>> coming on washington journal, your reaction to yesterday's announcement from former president donald tmp he has been indted for his handling of classified documents. you can join the conversation by phone or send us a text, tweet, or facebook comment. "washington journal" starts now. ♪ host: it is "washington journal" for june 9. according to former president trump himself and other

reporting he faces a series of charges related to classified documents. it makes him the first former president in u.s. history charged by the department of justice and that is the focus of our program. you can call in and tell us what you think about the expected charges against former president trump. republicans (202) 748-8001, democrats (202) 748-8000, and independents (202) 748-8002. text is if you wish at (202) 748-8003. you can post on facebook at facebook.com/c-span or twitter @cspanwj. the story has made the front page of several newspapers. here is a sampling of how some of the papers are treating it. the chicago sun-times with a profile picture of former president donald trump, the first former president to face

federal charges. trump says he has been indicted and classified documents cases. the tampa bay times at large font, trump indicted. the other charges stemming from the new york case you saw a couple months ago. the new york daily news, indicted again. criminal charges in florida tied to documents at mar-a-lago according to reports and according to president trump on his own truth social feed. politico offers a cheat sheet into these new charges. this is from the section of what crimes the president is being charged with. they write the indictment is under seal but is said to contain seven criminal accounts. one of trump's attorneys said in a television interview he has seen summons documents from prosecutors, including a provision of the espionage act

that prevents the retention of classified material, a statute that prohibits falsifying and destroying records pertinent to a federal investigation, and a statute prohibiting false statements and conspiracy. former president trump expected in court in florida next tuesday to hear these charges, file a plea, and so on. for the course of three hours you can share your thoughts on these latest developments concerning the former president. (202) 748-8001 for republicans. (202) 748-8000 per democrats. (202) 748-8002 for independents. former president trump put out a lengthy video yesterday on his truth social website about these latest charges. several minutes in length. here it is in its entirety. [video clip] >> we are a nation in decline and yet they go after a popular

president, president who got more votes than any sitting president in the history of our country by far and did much better the second time in the election than the first. they go after him on a hoax. just like the russia hoax and all of the others. this has been going on for seven years. they cannot stop because it is election interference at the highest level. there has never been anything like what has happened. i am an innocent man. they had the mueller report. that came out, no collusion. that was set up by hillary clinton and democrats. this is what they do. this is what they do so well. if they would devote their energy to honesty and integrity it will be a lot better for their country. they can do a lot of great things. if you look at what has happened to our country. we were energy independent. we had a strong military that was not woke.

we were doing so well with respect all over the world. the biggest tax cuts in history, the biggest regulation cuts. you had an election that was taken. a president that got more votes than any sitting president in history by far and they come after me because now we are leading in the polls again against biden and against the republican. we are leading against biden by a lot. a tremendous amount. they figured the way they are going to stop us is using warfare. this is warfare. we cannot let it happen. we cannot let it happen. our country is going to hell. they come after donald trump, weaponizing the justice department, weaponizing the fbi. we cannot let this continue to

go on because it is ripping our country to shreds. we have such big problem and this should not be one of them. it is a hoax. just like russia. just like the fake dossier was a hope. -- was a hoax. you saw the durham report, you saw the mueller report. you had two impeachments and they lost and we won. we had tremendous report but that was a hoax and a stamp and now they are doing it again. seven years. even after i am out. it is called election interference. they are trying to destroy a reputation so they can win an election. that is just as bad as doing any of the other things that have been done over the last number of years and especially during the 2020 election. i want to tell you i am innocent man, i did nothing wrong, and we will fight this like we've been fighting for seven years. it would be wonderful if we

could devote our full to making america great again and that is exactly what we did. now our country is in decline. we are a failing nation. this is what they do. i am an innocent man. we will prove that again. seven years of proving it. very unfair. i want to thank everybody. we are doing something very special for our country. i always put america first. that is why we were in a position. unfortunately that position is no longer valid because they have done such a poor job. we are in a position where we will make america great again. i am innocent and we will prove that soundly and hopefully quickly. thank you very much. host: that video released about an hour after the president finding out about these expected charges from the justice

department from special counsel jack smith. the former president indicted in this classified documents based. that is the topic of our show. republicans (202) 748-8001, democrats (202) 748-8000, independents (202) 748-8002. you can also post on facebook and twitter. we will start off with perry and south dakota. you are first up. go ahead. caller: thank you for having me. i am jill that the justice department -- it is a whole different level of what they are doing with the former president. we have now a present president that the house of representatives is taking up with bribery. his bribery worse than this keeping records in your house that just about every president

in the past has done. they have taken stuff home with them. now we are making an issue out of taking it home and using it to a certain level. i do not know what that is. i feel it is up to the justice department to consider what we have right now. what is good for the gander is good for the goose with this present administration we have now. it is coming right out of the house of representatives that there is bribery. host: robert in baltimore. democrats line. caller: i cannot believe what i just heard. trump knew better. i do not know if the man is crazy or what. i believe what he is doing is

selling secrets to other countries. look at his son. his stepson. his son-in-law. $2 million he got. host: ronald in east orange, new jersey. independent line. caller: good morning. what that first caller does not understand is it is not the fact that he took the documents. it is the fact that he did not want to give them back. that is the problem. the man has always thought about himself first, the country last. anybody else who does not believe that is crazy. host: we will go to dahlia in miami, florida. republican line. caller: good morning.

we are becoming a banana republic. when you have a government that weaponizes and make sure another man cannot run for president because he is waiting -- he is winning, that is called banana republic. we have the biggest criminal sitting in the white house. all this about the $5 million he got because he interfered in ukraine. it is allowed. he even said it in 2017 that he went to ukraine and he told them unless you fire that prosecutor you are not getting $1 billion. and what was the prosecutor going after? burisma, where his son worked. for that the burisma people gave

him $5 million. that is being criminal. he is a criminal. he is the one that should be going to jail along with his entire family. host: that is dahlia in miami, florida. president biden was asked a question about the justice department's investigation into the former president. this was before the charges we heard of. news came from that. here is president biden from earlier yesterday. >> what you say to americans convinced they should trust the independence and fairness of the justice department when your predecessor donald trump repeatedly attacked it. >> he knows i have never once suggested to the justice department what they should do

were not do as far as bringing charges or not bringing charges. i am honest. host: that was from the white house. the new york times highlights that it was in may of 2022 that prosecutors issued a subpoena for the return of all classified documents. when mr. trump received the subpoena he asked a lawyer how to help them comply with it come if he has to obey its demands. according to the notes of the conversation mr. cochran conducted a search of mar-a-lago and drafted a sworn statement that everything demanded had been found. in early june of 2022 prosecutors from washington visited mr. cochran at the florida compound to collect the folder he had prepared for them with about 30 classified documents he had discovered during his search. within a matter of weeks prosecutors developed evidence the search prosecutors conducted was incomplete and more classified material remained at mar-a-lago.

all of these events leading up to yesterday's indictment from special counsel jack smith who was tapped by merrick garland to investigate these matters. ricky in maryland, democrats line. caller: good morning. let me just remind the american people how we got to this point. i want the american people to know that the department of justice did not just wake up and say let's go get trump. let's remind each other how we got to this point. he started off with what was said earlier. he had an opportunity to turn over information that belongs to the archives. he chose not to do it. that is a felony. he had other allegations pending towards him, what he did in the state of georgia when he called and asked the state secretary to

look for 11,800 votes. that is another felony. he has also been involved with paying a prostitute $130,000 which his previous lawyer went to jail for. that is a felony. host: that is all on the record. what about the charges yesterday specifically? caller: i am not surprised. the evidence is in place. the special prosecutor is doing the job he has been hired to do. he followed the evidence and now here we are. we have a duty and obligation to go after donald trump and let him face the charges and let everyone remember this. he is innocent until proven guilty. the burden is on the government

to prove him guilty. everybody sit down and relax and let see democracy at work. host: that was ricky. let's go to larry and north carolina. independent line. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i wish i could redo this morning. i told my wife i must have esp because i said they are going to talk about this indictment on c-span this morning. yet nothing about the numerous scenarios with the biden they are bright. i don't understand it. i really don't. i am amazed that this is going on, and this all stems back, and i appreciate the caller from maryland, he made a lot of sense on things.

this stems back from the hillary clinton scenario 2016. darling hilary did not win her election. from that point on the democrat machine started putting lies in the face of the american people and saying they were truth. it still continues today. host: larry in north carolina. the new york times highlighting what larry has brought up, saying mr. trump will try to turn this around on his pursuers arguing he is being persecuted because he has been indicted where misses clinton was not. never mind that the facts of the case are different and he seemed to go out of his way to intentionally thwart authorities trying to recover the secret documents. and mrs. was not willingly tried to violate the law but it will be useful argument for mr. trump that he is accused of a double standard.

the 2016 campaign is another matter but he spent much of his presidency disregarding concerns about the security hub is information. that is in the analysis section of the new york times. let's hear from david, republican line, indiana. caller: good morning. i appreciated the callers before me. it is amazing you can find all sorts of documents scattered around the biden residences. he took those when he was a senator, which is completely illegal. a felony. a president has the right to handle classified documents and make them unclassified whenever he wants. i knew you would not mention anything about the $5 million that was paid out by varese ma to the biden family.

a member of the biden family is a teacher. where did he get the money to build all of his homes? amazing. the biggest corrupter is sitting in the white house. the biggest liar. controlled by the democratic puppets. caller: james -- host: james in new york, democrats line. hello. caller: i am elated the department and merrick garland have finally shown some sense of jurisprudence. i was beginning to think this country is going up in smoke because of all of the things that the ex-president has done and also with all of the people like tom cotton, lindsey graham,

mitch mcconnell, kevin mccarthy, who had a chance and spoke after the insurrection. in ex-president that sat in the white house and watched people get murdered during the insurrection. nobody talks about that. i am so glad that finally there is a semblance -- like the gentleman said he is innocent until proven guilty. one thing the ex-president is really good at, he knows how to play the media. he is the pt barnum, he is very shrewd about that. it is all about victimization. it is them against us. nobody talks about nixon, nobody talks about george w. bush, who sent american troops into a war that should never have been fought. nobody talks about spiro agnew. this is a way of the

republicans. i am just glad that this morning, i've been waiting for four or five years where republicans allowed him to get away with. the republican party is complicit by being silent and allowing -- paul ryan had a chance when he was speaker. he did nothing. host: we got your point. these indictments have been alleged in other various were. the president talking about receiving them himself. tuesday will be the date when he hears the charges in court in florida. for that to happen next tuesday when it comes to members. various members of congress have put things on their twitter feed. this is kevin mccarthy saying today is a dark day for the united states of america. it is unconscionable for a president to indict a candidate opposing him.

i never he american who believes in the rule of law stated with president trump. house republicans will hold this brazen weaponization of power accountable. jim jordan, also committee chair, putting out on his twitter feed "sad day for america, god bless president trump." republican max boot, the phony indictment is an attempt to distract from the bribes the biden crime family received from foreign nationals. donald trump will be back in the white house and joe will be hunter's cellmate. the house minority leader hakim jeffries saving the rule of law is central to our democracy it must be applied without fear or favor to everyone. democrat from colorado say never before has a former president been indicted for a federal crime. by indicting trump america's justice system is once again showing its strength and reminding us no one is above the

law, not even former president. representative robert garcia. donald trump is a con man who damaged our institutions and is finally held accountable by the country he tried to destroy. that is just a sampling of what legislatures put on their various twitter feeds concerning the indictment reports released yesterday. this is paul in minnesota, independent line. good morning. caller: i am truly an independent. i voted for bush the father. i voted for other republican candidates. not for mr. trump. i think today is a good day for america because he is being held accountable. as much as anything, this man is a bully and he is all about himself. the best evidence of that is his conduct on january 6 when the capital riots happened, the insurrection, whereby he did try to overturn the election and how

he treated his vice president mike pence who was loyal to him for all four years. host: to the charges yesterday, how would you address those? caller: i think he needs to be held accountable. he needs to be fully adjudicated and held accountable. he is a bully and he is all about himself. host: sylvia in west palm beach florida. republican line. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. here we go again. we have gone through russia. we have gone through the impeachments. here we go again. this man has nobody on his side except the republicans and thank god we are there. people in the white house have

done nothing to him but try and take him down. thank god he has the ability and more than biden the legs to stand on his own and defend our country. we need him desperately. we do not need biden in the white house. host: what you think of the charges themselves? caller: they are bogus. somebody needs to take them away and give him back his life and let him run for president and win. people understand what is going on. they are not stupid. they recognize merrick garland is upset. they realize the democrats want him no matter what. they do not want him running against biden because biden is weak. he is the worst president we've ever had. i do not understand these democrats. they are so stupid. host: there is sylvia in florida. cnn has a profile of the special counsel that was appointed to

take a look into these matters at mar-a-lago, jack smith. they highlight he is also overseeing the department's investigation into efforts to overturn the 2020 election and he is investigating members of both parties had like some of the most high-profile political corruption cases in recent memory to mixed out. the special counsel's experience ranges from prosecuting a sitting u.s. senator, bringing cases against gang members convicted of murdering new york city police officers. his career spans multiple students in the justice department. smith was head of the section when the department failed to convict at the international support and then he saw corruption cases with the chief of the justice department's public integrity unit. he was head of the section when the department failed to convict former senator and vice presidential candidate john edwards in 2012. then virginia governor bob mcdonnell was indicted in 2014 he oversaw the investigation

into former house majority leader tom delay, a republican, closing the probe in 2010 without bringing charges. you can find a profile on cnn about the man at the center of this, jack smith, the special counsel appointed by merrick garland to take a look at the issues involving mar-a-lago. in virginia, democrats lied, this is stephen. caller: the callers have set me up pretty well. there are two i words republicans are stuck on. watch senator johnson and congressman cromer, look at these interviews on fox. johnson said we do not have any evidence, we just have to infer that joe biden is guilty. at the same time the republicans are inferring, everyone of these callers they are inferring. there is no evidence. the reputable person is the person talking to person who is

giving whatever evidence they may or may not have about biden. he is not the guy with the goods because there are no goods. we will infer that biden is guilty but we will ignore the other i word, all of the facts around trump. he took those documents. they asked for them nicely. they asked for them les nicely. they asked for them with subpoenas. all he had to do was comply. the republicans are willing to ignore trump sexual assault. host: these are just charges from jack smith. caller: where are we at? it is not the fbi. you guys are ignoring and inferring. host: we have not seen formal charges yet. just to make that clear. let's hear from jack in ringgold, virginia. independent line. caller: thank you for having me on. so many thoughts in my mind.

i am an old marine. 77 years young. [indiscernible] in my lifetime i've never had a better president than president trump. the justice department and the fbi are doing everything they can against president trump. they know he will probably win. host: what you think of the charges laid against president trump yesterday? caller: i think it is a bunch of democrats, a bunch of communists trying to bring this man down. [indiscernible]

host: first half-hour down. we have the whole show free to make these comments against the inspected indictment of former president trump by the justice department. the former president going to his truth social feed to talk about himself expected to appear in court next tuesday. if you want to call us and give us your thoughts, (202) 748-8001 , (202) 748-8000 for democrats, and independents (202) 748-8002. the president's attorney appeared on cnn yesterday and talked about what he is expecting when it comes to these charges from the justice department. there is part of that interview

from yesterday. [video clip] >> we have not been provided with the indictment. what we have is a summons, which is a replace for a warrant. here we have received a summons from the department of justice asking us to be at the courthouse tuesday by 3:00. >> does it sail many charges there are against your client? >> it does not perfectly mirror and indictment. it does have some language in it that suggests what the seven charges would be. not clear all of those are separate charges. they break out from an espionage act charge, which is ludicrous under the facts of this case, and several obstruction based charges, and then false statement charges, which is a crazy stretch from the facts as we know it. there is lot to pick at from the defense side but that appears to be the charges and it appears to be something we will get off the

ground on tuesday. >> you're confirming it is seven charges. there is an espionage act charge. is there one on the willful retention of documents? >> that is it. $18 793. it is great television to cite these numbers. the bottom line breaks down to the retention charges. >> is there a conspiracy charge? >> i believe so. i do not have it in front of me. this is not biblically accurate because i'm not looking at a charging document. there is language that might be reflecting a single count instead of two but i think there was a conspiracy count. host: jim trusty, the former president's attorney. talking about what he knows when the president will appear in court in florida.

helen in california, republican line. caller: the law being applied to trump from the classified documents. i may rightfully assume trump and biden may soon be cellmates because biden was found with classified documents in the garage of his delaware home there was a little bit over that. as trump said, he is not even president anymore but the democrats are terrified of trump regaining power. it is not so much trump regaining power, it is the power of the people have that want trump as president again. that is what they're trying to squash. this is not about squashing trump. this is not about proving he is guilty of espionage, therefore biden would be too. it is about squashing the people's right to vote for who they want to have as the

president. as an aside, the idea of classified documents -- it should be illegal to have any documents that emanate from our government as classified, therefore secret from the people. all documents should be public for the very fact we are a republic. we are owed all of the information because it falls on us to determine who is good and who is bad, who best governs and who does not. host: let's hear from elaine in illinois. democrats lied. -- democrats line. caller: good morning and happy pride month. between pat robertson dying and donald trump getting indicted they are thinking this is like their 9/11. i do not think they understand donald trump broke the law. on both sides of the issue i think biden did some crimes but

it was more or less trump. host: is only reported indictments at this date. caller: true. it is. he will have his day in court and we will see what happens. between pat robertson dying in from getting indicted, happy pride month for all of the queers like myself. host: ronald in oklahoma, independent line. next up. caller: good morning, c-span. host: go ahead. caller: he was indicted by an independent counsel. host: special counsel appointed by merrick garland. caller: a special counsel. merrick garland did not sign off on it. he did not say he approved it. he just gave him the advantage to say you have this indictment, you tried to hide these

documents, this is what you get. don't go to jail, don't pascoe, don't get $200. ho: the politico cheatheet i showed you earlier, and you can find this at politico.com. they have a section when it comes to who at the justice department approved the trump indictment. it says attorney general merrick garland appointed jack smith to oversee the classified document investigation as well as a separate probe into the former president's attempts to derail the transfer of power after 2020. the doj special counsel regulations to clear that smith should not be subject to the day-to-day supervision of any official at the department. under the rules smith had to advise merrick garland about any major action. -- any action that feels so unwarranted that it should not be pursued. merrick garland is the most to give smith's views "rate weight"

and must notify congress if he turns the special counsel down. this is the mechanics of what goes behind the seat when it comes to the special counsel investigations especially as it relates to the indictment of former president trump as he talked on his truth social site and other reporting. republican line in texas. this is mike. caller: the biggest bully in the united states is the federal government. we are getting it good and hard right now. right now. if any caller destroyed fbi subpoenaed information, maybe emails or a server, like hillary did, they would be living in a cage. every single caller who did it would be living in a cage. hillary is not. how suspicious is that? host: how does that apply to yesterday's news concerning

former president trump? caller: the targeting of trump is all they do. that is what they do because he is a threat to their acquisition of political power. they are going after him because they do not like what he does. personally, you have a political party that likes government, they feel government can solve problems. i would submit to you this is how they use government. we are next. they do not solve problems. they claim to. the border, poverty, the things that matter most to democrats is just the acquisition of power and it is not to solve problems. donald trump is in their way. that is who they go after. joe biden has all of those classified documents for over a decade and -- the president has the right. there are constitutional powers

a president has to declassify without any formal activities or approval from congress. why are they going after him like this? they are requesting them. they also told him to put it under lock and key in mar-a-lago. they told him to do that and he did. host: and he resisted and he resisted in other areas according to reporting? caller: according to reporting. according to the article you read hillary had no intent of breaking the law. host: why do you think this compares to the expected charges against the former president? why you think that is a comparison? caller: because the fbi is choosing what laws are going to be applied. that is what they are doing. they are choosing what laws to apply because donald trump is the one they're going after. that is what a bully does. it selectively applies the law when it chooses to do so. host: let's go to james in new

jersey. democrats line. caller: good morning. i'm hearing everything everybody is saying. it is a sad day today. i did not particularly agree with a lot of things the ex-president does or did, but as far as the documents, it is amazing. biden had some in the house. mike pence had some documents they turned them over. trump was asked to turn them over. i think all he had to do was turn them over. i was in the military. i had a clearance. had i taken any of that home were kept any of that stuff, i would not be talking to you. i might just be getting out of prison. i think it is sad. he will have his day in court.

i would've never taken any of that stuff home. what am i doing? host: joe is next in iowa. independent line. caller: hello. first off, i think is a good day that they have finally are going to press charges along with all of the others that are coming. the ones in the past. what'd i hear? over 4000 lawsuits in his lifetime? i want the country to think about this. look at the man when he talks. do not just watch fox. you have to watch everything. c-span, the good, everything. look at the man.

he talks about he is so christian. i bet that man cannot name six books of the bible. host: let's go back to the charges yesterday. what did you think about that begins the former president? caller: absolutely we need to. the country needs to think about this. that man, i've been watching them closely for eight years, before that i watched him. i think he is the devil. i really think he is the devil. host: will hear from matt in missouri. the caller brought up some of the other inquiries into the former president about his activities and they highlight them in the new york times this morning. they go back to the manhattan criminal cases we experienced earlier this year. alvin bragg brought the case of the former president's role in a hush-money payments to stormy daniels.

still pending is the georgia criminal inquiry saying prosecutors recently indicated they would announce indictments this summer in their investigation. some of the allies in their efforts to interfere with the 2020 presidential election. there is still the outstanding january 6 inquiry by the justice department and the special counsel as well as other factors. there are numerous others as well. this is in the new york times if you want to read the summary there. again from yesterday's expected indictment against the former president is where we are turning our attention for the program this morning. in missouri, republican line, this is matt, hello. caller: trumped arrangement syndrome israel. joe biden -- is real. joe biden has 1850 boxes of documents. he had them at the center that was financed by the chinese. nothing. as soon as they find the --

trump got indicted. yesterday they come out with a $5 million bribery scheme. where is the money? host: your drawing straight lines between those incidents and yesterday? how do you prove that? caller: it is trump. they have been doing this for how long? since he was president. it is driven by the state run media and you are part of it. host: how do you draw the line between what you are claiming and the charges? that is what i would like to know. caller: is the truth. you trump will be indicted for georgia? as soon as they come out with more evidence for biden. every time they come out with evidence of biden doing a crime trump gets indicted. host: let's hear from john in california. caller: thanks for taking my call. i do not know what the future will hold.

i do know he will be in court on tuesday. you have the attorney for him that does not understand all of the charges. he said something like is just a list. i understand there is a conspiracy charge and he was in possession of these documents and all of that sort of thing. he just went through a trial where he did not win everything. they did convict him of the other charges. then he shut his mouth -- then he shot his mouth off and he is trying to go after him again because he defamed this person again. this will be an interesting time. one of the things a lot of the pundits and people are talking about is this really does have an impact on the general election. this year it will not. he should be grateful the base is not representing him because

the defense they put forward is everything they hear on fox news and all of the radio dominated republican radio. he would lose. host: and is next in new hampshire. independent line. caller: hi. i just want to say this country needs to uphold the rule of law. president biden has separated himself. he gave merrick garland, who is greatly respected by many republicans, and he appointed a special counsel so it would not be political. he deferred to jack smith, who had great experience in public integrity. mr. trump had the chances over a year and a half to return the documents. he knew explicitly that every

document from the white house belongs to the national archives. he had fits when his aides went through the trash and taped up documents he ripped up because they went to the national archives. he brought this on himself. if you listen to it, he has gone on and on many different outlets saying he took them. he had every right to them. he knew explicitly he did not have the right to them. everybody is in their little path this way or that way. let's severe biden, let's smear the justice department, the fbi. there are people both democrats and republicans in the justice department and the fbi and they take an oath to uphold the constitution and the rule of law. host: if the issue is holding onto these documents, if this is

the issue, are both mr. biden and mr. trump being treated fairly or equally? caller: no. biden found the documents and notified the justice department, they went and retrieved them. he also alled search of his ns.idences and every property he host: ultimately it deals possession of documents. caller: yes. but according to many different prosecutors this happens to many former officers or officials in the government who accidentally take them and return them. should biden be sanctioned or pay a monetary fine? fine. i am sure he would approve of that. he is more honest than mr. trump , who refuses to return all of the documents, even after served a subpoena. host: that is and in new

hampshire. about 12 minutes until our next guest joins us. a discussion and continuing on with the theme of the events of yesterday. at 9:00 the house expected to come in for a short session. should take a couple of minutes as they finish up their business there. then we will continue with calls about the events of yesterday. that is the focus of our program about these expected charges or what might happen next week once mr. trump does appear in court. just to go back to politico saying it was mr. trump's attorney jim trusty summarizing the laws trump is being charged under. the laws saying they are provision of the espionage act that prohibits the retention of classified material, statute that prohibits the obstruction of the proceeding, statute that prohibits falsifying of records. then statutes prohibiting false statements of conspiracy. that is expected, at least from

the lawyer, what he learned yesterday from the charging documents or at least the information he got access to from the justice department. dj is in texas, republican line. caller: good morning. you might as well get to reaching for that button. i want to ask you a question. you sit there and you take in all of this information from people and you talk about somebody that is not really knowing what is going on. the last caller said we should sanction biden? that is part of the problem in this country's people do not know how government works. first of all, you are out there as a reporter, i guess. host: i'm just the host of this program. i am not a reporter in any respect. i'm the host of this program.

caller: you're on washington journal and you are not a journalist? host: we are public affairs program. caller: so what you spend some time talking about the different llc's and going through the whole latter of the llcs the money went through with the biden family. why are we bringing that up? i don't care about these documents. i do not care about any of the documents anybody has taken home. i think most of the american people do not care about documents. they care more about senior president that will take care of them. i am seeing a lot of people suffering because the administration that is in place right now. host: that does not apply to yesterday's expected indictment. what you think about those? caller: why we go to your words. you're bouncing back and forth saying there is an indictment. there is no indictment. host: there are no charges yet.

caller: i am listening to you bounce back and forth on that term. ok? you're bouncing back and forth between -- host: you're bouncing back and forth between trump and the biden administration. talk about what happened to president trump. caller: you're bouncing back that he was either indicted or this is a summary of what might,. host: let's go to sean. north carolina. democrats line. caller: thank you for taking my call. every single republican, every independent, any democratic who voted for donald trump should look themselves in the mirror and they are complicit. they cause this problem by putting such a clown in charge. host: ok.

cliff in virginia. independent line. caller: good morning. i remember you from the charlottesville station. i would like to say i am not republican or democrat. a prosecutor once said they can indict a ham sandwich. i've have been watching this for seven years. it seems like everybody has been against trump. he is the underdog. he has gotten a lot of free press. it seems like the shows on tv have been making their shows based on putting trump down and false allegations for seven years. it is going to be tit-for-tat if the republicans get in. it'll be never-ending. host: let's stick to the events

of yesterday. you think there is substance there is for the indictments are concerned? caller: prosecutors once said if you get a businessman, you're going to find charges on him. it is the federal government. you can become a u.s. citizen and they can take that away from you they have the power to charge whatever. nothing is really, bid for seven years. we have been trying for seven years. it is about time to give up and let the country, and the voters need to have the choice on who they elect. it seems like the democrats want the power to tell you who to vote for. host: president trump himself talking about was he expecting

an indictment from the justice department. other sources saying those are coming. the president expected to appear in court next tuesday as the next step of this story. one of the people talking about this was adam schiff on msnbc. remember he led the efforts in president trump's first impeachment trial to talk about these latest charges on msnbc. here is adam schiff, democrat from california. [video clip] >> this is a very difficult and very important day in the life of our democracy when you have a former and leading candidate for president who is brought up on federal charges. it is a perilous moment but it is important because it is an affirmation of the rule of law that it applies equally to everyone. it applies to the high and mighty, former presidents as it applies to ordinary citizens. to the extent we depart from

that, the extent of that departure is not democracy. this is a very important step. just to respond to what you were talking about earlier, we do advise other countries, emerging democracies, you do not simply seek to indict the losing side in an election. there is an important distinction. these charges are not brought as a way of punishing donald trump for losing an election. they are brought because he violated the law, or the justice department believes they can prove he violated the law beyond a reasonable doubt. that is what should happen when the department reaches that conclusion. this is an important day. there are difficult days ahead. i think in terms of the congress we ought to stay out of the way and i am deeply concerned kevin mccarthy's death threat they do try to bring congress into this -- kevin mccarthy is now

threatening to bring congress into this. i would say to mr. mccarthy that donald trump has -- host: james in virginia. republican line. caller: i think senator schumer said it best in new york. he said when the government once you it has six ways to get you. nowhere in that statement it say break the law. it simply says they want you. then you have adam schiff you just played. he spent two years like the 320 million americans about evidence about russia conclusion -- russia collusion and no consequences. if i sat before a judge and lied that his perjury. if i sat before congress they can charge me. five lighted the fbi they can charge me. here we have a sitting congressman. now he has airtime on msnbc. what is his consequences?

host: the charges against trump yesterday, what you think of those? the expected indictment? caller: i understand what they are -- i understand what you're saying. they've been going after him for seven years. do i think they will stick? no. my republican friends were all looking at maybe desantis in the primary, but the more they go after trump the more we are like , you know what, we are going back to him. all they are doing is reinforcing the trump supporters. i have friends who are giving money to them now for the simple reason he is being attacked day in and day out. can you name a politician in our 250 years of republic that anybody has gone after like this? host: that is james in lancaster, virginia. let's hear from betty in pennsylvania, democrat line.

caller: this has been a long time coming. they should have happened a long time ago. i don't know how republican and trump supporters support this man. he does not want to make america great again. he wants to destroy america. after all he has done to our country. if anyone has watched the pbs memorial day concert, you would've seen decent americans. he rose in america. trump is not -- heroes in america. trump is neither decent nor a hero. host: how does that apply to yesterday's events? caller: all of these things he has done, it is about time he has paid for something. he just keeps causing this country more pain and anguish. i just don't know how anybody can support him, how many decent

american could support this man for all he has done. host: that is betty finishing off our first hour of your calls on these indictments expected against former president trump. he will make his appearance in court next tuesday. up next, the legal expert to help walk the legal technicalities. it is a law professor at american university and abc news contributor kimberly whaley talking about the legal technicalities of what to expect in the days ahead. she will join us as "washington journal" >> american history tv saturdays on c-span 2 exploring the people and events that tell the american story. a p.m. eastern cassandra alexander on the history of the underground railroad and efforts

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does have enough parking but it is not properly managed, not shared, people do not know where it is. that speaks to the parking situation in the country as a whole. we began to think about how much parking there is, you realize there's a lot of opportunity to better use the parking we have now instead of forcing everyone to belittle an apartment building or open a restaurant to build new parking spaces. >> paved paradise sunday night 8 p.m. eastern on c-span q&a. you can listen to all of our podcasts on our free c-span now app. >> a healthy democracy does not just look like this, it looks like this where americans can see democracy at work, citizens

truly informed, a republic thrives. get informed straight from the source on c-span unfiltered, unbiased come word for word from the nation's capital to whoever you are. the opinion that matters the most is your own. c-span power by cable. >> "washington journal" continues. host: kimberly wehle visiting law professor. also served as former u.s. attorney -- assistant u.s. attorney and to join us to alter the events of yesterday. welcome back. former assistant u.s. attorney point of view, what do you think about yesterday's events? guest: given what we know about what is public, it sounds like there is a strong case on the fact that special counsel jack smith has gathered so many of us

anticipated this coming and we do not know what is in the indictment. it is not a big surprise. host: what gets us to this point? especially when it comes activity with the grand jury. guest: one of the surprises was there are two grand juries related to the mar-a-lago investigation, donald trump taking classified information out of the white house and not returning it for 18 months. that is the critical distinction between him and former vice president mike pence who also and joe biden found having to possess records in their private homes after having left the office. there are two grand jury's. one in d.c. ongoing, not just mar-a-lago but with the january

6 insurrection event that jack smith is spearheading. we found out the second one is in florida and the reason why it do with the legal contact known as a venue. you cannot charge someone in a state that is note nexis with the activity to the indictment. the indictment will contain information regarding alleged wrongdoing trump did in florida. that is the connection that is the venue and that is why the grand jury out of florida is the one issuing the indictment. host: take us forward to tuesday and expectations there. guest: he supposed to be in court tuesday and this is typical for anyone who has been indicted or charged through another kind of document and

indictment comes from a grand jury and they are regular people, your neighbors, friends they get called to listen to evidence. sometimes they just listen to evidence and do not do anything with it. it is an investigative grand jury to gather facts. sometimes they had to make a charging determination and that is what is happened here. tuesday trump will at some point be formally arrested. we saw this happen with alvin bragg on manhattan. i'm sure his lawyers are negotiating around that to be smooth and without incident. then there will be an initial hearing at which he will be arraigned, he will be formally here the charges basic due process. get to have notice about what the government says you did wrong and his counsel will enter

a plea, presumably not guilty. then the judge, the same judge to issue the warrant to search mar-a-lago, that the judge will talk to trump's counsel about the conditions of his release between now and trial and possibly in addition questions around confidentiality because one of the things here is this indictment sounds like it involves national security information. we do not know if this listed in the indictment but i'm sure sensitivity around subject matter of this case, classified information that should not be out in public domain even though the court system. host: reporting taking a look at the loss potential charges might stem from. provision of espionage act one of them which prohibits the retention of materials.

can you expand on that and what could it mean in this case? guest: as a postwar or -- as a post-world war i statute and it talks about national defense information because at that time there is not such a thing is classified information but this is the go to place for people that are leaking classified information or mishandling classified information that belongs to the united states. that is a big charge because it is not just taking information from the white house, the presidential record act, when a president leaves office under a statute called the presidential record act enacted after watergate -- when he leaves office his records belong --

transfer authority -- transfer of possession and ownership to the united states people. none of those records he was allowed to keep and did another level as some of the records reclassified then that -- records were classified then the espionage act which is why it a serious case because that's information that could compromise national security. we got notice in the indictment but that is what makes it a serious offense because it involves potential national security information. host: our guest with us until 9:00. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. you can text us at 202-748-8003. another statue at the

obstruction of a proceeding. how does that apply here? guest: one is the taking of the documents and the fact that over 18 months the national archives and fbi asked trump and lawyers and associates to return the documents and the government was told that they had received everything turns out the warrant was executed there were additional documents at mar-a-lago. obstruction we heard in connection with the mueller report when there were 10 alleged acts of obstruction of justice by donald when he was president. we have heard about obstruction in connection with january 6. those sets of statutes are about this. criminal investigation underway we do not want to have people get away with hiding evidence,

bribing witnesses from threatening them, threatening the judge, harassing the jury. those things are illegal because if they were legal we would not have a criminal justice system that functions. the obstruction part of this case has to do with the reports that documents were moved around , boxes were moved, cetera there's a report at a c in and suspicious flooding of a room that contained recording related to where the documents were -- we did not know if that is accurate but those things to decide to hide or conceal the stuff and keep it from the federal government must became clear that donald trump had not turned everything over that as a separate charge. host: if you want to ask questions the numbers will be on the screen. city in florida on the democrats line. good morning.

caller: i think she laid it out pretty good in terms of what happened. he has been taking advantage of position he was in previously and having people around him to cover up and hide and even maneuver before he left the presidency. and over to put people in certain places from the pentagon -- maneuvers to put people in certain places from the pentagon that were doing things for him even when he was leaving the position. to have an individual like that as president is a hard thing. people cannot understand how you can have somebody like that. nonetheless things he did -- one of the last things he did was expedite the killing of nine or 13 people on death row.

host: do you have a specific question to ask? caller: are they going to allow go where the evidence leads because they've already got the evidence they have for him and have a considered the fact he is the kind of guy that would have people play documents -- put documents in other people's position so it would take the shine off of him? guest: it sounds like from the airport that this might've been -- report that one of the cows in indictment is for conspiracy. that means the government does have evidence that more than one person was involved in the alleged crime and it was a meeting of the minds, some kind

of coordination or agreement between donald trump and others relating to these other crimes, obstruction, for example. that does not me there be other defendants and name it could be an unindicted co-conspirator but it looks like special counsel jack smith and the grand jury is charging this in a way that it is not just donald trump acting on his own, it is donald trump coordinate with others to thwart the rule of law, allegedly, and to frustrate the investigation and national archive efforts to get the documents back. host: dave on the republican line. dave, in pennsylvania, hello? one more time for dave in pennsylvania.

we will go to rudy in arlington, virginia. independent line. hello. caller: good morning. my question that it looks like we have to speculate at this point with the potential charges are because no one has seen the indictment but it would appear and i wonder if your guest agrees, looks like it is a violation of the espionage act. obstruction of justice, false statements, and carry over the earlier discussions this requires an intent to possess documents that you believe you are not entitled to receive. there is questions this morning about why is it that biden is not being charged and it seems like you need to draw a

distinction between those and that seems to be from claims he has the authority to declassified the documents but if he has that authority why did he permit the submission of certification in which it was claimed all requested documents have been turned over. by submitting that document, it led to another charge create a set of say i have the authority to possess this document, he filed something saying all documents have been turned over. i am wondering if that analysis -- guest: the caller points to something really critical which is what lawyers and judges call mens rea, the state of mind, was it willful, knowing, and intentional. proof of that state of mind is what distinguishes negligent conduct, mistakes from something

that becomes criminal. the difference between civil action and criminal one is only a criminal one can take your liberty and put you in jail. it does require mens rea. we do not know. reportedly it is called a speaking indictment. if and when it becomes public, may be redacted, we get a layout of the evidence gathered but reportedly there are multiple officials in the white house that testified before the grand jury that trump was briefed on the property classification procedures. there is nothing in the lot that allow a president think about declassification. we have a tape that leaked when he was in new jersey estate where he reportedly on the tape

waving around a document that lays out plans to potentially attack iran and he made a comment about classification status and that we show knowledge and attend. the judge in florida as a federal judge found attorney-client privilege that took copious notes of this whole process that attorney-client privilege will not protect those communications firm going to the grand jury because there might've been a crime involved. we have additional facts relating to the trips to -- trump story not close to anything that happened with joe biden and mike pence. taking and hiding and refusing to turn it over with multiple request is what got donald trump in hot water in ways other

officials who mistakenly had declassified information or did not do it to the level of espionage act crime did not. host: cnn to put out something saying it was the former president who acknowledged on the tape that he retained secret military information according to a transcript. it says that the references document about attacking iran. guest: this is a smoking gun is overuse word but it is the kind evidence that does not happen very often in cases. a tape that does not lie, die, or misremember. it is him speaking his own state of mind in his own words with his own voice. that is pretty powerful evidence of what he knew and thought in the moment. host: renee in new york on the

democrats line. good morning. you're on it with kimberly wehle . caller: kimberly wehle thanks so much for laying out everything you are. this morning listening to some of the callers. it is pretty scary there able to vote. it is a primary election and possibly put this man in power again. i am an american. i vote democratic. i am married to an american that recently votes republican. how some of these people can hear this. they being fed a narrative. i watched on cnn talking about the espionage act being one of the potential charges on the

summary sheet. how can that -- how can anyone rationalize someone in a position as a president, how can someone rationalize that? i do not understand it. we all have to live together. i have two beautiful grandchildren going to and i'm afraid of their future and it is because of one person, donald trump. guest: for a long time here in washington talking about this with other experts, no one thought this day would come. many people thought it will never happen and i think the fact that it did means the justice system and rule of law and constitution is functioning in america. the preamble of the constitution is in the first person. we the people.

it is the people's government. no politician has power. that is different from king george the third where the american revolution was fought to get rid of a monarchy with a kink in england had a divine right from god to have unlimited power. that is not how america work. we got a little lost in republicans versus democrats. now that is in the constitution. there are no parties in the constitution. it is we the people. people have gotten lost may be moved away from the foundational idea that if you're going to speed up the red light, you get a ticket. the only person responsible for where we are right now is donald trump in his actions. he had every opportunity to cooperate with the government he led and comply with the presidential records act and he decided not to. sometimes there are consequences when you make those choices.

host: as far as the presidential election, will complications -- what complications will prove? guest: there is nothing in the constitution that probus someone for running for presidency -- prohibits someone for running for presidency. it is really from science and politics, not just voters but republican party that set aside who the nominee will be for president. those in republican party leader going to have to sit down and say is this our best candidate geico assist the person we want to represent our party and to lead the company moving forward notwithstanding the serious allegations and even if they are

not proven, they might make a decision that there are other good people in their ranks they could do a good job without this yoke criminal liability hanging around their necks. host: pat in florida on the republican line. caller: about a commentator, i think it is rich you will -- she quotes the constitution and not have an amarnath. constitution does not say anything about the fbi or doj. every american should be against fbi or doj. doj going after a former president or presidential candidate. this is a chance to influence an election. that should be -- every american should be against that. i would not want the doj going after a democratic person.

every american should be scared of this. why the photos of the documents joe biden took -- where are the photos documents joe biden took spread out on his floor? nowhere. i will hang up and let her talk. guest: i understand the sentiment and i think pat is right we should scrutinized anyone who holds the people's power. doj and fbi all flow from article two in the constitution which gives the presidency power constitution which gives the presidency power and to take care of the federal laws they execute. they're like the cops for the federal government and just like local cops, federal cop should also be held accountable.

the constitution gives him all kinds of protections and he cannot be convicted unless evidence that is authenticated, all the rules are followed, procedural rules and then a right to appeal. that system falls down for low income people and which tends to be in our criminal justice system, disproportionately people of color, but this is not someone i think that she will get every protection under the law. this is a legal process. i have quite a bit of faith in the judges and justice system to make sure this process is done based on facts and law. host: does the special counsel

-- does he get any input from the attorney general himself? guest: that is not in the constitution. there is no rule that limits the ability of the attorney general to talk to the special counsel. there are regulations under doj umbrella that creates the special counsel which is different from investigating bill clinton, does a statutory system. some of this is just the norms that have developed. to keep prosecutors in the business of looking at the facts in the law. there is no barrier on attorney general merrick garland communicating with special counsel jack smith about the process moving forward. host: gail from north carolina

on the democrats line. caller: thank you for everything you're saying and the truth. i want to say it is a long time coming. why when trump was painted for the records in mar-a-lago and he did not comply with the subpoena, why was he not held accountable for that? why did it take so long -- everyone keeps talking about the other cases with biden but it took trump -- i think he ignored the subpoena for over a year. he was being treated like differently then someone off the street had done this. there's a lady that went to prison for one classified document recently. this a long time coming. trump is a criminal. you should never be president again. everyone needs to read his thesis book, too much is never a

no -- his nieces book, too much is never enough. these republicans mike kevin mccarthy and far right -- republicans like kevin mccarthy and far right trumpist have no integrity and they are disease on our democracy. guest: grade point that the federal government, fbi, national archives did backflips to try to give trump every possible out to cooperate and his lawyer said if they had everything and they went in with a warrant and there is more stuff. i think you did the right thing. because of the stakes for the presidency itself like other caller frustrated with the actions, because the stakes of the presidency, doj should do

back flips. a former president should get every possible benefit of the doubt, given extra special treatment. that wore out. he did not ultimately comply. as far as the question of why from the republican party, why they are not moving away from donald trump, we thought that might've happened after january 6. it is all about power the constitution structure reeks of the power of the government into three branches. i tell my students the idea is every branch gets their paper created by the other two branches. consolidated power in one place is dangerous. congress is not going to hold them accountable. racing executive and judicial branch doing it because the congress has been stupid trying

-- has been not doing it for political reasons. host: we're still speculating a lot as far as what might happens. if what we are seeing does set a self out and charges are brought and go as a determinant, what is the penalty -- and guilt determinant what is ability? guest: it is not apples and apples. even if they were to be conviction, any defendant would have potential sentence filtered through the center guidelines and it would -- the judge or take into account all factors including the first federal charge. this possible to speculate what the present time could be if there is a conviction and my next book there is a question of a pardon. did donald trump self pardon

himself? is that in the drawer someplace. weatherby pressure on joe biden -- will there be pressure on joe biden like general for did richard nixon. joe biden could do that in theory as well. it is impossible to determine what the fate is for donald trump moving forward. host: was a trial starts, does the president has to testify? guest: does not have to testify. fifth amendment against self-incrimination. he could not take the stand based on what his lawyer recommend. weatherby a child before 2024 election -- will there be a

child before 2024 election, -- will there be a trial for 2000 24 election? it will be interesting on tuesday to see if the judge says a trial date. that timeline is going to be important in terms of the political landscape for the next presidential election. host: our guest kimberly wehle of american university, a visiting law professor. also former u.s. assistant attorney. clark on the independent mine. caller: good morning. i cannot see how you can look this in the face and not see the blatant streaming weaponization -- streaming weaponization of our justice system in making

this so partisan. the people on the left are terrified that president trump could be reelected and i think this is entirely engineered to fort that and frustrate -- dort -- to thwart that and frustrate the american public. look at what the president biden and hunter biden have been hiding while the justice department, merrick garland, looks the other way. you cannot tell me there is not an egregious double standard here. guest: i understand the

sentiment and the optics of it whenever there is an indictment of a politician. any politician that will mean there'll be people from that politician's party doubly upset and see it as politically motivated. we do not know what the evidence is in the moment. we will know when the indictment comes out and ultimately would not know unless there is a jury trial in the present the evidence of the government is held to his burden to prove in court beyond reasonable doubt the charges otherwise donald trump is presumed innocent. my perspective as an academic is about the facts and law, not the politics. as a mother, if there is evidence beyond a reasonable

doubt, that is not the kind of person that some of us are comfortable having in one of the most powerful positions on the planet. that is the reason we have criminal law is to this incentivize people from -- de incentivize people. it is a critical moment because it is not democrat versus republican. trump blew through stop signs that enlarged the office of the presidency itself. that office with joe biden can be handed off to others in the future we have to have guard rails. i have not seen about joe biden that come close to what we know public about trump. host: eddie in virginia on republican line. caller: good morning. i have a couple quick questions for the guest speaker.

how many classified documents does u.s. have? you think the jurors, prosecution, and defense will they see the information that relates to each document trump is charged with having or really just the documents? just get the comments on those items. i'm sure if it goes before a jury they will see the nature of for they were attacking iran or simple documents. guest: there is a whole debate about the classification process. this might be something that congress should step in and pass laws arounds. some people within the community

think there is classified and the process needs to be tightened up a bit. i did not know anyone has a number of how many classified. there are levels of classification. i'm a big believer in transparency in government. that is something probably for congress to look at. as far as what is in the indictment, at depends on -- it will depend on what the government has to prove, particularly the espionage act. they have to show there is national defense information. the government will have to disclose enough so the jury can find beyond reasonable doubt the government has established that part of the elements of the crime. host: hector in boston on the democrats line. caller: good morning. i got to say i was arrested

years ago and when they come and arrest you because they got something on you and they could have proven in court but i knew i was guilty and with the fed did they take you to a local district case and we were honest with defense, i ended up with probation and for donald trump, he lied. he tried to cover it up. he had conspiracies including lawyers. we are honest with defense -- when you are honest with the feds, you will not go to jail. guest: i work to other parts of the federal government and i know many people in washington that work for the justice department.

these are honest, hard-working, thoughtful, serious people that really believe in america and trying to do the right thing under the system of government we all enjoyed the benefits of. have not had the personal experience but it does not surprise me if there are better stories, it does not surprise me the caller got a fair shake from the federal authorities once they engaged him. host: heather they been similar cases like this -- either a similar cases like this that might give us a sense of what to expect? guest: professor goodman out of new york university law school have looked at prior similar case under the espionage act. his conclusion is that this more

egregious than anything historically that is made public. because not commonly use but also because it involves a former president were to a large degree in uncharted waters. espionage has been used for prosecuting people that mishandle classified information. host: from michigan we hear from kevin on the independent line for our guest kimberly wehle. caller: thank you for taking my call. where in the archives when the president leaves office? why are they not going to the stuff mr. president leaves? -- as the president is leaving?

guest: that is a fair question to ask. if someone wants to hide information, articulate the president, they can be in one room in the documents going out the door in the other room. the archivists have a reputation as being among the most diligent , serious, loyal people in the government. it is the archivist that identified that information was missing and reach out to the president and contacted the fbi when there is not cooperation. i agree with the argument that there should be accountability for people who hold them. host: mr. president complicated by the fact he is being investigated and the trial in new york and other things as well? guest: other than managing the

trial dates to make sure there not overlapping trials, i think in manhattan case is scheduled for the spring of 2024. beyond that these are different jurisdictions. federal government create a state government. -- federal government, state government, local government. there is a georgia district attorney potentially going to indict out of georgia for election related potential misconduct. he could be facing multiple trials and jurisdictions and they do not need to check with each other for they take action. the judges would appreciate there be coordination in terms of calendar but beyond that we could be covering all of this at once. host: joe from ohio on the republican line. caller: good morning from sunny

dayton, ohio. you like facts. i do not like public enter from the media. mike turner, congressman in ohio, said donald trump got more information in his head that in the boxes. donald trump can d.c. classify -- can declassify any document. he just needs to have a witness. the archives told him to take it to mar-a-lago. he has two years to go through his boxes to separate his personal items to the top classified documents. joe biden on the other hand still documents when he was a senator.

he has no rights to declassify documents and he had them at four unsecured locations. when clinton took a documents and he melt servers and she was secretary of state. those are the facts. the media cues donald trump -- accused donald trump of nuclear codes. those are changed every second. guest: i'm not aware of any law that gives the president two years together documents. or one person senator to declassify information. that will come out that there are holes in the law the need to be fixed, it is up to congress to do that. that is not my understanding and i encourage everyone to actually find the law. we will see it. that is not a fact.

the standard for declassification and it would not make sense it can be done without official process because it is about the security of united states. the secret stuff is secret for a reason to protect america. that stuff is carefully managed. this is careful chain of command to make sure it is not get leaked. i embrace the idea of getting facts but have to be accurate. host: kathleen in new york on the democrats line. caller: ok. good morning, everyone. i really like listening to you talk. you are a very smart woman. i listen to these people that call in and it is crazy. but donald trump when he said that he could shoot someone and get away from it, he said that because he knew.

he had been doing criminal acts throughout his life. got away with every one of them and his chickens have come home to roost. i enjoy you. have a good day. guest: thank you for that commentary. i do appreciate it. we have a system of laws. you talk about the rule of law, that means we all abide by it and he gives us an order to society. it avoids chaos and corruption. that is the idea. it is functioning in a moment in a sad way for all americans whether you are democrat or republican. it is unfortunate it is gotten to this point but it is important to have accountability , particularly for people with a lot of power. host: right is jack smith go from tuesday? what is his

day-to-day look like once tuesday comes? guest: their entry of a plea and exchange of information and discovery process leading up to a trial date and they will prepare their cases. he is also working a grand jury on other aspect of his job description headed off by attorney general merrick garland, donald trump's role in january 6 insurrection and attempt to stop the trustful -- peaceful transfer of power. he could focus on this case when it comes to donald trump. we also have alvin bragg is going to trial unless there is a plea. donald trump, if the government goes along with it, he could

plea and make it all go away and have a deal with the government in those proceedings within -- will and. host: tom in new mexico on the independent line. caller: thank you for the opportunity to talk to you today. i want to talk about the role of law. i wrote a letter to my local newspaper about how important is the rule of law and it is important because it is considered one of the guiding principles of our constitution. they are known as the right of the individual, law and order, judicial independence, checks and balances. i found out it has been said that without rule of law lawmakers in a government can abuse their power and not be held accountable for their actions. let us be aware how our lawmakers use the excuse of bad

actions because of security or executive privilege. thank you. guest: i can have said it better. -- i could not have said it better. when it comes to our government, our democracy, it is important to understand how it works so we can protected and have thoughtful informed opinions on how to fix it and i agree the underlying concept of the role of laws accountability because the framers understood it is human nature to abuse power. nobody is beyond those dark forces. the structure, including criminal indictments, designed to push back against our worse. before yesterday -- if there is

an indictment on tuesday, we had not seen accountability or something pushing back on the worst instincts of someone who sits in the seat of power in the united states and possibly globally. that is unmatched and it is that pushback structurally in the system of the rule of law that is so vital to protecting the liberties of our children because without accountability people start to blink other people because there is no downside. -- bullying other people because there is no downside. that is why this process is so important for the constitution itself. host: catherine in michigan on the republican line. caller: good morning.

the two gentlemen really address what my question was going to be . i cannot see how you think that the laws -- it amazes me how you work in education and you think this is legal and this is right to do what they are doing the past president. this man has been under investigation even before he became president. you think that is right? that is all i have to say. he just amazes me -- it just amazes me. guest: earlier in my career i participated in an investigation of a democratic me -- it just amazes me. resident -- president, bill clinton, and so

i do not think the rule of law distinguishes around politics and should not. i understand the perception this is unfair to one party leader versus another party leader, get that it's hard and emotionally difficult to process and cannot make sense but in terms of the facts and law, we all have to abide by them. if i run through a red light, i will get a ticket for president runs through a red light, she should get a ticket as well. you might say hillary or joe biden -- there is a standard of evidence that needs -- there needs to be a lot to justify an indictment and we have not seen it yet and will have to see tuesday.

jack smith needs it all in order to take the country to this moment. host: mike in virginia. jump right in please. caller: i think the law should be amended. no one man even the president should have classified documents. fbi director said president is being investigated, i think by impotence should be fined, but -- president by then and mike pence should be fined about the trump refused to get the documents back and he said i owned them. it is clear he took them despite the fact he was not supposed to. host: that is mike there. we have one minute with you. tell us what you're looking to add going forward. guest: what we he the

indictment? -- will receive the indictment? i think there'll be pressure to make it public because the stakes are high and we should all read it. this optimist information online. -- there is a lot of misinformation online and spending of things one way or the other. i encourage everyone to read the original document yourself and become your best lawyer, investigator and inform yourself and you will be in much better position about how the process unfolds. host: our guest is a visiting law professor from american university kimberly wehle. we have five minutes left on to the top of the hour with a house expected to come in as a session was to take a few minutes but we will continue taking your calls until the house comes in and after they go out. if you're interested give me your thoughts on the events of

yesterday concerning president trump, here is how you can call. republicans, 202-748-8001. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. you can text us at 202-748-8003. up until the house is coming up, 9:00, we your calls. the guest has left. comment if you wish. this is from florida. mark and the republican line. caller: thank you. i'm kind of all it in mid 60's. i have seen a lot. i worked for the federal government for years. i worked for the state government in florida for years. as a prosecutor that is local, not state exactly. i represented the state but i

worked local. i am devastated by what is happening to our nation. when i read these articles i hear terms like we are a banana republic. there is one justice for one group and justice for another. i've never heard anything like that when i was younger. now it is everywhere. i like the professor from american university. she looked normal like she really believed in things and she would do her duty as best she knew but the problem is we got people in our government now and i do not want to blame biden , i will blame obama, he hired people at high levels and let him remake the agencies while they were there. he hired people who were like him, quote unquote people who believe in communism. we look at the people at the head of the fbi at that point and cia, we hired communist to

run them. we are in a place where you ask the fbi to tell the truth, we note they do not do that. host: bill in new york the democrats line. house is about to come in for the session. caller: i am wondering why donald trump is keeping the documents. was he going to do with the documents? get out of jail free card? nuclear sellers all over the country and he's going to get them to somebody? threatening to get them to somebody? because he has the power to do that? why? why keep them?

host: some of you responding in text this morning. sue from new jersey saying no one should behost: above the lar exempt from investigation. the doj cannot become bias. donnie saying everyone needs to know -- president biden had records unsecured as senator and vice president. where is his indictment? stephen in michigan saying former president trump but not be able to lie his way out of this one. we watch is press conferences during the presidency he told us exactly how he was breaking the law. bill from new jersey on the independent line. caller: yes. i just want to comment on professor kimberly wehle. i think you guys should rebroadcast her interview. you can tell she is a professor because she was so detailed and

giving a clear understanding of the law as it relates to the indictment on potential indictment on trump. it will serve your viewers well if he rebroadcasts -- if you rebroadcast the interview. she was extremely detailed and refreshing. i had an opportunity to go to law school i would like to be in her class. host: you can find interview on our website at c-span.org or download our app at c-span now. even though they are out of session, there is a pro warm up session to come in and take in and go out. usually the process takes just a few minutes. they are scheduled for one today. when they come in, we will