speaker, i guess to any of you need a five or ten minute break? okay. so we are going to recess for ten minutes or the sound of the gavel.

>> the committee will come to order. the gentleman from oregon, mister pence, is recognized for

five minutes of questioning. >> thank you, mister chair. let me just start with sheriff daniels. and sheriff, i'm interested in knowing about the, how you would view a system that did not allow asylum claims. if we decide to secure the border completely and cut off asylum claims, and cut off parole claims, that doesn't mean necessarily that the border is going to be secure. there's still going to be issues because the border is a long space and folks will be coming across it. the reason i bring up this reference to asylum and parole is because one secretary mayorkas appear before us, he assured us that the border was secure and that law was being force. but of course, he neglected to point out that literally tens of thousands of people were being allowed in under the guise of both of those perfectly legal devices. so, two questions to you.

first, i was looking at your suggestions on what we needed to do to perhaps secure the border. so, the first question is, which ones the most important if we're actually going to do it? the second one, in the same vein, he is can we do it? do you think we can actually secure the border? and if so, tell us how much money is going to take and i saw your list, i have no idea what the cost would be. can we actually secure the border? >> i do believe, congressman, that we can secure the border to a manageable state. we've seen it done before. i've seen -- for decades of law enforcement where we have manageable border. it'll never be perfect. we've seen that, it'll never see perfection on the -- but what i do see is having the right programs which starts with the president of the united states. i know it's been mentioned before, different presidents, different ideologies. the bottom line is when we have a president that prioritizes all our borders, not just our southern border, and then we enforce the rule of law. we don't always polish the rule of law, we have to enforce the rule of law because -- >> stop there and that takes me

nicely to asylum and pearl. those are the laws. are you suggesting we do away with those and say, the border is now closed? we don't want anybody coming across. is that what you're suggesting? because -- can't let you get away with that polish the rule of law without talking about asylum. >> congressman, when i say i always put border security first, and then immigration second. because we can talk immigration all day, but the borders not secure, we're going to be inviting ourselves like we are in this meeting today. so, when i talk about asylum, i believe in asylum. you've got to do it legally, have to go through port of entry, as designated by our rule of law. you can't come across our border illegally and then have no consequences. that's what -- i've been a cop 38 years, i've been in the military. i support the rule of law, i've never been changed from that. i've done that for so long. so, we've got to have rules that we are going to follow. not that we make them subjective to what political

ideology fits. we have to have a rule that fits and that's why i say we have to enforce the rule of law or we change it to make it fit current times. >> right and with mass migration, that's a real challenge. mister don, i really, really sorry for your loss. and i have some staff ask you during break if there was a way of testing for fentanyl, so that children, such as your son, could have some means where they could check to see if that which they are taking has been contaminated with fentanyl. my i understand that there may be a way to do it, but it's designated as drug paraphernalia and that's not available. tell us about what the future is when it comes to trying to warn kids who are taking these kinds of things of the danger. >> there are fentanyl test strips that are available. right now, they're classified as drug paraphernalia. excuse me. and one of the things that we are working on, along with other families that we talk

within texas, and as well as multiple of our democratic state representatives, our current representative is a democrat. it's to have these removed from that classification. governor abbott has already stated that he will sign any legislation that decriminalize is fentanyl test strips. they just have to get that legislation out there, so it can be enacted. >> why would anybody object? >> they won't. everybody that we've spoken to is on board with it. it's just our session in texas doesn't meet as frequently, so they have to, we've been told it is one of the priorities, but i believe there are several different bills out there. so, i think it's finally just getting everybody on board and getting it done is what we are waiting on. i think our session just convened a few weeks ago, and

that's one of the top priorities from the representatives that we've spoken to. >> yeah, thank you for being here. i yield back. >> thank you. >> from north carolina, miss ross is recognized. >> thank you, mister chairman and first, mr. done and to your wife, i'm just so profoundly sorry for your loss. i've met with the families of folks who have lost loved ones to fentanyl. it's a problem in my home state of north carolina. i think it's quadruple a problem. and so, i'm 100% with you in finding a way to stop this drug from coming into our country and spreading throughout the country. and so, please, please know that. i'm just so much saddened by this hearing, because we have had the opportunity to work on bipartisan immigration reform, both immigration reform that deals with the safety and security of our border and that

addresses the needs of our workforce. i represent north carolina and so, we have a huge agriculture industry that is dependent on migrant farmworkers. we also have a lot of people in our state who come to work in high tech companies, and in bio pharma, and they are having difficulty with their visas and extending their stays. and it really is incumbent on all of us to work together to solve this problem. we're seeing some glimmers of hope on the senate side, but my great fear is that we're going to have one sided hearings on the house side that don't bring people together to be able to both solve the situation at the border, which is both a humanitarian and a safety issue, and make sure that we have the

workforce that we need. and as i said, in my state of north carolina, that workforce comes from all corners of the world, but has insecurity about whether or not they're going to be able to stay and whether or not their children are going to be able to say. and so, it's my hope that the majority on this committee really wants to do that hard work. i know that congresswoman lofgren is not here right now, but the work that she did on farmworker modernization was bipartisan. and important. and helped with border issues, and helped with making sure we had enough farmworkers. i worked last session in a bipartisan way to help the documented dreamers and these are young people who come here legally, with their parents, on a visa. but because our immigration system is so broken, they have to self deport at age 21. and we have bipartisan sponsors on the house and senate side that got through the house, and

we really, really hoping to work on that. and so, it's in that spirit that i would both ask my colleagues to work on this issue and i will be asking some questions of our witnesses. and my first question is for our judge, please tell me how to appropriately pronounce your name. >> samaniego. >> samaniego. so as i've said, immigration has become such a partisan issue. and what i'd like to know from you are, what are things that work where you think we can get some bipartisan support at the border? >> and i'm glad you're seeing that, congresswoman, because we gain a lot of traction and things seem to be moving in the right direction, when politics enters, it sort of distract us from doing what we need to do. but i think you would think that this point that, you know, necessity would give us the way

towards getting job creations and, you know, we hear a lot about that. and i ask two questions from every migrant, every person i meet, and that's one, how long have you been traveling? just to get into sympathize with what's happening with them. and then secondly, what is it that you did in your country? and i can tell you plumbers, teachers, brick layers, agriculture, i mean, everyone has, there is no one that had said, i'm just a labor or i'm just -- they working farms, they work in doing things that we need. and so, if you connect the two that we have a tremendous need, i know just in el paso, right? right there on the border, we have maybe 20% that we could use 20%, especially in the service industries and the entertainment industries, and they have all of that -- the abilities and i think the first thing is, you know, instead of trying to eat the elephant in one sitting, that we start saying, what are some of the small things that we could do? i believe from just my

experience, job creation and connecting the immigration situation to jobs, we've already lived through the -- situation that, you know, we needed and we use it properly, and it was very successful. so, i think the first thing that i hear is ready to work and if we could connect it with our needs here in our country. >> thank you so much and i yield back. >> gentlelady yields back. judge, why wasn't it fix last year? >> pardon me? >> why wasn't it fix last year? gentlelady talk about working in a bipartisan situation to facts fix this problem? why wasn't it fixed last year? >> what wasn't a fix last? are >> you talk about the concerns of how we work together. i just want to know, why wasn't it fix last year? they didn't need bipartisan support last year. lets congress, they controlled everything in the federal government. it's a federal government solution, why didn't they fix it? >> one of the things that we're doing today and i appreciate that, as we are having a dialogue. those dialogues -- >> i'm all for dialogues, i'm all for working together, but now it's all bipartisan. they had, first of all, they

say there's no problem on the border, the border security. then the company who say no, no, we have to work in a bipartisan way to fix it. now that we're in control of the house of representatives. all i'm saying is last congress, they control everything. joe biden is a democrat in the white house, the senate was controlled by the democrats in the house was controlled by the democrats. why didn't they fix it then? >> i think that falls more on your corner than mine. >> my corner? >> yes because -- >> in the minority lets congress? >> what we do is maintain the flow and try to do the best we can with a broken system. we have nothing to do with fixing a system. and so -- >> you understand how the united states government works, right? majority now house, majority in the senate -- he signs, it they could've done that last congress. they did not. why not? >> what a great opportunity for you. >> great opportunity, that's where we're having the hearing. they criticize us on the hearing, they say, why do we start this congress off with this hearing? they can't have it every way and they can't blame republicans when they were in control. you can come here and you can say, oh no, now it's time for bipartisanship. we welcome that. we really want to address the problem. the problem that caused mr. and

mrs. dunn to lose their son. the problem that sheriff has talked to us about that's been so, so dramatically changed in the last couple of years. that's what we want to address. i yield the remainder of my time to the gentleman from texas, mr. roy. >> i thank the chairman for his remarks and just got to follow up, judge, with the question of you when you and i came to an agreement about the numbers of 55, 000, roughly, that had been encountered in december in the el paso sector. some 200, i can't remember the exact number, i'm sorry, 45 or 50,000 encountered over the fiscal year, of three months. how many of those encountered have been turned away under title 42? >> have been what? >> how many of those have been turned away under title 42, with respect to the -- >> i'm not sure of that number, but i think from the border control they're looking at about 35%. >> that tracks with the numbers

that i understand, right? you're talking about, of the 55, 000, you would have 18 to 20,000 will be turned away under title 42. about 50,000 of those 150,000 would've been turned away under title 42. we know there is a situation in el paso with the difficulty of dealing with the process and the numbers. now we have busing going on across the country. what happens if title 42 is no longer being enforced? >> i think you're doing the right thing. because, as you know, it was a public health mandate. it had nothing to do with migration. if you want to figure get to the problem, that was very confusing because it had to do a something totally different that is now being utilized. to me, i think the reason we would lift it is because we continue the process and do it properly. and you're not going to have all these other individuals that are trying to cross illegally, because that's their only way to get their. as i've said over and over,

there's a lot of them that have been stuck in the middle that came thinking title 42 is going to be lifted. when it wasn't, lifted they fell into this desperation. i believe and i say over and over -- >> judge, i'm running out of, time i'm sorry. we just have limits on time. >> go ahead. >> i would say to you that way you just described it's all in the context of border security. it's all in the context of who comes in and who doesn't, right? which is what borders acuity is. there's some data been critical of saying we should enforce our existing laws with respect to asylum laws. asylum laws which require detention, that's what our current laws require. detention will make a determination. a determination of credible fear for persecution under our asylum laws, which is a smaller number than the people who are coming that would qualify. so, we're saying we should detain in order to make those determinations.

the connection to title 42 is really important because the current administration is, even in all of its bluster about title 42 still defending the law in court. because they know what happens when title 42 goes away. what you just described is really important for the american people to understand. you just described it in the context of border security, not the context of covid and the pandemic because it's being used as a border security band-aid. what we must do as a body's policy changes to make sure we can manage the flow while respecting our laws, with respect to asylum. which is precisely what house republicans are putting forward, notwithstanding the allegations of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle. i yield back. >> the chair now recognizes the gentleman from maryland, mr. ivey. >> want to thank you all for

kelly to testify today, mister don and your family in particular. i want to commend you actually. it turned a tragedy in your family into action that's making a difference in your community and your state. i was especially appreciative of your comments about the effort to utilize testing for fentanyl, i guess in texas, and the texas state legislature. >> correct. >> i think it's important for people like you to continue that kind of work, bring that activism into the public arena. because i think of voices that are immensely important. certainly an impact in my community. just the past week or two, in fact, congressman trona and i were having to deal with the situation, a family that straddles are two districts in montgomery and prince george candy that's having issues with fentanyl. i've seen recently, there have been high school deaths and

overdoses with respect to fentanyl. so, it's clearly a major problem. supportive of your efforts to try and address it. i was a prosecutor beginning back in 1990. it wasn't that no, then it was crack cocaine. i became an elected prosecutor in prince george's, we still had cocaine. there is pcp, all sorts of drugs like that. some of it coming across the border like cocaine, some of it like pcp, not. but i think it's clear that this is an issue that we need to do more to address. that's kind of why i was disappointed with hr 29. it's a bill, as i reviewed it, that was supposedly the republican leadership effort on addressing these kinds of issues. i just took a look at the bill and it didn't really do anything with respect to the problems you addressed today. the need for additional

resources, getting rid of the backlog. judges in courts and the like, to address some of those issues. i think congressman swalwell asked about whether 20,000 additional border agents would be helpful. there's no additional resources that are provided under this legislation. and the legislation rate some additional issues too but i wanted to raise. we got a letter from the u.s. conference of catholic bishops which they submitted to the congress in response to their reading of hr 29. their position was they asked for members to vote against it. we urge you to vote against hr 29, as well as any subsequent legislative proposals that would unjustly deprive vulnerable peoples of the legal right to seek humanitarian protection in the united states. i know we've had a little discussion about whether this bill impacts humanitarian rights. clearly the catholic bishops

had concerns about it. this bishop wrote this. most concerning is that the bill effectively expands the policy, that's of title 42, without any exceptions for those with bona fide asylum claims. unaccompanied children, victims of torture, victims of trafficking. protecting these populations are delineated, they let some of the statues that are in place currently. moving forward with this piece of legislation would exacerbate the harm faced by vulnerable persons, while also feeling to meaningfully address the root causes of migration and the unsustainable conditions at our southwest border. not only will the challenges we face persist, people will suffer. we must remain true to our laws and our nations proud tradition of offering safety an opportunity to those who have lost everything besides hope for a better future. and they end with this. the bishops committee called on

us to reject the contemporary forces of division that tempt us with false choice between our security and our humanity. our great nation is capable of safeguarding both our humanity and our security. judge, let me ask you, what sorts of resources and support do you think would be helpful in addressing this crisis that we're having at the border? you mentioned, you testified a little bit about the governor and the absence of support at the state level. i wonder if you'd elaborate on that. >> yes, they have resources and they should be understanding what we need. we're, texas for some reason people, forget they probably think new mexico because we're so far away from the capital. we need to have those discussions on sheltering, and processing. like i, said we can go to as much as 1200 a day processing. all of these are individuals

that have sponsors are able to move quickly, that same day. and that helps us to be able to address all the other concerns we have of the other 60%. but i want to reel, quickly if you don't mind, just to comment on the congressman from texas. >> my time has expired, so perhaps we should wait until the next round. >> we can get that at the next round. the turnout recognizes the gentleman from kentucky, mr. benson. >> i yield my time to mr. fitzgerald from wisconsin. >> thank you, mr. massie, from the time. sheriff, one of the things i tried to focus on in the hearings that we've had on the border is the corridors that exist throughout the united states, because i'm always perplexed, i think, when you hear people talk about, well, it's an issue at the border, but it's not an issue in wisconsin or south dakota, north dakota. that's not the case, right? the other thing i'd say is, you know, we strip clubs, head shops, truck stops, all of these types of locations are

kind of where this stuff is transported, right? we started to see that probably ten years ago, maybe even longer. how it's being distributed. so, i was running if you could comment on that because the one thing we have a fentanyl is, we still have issues, i think, related to it not being a schedule one drug. that's something that congress should do as well. i wonder if you could comment on that. >> i can and there's been a shift over the last couple of years on smuggling. -- two thoughts on this. first of all, since there is less border patrol on the border now, and they're more into processing, they're very thin, so the migrants that are being smuggled, they get him up to the closest asphalt, the closest highway, cars pull in, grab them, they're gone. so, the old quarters like you're talking about that were very common, they're not as use like they used to. -- we the other aspect of when you're talking about the trafficking aspect of it, when your trafficking kids and

adults, females and males, the trafficking aspect of non consensual part of it is, yes, they're taking them to stash houses, they're making them servant within truck stops, for example. but then strip clubs and places like that. just a little side note on that, one of the question has been asked to me, but one of the things we've done on the many, many innovative thoughts is, we have a program through our nonprofit where we're going after the cartels that are trafficking these people. and we're going after them not just in my county, but we're going with sheriffs and dallas, texas, sacramento, california, throughout urban areas where we know they're being taken to and exploited. so, we're doing that program again, that's a multi million dollar program that we're putting forward. >> thank you very much, i appreciate the comments. i would yield back to mr. massie. >> thank you. >> thank, you i yield my time to mr. roy from texas. >> i thank you, gentleman from kentucky. kayla hamilton, 20 years old. aberdeen, maryland. she was recently brutally murdered by an ms-13 gang

member whose with allowed into the united states as a usc last year, who was 17 years old. there was a 24 year old honduran egg or immigrant charge with murder in the brutal seven down of a florida man after crossing the u.s. border illegally while posing as a u.s. aid, u.s. ac. he was found covered in blood after allegedly killing a father of four who had taken the immigrant in, because the immigrant had posed as a usc. it's not always as simple as some of my colleagues say. , some one of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle have been spending some time today misleading the american people, telling untruths about legislation that i have put forward, hr 29. and in so doing, using words like on christian. the legislation, to be clear to all, is legislation that reiterate's existing law. it makes very clear under existing law, we are supposed to detain when we have somebody

who's seeking asylum. it maintains our asylum laws in full and requires that we detain. to be clear for everybody to listen, i want to follow with mr. daniels, for your view on this. my colleagues on the other side of the aisle are universally saying to the american people and to all they represent, to every single american citizen, they are saying that they believe we should release, against current law, that we should release into the united states, using parole, which is supposed to be on a case by case basis, released into the united states under parole where notices to appear without having full detention of someone making an asylum claim. they're making false accusations about a law saying that we should follow the law, and detain. and so, my question for you, sheriff, with your knowledge of the law, is, if we were going to follow the law, would that not slow down the numbers, funnel in those who can make a legitimate asylum claim so that

they could then be detained for adjudication of that claim, so they could still claim asylum and americans would be safer and migrants would be safer? can the sheriff respond to that? >> yes, congressman. the answer to that is yes. that's our approach on the national sheriffs, western sheriffs southwest border. address that with secretary marcus -- in a room about enhanced judicial oversight. when it comes to how we address them at the border. right now, there is no consequence. i mean, they know if they come here, they claim those couple words, they're in the country. they will come back within the year for the first hearing and then -- >> so that is key, they know that they will get released. therefore, that's a problem at the border. i yield back. >> the gentleman for texas, mr. goodin, is recognized. >> thank you, mister chairman. judge samaniego, i was listening to your testimony earlier and in your opening statement, you said there is no open border in texas. yet, it seems that you've spent the last several years

processing, as you say, migrants that have come across. so, i don't know how you can see there's no open border. you mentioned several times, in fact, that your processing illegal immigrants and i would like for you to elaborate what you mean by processing. because a little over a month ago, about 1500 migrants cross the rio grande in a single night and our report suggests that because there weren't enough beds, more than 600 of these release these migrants were released into the streets. is that an example of processing? >> the example of processing is that the border patrol lets us know about those that have been sponsored. they've been on at that point and this is what we worked really closely with them. >> you are saying if they have a sponsor, they're allowed into the country with the requirement? >> no, that facilitates the fact that they are allowed into a country and when it process, they become legal. and at that point, the fact that they have a sponsor allows us to work with the persons that are legal. we never try to process illegal, at any point, at anytime, there was no consideration.

>> one of the things you mentioned where these ngos, catholic charities was brought up. are you aware of taxpayer dollars being spent on those? you talked about plastic, it's shelter. i've been to the border personally and seen catholic charities put migrants in hotels and sound them to the airport, purchase flights. where is that money coming? from >> in el paso, most of them are donations from the public. they get donations, we have and none ca should have. >> you don't believe there's taxpayer dollars being spent on that? >> let me give you an example. one of the ding examples that houses and shelters or moving forward is an enunciation house and they don't use any federal money. because they feel like they'd be trapped into that. >> the information i have from our government is that we've been quite a bit on that. i hope this committee will determine just how much. i would also implore you to revise some of your wording.

you've called several of us racist. and opening testimony, you said there is no invasion of migrants in our country, staying at such continues the false racist narrative. he went so far as to try to link these words to a horrible crime that was committed in your city. i would advise you to watch your words when you're talking to people like mr. dunn who are voicing a very serious issue. migrants are absolutely invading this country. i applied this, bill i'm very disappointed in the testimony i heard from my colleague at maryland, citing the catholic bishops. i think bishops have endorsed this charities varies to encourage more migration. they've encouraged and facilitated child trafficking and a lot of the violence that we've seen of borders. it's absolutely open, out yield the remainder of my time to mr. roy from texas. >> i yield back. >> when you yield? >> i yield to the chairman. >> thank you, gentlemen, for yielding. on day one, president biden

cared them urgency declaration on the southwest border. number two, on day one, he halted construction of the border wall. number three, on day, one he provoked president trump's immigration enforcement authorities. on day, one he paused deportations. number five, he moved to terminate the asylum cooperative agreements with countries. number six, he froze and romance of the remain in mexico program. to any of those things factor into the considerations you mentioned in your opening statement at this influx of people coming to our border? the data of those six things that president biden did on day one contribute to the situation we now find ourselves in? >> mister chairman, it did. and that's all of. it >> every single? one >> every one of them changed. we went from what i consider probably in my 38 career almost manageable borders, that was also shared -- >> i want to be clear of what you said, sheriff. the most manageable border we had in your 38 years of law enforcement was two years ago? >> yes, it was. >> on day, one president biden

turban as the emergency declaration on the southwest border. that's contributing to the problem we now have, right? >> yes, sir. >> he halted construction on the wall, is a contributing? >> yes, my borders president time in my county. >> he revoked president trump's immigration enforcement priorities. to that contribute to the problem we now see? >> it has. >> including the footnotes getting to communities and harming people like mr. dunn's son? >> yes. >> not, harming taking his life. he paused deportations. is that hurting? that's what mr. roy was just talking about. >> it's all a collective mess, the borders open. >> terminated the asylum cooperative agreements and suspended enrollments of the remain in mexico program. that's contributing to the situation we now have. >> yes. >> this idea that if we just give more agents, build more wall, put in the roads, more drones, more border security, which i'm all for, that's going to solve it. that's not gonna solve it until you go back to these policies. is that? right >> that's correct. mister chair, if i could add one more thing, before president biden took office, myself and several other

sheriffs on behalf of the national sheriffs met with president biden's transition team. and went over all the current plans on the border to include what was working. i was told by his transition team, sheriff, we appreciate all you're doing. they're very optimistic that things were doing well on the border. they took over, that all changed. >> that's important. what you just said, i know i'm overtime, or go to the gentleman from colorado. what users that is import because he basically told biden administration do this and will have secure border, the most secure in your 38 years of law enforcement. and they basically said, thanks but no thanks. that right? >> they are very complimentary. i was shocked on day one. >> even worse! >> they were very, thank you share for everything you're doing. they, one when i saw, that i was disappointed in shocked. he >> yield to the gentleman from chicago, mr. -- >> thank, you mister chairman. first, how to say congratulations to the chairman on his ascension to the chairmanship of the committee. i missed organization meeting

this morning so i wanted to make sure -- >> missed you. >> appreciate, that i'll be there for the future meetings. i want to say thank you to the acting number, from texas, miss escobar for her leadership during a difficult time for the country and her community in el paso. we're all grateful for her service to the country, her caucus into her community. that i have visited and look for the visiting again. to the witnesses, i want to thank, you judge, for your testimony and your service. sheriff, thank you for your service and the service of your many deputies and all the law enforcement who are engaged in herculean efforts in protecting our communities. mr. dunn, i want to thank you that our hearts and thoughts and prayers are with you. my wife and i are expecting our second child later this year. a son. it breaks my heart to hear your story. very much want you to know that i think across both sides of the aisle here, everyone

express our deepest condolences to you and your family. sheriff, i just want to dig in a little bit on your testimony. i reviewed the written testimony that was submitted by all the witnesses and a lot of -- you had written testimony but also a memo that was upended, essentially, and appendix to your testimony. i reviewed that appendices and you suggest a lot of proposals, ideas of programs that i gather you believe would help us ameliorate the emergency. that's happening on our southern border. in digging through some of these, just for example, you idlest communication interoperability with local law enforcement. i think that something that all members of congress would you support. democrats, republicans, that's a common sense steps that we ought to be funding. you list here continued funding in support for the stone garden

program. i don't know if you can talk a little bit about what the stone garden program is, i'm certainly aware of it, some of my colleagues might not be. i know my colleague from texas are. but if you care to talk a little bit about that program, the dhs program that you would like to see have continued support for. >> it's one of the only programs, congressman, where stone garden brings premiership tween cbp enters and local law enforcement, to acquit our state law enforcement. it's a program that sheriffs nationally and beyond have supported. it is our overtime, you are is working side by side with porn patrol. it's a great program. >> here's why bring that up. the stone garden program has been existence for quite some time. back during the administration of president obama, it was at about $50 million, given the fiscal year. right, now we are finding it at $90 million for the fiscal year 2023 budget that the president has admitted. that's the exact same number that president trump, former

president trump, submitted during the course of his presidency. that's why i offer that is because, to me, these aren't partisan or proposals that, at the end of the day, are focused on blaming one side or the other. this is an example of something that president biden has continued to do. to support. i presume you support, that that he's continued funding for the stone garden. similarly, you put here, one of the items in terms of a proposal that you like to implement, to hire more immigration and asylum hearing officers for all po ease from port of entry's, i presume that acronym. i'm sure you're aware of this, january 5th, a few weeks ago the president announced there be an increase of officers at the border to help process migrants. that's in addition to the 25,000 officers, obviously we're waiting in terms of the presidents budget to get the exact number. but i think that something you

support as well, i presume, in terms of adding more officers. >> i do, i do. >> the reason i'm asking those questions, again, to kind of land here at the end. from my perspective and for my constituents perspectives in northern colorado and western colorado, they are focused on solutions. trying to solve the problem. and you've outlined a couple of solutions here, i'd love to be able to have a thoughtful conversation with my colleagues on the other side of the aisle about these different prescriptive proposals. and it'll play so we can find consensus. but unfortunately, at least as i've gathered from the parts of the hearing that i've heard, it's a lot of heat from some of my colleagues, unfortunately. about blame and characterizing the problem instead of solving the problem. so, i'm hoping we can get to that. with, that at the yield my remaining time to the ranking member. >> thank you, mr. neguse. two quick points. the folks that are being processed by cbp who are seeking asylum, i want to remind my colleagues, seeking

asylum is illegal. once they've been processed, they are legally in the country. second thing, mr. roy stated that we politics bill on christian. we did not. we are quoting his colleague from texas in the republican conference, mr. tony gonzalez. he is the one who called mr. roy bill on christian. finally, i'd like to ask my colleagues not to slander the u.s. conference of bishops, catholic charities in the catholic church as one of our republican colleagues did just moments ago. thank you, i yield back. >> gentleman from texas is recognized, mr. nehls. >> thank, you mister chairman. i like to thank the witnesses for being here. it's no secret, it's self evident, we are facing the worst border crisis in the history of our great country. it's self induced, a self induced crisis and it falls at the feet of joe biden and his border star kamala harris. who have addressed very little concern in addressing our border crisis, as evidenced by their unwillingness to place

the american people first. i'd like to address chair of daniels and thank you for your almost four decades of service and law enforcement. sheriff, in your written testimony, you highlight tragedies in your county related to illegal immigration. a former sheriff in texas, big county, and i feel your pain. sheriff, i feel your pain. >> thank you. >> i also experienced a loss of life of innocent county residents, americans, at the hands of joe biden's irresponsible border policy. it's very clear the individuals from around the globe that have been invited into our country by this administration do not have the american best interest at heart. i say that's because they are willing to kill. share, of you shared a personal tragedy in your testimony about a citizen, wanda, i believe, 65 years old. attending her birthday party, going to celebrate her 65th birthday. ramp back, hard high-speed

chase, ran a red light and killed her. the smuggler had three illegal aliens inside that vehicle. it ended her life. and then i understand that shortly thereafter her son ended up driving upon the scene. i can't imagine! i can't imagine how he felt, what he felt when he saw that car with his mother inside that vehicle. but stories like this are often to comment, their comment today. i want to show you this here, this is here. this guy. this guy. his name is mr. cheval o. he ran over and killed miss boone. last name was booed, 81 years old. ran, of fled the, scene took off. we apprehended, him sheriff's office apprehended him. couple hours later, we start putting him into the county jail. we run him. this knucklehead it's been deported six previous times. six!

i think the american people will say, how does a guy get deported more than once? he's been deported six previous times. dealer just a few stories that share of details and i are sick and tired of telling the stories. we're sick of having to families come into our offices and explain that their loved ones were killed by people that shouldn't be here in the first place. about to turn my attention to judge samaniego's testimony. your testimony claims are center has assisted 6229 asylum seekers. it opened up in october of 2022, correct? for months, 62, 000, fair enough. that has shown that between the ears of 2008 and 2019 just 14%, 14% of aliens, who claim credible fear were granted asylum. that means 86% don't. so, 40% of -- its 3756. would you agree with that

number? okay. congratulations. her center has assisted over 23,000 illegals that have been scattered throughout the country. coming up to houston, buses, bus every day. scattered throughout the entire country. 23,000 of those will never be able to have a legitimate asylum claim. because only 14% of them do. sir, that puts the american people at risk. and it puts the american people last. he stated there is no invasion of migrants in our community, nor their hordes of undocumented immigrants committing crimes against citizens or causing havoc in your community. i'll say this. el paso pd, february 25th, 2020, to finally crimes on the rise in el paso. the sergeants that we've seen a 27% increase in offenses involving weapons. stabbings, everything. here's another. one el paso cups arrest to migrants in overwhelmed border city, that's your, city sir.

people selling dope, doing all sorts of stuff. illegals, venezuelans running around and stolen police cars. talk to having to chase them. here, two days ago, we have here in the city of houston the enforcement removal operations. have to remove a guy that was in houston illegally. he goes and commits an armed robbery in the city of houston. we arrested, think it does we arrested him. we find out he's got a murder warrant out of mexico. so, we've got some problems here, sir. i like to ask you this question. do you believe these illegal migrants are coming into these communities and harming american citizens? >> -- >> thank, you your answer is yes. you know that houston is right next to my district. i will say this, my eyes are wide open, the american peoples are wide open, a basket open yours. i yield back. >> the chair recognizes miss bush. >> thank you. to mr. dunn, my condolences, very sorry for your tremendous loss.

to judge samaniego, thank you very much for your testimony and four listening and enduring and for giving your testimony. st. louis and i are here to recognize the humanity of all people, regardless of immigration status. you know, we are here in opposition to any racist agenda pursued by republicans. and let's take a moment to reflect on this first month of republican control of the house. the disastrous and embarrassing speakers vote that resulted in the selling of the gavel to a bunch of pro coup members of congress. the seeding of insurrectionists and someone who defrauded his way into congress. that's where we are. now, this hearing, whose purposes seems to amplify the anti immigrant hysteria and right-wing conspiracy theories.

the republican position on immigration is to inflict as much cruelty as possible on people fleeing suffering and persecution. as democrats, we need to recognize this reality and refused to be a part of it. that's why i strongly oppose the administration's expansion of title 42 and the reinstatement of the asylum transit ban. he is lawless and inhumane policies deny the right to asylum while failing to address any of the underlying structural problems of our immigration system. so, judge samaniego, i want to ask you, do you believe title 42 is an effective or humane immigration policy? >> there's not. i thank you for being practical. because i need to get back to this idea of detaining them until they're able to vet them. that's one of the most impractical things i've ever

heard of. right, now border patrol is shivering thinking, how are we going to do that? without the community being involved, for pushing that on them. for their 1400 spaces and we're going to detain them. we talk about the humidity of the border patrol. just think about what it would take to detain until we vet them. it would be impossible. i remember growing, up we'd say, how do you put 50 people in a volkswagen? 25 in the, front 25 in the back. that's about as impractical as this idea of detaining them until you can let them go, but you don't have the facility, don't have the man power. it's the impractical solutions that confuse people. i tell you but we know, we've been able to manage things and we know, that when there's issues and other parts of the border, it's because of a lack of organization. it's the lack of collaboration, so lack of a lot of different

things. when you have people running into your country because you're not well organized and you're not using collaboration, we've had two or three incidents, we have 800 people out that were not able to manage because of funding. there is communities that i've had of many as 10,000 because they're not organized properly. so, i can tell you, our strategy works. and if people listen to it and we were able to share the ideas and how we've been successful, i can tell you that we minimize the problem credibly, minimize a problem for the federal government. and there should be some kind of appreciation for community that is sensible about what's happening in el paso. and we all know that we don't want to happen to the rest of the nation. all we hear is, you know, did i use the wrong word, where i said racist. i never said that. what i said is thating those narratives creates more racism in a community. i didn't say anything about the people involved in it.

so, i thank you for looking at practical reasons. and i'm appalled when somebody has an idea like detaining them as a solution. when that's the most impractical thing you could probably do. thank you. >> thank you, thank you for your work and thank you for explaining that. as democrats, we must refuse to adopt illegal and effective solutions to this complex, long-standing crisis. we must be better than what we're seeing coming from republicans. republicans want to talk about biden's border crisis. but the reality is we have a broken immigration system because republicans want as to. so they can hold these hearings to mask the fact that they have no affirmative agenda that actually helps people. so they can speak their lies about immigrants bringing fentanyl across the border while exploiting victims and refusing to support investments in public health and addiction treatment. so they can take their anger and as a court is on the most

vulnerable. history will not look kindly on those politicians. thank you, i yield back. >> chair recognizes mr. hunt from texas. >> thank, you chairman, i appreciate it. mr. dunn, thank you for being here. my condolences to your family, from the bottom of my heart a very sorry and i hope we can do something to fix this issue of fentanyl in our country. mr. samaniego, thank you for your continued service. serge, thank you for being here, thank you for taking time under your very busy schedule to be here. i greatly appreciate everyone on this panel today. we've heard a lot of talk today about the 5 million people, illegal people, that have entered this country. and that's a, fact there's absolutely no getting around that. 5 million people have entered our country illegally, that's the equivalent to seven congressional districts. enough fentanyl has poured into our country to kill every american five times. i'll say that again, to kill every american five times. sir, your son is one of those

americans. this is a fact. i'm from houston. houston is known for a lot of things, we don't for the world champion astros and were also known for being the human trafficking capital of the entire world. that's not anything i'm proud of. this is all happening at our southern border as we live and breathe every single day. sir, judge, i'm not criticizing what you're saying, i'm listening to you and your heart and where you're coming from. but you did say that there is no invasion here. i'm somebody that likes to weaken the definition of things before we can actually have this conversation. according to oxford, the definition of invasion it's an incursion by a large number of people or things into a place or sphere of activity. i'll say it again, an incursion by a large number of people, i would say 5 million people constitutes a large number, or things, and say enough mental

deported or country to kill every american five times is the thing. i would consider that to be the direct definition of the word invasion. my colleague mr. gooden talked about race and using the word race and racist. i've been black for a long, time sir, so i get it. i've been a minority in this country for a long time. but this is actually not about race. this is actually an issue of public safety. if i call this, if i call this an invasion, sir, i'm not racist. i can assure you i'm not racist. what i can assure you is i want to make sure that no doesn't indiscriminately kill any race, religion, color or creed. because funnel doesn't care where you're from. that'll doesn't care about race. fentanyl kills indiscriminately. this gentleman right here works his tail off every single day

to stop that from happening. it's been a break at them, that's pretty obvious. because a couple of years ago, of course, we had some problems. but it was amplified to the level that we're seeing every single day. it's why we have to be careful with what we call and what we do racist moving forward in the future is because we start to lose focus on what the actual problem is. this administration and democratic party unfortunately uses race as a scapegoat for everything. somebody that wants to make sure that we do attack racist issues when they do occur, we can't be the boy who cried wolf and blame racism all the time. i'm here to hold this administration accountable to understand that there are issues of race that need to be addressed. and sir, this ain't one of them. a plot of some of your actions in el paso, it sounds like you're doing some great things. but i'm going to tell you, being born and raised in texas,

living in houston, we have a problem. this problem has precipitated over the course of the past two years. that is a fact. i get working together, i get reaching across the aisle. but this morning, i can't believe that we had a one hour debate over whether or not we should stay the pledge of allegiance before we can feed every day. one hour. that, to me, antithetical to the point of this meeting today. i implore you all to be careful with using race, because your son is no longer here. and i'm sorry. there's 100,000 sons and daughters that are no longer here because of fentanyl last year. this debate is very important, very spirited, but i implore this entire committee to take a strong look at what's happening over the course of the past few years and to derive substantive solutions to this problem. so that our youth can continue to have a future for this country.

it ain't about race. we are all in this together. i yield back, chairman, thank you. >> chair recognizes himself for five minutes. let me first say thanks to all the witnesses, we appreciate you being here. mr. dunn, i'm reminded of roman's 8:28. i know the plans i have, the plants to prosper, you not do your harm, more importantly all things were taylor good unaltered called your purpose. this denial was telling me how you are using this to tell the young people all across the country. that's a service to our nation, thank you for being here. with that, sheriff daniels, i want to cut away to you for a minute. been to the border a couple times down here. one of the things i took, away we talked a lot of statistics. a lot of things to see, in the record 5 million which is basically my states entire population of alabama. we had that many encounters on the border. the one that kind of struck me the most, is what i began to talk about and find out there

is a price that these people were paying become across the u.s. border. so, will you explain to me exactly who is controlling the u.s. southern border? and who's getting paid? >> congressman, it's a simple answer, that is the criminal organization called the cartels. they control the south of our national border, the south of it's all controlled. they control who comes across, there's prices based on who you are. a terrorist coming from a different country. india was $21, 000, for example. but the minimum is they want $7,000 right now. but to those people don't have it. when they come across the country, it might go through processing as the honorable judges talked about. but they're serve it to the cartels at the end. which is usually for sex trade, gangs, drugs, labor, you name it. i've seen no win-win in this. because we don't have a manageable process right. now >> sheriff, one of the things i heard was initially, with the course of inflation in this country, the rate we're spending, money everything is going up. now is our, there is about $4,000 for anyone just south of

the u.s. border. and then for countries further south it was 78,000. we had a price of that, time 20,000 -- refugees. recently, i think we -- testified and told us that we had two chinese nationals captured on those southern border who paid $80,000 each to come into our country illegally. my question, is what happens to that individual that says we want to come to america, we want to come to the great land of prosperity, and they don't have the money? say they cut a 7000 dollar deal with the sentinel like camp, whatever you call, the cartel. so they made that deal and they agreed to pay $7,000. from, there what happens? today committed the country? to they have to have the money prepaid? are they indentured servants? i heard the slave term earlier today? >> it's truly modern day slavery. the lessons of life and history should be playing out today. these people that don't, they go through processing, no doubt about it. they're well watched by the cartels on the u.s. side.

and they released into a family, member known family member, whoever. the bottom line is they're also received by the cartels. nato, that we hear, we see it. the american dream that you talk about, congressman, what we talk, about what people in this room talk about, in those circumstances it's never met. because they are a servant to these criminal cartels for bad, bad things. >> they want to make a deal and not necessarily make unstable, payments that could in fact cause her win or cocaine across the border, it's not the case? >> they're going to do with the cartels. do a lot of people make the comment weather here and united states, they're protected, they also have family in mexico that the hold hostage. it keeps them doing what they do here. they have the strings on the family in mexico. we heard that all the time. >> got you, one other thing i want to touch on real quick. when i was at fort bliss, i was at the emergency intake center.

that was for unaccompanied minors in the u.s.. i decided i didn't take the two or three facility, i decided to stay outside. ice was in a video well, young people shipped all over the country. they seized my phone on site. they did not want any record of people being shipped, young, unaccompanied minors to do google addresses in the u.s.. so, i asked the admiral onside, i said, sir can you tell me, where we shipping these children to? his response to me, well, we are building the buses. they had never seen the kind of influx that we are seeing coming here unaccompanied. they were building the buses. here's the thing, guys, here's the thing. young, unaccompanied minors, they were not doing background checks on who they were shipping them to. we are shipping these children to google addresses and send it back home to their country. who knows what happened to those minors in this country. with that, my time has come to an end, who do i need to recommend?

mr. kiley, you're recognized for five minutes. >> i want to thank you again after going through the unthinkable, every parent's worst nightmare, for your courage to speak out and do everything you can to stop other families from having to go through the same thing. the reality is, far too many families in this country have found themselves in the same unthinkable position. i've worked with a number of them in my own district. one of whom is the debeer family. they lost their son zach two days after christmas in 2020. he was a 17-year-old senior at whitney high school. he was an eagle scout, a soccer player, a start of the high school musical. no history of drug use. i've had the chance to get to know laura and her husband chris, zach's parents, over the course of the last couple years

as, they like, you have worked to raise awareness about the dangers of fentanyl. as part of her work, laura is actually here in washington, d.c., today meeting with lawmakers. and is now here with us. i don't know if you would like to stand up so everyone can see your button there. laura it will also be my guest next week at the state of the union. thank you for everything you're doing. thank you, mister done, again, as well. there is bipartisan support in this country among americans for securing the border. there should be bipartisan support in this committee and it is this congress for supporting the border. i have been rather discouraged by what i've heard at today's hearing. now, there have been some thoughtful comments on both sides of the dais. frankly, on one side of the dais, there has been a lot of excuses. we've heard that there may be

other sources of the fentanyl in this country. does that mean we should ignore the overwhelming nexus with the vulnerabilities at our border? we've heard what we really need is comprehensive immigration reform. that is a question separate and apart from securing the border. it is about enforcing the laws that we already have. we've heard that immigration is -- this illegal immigration has been a problem for the last 50 years. well, the two biggest years in terms of a number of illegal border crossing by far have been the last two years. 2022 fiscal year, 2021 fiscal year. the month with the highest number of illegal border crossings is not some random month and asif two years in the 1970s or the 1980s, it was a last month, december of 2022. the problem keeps getting worse. what strikes me is the lack of

compassion for this administration and those making excuses for it. compassion for the communities and families being ravaged by fentanyl. compassion for those who are victims of the horror of human trafficking. compassion for the migrants themselves who are now dying in record numbers. during fiscal year 2022, i reckon number 856 died attempting to cross the southwest border. that is three times as many as just in 2020. another fact that of this problem is the issue of sanctuary jurisdictions. we are seeing increasingly across the country. jurisdictions actively interfere with federal immigration enforcement. my own state of california in 2017, the super majority legislature and governor, declared california a sanctuary state. forbidding local law enforcement from communicating with ice, regarding the

whereabouts of wanted criminals. these are folks who are not just immigrants, not just undocumented immigrants, but who have committed crimes while they are here. from the very beginning, it was predicted that this would raise serious problems. the state sheriffs association wrote before this was adopted, our overarching concern remains at limiting local law enforcements, the ability to communicate and cooperate with federal law enforcement officers in danger is public safety. they say it preclude staff in jails from notifying ice at the request of the pending release of certain wanted undocumented criminals. we've seen time and time again this prediction to bear itself out. this last year in california, it was one of the most horrific crimes i've ever seen. you had a man who murdered his own three daughters in their chaperone at a church just a few miles from the state capital. it turns out this individual was in the country illegally and had been in police custody

just the week before, because he had assaulted a police officer. i.c.e. had asked to be notified of his release. the sheriff's office said we can't tell you because of the state law. jeff daniels, i want to give you a moment if you had any thoughts on the way that sanctuary policies are contributing to these problems. >> thank you for your comments. thank you, that something share around the country are talking about. this is where that partnership with our federal partners, state and local have to work together. that collective recipe as, i stated, is true to how we protect our communities. thank you for saying that. >> thank you, sheriff, i know you have got to catch a campaign. if we can, it's a 5:00 plane. we're going to go quick the last three. we will get you out here asap. the gentlelady from wyoming is recognized. >> thank you so much. border security is national security. the failure of the biden administration to secure our

southern border and uphold our nations laws has created a situation where the effects of the border crisis are felt nationwide. the number of people crossing the southern border last year dwarfs the number of people who live in the state of wyoming. since biden took office over ten times, the wyoming population has crossed the southern border illegally. statistics from the wyoming department of criminal investigation show a significant increase in fentanyl seizures within the state. in 2022, the wyoming department of health put out a notice titled, fentanyl bird and growing and wyoming as the number of synthetic opioids involved overdose deaths more than quadrupled. between 2018 and 2021. the situation is simply unsustainable. it is untenable. sheriff, you've stated that you have seen the good the bad and

the ugly being -- working in a border county. can you highlight for the committee where we were in 2013 and 2018 and 2022 going into 2023 and how they might fall on that scale? >> besides my collector statements i made during this hearing, i'd like to hit on any of the aggravated attacks to our law enforcement. that have not been addressed today. we've seen borders, i've always seen border issues in my 38 year career. what i'm seeing now is something that i've never seen. every other car runs from us, they try to assault. us this is a fight and flight. that's why we don't get the give ups. i'll give you an example. i'll give you a story. i've adapted are now on administrative leave. he made a traffic stop at 10:00 at night on a vehicle. the driver got out. fentanyl was thrown all over the highway. the driver was noncompliant. border patrol came in behind my deputy to a system. it turned into a physical

altercation. there were three illegal migrants in the backseat that ran during this at a more confusion to the case from the deputy. as they got into the altercation to secure the driver, they fell into the roadway. as they get them coughed up, the deputy looks up within half a second sees a car barreling at him. actually hits the suspect driver. take some right out from the deputy's hand and kills him. the deputy and the car keeps going. we suspect it was another driver. that's an opinion. the deputy performed lifesaving measures on individuals. medics got there and took over that. the deputy went back to the car to check the trunk. that standard. that's what we do. open the trunk, a male migrants that came in had attacked my deputy a second time. when i got to the scene moments later, the deputy made a comment to me, sheriff, i don't know how to prepare for. this i go, i don't know how you do it either. the bottom line, is this is a day in the county where the

assaults -- we have an agent was attacked on the trail. they took his -- gun from him. one round was fired. they took a knife and try to cut the agents throat. the deputy fought off for seven minutes before my deputy got there. the assaults were seen. i've had deputies drug by a cartel, drivers i've seen them assault for no reason. i had the cartels across the line actually come across. we had some different sources. they are coming to my county to kill one of my deputies. so, i could talk all day on this. i know i only have five minutes. >> sheriff, giving us that report and information is incredibly important. we all hold all of your folks down there in our prayers. one aspect of this is quite important to remember. president biden has not only halted the enforcement of the nation's laws at the border, he openly showcased his action to the world which only fuller encourages the security and

humanitarian crisis. in contrast, the trump administration not only enforced our humane immigration laws, but it also made enforcement known to the world. the reality is, joe biden has enabled the largest human and drug trafficking operation in u.s. history. the tragedy of that is, milton friedman said you cannot either an open border or you can have a welfare state, or you can't -- and that is an economic reality. you can't have both. it is the poorest u.s. citizens who suffer the most when the government refuses to enforce our immigration laws and secure our border. with over extended services, lack of affordable housing, and suppression of wages. this tragedy is not only man-made, it is government mandated. it is a tragedy and a legacy of the administration that must be fixed. thank you. >> thank you, we -- >> recognize sheriff daniels, when you have to, go you just

tell me. >> we are pushing time. one more. >> okay, one more. >> thank you, mister chairman, i want to address my comments to you and some questions to you as well. until my election and 2000 of 22, i was a text account as judge as well serving for six years in east texas and smith county. i am familiar at the limitations of your job and demands of your job. both in terms of man power and financial resources to meet the needs of your local county just like i had to do for six years in smith county. one of the things that i can say, even in east texas, we recognize that there is a real need to support border security. there is a crisis on the border. i'm surprised by your comments here today that would indicate that there is nothing wrong and nothing going on on the border. i've been to the el paso sector as well. i know firsthand that simply not the case. during my tenure as county

judge, we worked even in east texas to fight against the cartels. doing things like setting up financial crimes units that was a statewide unit that's now leading the way against financial crimes that the cartel is using for human trafficking to underwrite the human trafficking and the drug trafficking. we also are in conjunction with our neighboring counties and several state, local, and federal law enforcement agencies who set up a tag unit. you probably have one in el paso county as well. that works against the cartels. i am shocked here that you would dismiss the concerns of the right side of the aisle and say they're simply not a problem and not a crisis at all. i want to also address the fact that judge carruthers is not here today. being the terrell county judge, he's a good friend of mine. as county judges, we have lots of conversations about what was going on in terrell county. i would call those discussions way before i decided to run for congress. listen, there is times at night

when the sheriff will come, and i'm, alone on the ranch on the 17,000 acre ranch, by myself and he is calling me to say there are a large group of individuals that have just crossed the border. you need to be very careful. you are in a very precarious situation. she could not sleep at night because of that. there's a lot of instances like that where she can recount that. i hope you are not discounting her story about what's going on in terrell county. are you at all doing that, sir? >> absolutely, i think you're mixing things at el paso. it's very different from the other communities. i cannot speak for them, but i can speak for el paso. you've got the largest fbi you've, got the largest law enforcement, you've got a lot of conditions that you don't see. having crime in el paso, people know that's the worst place you could. go >> and your capacity as county, judge your focus on county of applications. have you guys analyze from the

el paso county state, what's the total cost of having to deal with on a local taxpayers burdens and their backs issues related to migrants crossing the border illegally? have you guys analyze that? >> absolutely, 95% is paid by fema. they are the ones that are assisting. the federal government is assisting. otherwise, we couldn't do. it >> your sheriff's office, i'm sure, is having to deal with those issues, are they not? >> we haven't had increases at jails or related to migrants at the sheriff's office. where percent of the population are migrants have come over illegally across the border? >> very small. >> how small? >> i wouldn't want to say something without fully understanding. that i could tell you, i asked the sheriff all the time, has there been an increase because of migrants? we don't face that. >> has your dispatch operations tracks the number of calls that your sheriff's office have to go on that a deal with illegal

immigration? >> our biggest impact, congressman, has to do with medical. like people getting across the mall, and hurting themselves. children hurting themselves. one of the things that you keep saying, things have chain. we're not taking into consideration that the world has changed. there is an increase of a necessity to move into the border. it's apples and oranges. when i talk to every single migrant that i've talked to, they are having to experience things that they didn't experience last, year experience two years ago. these are new changes in the world that's creating the increase as well. >> i understand, some things don't change. good fences make good neighbors. that's something i learned as a 12 year old boy, my next door neighbor so that kids from the swimming pool, next thing i did was i took my friends over there without permission. he said, you know what? that's not what i authorize you to do. he had that right. it's not because he didn't like me.

it's because at the end of the day, that is his property. we were good neighbors. as a result of respecting property. shouldn't we do that on a national basis? >> absolutely, i think there's confusion to believe we don't once -- we don't have the luxury. >> would you support congressman morrow's bill that would simply say, enforce the laws currently in place? >> that's what we do. there's nothing that we do. asylum is legal. we deal with the majority of people that come across through asylum. that is illegal. there's nothing -- >> the chairman yields back. thank you, chair, for your testimony. more importantly, for your work that you do in the law enforcement community. i express that same thanks to your deputies as well. i recognize the jadden lady from florida, this lee. >> think you for being with us here today and to all of our witnesses. the testimony that we have heard today makes clear that

the crisis and lawlessness at our southern border is endangering every american community. drug cartels and human traffickers are exploiting our failure to secure the southern border. they are criminal activities are eroding communities, and safety across america. and my community, authorities in polk county confiscated recently 11 pounds of fentanyl. following this drug bust, our states attorney general actually moody announced that authorities had seized enough fentanyl in the last few months to kill every single floridian. we have an obligation to take action to protect our communities. we are a nation of laws. we have an obligation to enforce our laws. to secure our borders and to keep our communities safe. i'd like to return, mr., done to your testimony. i, express my sincere

condolences for your loss. as a mother, it is particularly important to me that we always remember that this isn't just a crisis of statistics this is a tragedy in individual american families that cannot be separate i would appreciate it if you would do us the honor of sharing with us a little bit more about your son. what was he like? >> he was an athlete. he played football. he was an honorable students. he was a friend. he had so many friends. >> how would you describe the threat of fentanyl poisoning to

your son and two other young men and women who are like him across america. >> it is their. he was exposed to it by someone that he considered a friend. he unfortunately didn't survive. he had other friends that were poisoned also. luckily, they were saved. it is -- the threat is real. we've met at least 30 or so families personally in the short amount of time that we've been doing what we've been doing. we don't get into what politics each other's follows. i don't know the political

affiliations of any of them. we don't talk about politics. it is not a political issue. every single one, that i've talked to since they found out i was coming here was, tell them we have a problem. >> could you tell us about the organization? the forever 15 projects. >> we primarily speak to schools. we are really trying to reach the edith and our communities. we do public speaking at schools, churches, any organization that will have us come out. we partnered with the hays county sheriff's departments. they do a presentation that prevents facts and statistics on fentanyl and then janelle will tell our story to make it

related bull to the young people we are talking to. we also do a lot of awareness through billboards. we pay to have a billboard in hayes county. we were fortunate enough to be provided other locations throughout the state of texas because of the overwhelming response that media company receives about our billboard. just anything we can do to get the word out is what our focus is. >> are there changes that you would like to see enacted or things that we can do to help ensure that another tragedy like this doesn't occur? just stop it from getting here. there is always going to be drug smuggled in. it's happened forever. in the last couple of years, not just fentanyl but all narcotics while that is bad,

fentanyl is far deadlier than any other drug out there. it has a greater ability to kill more americans than any other drug out there. >> thank you, sir, mister chairman, i yield the remainder of my time. >> that recognizes -- for consent requests. >> i ask unanimous consent, this is on the behalf of iv, to submit into the record a letter signed by el paso's bishop, the most reverent mark sites, who is the chairman of the u.s. council of catholic bishops committee on migration. it is a letter asking congress to oppose hr 29. >> without objection, the chair now recognizes for our last five minutes of questioning, the gentleman from south carolina. >> thank you for having this

hearing today. thank you to our witnesses that are here. mr. dunn, words can't express how sorry i am for your loss. i was in the general assembly and south carolina. up until recently, served as the chairman of the house of abuse prevention study committee. we passed 18 bills, record investments, i will tell you that every hearing that we started, every hearing that we, finish we started with families who are going through exactly what you are going through. i know how incredibly tough it is for you. i know how incredibly brave it is for you to be here today to share your story. mister chairman, i will tell you, it is amazing to me just hearing some of the things that have come out of this committee. we on the side of the aisle have imagined things that we are engaging in conspiracy theories. we are not imagining human trafficking on the southern border. we are not imagining the record amount of fentanyl seizures, fentanyl into the country,

fentanyl associated deaths, overdoses that occur every single day. we are not imagining 5 million people in the country. the 1.2 million that got away. we are talking about it a little bit, judge, earlier about the amount of people who were seeking asylum. what's interesting to me looking at the statistics was, as was alluded to earlier, 14% were considered lawful. this was under the obama administration and the trump administration. 14% of all people who said that they were seeking asylum were actually legitimate asylum seekers. of that, a third, a third, according to biden v. texas, a third of that absconded into the united states, never appearing for their immigration proceedings again. i look at the way in which the other side today has really glossed over the problems.

the problems that have been exacerbated the situation. as someone who's that with the opioid epidemic and my state and i've studied how other states have done it in texas and elsewhere, i'm incredibly frustrated by unwillingness to deal with this problem. i do want to ask a few questions of both of you. i will start with you, sir. you have been to -- you've obviously and sexist and other states, you talk to parents involved. in your opinion, our governments attempting to deal with, in good faith, the fentanyl epidemic in this country? >> honestly, up until now is passing, really didn't hear much about fentanyl. we started to hear some about it shortly before he passed. since then, our local sheriff's department has been very proactive. i don't hear a lot on the state level. i know there is stuff about the test trips.

i haven't heard whistle or seen billboard media in the dallas area. i'm sure there are other areas were awareness is being raised. i don't think on a wide scale level the issue is getting much attention. >> we're not getting any attention in your opinion or much attention from the federal government to the level it should be. >> no. >> what would you tell, thinking back to what witness lee was talking about earlier, what would you tell parents and children about the risks associated with fentanyl? >> like we tell our five-year-old daughter, don't take anything from anybody. you have to assumed that everything is dangerous now. one of the comments the sheriff said, the days of experimentation are over. you are a kid. you can try smoking pot. you try this, that, the other.

now it's fentanyl. it has been mixed with everything. you can't assume anything save. if you don't get a prescription from a pharmacy, you can't assume that it's what you are getting. >> thank, you sir. >> judge, really quick, president biden recently visited the border passing through el paso. there is a common for me in the press that he didn't get to see the real difficulties. what did you mean by that. what difficulties did he not see? ? >> i know a lot of people thought that we had something to do with, what they call, it sanitizing. i could tell you that would be crazy on my part for him not to see what really what's happening. it just so happened the numbers had come down. we wanted anybody, please see what we really go through. >> what do you think to himself on to visit the border? >> i can't tell you. i know that they were really

connected through her. she is connected to the secretary, to the ambassador, we are constantly communicating through them. i have a lot of trust that congresswoman is relaying the information. i don't think it's that important that he's not there, but that he supports what we're trying to accomplish. that is the humanitarian components that el paso has been doing for centuries. >> thank you, mister chairman, i'm at a time, i wield. back >> real quick if i, could you said the numbers went down, they went down when president biden visited your city and the ranking member city. are they back up now? >> no, we are still pretty low. >> i want to thank everyone. before we adjourn, we want to inform all members about the committee that will be taking to the border on february 22nd, 20, third 24th. i want to make the minority aware of that. this hearing has made clear from the problems that, some of the real problems we see at our border and across our country. we want to make sure we can get

down to visit that area here later this month. without objection, all members will have five legislative days to submit additional questions for the witnesses or additional materials for the record. without objection, this hearing is adjourned.

it is about 25 minutes.