>> our secure future, make the difference. the scowcroft center works to develop sustainable, nonpartisan strategies to addressost important security challenges facing the united states and its allies and partners. we honor the legacy of general principle nonpartisan committee to the

costs cost of security, support for use leadership and cooperation with allies and partners, dedication to the mentorship of the neen leaders. in keeping with its mission our chance o-matic circuit initiative shapes and influences debate on the greatest secret he challenges facing the north atlantic alliance and its key partners. our partners for today's event our secure future, we mimic e difference, founded to strengthen women's peace -- sorry. our partners, our secure future make the women straighten women, peace, and security more peacefd through ensuring women's full participation in governance. they were to ensure the effective incorporation of perspectives and its peace and security of decision-making at the national and international level which leads to greater security for everyone. today's event kicks off atlantic n's of a weeklong programming. as we reflect on several critical milestones including nearly 25 years ofhe resolution 1325 on women's peace

and security as well as nato 75th anniversary, the discussion will csider a challenges should be addressed and prioritize through a general lens to strengthen collective security and defense alliances. this event is part of the cane that it's a good initiative 2024 native washington summit campaign. from information and updates for future events publications follow usy's conversation with l be moderated by sahana dharmapuri, vice president of our secure future and vice president of -- before return to our panel discussion however, i pleased to introduce our keynote remarks provided by special re and security at nato, irene fellin. >> allow me to expresso address you today. on the occasion of this discussion organized atlantic coci alongside our secure future of women's business security initiative security

landscape. while i regret i cannot be there in person, i am keen to shareths crucial subject. today discussion -- would reflect on 75th anniversary this year and the nearly 21st 21st years of d nations security council reso this milestone serves as a reminder to our collective commitment to advancing gender equali, promoting peace and ensuring the security of all individuals regardless of their gender. as s know, europe is not at peace. we find ourselves in the security environment -- instability. the unprovoked aggression of russia against ukraine violated the norms and principles that once contributed to a stable and

strategic european security order. shopping the piece that many terrorists is the most direct threat poses a significant challenge the security is an imt to international peace and prosperity. women increasingly face threats that arise globally and the continue to face barriers to full and meaningful participation in peace and secure processes. our resolutio5 adopted 24 years ago on not yet fully of limited but indeed authoritarian and terrorist actors narratives which are reflecting their tactics to divide and destabilize. russia's deliberative targeting of civilian and infrastructure in ukraine highlights sitter consequences of this action. women and girls remain targets

of multiple forms of violence including gender-based violence, sexual violence, exploitation, abuse and trafficking. we also face numerous crosscutting challenges. one of of these is climate change. as more and more research review, women and girls experience a disparate impact of climate change which amplifies existing gender inequalities, and poses unique threats to the. embracing new and emerging technologies offers opportunities to create more gender also be vigilant against technology buys engendered disinformation that risks excessive gender inequalities and violence, undermining stabilities and strengthening our core values. nato once again that significant impact that instability -- happen to women

and girls.dscape underscores the need for a comprehensive and strategic response here weta believe the complexity of the geopolitical challenges we face today demonstrates -- throughout agenda led. in line with this nato allies update policy set to be endorsed at this year's summit in washington, the new policy will set a a cr vision for advances of nato deputy eskridge and allowing the alliance to better navigate curren threats and challenges and to contribute to more gender equal future. we will deliver new policy that@ concept which already underlined gender equality as reflection of our values as■#egend

across nato three cortés, terror and defense, -- cooperative security. wps is as relevant now as it has ever been. resilience in face of thisevolvt requires the active involvement of full segment including women an organizations. they play a vital role in preparing for, resisting, responding to, and quickly recovery. exchange with civil society organizations is vital to prevent us as a work in silos and to ensure■p nato's approach wps align with the global wps agenda. this is why in january you civi, and integrated the policy update as a major part of the first annual meeting. functioning as an independent

advisor offers critical grassroots of society. this insight plays a a crucial role in helping us identify -- and preventing blindfold. nato acknowledges women are often at the forefront to support societal resilience, mitigate conflict. in addition to women contributions to all peace and curity efforts their full and meaningful participation in decision making and implementation of solutions related to all aspects of peace and security are criticate and promoting peace and stability in the euro atlantic area. as we confront, shift and security landscape it is crucial to uphold nato's values, reinforcing alliance unity, and citizens, safeguard freedom and democracy,

and work toward a just, occlusive and lasting peace here i extend my best wishes for a productive at insightful panel discussion. advancing women, peace, andnt to security in this challenging time. >> thank you so much, chris and irene for helping a set the stage for today's conversation, ahead of women's national date, with a very wonderful and thought-provoking conversation ahead of us and i'm really glad to share the stage with my colleague. my name is sahana dharmapuri, vice president of our secure future women make the difference. really excited for you who are watching and all of you in the room today with us. i i want to begin by quickly introducing our panelists and then jumping into the conversation. first i'd like to introduce

council. she has previously served as the president and chief executive officer of the truman national securityroject and the truman center for national policy. we're also joined by vice president for advocacy and external relations at the women's refugee commission, melanie nezer. she and her team share women's refugee policymakers, media and supporters to the wider public and in the u.s. we're also joined by ms. moira whelan, director for democracy and technology at the national democratic institute here in washington, her role at ndi she helps bridge the gap between technology, policy and democracy and is a regular contributor to the -- fosr digital ecosystem that supports democracy

worldwide. thank you, ladies. it's really a pleasure to share the stage with you and will appreciate your thought leadership in this area. so we heard remarks about theg e plans of integrating women, peace, and security more deeply into nato's priorities, but jenna, i would like to start with you too may be give us some reflection but also maybe confection lies the 75th anniversary summit that's going to be held in d.c. >> thanks, thank you and welcome back to the council. great to be a benevolent today at at a special thanks to our secure future for partnership. we are really delighted. in many ways it feels somewhat like full circle moments with a seriousn the 25th resolution 1325 which are ushered him this movement of women, peace, and security, and the national action plan, miller states around the world.

we have of course the 75th anniversary of nato coming, andt this summer, a date we are tracking very closely at atlantic council because we wiln the public form which is a civil society beating for that this summer. we do that of course amidst in n ukraine but is in many ways a war that is being contributed to, supplied by many countries around the world, the united states probably. the backdrop against which we're having these conversations i think is one of particular urgency and poignancy because of russia's war in ukraine, which is really i think russia's war with the west more probably get we also went with a the think is especially critical wps nato

moments with sweden andinland. we think in particular of course about former foreign minister margaret wahlstrom legacy of ahs revoked recently, i think it was in 2022, we know undoubtedly there is this legacy of feminism integration with security movement in sweden that will become a part of this conversation as they enter nato here can likewise with finland. huge legacy of women's equality and gender-basedqu to see how te accession of these two member states changed the the complexion of some of the conversation. it's an important moment and especially as we hopefully begin to i ukraine's reconstruction over the horizon, port remember to have his voice at the table for just the war fighting but the peace table as well. >> thank you. i'm going to jump to sahana.

so in your reflectionr work on y and democracy promotion and technology, your reflections on ms. fellin comments. jenna was talk about alliances, et cetera. would love to hear your perspective. >> and thank you, sahana, for having me joining to today. it's always a pleasure to be a with two of my my favorite organizations come atlantic council and i think the remarks which stood out to me is a transition over the 75 years and this evolution of watching one of the most enduring multilateral organizations in the world will embrace this of multi-stakeholder -ism, which is inherently women, peace, and security of the full participation of all people in decision-making to makebsolute f security, and as we're going

into, or we arection goodwill than we've ever seen before at the threats to democracy both on the periphery of nato but also in the balkans, from authoritarian actors in asia. we are seeing a rise in the need for all of us to pay attention y around emerging technology. not just an information space when you see when it's full chilled in in their ability to access information, but we are also seeing it in increasing the security threats, increase threats t■= surveillance. so the very tools that democracies that nato is using to potential help make us more secure can also pose a■%■p threo 50% of the global population in particular. so these conversations can't be more critical than coming to the table and figuring out how to rectify those differences, how we ensure that we over time and try to protect ourselves in

trying to secure the■! direction of free enterprise, free societies, we don't inherit, we don't destroy that from the increasing the use of these technologies to threaten >> yeah. security that we melanie, you work on a lot of these conflicts that we are talking about from the women's refugee perspective. what are your reflections on some of, irene talked about the inclusions of voices. how much of those voices do you think are being included in the conversation?■e >> well, thanks you're going to last is like echoing everybody saying, do that in shorthand way to grow great to be with you, sahana. always appreciate your partnership and great to be with atlantic council. pretty new to wrc such a great

way to get a kick off my tenure here. in terms of money for small yes, important wps has a a recognin that it has in nato and in the upcoming summit. i think what we really see some challenges are two areas and help with time to talk more about them. one is related to what you saidf protecting women, because the face of so many security threats, particularly women who were displaced by conflict and crisis, we kind of default and use it as an excuse to exclude them from leadership. becauswa keeping people safe. so that's a real issue, and are some solutions, , women are doig amazing things run theld■e■f particularly forcibly displaced women, refugees, women who are displaced by conflict and crisis, but they need our help and support and we need to follow their lead because they e excellent recommendations and ideas of how to build peace. so again saying it is great and

there been many strides over the last 25 women in decision-making and following the lead of women but they're so much what we can do from the kind of mundane. women cannot be literally be aln the bus because it's unsafe for them to get on the bus to go to the meeting, right? things like that that address women's in less women are safe we're not going to have security, and that particularly to a displaced. so that's one point. the other one is ongoing, this is not really and anniversary but we're pretty close to him going to throw it in there come is the 1951 convention on the status of refugees which followed world war ii which is really our framework for protecting people who are fleeing persecution. it doesn't address all of our modern challenges. it addresses a very specific, we talk about climate refugees. it's not really, i knew we knowa legal term. established in 1951 convention,

people are fleeing persecution based on race, religion, nationality, membership in a social group or political opinion. that's where refugee is. in the 1951 convention, , puts some requirements on refugees themselves on how they must supports, but basically it's about the states protecting refugees. what we're seeing now is kind of a race to the bottom. we have this massive crisis. we have people millions of people millions more who will be displaced by conflict, by climate change, by the conflict accomplice and climate change, and we are taking a very deterrence enforcement only approach. so some of the recommendations will be including women in addressing some of these challenges, and the world kind of coming together in a more kind of coordinated way to address these challenges that are not walls and blockades

because we know that's not going to work. >> i think what you have all said really underscoring the fact that okay, know, it's almost 25 years for women, peace, and security, we know now we need decision-making table. it's been for a lot of good reasons but not quite happening, but this multilateralism, the push towards multilateralism and re for that particularly made of being a leader in women's peace and security and addressing the go this is an interesting point to turn back to you, jenna, about how can nato better integrate peace perspective? they are talking about creating new policies, asking these civil society groups to add their perspective.but can you give use examples? how are these countries actually

doing this? number of important points raised here and having some societies v4xce structure included in conversations is really important one. i think nato like many multilateral institutions stgg not having its processes and its own diplomacy be accessible to structured entry point for the women, peace, and security agenda internet is an important part of the other piece of this is that so much of the dialogue around nato right now has been reaching that 2%t for defense spending. one of the things we know from our wps work is that asked hillary clinton looks at some length right thing to do,d if yn which you address we have this unprecedented level of a global

refugee crisis in many respects, and a tremendous number of people forcibly displace and on the move at a time institutions that demand, that is especially the time to ensure that these resources by n these decision moments not just because that disproportionally impacted my conflict but also because they are a durable peace that also needs to be part of that would be think about resourcing when it comes to addressing these crisis. this is one of the important roles that our secure future and other organizations play is reminding these organizations of not just the right space and paired is but imperative to equity. that is a big part of what will be on the table for conversations around nato as we approach the 75th. >> so you want to see not just a commitment to women's peace and security but from signaling and

resourcing at the summit, at least a discussion about that? >> i think it's on people's minds because of resrc i so doms war in ukraine. we are in the midst of our own u.s. congressional continuing battle o fsupplemental as europd native partners continue to try to reach their own threshold ;bmmhings of that nature. we need to be think about how we continue to provide force security, not just in a conflict ase. as a look at the data and we know that women at the table into his these moments of ct and also at the peace table creates more durable and long lasting peace, that is one element of addressing this resource-constrained environment. >> absolutely, absolutely. you know, something else you have mentioned, all of you mentioned, is the rolef women

as agents of change and of advancing the rules-based order your moira, i'd like to turn to you about this because your work is in the democracy and technology field. i think would be really interesting for our audience to hear more about how women are leading some responses to some of the threats that you phrase earlier. >> yes. think one thing that isn very positive about a lot of these dynamics is a a look ate technology space, we saw governments often -- the opportunities and the threats to social media, now that when in th look at generative ai we're seeing governments respond very quickly. to the point where we0, 60 global conversations happening about the issue right now, and a part of that is the bias that we know exist in thedo

protect us but also used to help create the information space we want to see. one great we're seeing forward action is in the global partnership for action on there are 14 member countries, many of them are nato countries, and their working together to redefine the space first of all to give us definit a issues like gender disinformation, but also then saying what to countries need to do? we can have this be the people versus technology companies. they do have a responsibility but we need to help shape the future. it's good to bunity and a challr organizations like nato urges inherently defensive to look at what is the outcome we want, what is the durable peace like, i had to acknowledge for instance, in information space that the harm done to womenaroun

happen online. this isn't going, going from online to off-line, right? and do we see what we see on pan reflected in streets? this is about the chilling of the conversation, the stalling of peace, , the threat of disinformation around democratic systems that's happening online. and so what we're going to need and what we see women doing around the world is leading in that conversation. can point to ukraine where we saw one of the most durable countering disinformation efforts toan actors are dominant led by women in looking at those threats. we see it in taiwan which is a secondary and maj ccern of nato where we see threats coming to taiwanese businesswomen, taiwanese political leaders, and the threats they are experiencing threatening the full participation of women. this is all by design.# we havet

of these overlapping alliances of the global partnership, of the freedom online coalition and look at opportunities where we can build on each other's energy to everyone and establish their swim lanes in the sense can do what they are best at a together but having a clear understanding where we're trying to get to. so that means not just rising in the streets or we're all secure and safe in her houses as we come back and cover what we are really able to freely participate in political discourse and actively driving forward to an inclusive society and inclusive democracy that nato and other organizations stand for. >> thank you. you mentioned some concrete examples from ukraine and i won. would you mind giving one of the examples as an illustration for the ideas? because i think sometimes it's hard, we heaand we hear this ise

show agency. but what does it look like? >> so, and this is hard, right k about, i'm reflecting on the fact when nato first went online on social media companies and now we're seeing social media companies being a constituency and part of town nato brings companies to the table, rhtse contractors and the defense industry be. .. b0

business of what women face friends authoritarianct are using to undermine the leadership of women just. this case the president but also undermine the dissipation right of the women because i don'tnt d and it's working and that's why they do it. what we are doing by protectinge throughout europe it is creating

democratic information space we want to see putting action on government and rebel alliance to play we can be that remember what i want to underscore it's very clear democracy the kind of alliance countries that are trying supporting the order where everyone can participate she are actively targeting women in particula not just to undermine the individual to undermine the system of democracy. >> we've seen this happen where on the verge of joining]i nato think about questioning

leadership undermining the content. think we need to sit back and realize we are seeing what it a national security agenda. >> you got women as victims change and it has a powerfulto . what we love to hear she with the recommendations to move forward. >> l■?ookiompletely different things but it's this intent to marginalize women but

they could interesting. everything you're saying up whether they are advocates or cr everything they know all the dissertations they trustede a lr themselves or they might not have status facing mcginnis either families really relied on crops for better failing and all the instability and on top■w of that is the gender issues lack of access to healthcare and

protection from gender-based violence and layered on top of that is the demonization of refugees and when the world he's countries like ours and some of us have the capacity u.s. and countries in europe, it's a challenge we have the capacity to integrate and volunteers are about these issues, what does it look like to the rest of the world where it actually is a fight for resources really say no more, we offer to welco y you? investing in them and led organizations makes a huge difference. it pays money dividends, women are responsible for taking care of the kids missing in the communities and often tasked

some of the things we can do in terms of women let organizations, ukraine is a great example a delegation of ukrainian actress for the■9 commission bringing two high-level criminal juvenile ngos in bringing some amazingtre mother so much capacity around theorld that will have a high level developed civil society like ukraine a need trump leadership fromo gete and create the situation for their safe and secure participate this is where we can

make progress therebç. >> would you like to see women >> it goes across all nato priorities from her recovery and all those things refugee women place is not all women who are displaced are refugees and there are many millions of people displaced for the reasons and talk about the impact of the insecurity that leads to what they are doing in their own community to make lives better for their own communities.

investments like healthcare. unity based of learned doctors and nurses available they#■= people so all of this leads to more security the order anymore, it's horrible so all this should be a priority for global security. >> and select from all your comments we need to think about and what they are showing us security is just talking orders and territory anymore. security pictus online we be

safe over here are unsafe over there and that's not the reality anymore. >> yeah. >> what would be interesting from a what is he recommendation to take under consideration this worker? >> what's interesting is how the nature of warfare has been. in the gray zone conflict and we are asked the days of armies coming over hills asymmetric warfare plan. we have so much conflict child war in this wide spectrum■< of conflict that has expanded

dramatically. increasing nature of online has room for growth and reflection. other multilateralividual natioy think about security in this case. approach security in a multilateral sense? is are questions. where are yours when it comes to cyber attacks? about escalation local proportionality? we know also women are at the forefront of online especially from our like governments in the nature of how these moments are online whether it's the president of taiwan

pacific to degrade the leadership profile of the senior leader the real world it is large languag models and we know a.i. what is only contributed. women's voices are marginalizedt wikipedia and women's voices online are not representative of women of the world. he began to think about how the nature becomes encoded our security systems, piece of the

questions need to taken consideration as you think abou■ worker. >> it is directly women where we saying post- conflict we want to be part of the constitution writing look institution building such and design of the world we want to live in such an what you're saying is we are on the same place with the digital ecosystem which >> i think it's true. we have so much conflict arefe going to result around the peace table in the way we want once might have and to think about all those opportunities

decision-making, it is so much more fractured and layered thats critical. coming to oxford when i worked on this many years ago physical moment oféó■3 competing peace, e don't have a lot of moments like that because so much of the nature of conflict is that gray zone short of war so how do you think about security? something with got to contend with. >> what are your thoughts? connect i don't know if i even remember. >> if you want to go back --

>> this is something advocates or refugees and migrants have been saying for many years from a security does not equal enforcement and security doesn't mean fortifying orders more building fences. security involves talking to civil society particularly organizations about issues that directly affect them and they engage in trying to address because nobody else is coming to help them so if we continue down this path of ripping out the foundationhumans going to lead to morek■m chaos. migrants and refugees arriving europe at the u.s. border, it's a globalized phenomenon.

everywhere there true been europe so it goes to what you're saying, a globalized chaotic, with no cooperation beyond deterrence and we need much morf women that organizations to come up with real solutions to build peace and maintain more because when you have chaos, it invites here and society rejecting a■x newcomer demonized and it's because nobody likes the feeling of chaos. we are at a really critical moment. >> i am optimistic.

we have organizations like nato and others acknowledged that we are doing it wrong if we limit conversations to bruels,@a washington and silicon valley. we open up and realize the most effective solution come from the women in the south who have developed plans and strategies,u who redefined security in their own sense have seen at first, seen the problems first and identify them long before others got there and we can look at this and say bonds in the borders connecticut things we salmon we all know there's a lot going on underneath there and we can look atno anniversary, we've been talking about a lot of fun but the reason anniversary, the conflicn

who provide the common ground redefined security at a local level, this for all of these organizations to include nato. going back to the beginning we heard about new efforts to bring in civil society but we have to redefine that relationship bring more people to the■■■u. it will look like it takes time and feel messy as democracies■o can often feel but ultimately it's what makes us develop address it i think are a major cap we should leave behind not.

>> i want to end with this question for alld2 you, what surprised you the most working on this issue? >> how hard you have to fight to just get in the room? should. >> imagine if we could just get in the room it would time admirg moms and more time solving them. >> i want to say surprised but inspired and all by those who engage this fight in the challenges.

unimaginable especially thinking about the population and in light of all that they are facing mark demonization, gender-based violence in all of those things and worrying about their kids all of those things, show up, go to the meetings and find each other and make progress. i don't know if i want to say surprising but it's something we should all remember it's frustrating democracy avoid some of us about future of our own country, these women everyday what they put every thing and to make our

community safer and also present but something in our minds. >> i'm a little surprised we are having the same conversations i feel like i've been having 25 years. [laughter] on the one hand it impossibly slow. on the other hand having just returned from a security conference, everybody knows why it matters and it's not the same -- you're still having the conversation but there's much less education happening so i do feel like there's been progress made, just impatient these things do take time. i've met with female heads of state, somebody women chief

assistance was sok many ministes for whom this is an obvious part of their strategy. it is not the first fan■c■8 fabric in the way that they are doing their strategy work. we continue in this moment where we are thinking about democracy on the back foot and pressure of authoritarianism around the world■f■zg she. >> let's remember equity and inclusion and authoritarian this is not just for women. this is a conversation for all these loving able and all societies security and access to livelihood and peace and prosperity so more urgent than ever before to get this right because it is also an insurance

societal underpinnings that brings us the ability long-term. up issues, many youth talked about online early warning signs nato and others should be taking into account because as you say, this is a moment we are in, how can we better integrate early warning signs into the conversation coming up? >> you can look at any society in the way that it is an indicator and what exists more broadly.

where it exists where it might be it is early a warning sign, there a lot of struggles of the table end up with think8w relate have to be attentive to those which. >> over to move to q&a. let me take a look and see what we have from the audience. okay. this is a little tricky but i think you guys can handle it. current situation and afghanistan were decades of efforts to promote security failed? how does nato promoting women security or women's security in the region?

the reason i chose that is because we have partners in the indo pacific region or want to be parers and i think this challenge of working in conflict zones places where we don't have partners protecting women's rights is a good one so what have we learned what you think nato has learned? >> specifically in respect to afghistan? >> yes. >> in my experience working on conflict stabilization n away as the changes durable when there is strong on both sides. there has to be a little strong

constituency committed to that great look at the successes of columbia and the nature of that country's commitment to securing ■itse outspend u.s. efforts by a long shot. for all the extraordinary work done advancing education and so many things, it is heartbreaking how quickly it has receded. i think what we are missing and summary things lacking but it's a broad-based commitment enshrine those rights. there's only so much that can be done to force back change externally. we look at all of the monies that was expended there. it is heartbreaking. so many of us who worked on

afghanistaissues in the last 20 years feel that really really deeply and personally. but i think that kind of durable change has to require local ongoing commitment in order to ensure it is sustained. >> host: i was going to say i there's a lesson in questioning the word culture, and what is take place in the name of culture and cultural understanding. beside afghanistan where that meant the repression of women we see that around the take a start with that and question it when you first hear it and see it as a decision-maker and not accepted and allow it to go by is a really first, have that moment, let the hair go up on the back of your neck and know what you are seeing and that you need to look at policy options that will allow us to avoid what jen is talking about.f0

>> that's a pretty complete answer. i might add my two cents on nato. i think one thing the women ofó afghanistan did give to the rest of us is the importance of having a gender perspective. i think that is something that didn't exist before that time we had in afghanistan and i■u think it is more, as you say, more familiar to people. we don't have to necessarily do a lot of explaining. we have to get >> we have time for just quickt quick but may be a little bit of a couple of exas we had a question about examples from ukraine but i think any examples would be useful.

>> i hesitate on this because i'm always like to protect the women involved i don't want to exploit it too much, but we see, iently returned from kenya where i was able to do a consultation with groups of civil society women and lookin and i would point to some lalp there who are regularly attacked for their marital status, for their religion, for their abilities as a mother, very little about their public record. there's another legislator!d w work with in tanzania who, you

knowtawhen the agenda becomes my gender, we have missed the point. then you can talk about higher profile cases like one of the winners of the nobel prize who regularly was experiencing online abuse and having her voice repeatedly silenced, so the moral of the story is this is affecting women locally and personally. we loo awhere it was the numbe issue how we train a lot of democratic activists. we go around the world helping them equal with themselves and it's the number one women say they are not going to run. threats of violence, they know will come but it's the online abuse that is the deterrence because of what it does to families, what it does to they were. turn and income, what■h it doe

to their personal reputation and credit ability and how hard they have to work just to have a voice. way too many examples to count. the other thing to note is that the women we've seen on a global scale who experience this in europe or new zealand, this is isn't what they want to spend their time talking about. they want to talk about the sues. many people in the refugee communities forced to confre authoritarian actors but also locally and among local leaders they don't want to talk about their gender in this space, they want to achieve peace tcoutcomes. >> thank you. we are out of time for more questions but it has been a

pleasure to have each of you and have time to have this conversation. we had so many other questions that hopefully we will get to another time. on behalf of the atlantic council and our secure future, would like to thank all of you for your attendance and participation in this conversation and ie ave more. it has been a pleasure to moderate and i encourage youked we look forward to seeing you again soon. thank you. [applause] ♪♪ >> a hcyltst look like this. it looks like this. where americans can see democracy at work, are

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