in the 90s, the minister of economy, it was absolutely unclear why we needed him, and now i have the impression that we will soon not need a minister of foreign affairs, because we have allies, they support us, and in any case this is not some kind of diplomatic achievement, it is simply their reaction to the aggressive actions of russia, and russia does not want to go to any diplomatic solutions, well, what should diplomats do, you know, i agree with you, no matter how unfortunate it sounds to me, for all my career, just need to put close on i often say this at student meetings. for example, who are going to become diplomats, that the profession is not only dying, it is already dead, in particular because the leaders communicate with each other, but also the decisions that are made, they do not need these negotiators, which we were from the very beginning and remained there for, i don’t know, 16, some 15 centuries, when the profession was more or less formed, and indeed from the moment of the negotiations, well, let’s say, minsk ended, this era of minsks, when they ended, and more and... and to be honest, in one of the interviews i

already said that, in principle, the biggest problem was the mistake of the democrats of ukrainian diplomacy in the fact that we could not avert the war, but if diplomacy somehow did something so creative, minsk, post-minsk , it does not matter what the negotiations are called, then i would say, yes, diplomacy has a right to exist in this conflict and it plays a role, once the conflict has started, all diplomacy can do is try to concentrate, coordinate the assistance that is ... well, for that you don't really have to be diplomat, well, ukrainian diplomacy tried to avert the war with the help of negotiations, consultations, this was the main line of president zelensky, by the way, he wanted to restore the normandy format, talk with russia, hold these huge number of consultations in the contact group, all this was continued, and that, vitaly, i had the honor of being a minister, then i remember perfectly these negotiations, which actually led to a meeting in paris, we, to be honest, expected this meeting much earlier than immediately. after admission

president zelenskyi, so that we know that this is a long process, and he needs a lot of time so that after the first meeting, getting acquainted, as it usually happens, the process would move somewhere, well, in fact, you see that this was actually the last meeting of the presidents , and it was obvious that at this meeting putin finally settled in the opinion that he will not achieve the solution he wants, he needs to use other tools, the other tool was war, and if we talk about the extent to which it was possible to avert the war, then with from the point of view of delaying the situation there, we had some opportunities, you remember, the russians all the time pretended to want to negotiate there, put forward some conditions of nato and the european union, sent some documents, what were we to do in such a situation? we had it at the first stage, which is no less, while i was involved in this process, we had an idea, according to which we saw the progress of the post. minsk, one of

the problems of minsk, which was, if you remember, the following phrase began: there are no alternatives to minsk, it was very threatening, because we got stuck in this minsk and could not see a way out of it. the problem with minsk was that, being planned for only one year, it survived not only this year, but even its original authors, merkel, poroshenko and hollande, and remained, in fact, the only one who remembered what it was for crashed, it's not funny. putin, one of the problems was that after leaving minsk, we did not get the same alternative. the alternative was supposed to be forms, and if you remember, there were ideas of all kinds of advisory councils, new road maps and so on further and so on. i believed that it is dangerous to go this way, because if putin does not understand that we continue to delay and there is no legal basis for this, he will simply break these agreements as he did and attacked, finding some case of beli there, finding. some explanation for why he

is doing this, but these so-called agreements in istanbul, it was a continuation of minsk from the russian side, they also wanted to create some kind of trouble, there is such an idea that it is possible, you know, to break off negotiations with, for example, russia and start with a new sheet and write istanbul ones, i even sometimes hear in the comments slip that there will be no such unfortunate minsk presidents, we will never sign and so on and so forth, the problem is not with the ukrainian president. and in the same way, if someone thinks that he can come to istanbul, sit down, take a piece of paper, say, well, everything that was postponed, yes, something happened, you have to think, then i will reassess, but let's write from the very beginning, and so point one, the war ends, point two and so on and so on, no, because the russian federation obviously remembers all these agreements, everything is sewn up, everything is numbered with them, and when they arrive, they declare, you, relatively speaking, fooled us all this time, it doesn't matter, even fooled, not fooled, this is their position, and then we all we will be equal... on those points, the most painful of

them, and now they have become much more, if we could not think about the fact at first, and they could not insert it, that something threatens ukrainian sovereignty and territorial integrity. the minsk agreements were not about this at all, and the istanbul agreements were actually already about it it. and tell me, if you're talking about diplomacy, to what extent can we work with our western allies to maintain this level of support and empathy? again, it depends on diplomacy or on the course of military operations. because now they say that the speaker of the house of representatives of the american congress, he realized that it is necessary to help ukraine when he was told that in april the ukrainian army will have no weapons at all, and this will all lead to... but this is not diplomacy, it's just setting before the fact disasters 2.5 years ago , almost before the war began, the talks in britain, for example, when i held them there, were so much along the lines that we will help you, as we helped you, but you understand, our soldiers will never

fight, and this is a red li and so on and so on and so on, to which i always answered my colleagues in conversation that your political system is so liberal-democratic that between the first frame... like ukrainian children the dead lie along the roads, sorry for being so harsh comparison, and by the time you make a decision that you will help ukraine by sending everything, you won't even have time to wrap your head around it, so your voter, your press is free bbc, starting, ending with everyone, you will just be forced into a circle for this, you just have no way out , that's why this conversation took place behind closed doors, let's not bring it to this point, let's immediately determine what you are ready to do, what you are ready to do in the event of an obvious escalation that leads to... war, by the way, you named the main motive, that western public opinion, american, european, canadian, australian, whatever, absolutely, is just an example of bhutan, it explodes just when it sees women and children being shot, and forces politicians to act, and if our army holds

its ground and nobody lets go on, then the curiosity of public opinion decreases, politicians sigh freely and start discussions for six months, they could have been for six months precisely because nothing like this happened, imagine what could happen if you and i successfully counterattacked and were forced to shoot even in some of our former places, where our troops are located, but were pushed out, and there could be, we would turn with you from good guys, to bad guys, like israel, in fact the same thing that happened in israel, we in this topic talk, talked with britain, the british noticed immediately and due to the fact that, to be honest, they fought... all their lives around the world and accumulated a lot of history, this conversation was held, well, there is some kind of understanding, how to counteract such trends , i have the impression that the israelis were not fully prepared for this ready, strangely enough, although it has already happened several times, i don't know if one can be ready for this at all, if you start from the fact that the position of support, it generally feeds

on the grief and misfortune that needs to be helped, take for example this the program that accepted ukrainian refugees in britain, unlike... in fact all other governments , the british decided that the citizens themselves would take on the biggest, biggest burden of responsibility, they pay 200-300 pounds there, actually for electricity and water, i.e. people are not paid for it, people give it themselves, and britain understands that the rise of ukraine, which in relation to ukraine will allow to calculate who has an extra apartment, i remember that the ratio of people who were ready to offer and those to whom the government allowed to take ukrainian refugees was 1 to 25, 25 times more british wanted to take, but the government. you don't really appreciate it, you can't afford it, there's no such support now even in britain, not to mention many other countries, but maybe it depends support from some kind of personal interest of the leader, we see there that president macron began to show personal interest, and in france the discussion

about ukraine began much more lively than a few months ago, and on the other hand in britain there was prime minister johnson, he was obviously those who are interested in using the ukrainian case, at least for their own self-preservation, to speak seriously, speak cynically. well, prime minister sonak has other problems, no ukraine will help him, he needs it to prepare for the elections, and that is why there may not be such an obvious, you know, price list, if we go to the end, then these conversations about the fact that berri johnson used us or another leader, i always answered that you know how many ukrainians are interested in this idea , is zero, because as long as it or other reasons help us get what we need, it doesn't matter to us, i agree with you. that there is a human role, but there is another interesting factor, which in principle contradicts the first one, what we discussed with you, very often countries want to see that they're investing in somebody who 's getting wins, so basically we 're helping, we understand that we're going to be helping for a long time, it's definitely going to hurt, but look, we're investing in the right

guys, they're attacking, they're attacking, they're countering, these are brave soldiers, and not just an obvious one, where the war is going, we just give up, well, just out of pity, no, no, this fact that you are helped, as the americans say, that if you... want to sit down at the negotiating table, we will help you negotiate, if you want to fight, we will help you fight, depends on what you want to do, well , this is not putin's order, because he believes that he will prolong the war. stand your ground and eventually the west will lose patience, maybe he miscalculates, maybe he is right, but we believe that he will miscalculate, i remember a conversation with the british prime minister, when he said that our economy is twice the size russian, and in the end, if it directly concerned us, even we could break them even in the fire of weapons, i am not talking about the fact that this the strategic depth that the allies, including the united states, have built for us is incommensurable with the opportunities that are available in... russia, it is obvious that russia is currently accumulating weapons, a large mobilization resource, we

are all aware of this, but ukraine would not have a chance, if we had no allies. now we are discussing the method of exiting the war, we are not talking about how you and i will surrender and capitulate at the lowest cost, because we have allies for and not the fact that putin will survive them all. you don't think there is the problem with this understanding of the very term victory, because for us victory is a zero-sum result, by the way, for the russians it is also for. by and large, we have to win as we see it, and for the west , victory is successful negotiations, and here we are , the west has been telling us from day one that we want you to sit at the negotiating table with a strong position, i'm actually surprised that you violate it, considering how unelectrified our information space is, how divided we are and this idea that the year 91 is our goal, and we we leave, then the voices are like this, if you listen, you understand that our allies may not want us to be allies with you. and we have a sociology of the ukrainian position, it is like this, the year 91, then we need to understand at what

point this help from the allies will decrease on the way to reaching the border in the year 91, and if you and i are ready to fight even with shovels and on we are saying this, as the israelis once said, it doesn't matter if you are with us or without us, we will fight, and the americans said, well, okay, fine, we will you and i, too, although we asked not to do this, if we manage to convey this to them and show the way to victory... well, if we determine that our victory is a state better than before the start of the war, it is normal, but it is just such a diplomatic trick that will allow us to see what we could realistically achieve. and i can tell you until what moment, perhaps, the allies will be with us, until the moment when the signal comes from the kremlin that yes, we are ready for real negotiations, until the end of the war, at least until the armistice, then we are ready to sit down to talk about it, i'm afraid that this is the biggest trap that can drive us into, if russia... says that we propose a truce, or let's say, a ceasefire. we are becoming

an aggressor with you, because maybe not for the americans with the canadians, the british, but for the so-called south of the global side clock, listen, russia proposed, well, they stopped the troops, what for what we helped ukraine so that ukrainian boys and girls did not die, then our position would be very weak and diplomatic. in the sense that we it is necessary to disperse the allies once again, to say that listen, we have stopped, but they will come again, but they will come again someday, it is not so sure, as now the battle, which is taking place directly, i cannot understand at all , why russia won't try during the minsk agreements, there were at least 26 or 28 of these fires, that is, you can't now, before you always understood why they, i always, every time worried that if they pull a little more, all help is included with german... in french, who stood behind us, will say: well, we have done everything, there are so many problems all over the world, we left, and you

are staying, we can find this point, when they had a therapist, that is why you were already working in the ministry of foreign affairs at that time, all of you do you remember this, this is the conditional year of 2014, the state is weak, there is no legitimate president, it is divided, you can take it with your bare hands, and they have never changed this point of view, they only stopped, or strengthened, stopped, but they all this paradigm has existed for 10 years. thank god, one of the reasons why we are with we survive - this is because we often overestimate the russians, they are not so deeply intellectual, organized, if they were better organized and more intellectual, we would have a really difficult time. well, here is the question, yes, here we are, how we use this situation, that is, to what extent we can achieve real security guarantees, not neutrality, because the exchange of peace for neutrality is the exchange of peace for the end. of the world, if it can be so, well, belgium violated its neutrality three times only during the second world war by the germans, and hussein

declared neutrality right before operation desert storm, that is , the result shows that it does nothing, and we need to tell the ukrainians about this, because there is some belief that let's give up nato, and then the russians will finally leave us and everything will be fine. the problem is, yes, we want nato, and they are offended by that. some people still believe, without understanding, that finland increased the border with nato by 1,000 km, and we did not even join... that is, fight, you know, i always i was joking, i said that the russians are not ready, so fight with nato, why are you fighting with us, well, you are afraid of nato, well, what did you know, well , i will remember on your border, as much as you like, but prevention. coronavirus? like that, yes. by the way, now, when prime minister sunak was in poland, just during the press conference with prime minister tusk, there was a conversation that, thank you for coming, you brought with you what your planes will patrol our space, polish, because we have such a difficult situation on our border, we have russia

with belarus, and the british prime minister: yes, yes, yes, i came specifically for the typhoons next year. will be to patrol, that it is very important to protect your space, and the ukrainians are important, well, at this moment , it’s a problem for them, for the poles, this is the country that actually currently has the largest percentage of gdp, the size of the military budget, more than united states, 3.9%. well, the poles may think that if there is some disaster in the russo-ukrainian war, they can at least get a hybrid war on the part of russia and belarus, what happened last time, as they call it in... you remember them, it's immigration immigration, hybrid war brought to its peak, when it was actually armed, and for this even the british sent their engineering corps, to help the poles build a barrier on the border, this is already serious, but after all, here is a security guarantee, they can be provided, we saw the previous nato summit,

which ended without the results that the ukrainian delegation was hoping for, and we saw that president zelenskyi was for in large numbers even in the countryside. wrote this famous post that showed him, i would say frustration with what he saw there, uh, and now there's going to be a washington nato summit, and also, i don't think there's going to be any frustration because there's not much expectation, i think that what happened last time was an incorrect overestimation of what a specific organization is capable of, we do not understand in ukraine that nato is as strong as it is strong, relatively speaking, it is precisely their weak link. and the weak link itself is a solution, which are all adopted unanimously, and any country, i don't know, albania, hungary, slovakia can interfere in the decision-making process, there are all sorts of clever steps that allow, but from the very beginning we talked about the fact that those people who - does anyone in nato understand that it is necessary to look for a coalition of the willing, just as

piracy was formed, on which nato did not have a common opinion, if we had worked from the very beginning to assemble a coalition around us... of the willing, and not to break through our accession to nato, which is evident at this historical stage, to say the least, complicated, it seems to me, as of today, this coalition would look much better, here is the trip, the same sunka is back in britain and a meeting there in poland with the secretary general of nato, with tusk and not a reverse whore with the germans, that's just right the first signs of building around a center like britain a coalition willing to help us. to put it mildly, to go to the end, well, that means that there will be several coalitions in the seventh bloc, those who will say that it is necessary to go to the end and you, who will say that you must be careful, we do not want, welcome, you remember, there were also cases of operations in the east, which nato, to be honest, is not nato, these are countries that belong to the nato bloc, but they acted in their national form together with

a coalition of people like them, they could belong to things, for example, the operation in libya, if you remember, joined there... this finland, which, in principle, sweden bombed, not being, not being a member of nato. there is an indicator that it is not necessarily nato, it can be a coalition of nato and non-nato, relatively speaking, the australians, the australians are now training with the new zealanders, training our soldiers in great britain, they directly transfer weapons to us, they directly train, they transfer intelligence to us. well, this is the result of this new military cooperation, which is manifested between the united states, great britain, australia, well... zealandia, this is a pacific, one might say , military cooperation, and it is simply some kind of mirror in nato in another region. nato was an old story, as you remember the southern one, which was called, but before at this time, despite the fact that that block has left, there remains the so-called five eyes, this is a combination of intelligence and special agencies of these five countries, it is precisely the united states, great britain, canada and the two countries of new

zealand, australia , they still work very closely together, and some of the information we receive is critical for us. we will get because there is this alliance that exchanges itself outside the alliance. what can be done in order to really build such a political model of support that would give us the opportunity to survive in the event of the end of hostilities. well , you have already decided that in the event of an end, we should end the military operations, while the military operations are ongoing, we know that no one will offer anything, we heard president biden's statement that... ukraine's accession to nato is a victory over russia. this is, well, a quote. well, for all my high assessment of the alliance as our future block. i think it is necessary at this stage. to talk about the formation of the coalition he is talking about, which will help us solve the first stage, stop the war. i know that for some reason it is accepted in our country to scoff at the words of president macron, who offered his troops, i

think we should have seized this opportunity, but he did not have time to finish speaking, absolutely, please, at least tomorrow, the verkhovna rada immediately receives a draft law on the entry of foreign troops, in particular , french, as well as all others on the territory of ukraine. even this move would show russia, i understand. that this is an escalation, but i think it's too late to cry now, the problem of escalation is endless so-called periodicals, we are a little more russian, we get a storm shelter, they they start bombarding us with zircons, we get tanks there, they launch the newest tanks there, it seems to me that in this race we are, you know, like stigren, you can saddle it, you just have to hold it tight, otherwise, if you don't hold it tight, you will drop, then you will become his victim, at this stage i think that despite all our attempts to peacefully as ... resolve, this is a tiger that i do not think will be ready to negotiate. and why did president macron, by the way, not receive this support with this, his, i would say, no,

not even with the words of this, this new course, which he could count on, we now know that americans were generally advised not to go to the conference he held in the elysée palace, and many did not go, i understand why olaf scholz did not support him there, yes, but when he was not are supported in washington and london, this raises questions. i agree with you, some remind that macron has gone through the elections and he is not afraid of more elections, he can behave like a statesman and not like a leader who is waiting for re-election, there is also some truth in this, but i think that it is not we need competition between these centers of influence also played in our favor, besides, there was no clear position of ukraine, if there was a clear position of ukraine, then the same olaf scholz, the same rishi sunak or... joe biden would have to answer not only to the french, but also to the ukrainians, and only the french replied that you can do what you want there, but our troops will not be there, this

position can change, just like the position with the attacks, it has changed, which absolutely, i think, i am not alone anymore once i say it, it seems to me that this is just the next stage of our war, it will be the same as we did not believe, or someone there did not believe that there would be tanks, missiles, i don't know, everything else, we started with the fact that our special forces ran with... with javelins and inlavs and burned tanks wherever they could, these are semi-guerrilla measures, now we have, i don't know, you saw that the discussion between germany is very interesting, not with poland, but with germany, there was a part that it did not happen before, about the support of ukrainian helicopters, this did not happen, the only country that we have so far handed over helicopters, three of them, they were britain, britain continues to promote these main directions with other countries, and here it signs up to them... germany, to be honest , i did not find the ones mentioned, which ones exactly, but it is very interesting that it sounded , that is, this is a new type of shock weapon that we did not have before, maybe politics is also in such

a state of crisis, i would say, like diplomacy, now it is not politicians who control events, but events control politicians, this is the impression, i am afraid that with diplomacy, you and i have already agreed that will take place, now let's take up politics, in fact, it's not that we haven't reached such a level, as in the movie that the tail wags the dog. but the fact that politics has come very close to the events is true. and i, i think that part of it is all the social networks and the ability of people to move around the planet, to communicate easily with each other, and so every event causes a resonance, with the media overloaded with tragic events, people read and learn mostly about tragic events, and therefore every such event requires a reaction, there is no time for planning, there is no time for any long strategies, it is necessary to really have a very... a long time, i don't know, some imperial hundreds of years in order to still be able to plan, for example, rishonok said a very interesting phrase now in relation to ukraine, that we have announced a package,

and this package will be renewed every year as much as necessary, not less than this amount, i do not hear this from anyone, despite the fact that the government in great britain may change, absolutely, more that we know that the decision-maker is a former, former finance minister, one of the reasons why, for example, defense minister wallace, our second supporter, followed because he demanded to increase, increase the allocation for arms, it was a conflict with the new prime minister, as soon as sunak came, over time, this thing happened that what you say is possible, the process is possible, and it will happen, but sunak has now come to the point that despite the fact that he has to spend money on all other projects, and he a financier himself, a banker, he realized that can't do anything, need to spend more, for example, a unique thing, he said that 5% of the budget will be transferred to innovative development. military, because the war in ukraine has shown that it is a war of technology, moreover, we are launching an analogue, the british analogue of darpa, but i would honestly expect that these words would be

said by ukrainian officials. it is necessary to say that in ukraine the plan is long-term, so many funds are allocated, plus so many of them for innovation, plus a special agency that is engaged in the development of the newest weapons, and coordinate this process. well , by and large, this is the only way democracies can match dictatorships, because putin, he no longer thinks about electoral results, he can simply plan it 20 years ahead, the question is correct, how can he plan it more decisively, i am ready to agree with the fact that a consensus has been established in a specific society, well... the government can sit down with the shadow government, hold consultations, come up with such an initiative after, well, you saw a couple of days ago, the head of the shadow government, not the government, but the ministry of defense criticized the acting ministry of defense for the fact that they are very slow to use the money from the ukrainian fund, this is, by the way , a separate fund from the money that ri shunok promised, this is the money that the northern countries under the leadership of great britain collect, that is, imagine, instead of to say

that this is a unique case, they... the night that they spend not enough for ukraine, slowly, we need more and faster, well, this is another motive of the election campaign, if in america the republicans say to the democrats, you give a lot of money to other countries, and need to think about america, then the great britain says, no, you are not helping much, because this is the security of great britain, well, so that britain is closer, it is simply closer, it is true, although traditionally they are also libertarians due to many geographical and other reasons, but they understood , who can't do anything, can't come to an agreement with this tyrant, everyone has to... listen, even the decision of the decider that i guarantee government procurement for british military companies, it means that, well, what we tell ourselves that we need to get on the rails they are passing, we have chances that we will build our policy in such a way that we really can, and events will not guide us, but we events, but to finish our conversation, there is such an optimistic idea, i... i am

sure , that optimism should be present, no less, an indicator of the validity of this optimism is that we have been fighting for 2.5 years during this one of the largest armies in the world, and we are still enduring it, of course, sometimes you just don’t have to come up with anything, just lead by example if they understand it, being safe for now, thank god, we definitely need to think about it, well, maybe that's just why they are safe, because they believe that we are the force that restrains russia from any other actions, not only we. stuck in this situation, is russia stuck up to its ears in it? they also say that helping us is, relatively speaking, not just an investment in the future, but it is an investment in the future, even so cheaply, that is, there is no need to explain to mothers and other voters where her children went and everything else, and that's why we still need to start talking to ours allies that we may not have enough strength, of course we must first set an example ourselves, because no one will come if we cannot mobilize ourselves, but in

principle... such a difference as it is, we have already proven that technologically nato weapons are better, if we get more, technologically we will close them, we have already received there 4 million projectiles only from britain, from the czech republic, the americans are speeding up, as the second world war showed that if the americans speed up, then they will break everything, just force power of the economy, this happens, if you add to all this coordination, the ability to fight, i think that this war can have a completely different pro.

greetings, dear viewers, this is yana yavomelnyk and this is news: a 60-year-old man died as a result of enemy shelling in the village of kyzomes in the kherson region. the russians hit residential buildings, oleksandr prokudin, the head of the regional military administration, said. the person was in the garden at the time of the attack and died on the way to the hospital. and one man was wounded during an enemy attack on the zaporozhye district, the leader said ivan fedorov of the military administration of the region. over the course of a day, the occupiers struck the populated areas of the region more than 300 times. 10 settlements were under fire, 12 houses were damaged. in glyapolia, on one of the houses behind...