged or gone down as sarah would say. there is a lot of muck to wave through and maybe it will be cleared up in november. >> tobi is it clear to you. >> you have tale of three 73s. staples is getting their lunchh eaten by amazon. and innovator like target and home depo doing well because

they are north american facing . and then you have a company like mcdonalds and like deere that sells in europe having problems because europe is having problems. we cant make a global macro statement based on these four companies. >> jon as, is all of this relative really? >> america is doing better than the other countries. >> sure. take that back. >> and market growth in china is not there. it is u.s.. back to our old position. corporate earnings are never been higher. that part of the economy is looking spectacular. the real economy is between bad unemployment figures and good corporate figures it isf i. i don't think the growth is going to be there as well. they are doing fabulously and done it without -- profit picture and not revenue. sales growth is not there.

but they are squeezing out profits and not hiring people and paying more it worked out with l well. >> and at the expense of human capitol. they have a lot of cash and not clearing hiring. >> sarah last word. >> it helps with the earnings but not the over all economy. this is what is happening with the selection. whether or not it is average consumer that goes to the stores. that's what we are seeing in the uncertainty. >> thank you, guys and sarah for joining us. >> thank you. one internet name everyone is running from. someone here said if you run to it. you will see run away profits .a most rare and magical fruit. which provided for their every financial need. and then, in one blinding blink of an eye,

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brenda, i like facebook for the main reason that everyone now seems to hate it. i hated it, too. and i stayed away because

everyone is leaning one way. i think it is time to dip your piggy toes . stock is up 50 percent. >> todd bulls or bear. >> bear at this one. no chance to buy it. >> jonas your predic. >> with the internet stock collapsing it is easy to say it is a internet bubble. it is not true. first index up 25 percent. >> gary b bull or bear. >> bear, trades five shares a day. i don't like it>> todd. recession proof. go out and buy autria. >> jon aswhat you think. >> recession proof but not tax proof. so no. >> tobin. >> game stop is blown up. i like it i think it is up 50 percent. >> i spend so much money. >> todd. >> no, bear. no one