before we find the bulletin the side of the white house, because of the new procedures? >> yes, ma'am, lessons learned. mr. ortiz, the recent breach that just happened to him he was apprehended, and he had this story, was information of that apprehension or that discussion that the agents had with him, was that shared, would have been shared as part of fact-finding the next day? with pictures of him been shown to the officers coming on shift on the next shift? we stopped this guy, he had an ax and will he stand -- in his waistband, what's up for him. was that ever done? understanding that he was observed by the countersurveillance division, so

i am assuming and i would have to get back to the committee that that would be part of the protocol of the division as well as the uniformed vision officers that are frequenting these people to me along the south fence line. >> with that have been shared with all of the officers stationed along the south fence line who might have contact with passersby, this guy has been by a couple times, keep an eye out for him? is that a standard thing that would happen as far as standard for teachers every shift? >> i would assume it is discussed, but i do not know to what specificity it is physically reported among uniformed division. the information mr. gonzález had appeared on the south fence line, was interviewed, his car was searched and all that was it a written report provided and supplemented. >> what about any results of fact-finding that goes to the lack of communication between agents who were safeguarding the first daughters being on a

different frequency as the agents who were responding to the 2011 shooting incident? my understanding is the agent inside the not know because she did not hear traffic, that the theect he does -- that suspected shooting had happen and deny find out about it through a third-party, another agent, it had not been fixed. now are all agents listening to multiple frequencies? >> are protocol would require that all agents are notified regardless of their assignment for that type of incident on a shooting on the complex habits. i would say that information is now past to our joint operations systems. >> i am very concerned that we are not learning from lessons learned, that these things are happening whether or not the fact-finding sessions are happening. this information is not disseminated in some way, and i would love to in the executive session touch more on how you are fixing and updating your

protocols, because this seems pretty standard to me. i yield back. >> thank you, and i will recognize myself. pierson.director a lot of chest beating and beating up of the director today. i want to give you an opportunity to talk about not just what took place, but what we can do to make certain that the white house is safe, the first family is safe, and these incidents do not happen again. basically, two things that we deal with to do that, one would personnel,l, your and the second would be technology. wouldd believe those two resolve the problem in the future. in sort of to clean up the mess, the problems with performance, the problems with morale, i will say you are

the first director in 22 years to ever call me personally and ask for some assistance. before this incident took place, she actually called and said i want to improve the quality of our personnel. and she asked for actually two are stilld they pending before this committee, interestingly enough. i just checked. one was to improve the standards for the agents. i know there had been a lack of academy trading and not a lot of folks trained. but you were also and you a concerneaded h.r., about the agents, is that correct? ok, and also the ability to hire and fire. he saw in the v.a. scandal the hands tired to hire and fire, and you asked to create to call the service and exempt service.

is that correct? >> yes, sir. is referred to as accepted service. >> and will give you more ability to discipline. i asked the staff of the status of those, and it is still pending. it has been some ejection from the other side of the aisle, even to take them up. i thank you for stepping forward, and also recommending that. there are things like technology. 2011ere not director in when the bullets hit the white house, were you? >> no. >> you got beat up pretty good on that one today. it is interesting the white and they discovered some concrete or something that had been shipped -- checked out of a balcony that was examine them in the service area of the white house is quite a it and you would not want to examine some of it. that was not on at 9:50 at night.

the fact remains that a window was broken. that concerns me because at my house, i have a security system that if a window is breached >> when i left this morning, i did not want to disturb my wife, the security -- but the security alarm sort of notifies you that someone is coming in or going out. i do not have a very sophisticated system. but a window breaking in the white house in 2011 it seems -- and thereuld are two barriers. one is a bulletproof and the other is original or antique glass. that should have been taken care of. has that been taken care of, do you know? >> the windows have been replaced -- >> no, i'm talking about security for breaching that. again, sybil thing. if someone opens a window or a

window is broken at my house, i have an alarm. have you ever heard of these guys? it is not very costly. you can subscribe. that can be installed. it is a simple technology a privatecompany, system can do that. i do not think we can spend a lot of money. it can improve the quality and professionalism, you got to be able to hire and fire people. you have to put some technology in place. we do not have to put cement trucks and barriers in front of the white house. it is the people's house. do you know when the current seven-foot six inch fence was installed? >> 1965. >> i do not want to go through some outrageous things. taxpayers have to fund this, but maybe we could raise that a little bit. editing is your part -- he lived

in florida. we could put some vegetation barriers, simple things like how about spanish bayonet? you jump that fence and you get quite a greeting when you hit the ground, inexpensive invitation -- vegetation barriers. there are whole host of things we can do cost-effectively. i hope you consider some of them. dubbing the fence at the white house is not new. is that right -- jumping the fence of the white house is not new, is that right? >> correct. >> i understand the president and first family were not at the white house when this took ways, and sometimes the security personnel and secret service do get refocused to address where the president is, and he had just departed. is that correct? >> that is correct. governmentto the reform and oversight committee. it is good to have you here today. thank you. chairman, can i make an

inquiry. a reference that the director made two requests and there was objection from this side. could you expand on that? we are not aware of that. >> the two requests that were made. -- we contacted staff and we asked staff to look at it. i asked the staff just now, what is the status of that, and they said -- i said, have we move forward? they said no. i said why. they said some of the members on the other side of the aisle objected to that. i mean, you can object to it -- >> that is my point. we are not aware of that. >> staff has taken steps to improve performance -- >> we understand-- >> and the status of one of the most respected law enforcement services in the world, not just -- >> we appreciate that. is. got to tell it like it

>> [indiscernible] >> that is the facts. >> she testified under the oath that it was contacted in that regard. i asked -- >> will the chairman yield for a moment? i want to make something very, very clear. on this side of the aisle, we will do everything in our power to make sure that the secret service has everything it needs -- >> there are two -- >> everything it needs to protect the family, the president, the vice president, and our former presidents. this is extremely important to us, and i do not want this hearing from anybody to get the apression that we are not million percent supportive of making sure that the secret service has what it needs, legislatively or financially.

thank the gentleman, and i know he will work with us to accommodate the requests of the director. >> will the chairman yield? irhaps to clear the record, think the entire committee needs to be aware that there have been personnelo have standings of exempt changed in some cases to make them easier to terminate. that is a debate we can certainly have. i do believe today that although that is something the committee should consider him and i am supportive of at this level people being subject to disciplinary action if they are unable to fulfill their mission easier, i do not believe today that is the basis under which these areas failures occurred. i am happy to have a discussion later on the details of the personnel changes. that was the limit, and again

for the director, i did receive that. i did not, because we cannot immediately act on it unilaterally, but i do not believe it has anything to do with today -- the number of failures. it may have something to do with low morale. if you make people easier to fire, that also sometimes leads to low more. stating respectfully, my point on this, i think the director has taken on the responsibility of improving the performance, and very key to that is the educational qualifications which she has and the ability to hire and fire people. i think they're relevant because when you do not have discipline, you do not have good performance, and when the director does not have the tools to a cobblers that, then we -- to accomplish that, then we do not get that. i recognize the gentleman from nevada. chairman issahank

and the ranking member mr. cummings for holding this extremely important hearing. director pierson, let me be frank, i believe you have done a disservice to the president of the united states. not only have you compromised his safety and security, you have compromised the safety and security of his family and the staff of the white house. xhe pattern of la security and follow basic circles indicate a culture at the secret service that needs to change. bele the president may not in a position to publicly criticize this failure to adequately protect his needs, i will. this president has far too much to worry about them up both here and around the world. he should have not to also have to be concerned with his personal safety and security and

that have his family. is,y question, director, why should we have confidence in the secret service's ability to protect the president and the first family when there has been such a pattern of lax security? >> i believe the incident on september 19 is not representative of a pattern. as i have stated, there have been others have attempted to gain access to the property that were immediately arrested. my biggest concern is that security plan, that effective security plan, was not properly executed on the night of the 19th. >> beyond september 19, the most recent incident, the fact that we are just now learning from the washington post that ran a story about the 2011 shooting where a person fired

at the white house, it took four days for the secret service to realize that bullets actually had the white house residence, and that only occurred after a housekeeper and usher identified concern because of a broken window. can a broken window be observed physically from both the inside of the white house as well as the outside? >> in this case, the location of the broken window, up against themansion the sod along truman balcony, it was not visible from the exterior. >> from the exterior. what about the interior? >> the interior, the private residence of the president and the first lady, there were indications that the ballistic last had a dimple or damage to the ballistic glass. that was not recognized by the housekeeping staff until the curtains had been told in preparation for the first -- for the president's and first lady's

return. >> how was it that the secret service personnel prior to the that,eeper finding they did not do the proper assessments, inspection of that location in order to identify that until four days later? >> i will be happy to have a discussion with you in a private session, but typically the private residence of the president and the first lady is that, their private residence. >> i understand you are not able to discuss the exact details of some of the security protocols in this open hearing, and i look forward to asking you more detailed step i step questions about the exact protocols that failed, the missteps by individual agents, and that's and breadth of this review of the investigation of this incident covers.

has there been any disciplinary action pursuit against any of the personnel who failed to follow proper protocol to date? >> that is pending, based upon the conclusion of the investigation to determine , andly what the facts are appropriately, enhancements will be made at propria action will be taken. >> that is where i tend to differ and little bit. of lax of this pattern security, not just from the most recent incident, but from prior incidents, someone should be held accountable. the security of the president of the united states is serious, and his family is serious, and we do not need a long, lengthy review for someone to be held accountable. so i look forward to getting more facts about this in our

executive briefing, but ultimately, director, we need to make sure that people are held accountable. there are men and women in the secret service that doing great job and they are to be commended for that job. but when an individual fails to do their job properly, they need to be held accountable. >> i agree with that statement. people make mistakes. they need to be held accountable. >> thank you. for all members as we near the end of this hearing, we will be going into executive session upstairs at the subcommittee room immediately following this. gentlelady from new mexico is next. mr. chairman, thank you very much. couple of things. i want to go back to many of the

statements that have been made today, and i want to fast-forward to the situation that we are all dealing with, and then i have a very specific question about a protocol that i not in executive session you can answer. we are trying to figure out what we can do in this hearing to understand this incredible breach, but that the same time recognize that this is the people's house, a public building, and to work on this now wants this. you have heard many members be concerned about the thought that sort of camacho should go first, and i think about earlier. this year we had a toddler breach the fence. for me at least, it is clear that that is too far and would create an environment where we all feel that there is a public safety aspect here. but i think in your earlier testimony, you said that we have had 60 individuals try to preach

-- 16 individuals try to breach the fence. >> 16 over five years. 16 this year. >> we know that folks, whether it is a mental illness issue or that,ing in addition to we know we have an issue. i also heard you earlier in your testimony talked about your career in the secret service, that you were at one point in time working on some of the i.t. issues. is that correct? >> yes, ma'am. >> i want to go back to the 2011 incident, and i want to read you what "the washington post" said about that incident. and we have said this several times there's repeating. key people in charge of the safety of the president's family were not aware a shooting had occurred. because officers guarding the white house grounds communicate

on a different radio frequency from the ones used by agents who protect the first family. the agent assigned learned of the shooting a few minutes later from an officer posted nearby. and radiounications dispatch in and of themselves may not be narrowly construed as i.t., i construe communications efforts and particularly in the context of interoperability to be definitely inside that realm. since 2011, have you resolved those two mitigation issues? >> yes, and as a result of the the incident, we have ensured that the same information is passed, the emergency information is passed to all people who have a need to know.

>> all of the radio frequencies communicating are . they are all interoperable. all those committees and techniques are working collector of -- collectively, and so are the alarms? the radio systems are operating with commonality, and that is controlled through our joint operations center. agencies are allowed to operate on the same frequencies based on their work. the alarm systems are now becoming more integrated with some of our radio systems, but we are still in a transition phase. all of the other issues, i'm really struggling with the communications and the for anyal effort personnel to decide not to have .n alarm if you are doing this continuous improvement, training,

investments, and making sure that this deal eat for tech of force is, in fact, just that, state-of-the-art and effective medication could occur without anyone having any idea, for me, it's gross neglect. how does that occur? that levelone at interfere with the protocol established by secret service? -- how does someone at that level interfere with the protocol established by secret service? concern was when these alarms for putting the place that the proximity to other activities within the white house, it could be an interference, such as the tour lines or other public events. >> so interference, and i said that i think you need to be able to address the balances of the public visiting, utilizing, meeting at the white house. that woulding to me

trump your own protocols for making sure you have alarms, aose purpose is to trigger threat so that you can have an effective global within the secret service, interior and exterior, protocol to deal with that. i know i'm out of time. >> some live events to tell you about tomorrow -- bobby jindal will discuss defense policy and offer his thoughts on obama's administration handling of foreign affairs. that's at the american enterprise institute live at 11 a.m. eastern on c-span. then the wilson center hosts the russian foreign minister for discussion on u.s.-russia relationship.

campaign 2014 coverage recently included a debate between the candidates running for governor in oklahoma. that race features mary fallin who is running for a second term against democratic state legislator joe dorman. >> in light of recent natural disasters and school shootings, how do each of you land on a aiding emergency plans for oklahoma's look school system? fax that is a great question. we want to make sure all facilities in the state of oklahoma and the public schools are safe. i just recently this week received the nra endorsement which i am very proud of all stop i'm a big supporter of the second amendment and we want to make sure we do everything we can to create safe rooms are safe facilities at our school.

that's why i propose allowing school districts to look at local needs to be able to decide if they need to enhance their school safety facilities and be able to make those decisions themselves. that's something that is very important will stop i certainly work with our highway patrol, our homeland security in making sure we keep the public aware of any potential threats. we had a tragic episode that happened in the state of oklahoma this week that shook us down to our very foundation and we want to do everything we can to make sure oklahoma is aware that whenever there is a threat that we address those concerns quickly and keep our public informed. are doing everything we can to make sure we have an emergency land in place and we have initiated that many times. i was lieutenant governor when we had the federal building that was bombed many years ago.

i was there during a very different -- very difficult time in oklahoma history and we're going to do everything we can to make sure we are safe and protect our second amendment rights. >> representative dorman, you have 90 seconds. >> sometimes talk is cheap and we need real leadership and action that will respond to this. four years ago, when janet griese took over in the state department of education, one program she illuminated off the bat was the emergency hotline to call in for issues that might be facing your school. we saw when the council met just a couple of years ago that was one of the first said essence to reinstitute. the board my opponent appointed has backed up all of these policies we have seen that have hurt our schools. action and real leadership that will sit down. i champion that after the school shootings a year ago. professionals,l

teachers and parents from all over the state to discuss what we could do better. in bartlesville, we almost saw a tragedy similar to what we saw in sandy hook, but that was averted because students acted the right way. they were ported a situation. we must encourage the students to look for these situations and work with school administrators. i want to see more research officers in the schools will partnerships between municipalities and school districts that have law enforcement officers in the schools to provide safety and security. we must make sure our teachers have the right resources. we cannot continue these cuts. >> more debate coverage begins with the race in north carolina's second district. that airs at 8:00 eastern on c-span. tuesday, live coverage of the

west virginia senate debate between the republican congresswoman and the democrat who currently serves as west virginia's secretary of state. that is >> the student cam competition is underway to does nationwide competition for students will award 150 prizes. minute documentary on the three branches in you. videos need to include c-span programming, show varying points of view, and must be submitted by january 20, 2015. is it >> here on c-span. newsmakers is next with jerry moran of kansas. then rand paul is campaigning in

north carolina for follow republicans. that is followed by president obama speaking at a memorial dedication ceremony for disabled veterans. with00, our conversation the smithsonian national museum director on q&a. >> we want to talk about the national picture. roll call this past week, senator roberts is one of the most 10 most runnable in reelection. a new came out showing him at five points ahead. thedistrict court saying democrats do not have to put a democrat on the ballot. how worried are you? >> there is a race.