the stock price and it will reflect that daily. jackie: taylor, you have to be in it to win it, right? that is the famous lotto slogan. kevin is proof of life. taylor: taught minimum everything he needs to know about day trading which tells you a lot. get another economic on your money. stocks on track for north day of records. all three indices looking at record highs. i'm looking at individual stocks, we have a few companies coming out after the closing bell. fedex, nike, i will talk about nike as well. two annual years of back-to-back losses. the bar is high, brian that they can turn the company around. they have to come up with new offerings to compete with their competitors. brian: they have to get a lot of people to pay a lot of money. jackie: the shoes are expensive. brian: a guy with great shoes, charles payne is coming up right now. charles: thank you all very much. good afternoon, i'm charles payne. this is "making money." breaking right now we call it

the ultimate one-two punch, jay powell, artificial intelligence has added more fuel to this rally. here is the thing, so many missed this whole big move. everyone is kind of waiting for it to pull back or to stall, by the way including most wall street firms. here is the thing, today will be the 20th record close this year. the record is 77 in 1995, and 70 in 2020. just a reminder that this market can possibly to a lot higher. another reminder folks, there are more than 10 stocks in this market. so many are beginning to sizzle. we'll try to share them with you. meanwhile the national association of realtors finally spoke but the statement was so weak i've got the true state of the housing market. i'm going to tell you the real winners. at least we have a special guest that will from that box settlement. converse lit ipo hype is also back. we'll review this reddit situation with one of the smartest guys in the business but i will also share my cautionary tale and disdain for the great ipo ripoff that lasted

from 2000 to 2021. that is in "my take." all that and so much more on "making money." ♪. charles: so the ipo story jumps back to center stage. the stock of the day, folks, without a doubt, micron computers. this thing right here, the financial results, i mean they absolutely crushed wall street estimates. so $5.8 billion. a year ago it was 3.6 billion. gross margins of 20% a year ago it was negative. operating margins were up. a year ago devastating. earned 42 cents. a year ago they lost $1.49. this is what you call a real turnaround story. this is a real investment of a real company. it is one of the reasons why we'll have the 20th record high close for the year. yet, here's what the irony is. you know that so-called fear and greed index, it is still in greed. we're not even in extreme greed

yet, folks. i'm not big on this thing but it just suggest, underscore the fact maybe, just maybe there is room to go. i will say wall street missed a whole lot of this and they're trying to catch up. one of the things some folks are talking about, they call the risk, wanting to take on greater risk. some are saying this is euphoric. i don't buy it. i think wall street is simply playing catchup. by the way it is about time, right? here's the thing. we have this market. we're rallying, making new highs all the time. again another part everyone is talking about, sort of persistent. you heard the story a million times. it is a red flag, the concentration of the top 10 stocks. now you have to go all the way back to 1930 to see something that matches this. it makes you a little nervous, right, 1929, 1930. still though i continue to point out this rally in this year, 2024 i want you to take a look so far coming into today's session. yeah, communication services without a doubt rocking and

rolling. yes, technology, rocking and rolling. but 8.9%? you got some others, industrials are doing better. energy is doing better. financials are doing better. it is not just two or three sectors anymore, folks. joining me now, satori fund founder, portfolio manager, dan niles. dan, first i want to get your thoughts. the fed is back to being the friend of the market. >> yeah. i mean they have been friendly to the market now, you could argue since 2008. so nothing has really changed but you're absolutely right, they're not going through the fastest rate hike in history. they have been on pause now for a while and we know that it's a matter of when not if they cut-rates based on what jay powell told us yesterday. so, and they're going to cut back on quantitative tightening. definitely the fed has your back if you're an investor in this market. charles: so i'm loving this movement in micron, in part,

full disclosure, my subscribers own it. als great to have the number one stock when your subscribers own it. you know what i'm talking about! you know the a.i. part, first thing they say it is all about a.i. it has turned that company around. listen the semiconductors, they already made this gargantuan move. are there any bargains in that space at all? >> yeah -- charles: you know dan is like the best when it comes to technology but his gear always goes down. we're going to work on dan's gear. the reason i brought up the semiconductors, they have been absolutely on fire as everyone here knows and here's the thing, you know, you halt chasing stocks but by the same token, by the same tech ken you token youe to have exposure. i think you have to have some exposure of course when it comes to these technology stocks. we'll try to get dan fixed. meantime we bring in a different dan, dan flax. you talk about someone in terms

of an analyst on wall street who understands this. dan, i always have to give you props. you have long-term vision. a lot of our guests. me too, i'm a tech, i use fundamentals. then i use technical analysis. then i use a little behavioral analysis. you're more after fundamentals guy. i think that helps with crazy gyrations. i can't tell you how many years stocks we were stopped out of, then 10 days later they were through the roof. you don't have to do that because you look at fundamentals. apple is a stock people are worried about. they have the doj action. other things are happening elsewhere. you're not really focused on that, are you? >> charles, what we're focused on apple the ability to execute on their product cycles. demand in the near term is difficult. china is soft. there have been rumors around the doj lawsuit. we have news out today. if we step back think about how this story will evolve over the next 12 to 24 months, i think

you see better growth driven by product cycles, in iphone, ipad, which had a tough couple years. new product services remains healthy. as we look late this year, and 2025. i think growth continues to improve. most importantly in my view, this is a story about empowering others. the ecosystem is vibrant. charles: the ecosystem is vibrant and the irony of empowering others, that was sort of the part of the theme of this a.i. woodstock thing. by the way, did it live up to the hype this a.i. woodstock? >> it did. what the company demonstrated time and time again with the ability to innovate, with the chips, the software continuing to attract new developers and really broadening their reach. if you think about manufacturing environments as one example you have digital twins. so that helps to really transform say how automobiles are built. think about drug discovery, climate change, fraud detection, a whole, explosion of use cases

that nvidia sits at the heart of. charles: we have here, folks, the so-called "magnificent seven." one of the things they all have in common, they're sitting on a ton of cash. we have dan niles back. i want you and dan flax to share the stage if you don't mind. you talked about the "magnificent seven" being the magnificent four. let's talk a little bit about them, i was talking semiconductors but the frustration for many is where do i go? what if i missed it all where can i find opportunity still at this stage of the game? >> i think if you look at this longer term a.i., you only had chatgpt burst onto the scene in november of 2022. we're 14 or so months into this and if you go back to do the analogy of the internet when netscape came onto the scene at the end of 1994, the first 14 months into that rally from the end of '94 through february, the

nasdaq was up 74%. but to get to the peak it closed up 571%. so you're really not that deep into this because it took the internet bubble five years to reach its peak. not to say that there weren't pullbacks along the way. but i think if you want to participate, you're honest with yourself, ignore the stock prices for a second, look at the fundamentals, nvidia is in rare company of names that have beaten and raised for over a year now. it is only trading at 40 times earnings for 90% revenue growth. so it's actually, believe it or not, despite the fact the stock's up so much over the last year or so, it is still one of the cheapest ways to play the a.i. trend because they're gobbling up market share, whether it is micro pros severs, gpus, networking chips, et cetera, and they're really at the heart of it so that to me is my exposure to the a.i. trade for however long it goes on. charles: right. dan flax, i've got again the

table up here. they're all sitting on a pile of cash so they're not worried about you know, debt walls and maturities, all those sort of things but to dan niles' point, i remember, i think it was 2008, nvidia was on the cover of forbes, the company of the year. it promptly went down 90%. stayed that way for a decade. now they're all really getting their thing going. do you still like all of these names for the most part? >> we continue to own all of these names, charles. it is driven by the innovation, aggressive levels of investment. think about microsoft, google, amazon, they're investing tens of billions a year in capital expenditures and r&d. that is generating new cash flow. not everything is going to work. charles: dan, for you and our audience, ride the waves, periodic times they may fall out of favor a quarter or two, in your mind hold on to them if you're a long-term investor.

>> correct. selectively find the names that offer the most risk or most attractive risk/reward over the next 12 to 24 months. buy those and accumulate them over time. charles: dan, dan niles i want to give you props, there was a name you mentioned on the our show late october, impinge. pi is the stock symbol. here is where you liked it. here it is now. i live when you come on with these sort of ideas, you're moving away from everything else everyone is talking about, one of the things i like to underscore there are a lot of ways to make money in a bull market like this. do you still like this name and are there other thesis you're working on like this? >> we're trying to look at areas outside of the names everybody talks about all the time. impinj they're in the radio frequency identification market you put a chip on anything you ship around the globe. you're only tagging less than 1%

of those items. now you have chip technology come down so much that i think you can hit an inflection point. amazon actually adopted this technology late last year after looking at it probably a decade. and so, i think, you have gone to that level, you go, wow, this is a market that you could see 20% plus revenue growth for arguably the next decade and you're still underpenetrated. impinj is market leader with 45% of the market. by the way, they won a lawsuit, they get the technology license from the other guy who has the other 45% which is nxp. that is massively accretive to eps and nobody ever heard of this company. that is what we're trying to find. it is not the same thing where everybody else owns and you have eps leverage. honestly a lot of "the magnificent seven" you have got several of them where numbers have been going down over the year. you've been lucky because the fed has been on hold.

charles: nxp was one of the rare ipos worked out last year. a name to look into. we have had a snafu. i want to say thank you both to dan flax, dan niles. you're two of the best. we're lucky to have you both kick this show off. thank you very much. >> thank you, charles. >> home building, whole housing market thing is in disarray since last friday. national association of realtors that settlement. everyone has been upset, everyone is confused. we'll really get to the heart of the matter. more importantly though is the american dream simply out of reach no matter who botches it? aim any nixon is one of the best. she will walk us through it all. she is next. ♪. maybe rich is less about reaching a magic number... and more about discovering magic.

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her uncle's unhappy. i'm sensing an underlying issue. it's t-mobile. it started when we tried to get him under a new plan. but they they unexpectedly unraveled their “price lock” guarantee. which has made him, a bit... unruly. you called yourself the “un-carrier”. you sing about “price lock” on those commercials. “the price lock, the price lock...” so, if you could change the price, change the name! it's not a lock, i know a lock. so how can we undo the damage? we could all unsubscribe and switch to xfinity. their connection is unreal. and we could all un-experience this whole session. okay, that's uncalled for. charles: so almost a week ago, right, the national association of realtors offered to settle a couple of major lawsuits, then the firestorm broke out. it has burned hot ever since. finally the nar posted something about correcting the record, that they do not set commissions. believe me agents have driven that part home. i still think they have a lot further to go. on another note, however, major development this morning, so

redfin announced they have expanded pay for their agents with splits as i high as 70%. they will cover almost all your business expenses. that is what it comes down to. the brokers will have to fork over more money. overall confusion and frustration continue to reign. there is no prompts other people are talking about except my next guest is flagging. dw housing economic analyst aim any nixon. amy, initial thoughts just how poorly the national association of realtors managed this whole thing? >> it's been a mess, charles. this has been going on for months and months and this is not a good look for the industry and it is not good for realtors because essentially real estate agents are the ones who will get hurt by this and to me the biggest implication of this judgment is it is moving us forward towards what i have always considered to be the amazonification of u.s. residential housing.

we'll make transaction costs lower. but what that does make it easier for people to buy at scale. and guess who buys at scale? not families. investors and institutions. charles: right. right. of course they have already roiled the market and skewed it so many ways it is already a shame. i just, most agents who contacted me, listen, nar, they should not have settled number one. number two they should have been more articulate what happened, so the public doesn't think the agent, that the organization sets commission but more importantly the agents, you know work. they just don't sit around waiting for someone to click a button on the internet and call them up, they get paid for it. they put in serious, serious work about all of this. i just think it is heartbreaking that maybe more of these broker firms will be more like redfin because i see that as maybe the only way to make it through this? >> i think so. this hurts the smaller agent,

individual agent. remember like i said earlier, the human element is being damaged here because agents help families. families want an agent to walk them through a home personally, tell them about the neighborhood. when you move to virtual, online touring, it is something that favors investor buying and it hurts family individual buying and it hurts smaller agents. you will see a lot of agents leave the industry and look for other work. i don't like to see that. i don't like to see anything that advantages tech and you know, a movement towards something that is going to facilitate more institutional buying. >> hopefully the, the ones who put in the work, who have been doing this a long time will stick with it, and i hope they find a way to make even more money because i think they haven underappreciated. let's talk about millenials. you and i talk about it all the time. i saw a posting for a house in miami, bought for 125,000 in miami in 1996, sell for

1.4 million. i see millenials why should i play the fame. grandma, grandpa bought the house for nothing and i can't even afford isn't. >> it is true. a lot of millennials opting out. people are arguing why we're seeing highs in markets because instead of saving a down payment, millenials are putting money into crypto or equity, thinking they will just yolo would have been a down payment. they see housing is out of reach. really it is in the sense in 1958, cost three times the median income to buy the median home. today it costs six times the median income to buy the median home. that is projected to be eight times by 2050 if nothing changes. charles: you can argue it underscores maybe this is a great investment. on the other part there is a lot more work than high mortgages, right? we're in a frustrating time. i'm glad you could come on to help us. amy, thank you very much.

>> thank you. charles: check this out, he went from cautious powell, to exuberant powell all in a matter of weeks. the market is loving it. of course what will happen to main street? we'll dive into that for you next. ♪. he hits his mark —center stage—and is crushed by a baby grand piano. you're replacing me? customize and save with liberty bibberty. he doesn't even have a mustache. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ as an independent financial advisor, i stand by these promises. as a fiduciary, i promise to be the financial steward

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♪. ♪ living on a prayer ♪ charles: take my hand, we'll make it i swear. all right, move over, bon jovi, jay powell and company are living on a prayer. kelly o'grady has all the information. >> reporter: i'm actually you were singing, i was calling you out you were during that commercial break. we all got to hear. powell was on a single mission quell wall street angst. clearly working for now. while it was not a victory lap, the fed laid out adjustments to the forecast have somewhat immaculate feel when you look at december projections. strong gdp, particularly in 2024 but across the board. you have lower unemployment rate, higher core inflation expected through the remainder of 2024 that would potentially make the argument for slower rate cuts, right but what they did remain unchanged is still

those three rate cuts planned through this year, though a slightly less aggressive drop-off over the next two years. what is compelling that the fomc statement noted that job gains remained strong yet powell kept bringing up the possibility of unexpected events or deterioration in the labor force as a impetus to cut-rates sooner. i want to zero in on this unemployment rate, right? this is the december projection. it was revised down to 4.0. remember we're at 3.9% right now so if we were to see that same change in march as we saw in february that was down two basis point, that could make the case that the fed is ready to pounce. wall street of course loving this. meanwhile it's official that after 23 negative monthly prints the leading economic index has come in positive. finally just barely see it there, right? i will note that the u.s. economy lapsed into recession every other time.

it is these graybars here. it actually went down. so although the street has clearly already called off the recession, this data point has an amazing track record. now this development does help those calling for rate cuts and meanwhile harness pointed to this chart, okay? he points to this chart to show powell is no paul volcker. in previous rate hike cycles you can see them all here, okay, the trend is that rates are two to three times higher than cpi trend inflation but powell, look at this, as only gone to 1.5 times. so charles, they call alan greenspan the maestro. if powell can pull this off he can pick out his own name in my book. charles: he will have a whole bunch of nicknames he can -- that is if he pulls it off. we don't want to being too premature. kelly great stuff. let's bring in joseph wang. joseph, we went from pivot

powell in october, cautious powell, march 6th. now we have ex-exuberant powell. how surprised are you with the amount of confidence the fed chair exuded yesterday? >> i am surprised. as kelly mentioned it looks like immaculate soft landing. gdp revised up, inflation not really changed and unemployment revised even more benign so he is very much betting everything on a soft landing and definitely not any paul volcker. i thought the conference was as we all know over the past two months inflation has been surprising to the upside. when asked about that chair powell was basically, yeah, january, that's just seasonal stuff. charles: yeah. >> february, you know, that is actually not so bad you know. so he seems to be downplaying and looking through what looks like inflation stablizing at 3 and 4%. and not just that so, we have financial conditions which i think everyone thinks are quite loose. look at equity markets going to

the moon. looks like dog with hat a meme coin will show up on the las vegas sphere. clearly a lot of speculation in the markets. when asked about that, actually i think financial conditions are restrictive. i don't know when he is looking at but not what anyone else is looking at. charles: i was asking you, which set? goldman has financial conditions. citi has one widely used. maybe he has ising you and i don't know b the idea they're confident on inflation being a bump in the road really is amazing. i have to be honest with you, every time they say january was cold i lose my mind. most of the time january is cold. more than one fed official though, this i'm reading from your notes, you're saying more than one fed official that the economy is less interest rate sensitive and that could be the big mistake? >> yeah, yeah definitely. i think that what's happening the economy is obviously less interest rate sensitive than we thought. ask us a couple years ago, can

the economy with stand 5% interest rates. everyone would tell yous we would go into terrible depression and market would tank. fast forward today, fed funds five 1/2 looks like it is not doing as much damage. we've all come to realize that but the fed is slow to realize that. the i will add one more thing, charles, fed chair powell began yesterday to talk about the qt taper. even as financial conditions are already loose he is telling you probably at the next meeting they're going to be tapering qt. that is another dovish, dovish. when we see in the markets is a direct result i think of an exuberant powell as you so aptly put it. charles: he was a lot more patient on the inflation side. i don't know how much is human emotion, how much is miscalculation, how much is the election. but certainly accommodative powell. we'll give i am that nickname now. again if he pulls off the immaculate landing here he can pick out any name he wants.

joe, we'll talk to you soon. appreciate you. my next guest also thinks that the fed has a new goal, right, really 2% inflation, they're ignoring it right? i want to bring in the director of tjm institutional, jim iurio. jim, what is the defacto inflation target now? >> i think it's in the high twos. yesterday when he came out and said he expects pce to be higher but you're going to eases whether you like them or not, i think i'm paraphrasing it a little bit the market took it for what it is. it is a signal to buy stuff. i love things like bitcoin, gold, real estate, things that were no confidence vote in stewardship of fiat currency which i think those things still hold but other things somewhat tangential to that, like copper. i love them now. charles: when people say things like the market loves lower rates, that is sort of an oversimplification. why is that? >> the market loves lower rates when the economic condition

seems to warrant higher rates. think of it this way, burning timbers come falling to the ceilings we'll lower rates to zero as we always have in the past. not saying it will happen for sure, if it does, real estate, commercial, bank related. the economic condition is awful at the same time. i think markets love rates they think are kind of stupidly low like a little lower than they should be. the fact that we're now redefining inflation, what our targets are, i know he didn't explicitly say that, the market thinking 2.8, 2.9% is more likely of a goal, the market is saying that is dumb. that is when people get out of dollars into stuff and that's what they're doing. >> mentioned copper a minute ago, copper making this amazing stealth breakout. the materials sector on the s&p is looking absolutely phenomenal. what are, what are the i am implications? we know dr. copper is suppose to be one of those things, something you can't buy and trade, but it is a smart metal,

tells us more about the global economy, our economy what the implications of that breakout. >> that chart you had up i love, shows 2023 and 2024 despite pricing in precipitous decline in the chinese economic condition. despite evs went from real popular, not as popular after the cold winter, yet copper hung in. it is busting out to the upside. technically that to me looks extremely constructive. i think copper is my big trade. china we may have overestimated how bad things were in china hopefully. the fact that electrification is real thing, still will be moving forward. i think copper is a big deal. charles: ironically you say that, those cafe standards that came out of the white house this week, really i don't think people understand the implications. essentially they will make drive aghast car, selling them illegal at some point. before i let you go. you also alluded to the government, the credibility, we

talked about this so many times. we think about jay powell promising to be volcker 2.0. i have to be honest he feels more like burns. the reason burns is burns he blamed congress, he cannot do the right thing because congress kept browbeating him. do you think there is some sort of pressure? we heard from elizabeth warren, bernie sanders and maybe pressure from the white house on jay powell as well? >> we say on the podcast all the time, everybody has a plan until they get punched in the space. particularly fed chairman, they see any sort of stress they jump. a year ago in ma when svb headline came out, all of sudden opened up the bank lending program. that told the market they're quick to react in response to anything that is relatively negative. he is not paul volcker. paul volcker was willing to with stand it. people are saying how well jay powell is threing the

needle. by a six month time period he missed the whole transitory thing when inflation was obviously not transitory. he got us to where we are right now. not ready to pat him on the back. he has a tough job particularly with the way federal government spending way it is counteracting his fighting inflation. i'm not ready to give him any sort of ribbon, are you? charles: i'm not, i'm not. the stage is set. we'll see what happens. i'm having a hard time believing any of it to be honest with you, jim. >> amen. charles: thanks so much, my man, talk to you soon. folks we have a guest coming up who will tell you where to put your money over the intermediate to longer term, right? you want to be careful of these crazy swings. alli mccartney has been on the show so many times. she is one of best in the business. grab a pen and paper. be ready to be in position right after this. ♪.

it's odd how in an instant things can transform. slipping out of balance into freefall. (the stock market is now down 23%). this is happening people. where there are so few certainties... (laughing) look around you. you deserve to know. as we navigate a future unknown.

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weren't alone, right? let's be honest most wall street firms missed out on this big time. my next guest implored you every time she was on the show, stay in this market, have a strategy as most folks on the street were looking for an off-ramp. ubs private wealth managing director alley mccartney. first of all congratulations. it is not all necessarily about being in the big high-flyers but being in the market. the reason i bring this up, one large firm, ed yardeni is at 5400. your institutional research is at 5400. >> yeah. charles: your firm, ubs went to 5200. when i look at this none of these firms can have real good conviction about this market if your broker doesn't have conviction you may not be based properly to be positioned in this market? >> that's right. wall street institutions tend to have a bias to go higher and stay in but the truth is if you're an individual investor you can be trading in and out of

individual names from a market timing perspective but you should also have as much time in the market because if you think about it, s&p goes up, goes up about 9% a year. you are going to have some blips. but you want to be in markets for the long haul. charles: i have to be honest with you, i watch financial tv, doesn't a day goes by some says get out, or trim. some trim while during the commercial break. during the commercial we sell everything. a lot of people get caught up in the flew ounces. pick the top, sell it, go down i buy it back. i just worry about it. why i cherish you as a guest. let's talk about your rate gameplan. >> they will cut rates. charles: this is what people should be looking at the in terms of the gameplan. manage liquidity, what does that mean? >> that means if you have gotten lulled into staying in cash because you're getting 5.25, 5 1/2%, sometimes tax advantages if you're in treasurys what we got yesterday confirmation we'll not be there for long. and so every time the rate comes

down and you stay there, other people will be sending markets higher, either in bond prices or in equity prices and you're going to miss that and your opportunity costs is going to be whatever the fed funds rate is. charles: attractive bond yields what does this mean? i know like, you know, the, you can buy very short-term, you know, notes and get almost the same kind of yield as a long-term bond. do you want to stick with the shorter term stuff right now? >> so for a long time because of just low rate environment and concern about the interest rate environment, inflation, people stayed really, really short. and that felt okay again because where the yields were, however going forward, if you stay short you're lacking in five 1/2, for let's say three months. if you go three, four, five, seven years, you're locking in somewhere between 3 1/2 and 7% depending whether you're in munis or high yield for seven years. charles: right. >> so let's think before that if we have a target rate of 3 1/2

at the end of the year and 2 1/2 the next year. charles: most prefer u.s. sectors. technology, we talk about that over and over again. i want to talk to you about industrials. because they're making one of those stealth moves here. >> yeah. charles: what do you like about this? what is so interesting here? >> a couple things going on here. we have above average, normalizing but above average growth. that is supporting industrials. we have a cycle in terms of filling warehouses with materials where we need to have more, just look at housing and not less. in addition if you look at the industrial play, think of everything that happened in the world from a geopolitical standpoint or from a restoring and industrialization. even look at the ira out of washington. charles: right. >> we have a lot of money going into things like building infrastructure, defense and industrials is also, covers all the sectors in the s&p. it has really the widest breadth in terms of what it covers from a gdp perspective. charles: i have got 30 seconds. the russell, the small caps, the

beleagured small caps are coming on like gangbusters, making a major technical breakout here. you like small caps. >> we do. we were little early, rather than being late. you have a lot of sensitivity to floating rate interest rates. as interest rate goes down their cost of debt will free up. you don't want to be everything in small caps. all small caps are not created equal. you want to be the small caps that will be the mid-caps, large caps of tomorrow. charles: thank you so much, alli. reddit has gone public. i want to stack talk where is stacks up with others. tom is with us. he is one of the smartest guys in the week. we'll talk about some of this and some of the red flags he is seeing in this market next. ♪.

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charles: when i started in the business, ipos, initial public offering, were amazing, absolutely amazing. and, of course, they just got hotter and hotter until, well, they dried out the last couple of years. don't forget, 2020, 2021, mind-boggling surges. there were several factors including the fact that the public has been getting ripped off royalty by overhyped and overpriced offerings. and, listen, don't even get me started on these spacs. today we have reddit and another stock that have begun trading, they're both sizzling. i want the bring in tom zaslav. i know you had a chance to get a piece of the action, some reddit right around the $5 billion valuation. talk to us about what your thoughts are about this company. we know it's not, it's not -- they're not making money yet. we know it's worth a lot less than rivals like facebook and snap and twitter were at the same time when they went public, and knotts a young company

eitherment -- it's not a young company. but what do you think in terms of people that are thinking about buying it right now? >> i mean, i can't say at $46 or $47 where it's trading right now that, i don't know, i don't know if it's cheap oring expensive, but i can say that i do like reddit. obviously; i wouldn't have gotten involved in it if i didn't like it. it's one of those companies that's been around a long time. it is kind of a very interesting retail play for people that like social media companies, that like social media investments. and so i think it'll be, you know, generally speaking, something in a pure play in the 30, 40 or $50 range. seems like at least it's available to everybody. so from my perspective, i mean, reddit is a very interesting, it's kind of a cool company. i like it. i like the fact that it's not all just short form videos. so from that perspective, charles, i like it. charles: when you're looking at these names in general, because this is one, reddit, i think, has a special place that a lot of people interact with, people

know it, they use it. >> yeah. charles: a lot of companies like this other a.i. company that went public today, i don't know it. you've got to read the s1. an investor doesn't know a company, are there any kind of rules or tidbits that you would suggest before saying, hey, i'm going to buy this on the first day of trading knowing morn like it's going to trade -- more than likely it's going to trade pretty high the first day. >> i, i mean, the general rule of thumb and i've been on the retail and trading side for many decades now, the general rule of thumb is i wouldn't touch a stock that i didn't know on the first day. i would want to see, you know, like, what kind of volume it generates. you have to discount the first day because that's not really fair. charles: right. >> the first couple of days, i would just kind of step a aside. before i traded something that i didn't know, i would wait a couple of days, hopefully wait until the songses -- options open, and i would see what kind of volume it generates in the second and third week x. then if you're interested, get involved. charles: yeah. i mean, listen, i always tell people facebook, which to me at the time was the epitome of

greed because they kept raising the price, making the offer a wider, they sucked every nickel that they could out of the general public for the ipo, and it took a year for it to break even. of course, if you bought it back then, you'd be happy. let's talk more broad market. you see several red flags right now, right? >> i mean, i think anytime you get to record highs, i think everybody that's, every trader, every active participant, when you get up to record highs, you know, you have to start getting a little bit nervous, right? that's where i am. i'm pretty nervous with all the complacency that's out there. we're a little too bullish, you know, as a group. there's not too many bears around. i heard you say it before, there's not too many people selling anything. and the whole buy low, sell high thing somehow goes with out the window with, you know, bull markets. charles: yeah, it certainly does. i know you're an opportunist, you're look at a buying things that really aren't in favor right now. >> yeah.

i'm a contrarian, so i like things that have been beaten up. today's a weird day. a lot of the markets are making new highs today, but apple's down almost $8, so that becomes interesting to me. some of the chinese if stocks have, are on their butts and kind of trading really near their multiyear lows. that's interesting to me. and then there's a few stocks that have had bad earnings like this morning, i chewy. that's kind of interesting to me. if you're looking for long place. i like things that are beaten up, things that are, you know, pretty much down on their luck. charles: tom, it's great having you on. poem should know you're a pioneer of education in this industry. a lot of people look up to you, including myself. keep up the great work. finish. >> thanks, charles. charles: i want to talk about this ipo stuff, i'm not a royal watcher, but this story about the fakes, video of kate middleton, right, and this growing conspiracy is really kind of -- let's face it, as a

a. a.i. gets bigger orer, faster, more accessible to everyone, you know, all of us are going to have to -- it's going to lee a whole wake of disaster -- leave a whole wake of dallas, heartbreak, madness. the reason i bring this up is because many people say we're living that that world already, that it's fake, that it's rigged. well, the stock market is real but, yes, it is rigged. as a someone that has spent close to 40 years advocating for everyone to invest in the stock market, i know this all too well. but then again, folks, people who invest in the market, they believe it's rigged more than other americans. 55% of investors say, yeah, this thing is rigged. 47% of all a americans think so. it's real, of course, though in the sense it's unforgiving, unfair, and these ipos are a prime example. they have become sort of an exit plan, the ultimate exit plan for the wealthiest people on the planet, those silicon valley people who nurture these names

from $1 million valuations to $70 billion even though they might be worth $10 billion. the problem is they go public to an unsuspecting public at outstanding valuations. this year a lot of companies are going to go public, and the a.i. angle won't even be part of the real business model. you must learn how to play a rigged game. facebook, they raised the piece price three times. they took the number up, they took everything. it crashed bigtime. it took a year to get all the way back. but if you bought it, you are really happy that you did. so you just heard what tom said. i would just add to that in this environment you want to make sure that you wait. and i mean, wait a very, very long time in my mind for some of these names. do not chase them. it is rigged. but you can make real money with it, and that's what we're in this for. right, liz claman? liz: rigged. it's all rigged! [laughter] charles, thank you very much. charles: see you later e. liz: you