porn and ownership. land ownership. ♪ called a meeting to order of the agriculture committee. welcome everyone this afternoon.

your leadership is important and essential rural cnistrong. i share the concerns of my colleagues doctor years of record income, you show farming team is to be one of the riskiest businesses there is. this makes sense it is abundantly clear it's time to get together on a bipartisan farm bill that supports our farm bill and helps rural communities. farmville is always possible.

your willingness to work with us to finative important needs. together we have made significant progress. in october which are leadership senator boseman and i 2.3 billion working with you from commodity credit appropriation that will double funding for the trade promotion programs for the next five years andrandpa american grown food a growing crisis hunger around the world. secure $350 million in additional funding support the rights in the industry application process. it fully funded all of the programs in the tenure baseline

funding. we together the farmville full. of these actions joke we work together. to report our efforts to meet the needs of farmers. i should tell you this is no accomplishment because i remember the first farmville in 2014 with the leadership in the senate required us to cut $20 billion and that was extremely difficult so it's nice to be in a situation can add some resources. we need to use all the tools in our toolbox and draft new ones to improve safety net for farmers. the the 18 has the

ability to regional producers with timely targeted assistance. some disasters we need additional help. unfortunately emergency assistance delayed and some give 75% or more are covered and in other years it can be as little as 25% still uncertain if anything will be available for the 23 disasters. an opportunity to have more certainty and reliability. american family, workers in rural communities that is the foundation of the network american families who need just a little bit of help to make ends meet usually just for a while. bipartisan evaluation has been redirected in the 2018 farmville after the years of the program resulting in just an additional

dollar 40 a day.s to about $6 a day to put food on the table but this was enough to let 1 million children will not have the support they need to be unhappy a healthy a productive members of the community. as a bipartisan achievement. in the last congress made conservation moral development and energy to address the climate crisis hitting farmers bottom line every day. it's not been put to work on farms and fca. as i said, is where bipartisan solutions that help farmers for me family said in rural communities. we can invest in rural healthcare which i know will

care about deeply. americans benefited from the biden administration investment lthcare. usda was the first agency i want to thank you for this, first agency to get high-speed internet funding through the bipartisan infrastructure investment and jobs act. to build on the improvements made to grow connections between local farmers, local businesses and families so your leadership partnership essential to find creative solutions for a bipartisan path of bipartisan farmville done. we appreciate you b today. i want to turn to my partner and ranking member senator boseman. >> thank you for calling today's important hearing. february 15 during an agriculture repnga keep

accountants usda prices for most crop this year and he remained elevated. a week earlier ta forecast 27.1% and 43.1 in inflation over the last year. when you consider since 202280 billing dollars this will be the largest farm income of all kind. we welcome you back to the community and as we continue to work to reauthorize the bill you're interested in your perspective and the challenges in the economy. in hundreds of farmersoncerned.

most importantly of all the declining commodity prices and comes that would make the next five years the most challenging and their lives. all sectors of agriculture of all areas of the country lower incomes some pointing to a 20 here average in the former colonies health and we should talk about a 20 year average because current interest expenses are nearly double. the 20 year average income above the 20 year average not accompanied reinforcing these margins under which farmers

operate. for some 20 year average income isor other workers. when talking to producers from across the country sharing concerns thinker land and other assets aslateral to hundreds of thousands of dollars of crop in the ground. it was less than 3%.á&a in the family operations put so much emphasis on concerned about this as well.

traveling to arkansas care about rural communities and ranch families off scales must be economically viable and how it works. in the administration worries in farm country and there are more uncertainty farmers. i do farmville and have the

opportunity to make things right in rural communities but it takes a commitment for support together. no in the history of this committee isassing the farmville is but something the committee with comes to accomplish time and time again i do not believe the farmville should be different. a partner to accomplish these goals. thank you. >> i am pleased to officially welcome secretary tom phil suck. he's no stranger to the senate agriculture committee.

the iowa state senate iowa. secretary bill suck the porn programs we are assessing today for rural america. provide for the record. >> appreciate the opportunity to be here today and appreciate the opportunity afforded to me. recently i came across a relatively well-known house divided itself cannot stand. utilize it to address the state of agriculture and rural america.

in the history of the united states on the one hand. the other hand he just indicated we are returning to historical norms in terms of the farm income. lower commodity prices a result of crop and a strong u.s. economy a a weaker chinese economy all ability. it's interesting the farm income is not equitably divided among all farmers and 70% of farmers firms about a third owned bying 85% of the income over the last five years which meant 92% or 1.7 million families had to share 15% of the income. at the same time from incomefamilies was significantly higher than the family income across the united states.

88% of families productive farm and a majority of the income utilized by most families is generated. a firm story here the 1970s established farmers to produce and farmers responded.he same time we saw a consolidation of farmland and farm loss. in progress prospectively lost by 44000970 f 1981.

this was for long-term impact on rural communities and we have seen over the course of reduced job growth high unemployment. however, recently we've seen an upturn in the rural economy. now have returned to pandemic levels poverty rate is down for the first time in quite some time persistent poverty is down. the five counties categorized as silly poor that. those are counties in past had a poverty rate of over 20% for over decades. see that the client in the poverty category. we okay farmland?

will be okay with the notion is expressed in the past? or is the alternative? an alternative for relevant the farmer working two jobs creating opportunities the firm itself creates multiple sources of revenue so the farmer doesn't have to work full-time job the farm. provide opportunities and what they love to do. the questions from the committee committee. >> thank you very much and for the committee will do a round of minutes in the little time

provoked thank you for working with and i hope programs. the number two and what's important to us the metaphor for many years and you talk about money to build markets.

>> on the trade side, we on the trade market because we already bent and invest marketing resources into significant amot starting with japan moving down the list of market oppornito increase present and promotion and people in those alternative markets and allows diversified away over her lungs in particular so that is beginninge for several years and allocate resources to enhance and encourage opportunity. we created a special opportunity for experts enabling education and how pe able to take better advantage for these opportunities to work with usaid

50 that corrects for the resources are needed and when most needed and will work with them to get the resources and commodities to countries as quickly as possible we might thank you. also potential for the funding revoked by your congress or the targeted limit f crops, are you willing to work with us possibility of offering longer term contracts targeted regions >> absolutely, the key is encourage diversification so we are not overland he saw what happened with the trade workers years ago these cops don't have

everything working on crop insurance and make sure that's continuously effective but they have special challenges and i would ask you work to ensure any application process there is streamlined and workable. >> happy to do that directly no selling and servicing a firm revenue program and other policies for small operations can vary significantly it's been a real challenge. three assurance agreement includes lex ability for the board to adjust reimbursements for delivery it varies significantly. using this flexibility seems like it can allow ope up and avoiding other appropriations

and farmville issues, can you have rna look into this and put this on the tic board? >> we would be happy to work with you on that issue especially since our project offered in the last couple of years 12 policies 50 modifications. ob they may have increased. >> thank you. last week usda announced the 2023 conservation fund out the door congratulations. eleven of the top 15 across all among the practices being support. can you talk about these practices how farmers are using

the what it meant for traditional funded programs that are popular? getting conservation on the ground for all purposes and areas in the data that 49 of the top 50 practices saw an increase in funding traditional farmville so i'm wondering if you could speak about the. >> there was a record number in the contract entered as a result of 45000 and believe 45 and 48000. having said that, there were significantly greater numbers of people applying for the resources which is why we are excited to meet this need. equip had 250 million available there were 8000 applications for total of $405 billion.

the program helped craft previous farmville received $250 million of ira money and the request is to billing and eight times the amount so it is incredible popular opportunity for us to utilize all practices we know from science will make a difference in terms of increased productivity and better water quality and better use of resources and inputs which is really the purpose of this and we are excited about the opportunity because of the resources and we are streamlining the process to make it easier for people to apply for multiple programs at once so all that is taking place. >> on a different topic how does spending on the program interact the spending on

nutrition programs? usda evaluated after 50 years of operation, to that process or the outcome affect spending on comm programs or crop insurance? >> you said weekly. [laughter] >> thank you for being here the reality is these firm economies down 80 billing 2022 i've had the opportunity as we all have in the last year end a half and the need for better risk management including reference prices making sure crop insurance is available. right now it's up for 30. last week there were about $4 so the situation now is

difficult so you commented on the challenge with the priorities in the farmville and is a solution you've offered to address the firm safety. can you tell us about guidance you've rec castle for others that describes how the ccc could be used to provide more resources and increase revenue? >> actually what i said was not i said i'd be happy to work with congress to find a creative way to utilize resources in the ccc to address concerns you will have relative to reference prices. as i did when assistance which are more than happy to do my h down our team is happy to sit down and explore or create ways we could use the ccc on the part of

folks to think with the farmville is the only think we should be focused on it's a budget a farmville the ccc and all those work collaboratively together to address the issues that divide in terms of today. >> even though your testimony fails to make sure this program it is important topic for the farmville reauthorization. reevaluation and increase cost by 20 billion in 2022 determine the cost of 2021 across all nutrition programs? the food assistance program and others whose costs are based on the cop? >> i'm not sure we've made that

calculation and i would be more than happy to ask doctor look at it. having said that i think we did was justified and appropriate is to provide to families based on reality of what they live in. but we have not done we did do a couple of years ago was asked question how much does it cost the grocery store and for people buying? but assuming but what impact are they buying? from their we calculated an increase for families an opportunity to avoid serious consequences especially lift off. more than happy to look at this and happy to take i consideration and want us to consider at the end of the day there are many ways in which we can look at this program. we are seeing your people use it today so expectation is t c

will come down a little bit. >> the gao made eight recommendations for the re- evaluations. usda permits only four of thosela and it begins before and the recommendations made we have made a concerted effort for in a timely way. you will find cooperative much more administrations. >> what do you think you'll get it? >> i don't have a specific timeline today but i'll be happy to get it. >> i'm sure it's -- it will be before we have to reevaluate. >> so you could reevaluate is that what you're saying? >> no, we will take actions

requested prior ton of the food plant because it focused on making sure who workively on recommendations as we do with oig. >> in may of last year the plan for the 2026 reevaluation my understanding is usda as additional data on food prices and guidelines for americans to have insight on how the information will impact the will begin the process for the reevaluation. >> obviously we don't know because we don't have the information but i think it is appropriate to ask the information we have to deal with what's happening in the marketplace in terms of actual

cost and a better understanding of what family skus and need detail in terms of assumptions about families struggling financially but they were not wind up to the reality. the amount of time preparing food from scratch other items purchased not aligned with everyday american life is important to have make an informed decision. >> i'm concerned that a lot of us are concerned about california's prop 12 and housing at a time when producers and prices will break even. preventing chaos in the marketplace and other similar initiatives, can you describe what you perceive congress does

not choose to invest prop 12? >> you got 50 states essentially could make decisions based on their own individual value system and their own with literally travis of the beginning and we get states basically the ability to make decisions on the reality of the scale and this is why we have a constitution. i understand why californians want to regulate what happens in their state in terms of their own producers little think the supreme court decided that producers had choice to participate in the california market are not understood the market with 12% in one state there is not a choice between doing business in california and not in california. you essentially will drive it will be driven by the which will

make it difficult so somebody asked to provide some degree of consistency and 30. ot inviting 50 different states to do 50 different iterations of this and almost certainly the chaos they need certainty. >> q manager. >> thank you senator boseman. >> thank you very much.on't have a complaint we have the best usda people in vermont, we are so grateful so i will accuse you of hiring good people. i hope you don't take that the wrong way. she came up after a disaster and

i want to say it's been very responsive and heartening to vermont but there's such a response from the department to thank you for the. a couple of questions 12% of the food dollar. >> less than 15 cents but if you take the cost up, it's about seven. >> that's unbelievable. in my appreciate the emphasis for comes and there is a way to do that get the input costs down the income come up. taking advantage of a mother number of firms being able to take advantage with a lower cost.

that is the program. i just want you to comment what do you have any suggestion that might help us make it more possible for more firms particularly smaller firms under pressure to access program this? >> we've already done 58 hundred degrees this for the hiring of your getting the word out about it and continue to see thousands more the grant. we recently announced resources for small projects an example of an opportunity for farmers and those in the small distribution system to get the word out which will allow farmers to 2-megawatt opportunities to reduce costs. honestly i think the thing you could do that would have the most profound impact would be to figure out ways you could encourage the establishment of cooperatives between farmers who

can produce excess energy on their farm and courtney that excess energy provided in the midst of utilities looking to convert or transition from fossil fuel based to renewals and why the program part of ira is very popular see that happening. >> i want to talk about crop insurance in vermont as you may know in may we had a freeze that really hurt and a big flood in july it wipes out cps. vegetables are good for you but it is tough because under the existing programs a vegetable producer had to comfort how much damage and be have

introduced the weather act intended to make it much more streamlined for these farmers and they are relatively small but a fool in the local community. the positions in the wrong state. can you speak to administrative policies and the usa considers to ensure the disaster assistance and other insurance programs are more responsive to the small diversified firms? >> we venture creased crop insurance products for a number of fruit and vegetable products across the country and we have modified existing policies to expand coverage. we've established an increase under the farm revenue

protection program available and made it easier to qualify for the program available for those who don't have crop insurance. we take a look at ways in which we expand production under the microform program and expand months of coverage and opportunities in those programs and cover a greater that and try to use tools to the extent million acres in the u.s. and 42 million livestock nuts and expans in iraq in this disaster weught but got a lot of small towns as i know you do in iowa towns under 2500 they don't have the technical capacity generally very helpful but my question issider having technical assistance program specifically for towns having emergencies it doesn't have to be competitive

in the process he got a disaster you know they need help they have the technical assistance and we get it right away. >> will be implemented? >> world element resources and the ability from congress utilizes it. >> a good suggestion because it's tough. essentially when you have a small town select boards going through and truck but there are ongoing things that need to be done in a couple. >> a number of communities have regional governmentiations provide that service. >> thank you very much. i go back. >> thank you very much. we will not go to senator ernst and senator bennet the second boat has started. we will continue.

>> thank you madam chair and thank you so much mr. secretary it's great to have you in front of us today great to hav last month i kicked up meyer river to river to work going back and put between the state of iowa and mississippi river she and missouri on the western side and while visiting one of the questions up is one of us will come together to pass a farm. it's really active in our town halls and producers in rural communities deserve to have a company has a piece of legislation that provides them with certainty. to resort to a kick the can mentality isn't an option for farmers and ranchers and should not be an option for congress either so i hope we can come to the table and negotiate a bill of farm.

victoria built before i dig into those specific questions i would like to address the work policies of the department of agriculture. we are weeks away from the four year anniversary of federal buildings being temporarily closed due to the cov pandemic pandemic. as you know gao says headquarters have a safe utilization rate of just 11%. it's gotten so bad one ofployees went so far to write me an anonymous lette today and i would like to submit that to the record, please. let me read just a few sentences. the vast majority of usda employees are not working person. i brought usda headquarters in washington d.c. ever assembled a ghost town. your employee goes on to say remote work and telework employees are often unreachable

and do not respond to simple e-mail questions for with that, knowing your own staff is recognizing issues with the policy currently put into play how many days a week do you your managers and employees covered by collective bargaining agreement to be physically in the office? >> the majority of the week. >> quote tha >> for some three for some it for. >> yet the occupancy is 11%. >> senator that is not correct. that's not even close to correct democrats from the government accountability. >> i don't know what the data is of that or the letter you referred to but that is not what's happening in february of 2024. >> okay, t secretary. other than supervisor oversight does the usda do to monitor those federal employees that are

working remotely to make sure they are actually working? >> forcible to suggest they are not working i think of front to our working members. i can show you chapter and verse of all the work being done. i can tell you how many loans nrcs contracts entered and i can guarantee you compared to other administrations this team is working there tail off so please don't tell me the work is not getting done because i can show you that it is. >> we will take that up because calls at the office where our constituents are having trouble with the usda so we will continue to forward those questions on to you. federal employees defining their location based pay requires them to show up to the office at least once in the standard is

waivable on employee by employee basis. do you know how many exceptions to the standard pricing appear. the usda issued since the pandemic and the agency provoked any of these? >> i don't know the but i can tell you 82% of the hours are working in the offices. >> 82%? >> 82%. >> thank you mr. secretary. moving on to other issues another issue top of mind especially for islands is 815. last week we had an announcement from the administration and the eight governors request. i welcome t t is long overdue and i applaud the work but we know pushing off implementation until 2025 is discouraging in that

area so with the 2024 driving season approaching i will families and ethanol producers and fuel retailers still have no idea if it will be at the pump this summer so hearing the statements you made it appears as if you are confident that epa will announce another emergency waiver if that's correct. in your discussions with the administration and the epa what do you believe we see an announcement for nationwide scale systems the summer? >> consistent with the last two years whether you should waiver, i could be wrong about this in the april timeframe but i'm pretty sure they will have resources and data necessary to make the decision. >> thank you mr. secretary. i do hope you will continue to lean into the administration on this as well.

earlier this month and in regard to submit questions for the record because i do see that i am running out of time so thank you and i yield back. >> thank you very much. >> thank you i appreciate you this, thank you for your public service in your leadership as well. before i post my question, i want to pay tribute today in the west we mourn the loss of a chief ranger whose family has operations he served as president there for nearly 20 years.

i came to the senate in 2009 and brought me up to speed in colorado and the range in the river valley and all over the west and the conservation challenge. one of these observations in the western landscapes and prefer the advocate and secretary bills the greatest priority with their three children and six

grandchildren and future generations before starting this process to preserve to usda conservation. the community is profoundly grateful for the dedicated service commitment in his generosity. i want to associate myself with those words pat was an incredibly passionate individuald strongly about and was committed to not only his operation showing it modeling a different way and encouraging others and we are saddened by his loss. >> i'm going to give the family condolences so you. >> thank you for doing the. you know i was in ukraine and

had the opportunity to talk with you on the way back from the airport of all places but we are going to miss him a lot. and he felt a way to make progress. >> we are going to reset your clock here. i want to make sure -- this is important. thank you. >> secretary bills i want to thank you for the recent announcement of $35 billion part of the bipartisan infrastructure law and inflation reduction act. know this will because of what the economy spent in the west. in colorado and the west

continues to experience record shattering wildfires and our way of life. an active wildfire already burning in colorado this week expect a rough fire season and we are hearing no staff are available the fuel production work to help projects both small and land scale obviously not acceptable. i wonder if you could talk about addressing the staffing shortaged prepare for the upcoming fire season. >> i'd be happy to look at that particular forest. it surprises me because haven't had significant numbers. candidly right now we are

concerned with the lack of budget on whether or not we will be able to retain any of those who fight buyers absent firefighter fix or pay. we will see a lot of those folks leave so that is a big concern right now. as i say we streamlined the process for hiring and reached out and expanded significantly outreach and a significant number of people. >> we will work with your team given this information. i agree completely. i should mention them of the opportunity yesterday to meet with firefighters in my office. themd me this is a battle we've had for a long time just to get folks a decent

paycheck and care and access to education housing which in colorado throughout the west is virtually impossible. we got good work with the a and the department of agriculture gracefully has done land swaps with local communities and housing but we are way behind and i agree with you we are going to be in a crisis because the next generation of firefighters will not come from nowhere. the people they need to train all the ones losing right now. went to spare my last two questions for the record but i don't need

a judge. [laughter] i'm just doing it out of the goodness of my heart. i would say in closing i deeply appr said on forestry and salary issues continue to make it impossible for the agency to field offices adequately. we do have the budget you are talking about. i will send you a question about that. >> thank you very much. he came in and said can i go next? we said sure so we go back with regular order or what do we do? google back with regular order. all right. >> thank you so much for all

you've done and i appreciate the secretary being here and we have had the opportunity to work together i've enjoyed. during the recess going up into mississippi looking things we have a serious problem in mississippi right now so i was so excited is going on today. it's the southern time beetle which is the most destructive in the southern united states is your well aware but my goal is to make you aware of the issues so serious so many people have a college savings fund. so many people see you as their retirement and want to make you aware of this today and see if i could get to help me address this because it is truly critical. mississippi suffered a historic

drought last year and a one time all 82 mississippi counties are in an extreme drought or the u.s. drought and monitor especially pine trees and stressed pine trees bringing a dinner bell. all this to say mississippi is experienci a seven beetle outbreak and they are devastated. client mortality have never seen anything like it driving down the side of the road these trees are farmhouses spread over 12.5 million dead trees weal mississippi and the economic impact $96

million in lost timber. but that so many things including sawmills and everything else. the commission has reported to 30 fires across 9000cres in forrester's expect these problems to get worse as we go into spring season. now is the time for action. time to respond at further outbreak. it's so sensitive. i understand usda some service agencies emergency restoration program provides culture assistance landowners to carry measures and national disasters. ...

never take action. only the fsa national call office committee can optimize this which makes getting that authorization potentially more time-consuming as well. so my questiono you mr. secretary are there ways that we can improve the overall quality of assistance provided through ef rp? >> i think the answer to your question is yes. there transitioning it back to the

county because it's difficult to keep track of the resources that county. certainly we can look for ways in which we can streamline that process. we can also i think look and should be looking at a way in which we can perhaps adjust the cost share issue in terms of advance payment so that work is not delayed. i think those are two things we ought to be doing. >> fantastic. by the fsa national office when it happens. wonderful. trying to go ahead and mississippian throughout the south. >> will you get me a budget, senator. >> be glad to. this is critical.

we are getting flooded with calls about this. what we do as former add commissioner. >> i am very familiarvastating the west. it is a very serious issue. >> i so appreciate your willingness to help. >> thank you very much. >> thank you madam chairwoman. thank you so much for beinge we appreciate you very much. i have a line of questioning. you know we are in the middle of a compromise as to whether we will have a pilot program about nutrition, nutrient dense food. under the dietary guidelineseé whole milk, for example is not considered nutritionally dense. how would you define nutrient dense foods for? would you draw the line at nutrient c a flavored yogurt and a dessert.

what would the process to determine which are in and out usda guidelines based on your gu today on what is nutrient dense would you create new ones? much more broadly what will the impact be on retailers? how would this type ofimpact retailers? will it make it harder for retailers to use program? what is the impact on consumer choice and dignity. would you agree that investing more in nutrition education could be a better way t root causes of diet -related diseases? >> i will try to answer. >> i'm giving you all the questions to answer the parts that make sense to you. >> first of all i think obviously congress has to direct us to do this. if you do there may be parameters that you put around

it. if you don't we would obviously in a state or states depending on what you tell us to do that would be willing to work with us. the states administer the snap program. we do not administer the day-to-day activities of snap. there are a couple of states that have looked at this and i think they looked at it in a very tailored way. this is why you have a pilot. to find out whether or not work or does not. does it create serious it issues at the grocery store or not? letting us know the dietary guidelines.we have some scientific basis. depending on the capacity of an individual state.

part of the programhe nutrition ed. that express purpose of trying to better educate people about the snap dollars in way to promote nutrition. i think that i he touched on most of the questions. the impact on improving nutrition security. >> you would find a significant audience for that. how do i know that?

yo pandemic assistance bills that you passed as a result we saw a fairly significant up take -- uptick. we are working with pediatricians. looking at chronic disease situations and instead of prescribing a drug they prescribed fruits and vegetables as a way of dealing with chronic disease opportunities. anything you do in that space will be beneficial. it will increase our knowledge base and help us formulate better policies for transition. in the government of puerto rico to facilitate a transition to the program. in your view, what would you say puerto rico and the usda are in a position to eventually have the proper infrastructure to ricans access. >> we are working very, closely with the challenges that they need to

make sure that they have the administrative foundation to administer the program so that so they get benefits quickly. it is not a matter unfortunately of weeks or months but it is in the foreseeable future. in the meantime usda did publish a feasibility study where concluded that puerto rico is ready to transition from that to snap. is that your position? >> my position that we are working closely with them to make sure that they have their ducks in line. the were saying that could in place

to not administer properly >> i want to address national security. obviously, our farmers are as vulnerable as any other businesses in america. especially when they do not have strong data protections and don't haveybersecurity of their data and their information . a one health proposal where we create a commission of the fda plus cia nsa dod hhs will prevent the next pandemic. have you had the opportunity to work with any of the other agencies on pandemic? recommendations about collaborating to in advance so we can protect against the next pandemic. >> in which they are involved in

most recently either today or sometime this week they will table talk exercise on that vtzery subject. >> thank you. mr. secretary, welcome back. continue to appreciate your service to this country. let's go back to prop 12. as you know, california's proposition 12 is another costly regulation. it would seem to me that a larger company that you could overcome these hurdles a little bit easier than a small packer could. in the pork industry, we see a company that dominates 25% and they are able to overcome all these regulations. they are big enough that they can hank=dle another regulation. they continue to read to consolidation in the

industry. what effect do you think prop 12 has on independent producers that cannot afford to comply with this drive further consolidation? >> this is the reason we have invested in expanded processing capacity at the local level. 400 projects have been funded. we expect more to be funded in the next several months this is part of building out local and original food system so you're not at the whim of a handful of large-scale facilities or at the whim of a policy that you have a hard time complying with. >> thank you. should congress act like prop 12 across the country? >> i think you have t consistency. i do not envy your capacity to do it. and will not be easy to craft that. >> thank you. one producer to comply with 50 different states and how we are supposed to raise in kansas.

let's talk about disaster assistance for second. kansas coming off back-to-back years of drought. we've had to apply for more disaster assistance.e complaints about the response in the rollout of this latest disaster assistance and anyue in the last several years. specifically they were getting disasters at a greater per acre rate than our families were. it was a progressive way of what is seeming to be very complicated. it seemed to be very slow. i would ask you to do this in the future. >> it is interesting. i'm looking at the numbers for kansas. ore money as a result of this factor. 10,217 got less. 82% of your producers actually benefited from this effort.

having said that the way to avoid this the resources fully and completely for the disaster. it was a 10-12 billion-dollar disaster. we told congress that. >> we gave $3.7 billion which i think was more than adequate to situation. i think it is unfair to punish because they have more. let's talk about the packers and stockyards act. i don't know if we got a cover that today. in june of 2021, i quote re- proposed their rule to clarify that parties do not need to demonstrate harm in order to bring action. under certain provisions of the packers and stockyards act. the office of and budget before it is proposed. i point out that eight federal

appeals courts have affirmed that the packers and stockyards act requires a person to generate. certainly we have over 60 livestock organizations opposing the rule because it hurts livestock producers. the position for the usda that you can implement a rule that will be a blatant violation of circuit court president by not requiring harm to competition to bring an stockyards act. >> the rule itself has not finalized, senator. i think obviously we have to take into consideration any litigated risk associated with the ruling crafting at. i think that you will see more activity from packers and stockyards before that rule is available for folks to look at. i think that there is still work to do on the system. there is more work we have to do to avoid discrimination and retaliation. seeing those roles coming forward relatively. i think that there is still work

to be done and we are c to do work on the rule that you mentioned. i think that it is appropriate for us to craft it in a way that we believe response to any of the concerns in the past. >> i am digesting that answer. so you do not feel that if it has its harm to competition it is almost like a double negative on me here. in violation by not requiring harm to competition to bring an action of the stockyards act? >> i think it's incumbent in response to whatever has been raised in the past to avoid those problems. at the same time to provide balance marketplace for producers. >> thank you. >> i think i would just close by making a comment that if we want to guarantee affordable food,

access to affordable food for we are spending plenty of money on the backend but i'm concerned as we work on a farm bill going forward that we are not spending enough money on the front end to make sure our farmers are able to play at next year's crop. not really questions just a statement. thank you. i yield back. >> senator durbin. >> thank you madamod to see you. congratulations on caitlin clark >> she something. i'm not sure i pay 400 bucks but i might. she might be worth it. she has one hell of a player. >> i will ask you a question that starts with part of it that does not belong in this committee. i wanted to talk to you about the environment and particularly the dead zone in the gulf of mexico. it is a recurring and threateningnomena where some 4000-8000 square miles of gulf

of mexico dies because of the runoff primarily from the mississippi river. that chemicals nutrients animal waste sewage and the like. it has a dramatic impact on the gulf of mexico on weather patterns and a lot of other things. i know enough about you personally that youe about things like this. i do, too. they trace the origin of many of those elements of runoff to overstate spirit illinois and iowa. i guess my question to you is, what do you tut our current harm programs whether they are addressing this, and whether there are things we need to be doing in the future. i think about illinois situation blessed to have similar states we are from. pretty big state.

we ranked 37th in the nation when it comes to participation in the major conservation programs that may avoid some of the runoff. what are we missing? what do we need to do >> providing some ammunition to begin to address this issue in a ngful way. we have expanded the number of cooperative groups that are reaching out encourage them to participate in basic conservation that could significantly reduce the need. we are also funding research. we apply some of these i think that we will better job of understanding which acre of land actually needs nutrition in which does not. 30% of our corn acres in iowa and illinois may not require any fertilizer at all. we may reduction in the use of that.

we have resources that have been applied from the ccc that we are utilizing to create alternatives to the fertilizer. so we will look at different ways to fertilize the land. we have our climate smartre trying to encourage climate smart practices by paying farmers to market premium for what they raise sustainably. that should also have an impact. if you utilize if you expand conservation if you reduce the level of fertilizer being applied for farmers to embrace climates of our practices and you do research that allows you to be more precise i think the combination of those factors will significantly over time reduce the risk of the dead zone continuing to expand at the rate that it is. >> i know i am stepping i here but initial statistics which you offered earlier about ownership and in the size of the farms for average farmers and income in

such suggest that many of the decisions are being made by investors. rath farmers of the land. in that situation do we have the right incentives in place for these investors to be part of these programs? >> i think we do because if you invest in conservation you approved the value of the soil. you also have water quality improvements. in the long-term best interest of the landowner to have it will increase the value and productive capacity of that form over time. >> i recently took a flight last week to africa on a delta air lines plane and they were making it clear to all of their passengers that they are taking this global warming and climate change seriously. and they want to be zero carbon producers in a matter of just 10 or 20 years.

to the point where they offer and where was sitting i had a nice seat it is not unusual but it had ass plastic. it appears the private sector in this country at least some parts of it are taking it very seriously, climate change in the y you do your business in the future. what you think we need to do to bring the farming sector into that? >> 141 projects that we are funding through resources. encouraging in 50 states climates to be embraced by farmers. it involves, as i say 141 contracts. those involved well over 1 commodities in over 205 climate smart practices. the system basically pays farmers and sends them to embrace climate smart practices then is linking them up to

markets that will essentially provide a reward, if you will. a value-added proposition for farmers. by being able to measure we are helping to create the opportunity for that se farm to generate an ecosystem market credit which will generate more income from the farm. filly, the projects in the conversion of agricultural waste which is another answer to your dead zone question begin by taking the newer instead of overplaying it on land, you could created as a feedstock from products. it could be a variety of other bio products. not only new income source and new commodities for the farmer, you've also created jobs in rural communities. >> thank you for your service. thank you madam chair. >> thank you senator. thank you mr. secretary for being here. let's talk about snap for a

48% of the farm bill is for snap funding. we need to reign in fraudulent activity and make sure food assistance goes to those that truly need it most. i think we all agree without. i hope we do. the usda overseeing the program. requiring the asset test and states help address fraud and what would be best to do at this point senator get back to regular order in terms of the process for people qualifying and staying on snap. during the pandemic there was essentially a waiver o process including constant interviews and touching base with folks. getting back to regular order i think would be significant. sending letters to governors in a number of e back on track. >> what additional information does the usda need to help address the root cause of fraud?

anything else that we need to make it easier to catchm? >> i think that we have made some steps in that regard. i think probably what i need to do is i need to give you your s are taken given your interest in this spirit i think sometimes people see the error rate in it is overpaying. we want to make sure that we are calculating the benefits operly. getting the assistance that they need. >> thank you. i will get my staff to get in touch with you so we can work on that together the u.s. has historically been strong on agriculture exports but due to president biden's economy, the trait has a trade deficit over 30 billion due to

rising imports and lack of new market access. can you share how the usda is working with trade representatives to underscore the need so that competitors do not gain market share and opportunities that would otherwise have been hours. >> looking at what is driving the important issue. horticulture and sugar. to areas. i would also say that sometimes there is a tendency for trade agreements. work below this process that matters. we have calculated $20 billion of tradewinds that have occurred in the last 20 years. mexico and potato access. beef quota. expanding access to apples. the philippines extended access to port. egypt extended access to poultry a substantial number of things

that occurred that do not get the headlines but actually result in increased trade. the reality is we have a much stronger economy than the rest of the world. it has an impact on sports as well. a combination of factors. do we want a week dollar? do we want to weaken the american economy so people are not buying stuff? i don't know. we will continue to work on this as far as trade agreements are concerned maybe you think you ca authority. i have not seen that happen here in this body. until it does it becomes very difficult for us to negotiate a trade agreement when the people we are negotiating yourself included can renegotiate the deal. it's hard to have a trade deal without trade promotional authority. >> let's talk a little bit about

poultry. they extended the time-limited trial report processing facility allowing them to operate at higher line speeds. the poultry industry waivers are set to expire at the end of march. can you say whether usda plans to extend the waivers. >> i think we will see an n of this because we want to make sure weet the right information about whether or not lightspeed actually does relate to increased injury, worker injury worker safety. that is the whole purpose of this. finding out what the facts we need to structure these in a way that gives us the information. i am not interested in making decisions on this until i have all the facts. i don't have all the facts yet. >> thank you. we are struggling to survive. i know you met with a lot of them. especially our family farms income.

70 billion since 2022. that is the fastest and largest decline over a two-year period of time. erall input costs are up 27 billion since 2021. up over 100 billion since the last farm bill driven by rapidly rising interest rates which we cannot control. record high labor costs. if you c inflationary pressure across all of their farm inputs. farmers are struggling to keep up with ever evolving bureaucratic environment that requires them to hire lawyers and lobbyists to ensure compliance with the endless red tape up here in washington them to do. these are additional costs that they really cannot bear to contribute into further consolidation in the egg industry. when do you think that farmers are leaving the industry? the next generation does not have any answer to that?

>> i have several answers i think. one is that there has been a focus on production. talking about a commodity -based system. we have encouraged farmers to producewe suggested you have to get bigger get out. what we need to do, in my view is create an alternative market opportunity for the small and midsize producers so they are not competing slowly and completely in a commodity -based market which is not really designed for them. .... ....

it's all about regulation at the end of the day and the no about somethingoming out them alabama good crop everything works a lot better. thank you. >> senator grassley. [laughter]

create a level playing field which i know you want at the same time for any litigated challenge that may come to the rules. we're in the process of the complete transparency rule will be asked to provide more information. we are close to getting the retaliation and incrimination rule out in final form that says you can't retaliate against the user and rights. in the process and there is a discovery rule. balance in the circuit court of opinions.

just one. you characterize a few things and what you would like to do as effective or it enhances? >> do what needs to get done create a cesspool litigated cha >> maybe gently could you speak about your role for airplanes and farmers have a big interesting but your role in the the, preserve without

diluting it? i know some people want to dilute it. i think we have two roles one is todvocate for a rule that allows broad array of stocks including the traditional clocks for biofuels to qualify for the incentivized ethanol for part of the responsibly to integrate the need and the science behsful getting the model incorporated in the process and now process of the claimant tornado climate. the second responsibility is for usda to provide science and data behind the availability logistics for the supply chain and accelerate adoption commercialization. i was in georgia recently the

rst scale plant we need to get to $36 billion $10 million gallon plants we have to accelerate the commercialization and availabilitut the tools to use for programs and so forth that. >> would you characterize for me the advice you been doing in this how it is? >> they appreciate the fact that i am a strong advocate our team thoughtful the scientific data to back up what it is we are saying not just advocatinguse it would be good performers who advocate because support the and as a result a number of folks who may have been a bit skeptical the model now embrace it.

we are in the process of educating about private agriculture so they understand rob's and efficient fertilizer and things of that nature you can calculate the benefits of those and it should be incorporated in the calculations calculations. >> a position or a feeling there seems to be an inconsistency i would think primarily environment the group is not you can correctly but they want to clean up the pollution airplanes put in the environment if you don't use ethanol then you aren't going to help fuel and all the use so it seems to me we are to be on the same

wavelength environmentalists and farmers. >> i would add can't domestically produce feedstocks for this will you will have to import them. what would we do that? >> thank you for your courtesy. >> are you going to be long serving secretary of agriculture agriculture? >> i think so. >> you are not? >> no. >> fifteen years and 11 months jeopardy question question. >> did you answer it? [laughter] >> that's one of the few ones i can actually answer. senator fetterman welcome.

>> thank you. >> it's a pleasure t here. i meet with a lot of farmers for my state it is a top business in pennsylvania that may come up with these discussions but i want to bring about these issues i hear a lot. other farmers and the same argument is to have support to remain in business and profit and undersea by all things and one thing i wanted to talk about

and i hear this again and again is foreignountries voting our land. is that an initiative you might be concerned with flex. >> it's roughly 3% by foreign interest. ge is whether or not we have an accurate read based on the system where folks are supposed to report. some folks do, some may not. >> you don't believe it is a concern? >> you look at the people it's canadians often times people talk about this in terms of china one tenth of 1% of

that amount. >> i believe they are but even the other in terms of they effectively own about half the size of rhode island. >> my concern is twofold. one is the location of whatever they own we found the desire to buy in to the defense installation i have concerns about the. china is number one customer and when i was meeting the agriculture minister inquiring about certain laws which means they are sensitive but they are hearing and whether it matters to anybody in congress. >> american farmers or companies, are they buying in.

>> china doesn't provide that.>> don't allow them, that doesn't seem -- connect states can pass many states have done that. >> moving on but again i'm not concerned canada owns aot for not worried denmark china has been here it is not an ally and it is the category and they don't even allow us to have that same situation and it is a concern and i have a lot and moving back to another thing. the republican side especially

the ones in the house they want to make that a target and that is. given my position and chairman of the subcommittee or whatever, i would do anything lately i can get that in legislation to what denies that or do anything. in 2018 the farm bill authorized in a bipartisan way usda regularly evaluating. can explain a food plan that would cut to the benefits? >> it would result in less benefit over the long-term. it wouldn't cut the benefit today but result in a lower benefit in the future.

>> it's untouchable and sacred foods block they feel they are under siege by plant -based so-called plant i don't believe we should have something made out of boats or almond asma milk or whaver product you want but it impacting the bottom line for dairy farmers in my state and this is like across the nation. what are your thoughts on labeling plant milk when it not anything to do with milk next.

>> the challenge is the term milk as a certain brand in terms of nutrition. i think people believe milk is a nutritional anybody who uses the term milk or to establish t value of what it is they're trying to sell. oftentimes i you find with alternatives as they don't match the nutritional value of milk and therefore in my view they not to be able to use that term. >> ninety seconds perhaps. >> absolutely. >> it pains me to agree with governor desantis on anything but i is opposed i find it unattractive basically. another challenge too. it's one more product or

movement that will impact farmers raise or other kind chicken. is that really -- can you call it actual meet or what kind of category is that? >> we are currentlye grappling what youu call it. if the biological process is equivalent to what takes placelivestock the argument is it ought to be able to called meat. however, consumers need to understand and cde appreciate the differentiation between cultures me and livestock produced on a farm and thus we are dealing with trying to figure out english so when consumers make a choice, they know what they are going. ... think it's another

impact and challenge for farmers but anyway >> important questions in labeling. senator hogan. >> in cuba being secretary thank you for being here. and for your a work on behalf of our great country. our colleague from pennsylvania just mentioned a snap and in the baseline for the farm bill which is 1.5 trillion the snap baseline is going for about 600 billion to about one point to 5 trillion. so that is doubling. is there any other program in the farm bill where the baseline is going up that much? >> there may be a smaller program where you are seeing an increase but probably not. >> a reference that with a cut. last i checked it's doubling.

i don't understand where someone would talk about the cut. i want to bring up to programs that are fundamentallyro vital for farmers and ranchers across this country in terms of production agriculture and will not surprise you for the first one is crop insurance the center is that countercyclical safety net. these are fundamental to our system of agriculture. we have an amazing system of agriculture in this country. it is largely fame family -based businesses. family -based farms and ranches across the country. you look across other ind welcome some comments if you would like. our concentration over and over and over again in these other industries. that route diverse system of farming and ranching largely ly -based small businesses.

this fundamentally important for this nation and it gets taken for granted. we need to be really, really careful to not take it for granted. we have the highest supply in the ndworl americans across the board they are able to spend less of their budget then in other developed countries because of what our farmers and ranchers do. so we talk about a farm bill benefits every single american every single day because of water farmers and ranchers are doing. and i know you believe that too. we talk about this farm bill, we have got to get it right for production agriculture. we cannot take that amazing enterprise we have it. it is fundamental for our nation at so many ways on our national defense and that means crop insurance and risk management tool. with got to get it right. it also reduces the light ad hoc

. so when i ask you do you support making sure we update crop insurance that it is affordable as fair from state to state. and they have access to not only cropnsurance on their enterprise on a basis they can afford but also supplemental options are. do you support that? and the comment do you have ideas on how we can and should enhance it? >> a senator the fact we have had new crop insurance policies established while i have been a secretary we seen a dramatic increase the number of modifications to existing crop insurance policies for the establishment of a whole firm revenue protection even microform program suggests we understand and appreciate the importance of i would take a slight issue with one of the comments you made.

there is consolidation happening in agriculture. i am not hap in my professional life we have loss of 544,000 fms. gone. those are families that i suspected many of them would have loved to been able to continue farming but were not able too. folks can tell me it's abo forth which is what i hear all the time. but missing from the conversation is market development and domestic market development but alternative ntrevenue streams for these farms. swisherso as you talk about a farm bill that's focus on production agriculture i would hope we also understand the importance of the financial foodhe systems. understand the capacity to create additional revenue streams for these farms but otherwise were going to continue to seek consolidation. >> we are making the same case. we may both be talking about tools we think are important and additional tools but we are making the same case we got a

sure we stay there, right? you just lamented we lost. >> we want to make it better. >> ldyou a degree crop insurance -- make that really starts wn't it? i am not saying the others and she mentioned are not important isn't it? asked farmers across this country what is the first thing they tell you they need? the number one thing they think is most important in terms of risk management? >> there is no question that is the answer but the question is whether or not we have challenged ourselves to think in new and more broadly. i'm not suggesting we shouldn't do which you outlined in crop insurance, absolutely. but what i am suggesting if you stop it just that. >> let's add countercyclical safety net to that. we do as good a job on that and update that including a reference prices to make sure it's relevant and reduce the need for ad hoc disaster programs? >> as long as you are not

damagi opportunities to create opportunity for conservation practices to the extent you are talking about during reference prices at the expense of fill in the blank snap ira that is where i think you have challenges which is why i havehy suggested less be more creative than that. >> can ask indulgence of the chair for maybe another minute at most? >> yes. >> glad you brought it up. conservation programs would you agree that should be voluntary? they should be former friendly, they should be not one-size-fits-all. and that we have good examples out there like a quip, csp and ranchers tell us they do it more of. >> everything we have done is been consistent with that senator. >> in the livestock area i am glad to hear that. we lten to farmers all l the time they do want programs and want more funding for the programs and i really think again emphasizing farmer friendly being so important that you are from iowa you know what i'm talking about.

cattleman. how do we get more transparency? well but they suffered for a long, long timeuf before they got these markets.etter now and i hope it continues. how do we continue question reeking of the concentration i won't go into all of that on account of time. what doe do to improve pricing and transparency? works price discovery greater transparency more processing capacity at the local regional level very quick to support our cattle contract library? >> absolutely, we established it. >> thank you secretary be appreciated. >> think you've got a numbe coming in so thank you senator. senator warnock. >> thank you so very much madam chair. i was glad to get the news a little while ago i'm sure everyone here has it looks like we may be avoiding a government shutdown. but here we are again engaged

and governing through brinksmanship. which is a terrible way to learn anything. let alone the united states government. included in the deal that was struck is ekend. and hopefully get these bills cleared next week. the government shutdown if the secretary could put into sharper focus for us welcome secretary bill sack as we think about this i am considering the implications of a lapse in funding. puts millions of hard-working families at risk. both those who runll family farms that are the lifeblood of our rule economies those who allow food assistance programs. secretary, what a government shutdown at usda

keep you up at night as our way through this? >> first of all the farmer who cannot get the loan. a farmer who will not be able to get a wsrc and plc payment to the farmer that will not be able to get the disaster assistance program pretty farmer who not get the conservation contract signed. the snap recipient that potential of not get the snap resources to be able to go to the groceryp store. the wick mom that would not get benefits from the wic program. the researcher who spent his hers life for the last several years doing some extraordinary research only to have the lab shut down and millions of dollars of research lost. the forest service that wants to open up the forest so people can enjoy them but can't and won't. i mean the list goes on. >> thank you so much. i appreciate that exhaustive list. it shows us how much is at stake beneath the gains at washington plays big. >> et cetera if i could say one

thing about. this? just the threat of a shutdown this is the fourth time we have had to spend his staff time planning for and interestingly enough depending upon the timing of the shutdown depends on who gets characterized and in what category in terms of the workforce. time. >> and resources. >> it is just m >> i'm going to change topics. you are well aware child hunger is a serious issue in our country 30 million students are eligible to receive free or reduced however over the summer months they often do not have adequate access to meals. hunger does not go on a vacation. how many are reached by the summer lunch >> you want to know how many of the states have agreed? >> 21 million out of the 30 million or so there eligible.

thirteen states have yet to agree to participate in the program. >> sadly georgia is one of the states the summer meal gap is putting our most vulnerable children at risk of going hungry. struggling in school and experiencing long term health challenges. >> 1.1 million in your staten too. >> 1.1 millions of state leaders i don't need it i don't know who the day as they are talking about. turning to benefit. how much money is georgia leaving on the table that can be used to feed her kids? >> $138 million. then you have to figure out how trolls run in the economy you are talking close to half a billion dollars of economic activity that is lost for.ar >> not to mention the economic impact on our state.

same thing with medicaid expansion is some of the story. i appreciate your effort in standing up this new program. appreciate all the hard work you all are doing at usda i'm not opted in to do so next year. if they continue to the summer meal gap and all in all of our children have equitable access to food i want to change it to enough another topic to two double zero six. and to to zero seven. i'll take credit for that last number. of the inflation reduction act. i fought hard to include was senator booker and the chair provide 5.3 $5.3 billion for economically distressedarmers and farmers historical discrimination by usda. it's been a joy to engage the farmers might tenure here in the

senate. i think about the program is one work every now and then to get a chance to do something that is transformational. i think of abrams is one of the farmers in georgia who had all of the loans forgiven. you know what this means. risk of literally losing his farm. lesson became before the committee for eligible farmers they apply for a distantance that application window iss closed. want to talk about happens next. and when applicants might see assistance. when i talk to farmers in georgia who've apply for this assistance they say the plan for the next planting season. when they can expect assistance. what is your timeline for gaining financial assistance into the pockets of farmers?

>> buy at last count there were nearly 60000 alications being received. and now the administrators, the outside administrators have to go to the process of evaluating the applications. ourr hope is we get resources out the door sometime in the summer. >> very good. thank you so very much. these farmers have had a long haul. this goes back over decades the financial assistance is long overdue. i want to continue to strongly encourage you to roll out the rest of this funding to other distressed fan remain on the land and have the opportunity to grow another crop crop. >> their additional nearly 40000 farmers who have received assistance. >> that is correct. >> thank you very much mr. secretary. >> thank you survey. >> thank youenator. center barn your back with this

i was thinking as a secretary was talking about growing climate solutions the work we've done together. >> i was a long journey. through the u.s. senate. ninety-two -- eight per. >> it was great. center boozman thank you for your met leadership on them. thank you madam chair. i'm still involved in farming to the extent you can. and by the way jon tester i think still drives a tractor in his spare time. other than things out of your jurisdiction i have over the last six months to a year her to topic the farming community and farmers are worried about they would be foreign ownership of lands. in its report that we have a right here gao made six recommendations that would help usda modernize the process. make the most of the datats things

collaborate better with national security agencies. madam chaircu or like to smit this into the record. bookss without objection. >> thank you. according to gao the current system is not meeting the mark to f penalize non- filers i have simplelation the improvement act with the senator tester as a co- lead. fourteen republicans nine democrats on i including madam chair. i believe this bill is low hanging fruit. it should be the next step congress takes in addressing the foreign ownership of agriculturalgr land. do you agree this to be a good bill to get to the process? >> senator it would be a very fine bill to get to the process. i do not thinkl should be fooled this is somehow going to

result in a significantly better system. and the reason i am saying that is we basically have today and honor system. we have a self reporting system. and so if you are not an honorable person you may decide not to report. there are overlin 3000er offices where you could potentially file a deed and no one know about it.f central database which i don't think folks are excited about listing all the real estate transaction that took place in this country of god and honor system if you are okay with an honor system improving it these are absolute right things to do not fool yourself into thinking this is going to result in a full and complete understanding of foreign ownership or. >> as you look at the gao recommendation? >> they really don't do much in terms t self reporting

aspect of this issue. >> of the bill were amended to take care of self reporting that we would you need to be to make it more effective? ensuring you are getting the information. >> that is why bill or it might be better. >> if that happened would you be okay? >> i will be fine with it you will find people not very excited about a national database were every real estate transaction that takes place in this country is going to be in purview. >> the problem with these issues is it is so easy to demagogue them. i'm not saying you do but it is a self reportingif you do not want to report, you take your chances. >> is something we could obably do to be a national database where you could find it and i will preempt it in some fashion. ng that with an llc that you have the

ability to look into and godeeper because they can try to hide the true owner through that. >> and then the question of how much ownership interest are you concerned about? what if it is a 1% wildlife influence? what could she be smart enough to get to the bottom will be hard to do. i think that is what i am after. we'll take that into consideration and see if we can work with you on theseto get that where it would be a good a product you think would work. so on another issue that i hear a lot about is prop 12. that has probably got producers in many places in a quandary between what they are operations and what they may have to do to be relevant who have been torn

between the investment they may have to make, some may it. in terms of the way things are happening in california, may be opportunities. but for many it is an area of concern. my concern is that you do not want toomogenize things across the country. there may be a good idea that there what's happening along the lines of that in terms of how it's got producers worried if their investment is going to be irrelevant. that might cascade across the country. >> when it makes a decision this did not violate the clause did not fullyul the market. because i don't think hog producers have much choice as the supreme court seems to think they did and determining this is

not a violation of the clause. the reality it's opens up the opportunity literally for all 50 states to do this in one f form or another. it could potentially be quite difficult for producers to understand precisely what to do and how to do it. the reaction i am having at the usda building out the local regional food system. so producers who choose not to participate with large packing facilities to do business in california have an alternative. >> the concern has to be we don't let one state be a shadow regulator that this place is going to reflectively look at it and declared the new standard but not saying we are doing it. on the other hand we doan idea to

be suppressed. >> that is something that looks like more out there than not. a lot of this stuff has been originating there. sweeping across the country. have to make sure it's not the tail wag and the dog. >> o o other issues that intersect in this discussion. >> think about a time. >> senator lujan very. >> think it madam chair and thank you ranking member for this hearing a thank you and your team and the work you have been doing. madam secretary or it madam chairr thank you to brandon and kyle for coming to new mexico. i appreciate them traveling across the country and taking time to see firsthand. i want to get out there with shovels are going to clean when one of these days but we had them out there.

they got a little taste of new mexico so thank you for that. >> so pleased to support that. i wanted to highlight as a studied the usda recently released highlighted the discrepancy in farm payments from hispanic and the study also showed hispanic farmers are more likely to be a fi counterparts in. i've been calling for more data on ethnic disparities and i was glad to see usda released this report. and at mr. secretary want to ask if i have your continued commitment to make equitynt usda? >> absolutely. >> i cannot thank you enough for it one of the most recent visit you had as you not to to mexico first time your self and i cannot thank you it's one thing to be able to hear about what's happening on the ground. it's another thing to see it for yourself. you took time to visit with some

of those families who were devastated by what is our largest fire interstates history. now, as i've mentioned several times in committee new mexico recovering from this devastating fire back in 2022. i between fema and usda some of which you address what you are still there but there are still some areas that need attention mr. secretary. usda and fema have credit one of the time resto to help the folks back at home, there is still some additional a direction that we could benefit from. working within new mexico and what i still here is about some of the confusing guidance coming rcs on these plans a. in addition this help push and applyshouldapply for other usda programs. my question can you as do more to help new mexicans cover from thesem fires? >> it sounds likee do. recently allocated additional

resources from a d fund to create a additional resources available to new mexico. to vermont and also to alaska. at their issues relative to nrcs i'm make sure paying attention to whatever the issues are and reducing whatever barriers exist because i appreciate that secretary bill>> sack. one of the busiest with kyle and brandon is one of those with the local farmer t impacted by the fires. you had a few issues you raised. make sure were working with the team to get a response so i can help better understand of those specific programs. mr. secretary, going forward howhe department plan to implement the lessons it has learned the recovery efforts in new mexico and practices? the reason i ask that question is to me there has been a revelation on this fire disaster crossed america and the federal

government as a whole but some of the flooding but will be included in some the declarations. the alphabet soup of the acronyms of every one responsibility to work with families in new mexico mexico. this is o the first. it's very unique. there are some practices that may be learned here. is there a way we can work together to ensure if this happens in the country some of these lessons learned fro families on the ground of the leaders within usda we can capture those and include in policy? >> i think so. one of the things we learned was the necessity of having a central location for all of our people are in one place at one time available to talk to folks who havferent issues depending upon the nature of the disaster and how it may have impacted their particular farm their home, their community. we did this in a gymnasium i believe in new mexico. i think we learned a lot from

that particular experience and we ought to be figuring out how to make that a standard practice. in response to disasters. >> i project that very much. one of the areas related to this in new mexico as you know mr. secretary was somewhat the reports and investigations that have been conducted some of the out completely. as a matter of fact on one of the investigations i believe the folks were looking out up at their hands over it and said it is not hot but they did not use some of the infrared technology that is available to ensure something is put out completely. and the question i have mr. secretary, is usda moving more aggressively to ensure when or other fires that got started but when we are putting them out technology like infrared technologies are used to make sure it's out completely does have a chance to spread? works another lesson learned from this i basically have a much more extensive plan and thought process behind the prescribed burn print using all the tools and technologies to

ensure that it is safe and it does not do the damage we've seen in new mexico so yes that is happening. >> i appreciate that secretary. the last thing i will touch on and i know you have heard this from a lot of our colleagues is the importance of making sure the people need to get food that are hungry the conversations taking place here around kids i think we all agree democrats republicans the most vulnerable in our communities there's more we can do to work together. and so secretary yes or no with the recent upd food plant help combat poverty? >> it did. there is obviously more to do. the summer feeding programs when youhaven't impact on child hunger and.

as i mentioned earlier is that in rural areas for reduction in the number consistently poor counties in this country. for the first time in over a decadee we've seen a population increase in rural america. things are beginning to slowly improve. obviously this a lot more work to do. >> i thank you >> thank you very much senator fischer. >> thank you met in german. mr. secretary, good to see a thank you for being here today here with my colleague was talking about. we had a fire this week in central nebraska that burned over 70000 acres. i am thankful currently there aren't any reported injuries. but obviously when you have a significant number of acres like that and the time of year that it is taking place it's getting hay bales as well as a pasture it is going to be an issue.

so, as we learn of the damages i appreciate your commitment to work with my office and nebraskans to get the necessary disaster assistance to producers in a timely manner. >> i would encourage her team to take a look at our disaster at a glance document that outlines the various programs that could be available. >> great to print out ought to echo sentiments senator spoke about with regard to our disaster public programs. i have a bipartisan bill with senator lujan that would ensure usda would have the authority to provide some of the advanced cost share payments for the onion program. >> restoration program. >> that is a good idea for. >> it's fabulous. a lot of times it takes a year or two to get those payments out out. you could see people out of business.t is important because what we are now seeing as disasters on top of disasters. i was up in new england new england

they basically had a flood just when they got things right they the got hit with another disaster which basically eliminated work they'd that done to that point. to figure a different mechanism for providing that help more quickly people. >> we haven't had snow for a while it will come back it is march in nebraska. we still have the issue with the fires that we had.ave also expressed concern previously that conservation dollars i believe need to be prioritized based on a locally driven conservation c needs. we have a large resource concerns that i hear about inbraska it centers around water. water quantity and quality and those are not prioritized nor are they permitted under ira icabout 65% of the practices founded in nebraska from 2020

provisionally eligible or not eligible at all under the ira. as usda eligible under the ira funding is it accurate that if theocal office believes the practice should be eligible they must then use their own limited time to >> i'm not sure we are tracking on this and think nebraska is part of the western water initiative we have allocated resources above and beyond the ira. focus on this issue of water. >> i am speaking specifically of the water projects do not qualify under the ira there are other programs i can qualify under but not under the ira is that correct? >> think thati think that is correct. i could stand to be corrected by think that is correct. but there are other programs

available with resources with normal budgeted resources that are ava purpose. >> correct. but when you have over half of the programs in nebraska that address water that need to address water and a offices in the past and have always prioritized those and continue to it limits the availability to tap into what i believe our are conservation practices that should be recognizedut when we talk about the ira. instead of it all being based on a mission we should be able to recognize. >> is based on the science that these practicesra will impact and affecteffect greenhouse reductions or carbon sequestration. again, the regular programs can be utilized for the purposes of folks at the local level that are most appropriate.

>> i agree with that statement. but i also continue to push those decisions need to be made at the local level. and passing a bipartisan bill that addresses just one segment local offices and the state or recognize the need and prioritization of other resources as a water quality and quantity. i am concerned. i am saddened those are not recognized by anymore is important for the state of nebraska per. >> we can argue about this not being important they are not necessarily claimant's march. >> we will have a discussion sometime on that. because you understand the importance in the state of nebraska and the value we have

for that resource. >> absolutely and that is why the part of the western water initiative being made available. >> the claimant's smart projects as well. so we differ on that, we differ on usda has been investing significant funds to increase independent processing capacity and i thank you forave seen a number of grants that have been awarded 186 million went to 24 projects another 171 million went to some other projects. but yet see epa their own or regulatory analysis shows that if they take their preferred regulatory route anywhere between 16 -- 53 of those processing facilities will close as a result. my office has heard from a small independent

facilities that are concerned epa is may be maybe underestimating the impact of that. i thank you for the investment by usda are worried about that? >> we provided input to epa which is their preferred alternative is limited to 16. they offered three options the preferred option is limited the third is the 58. we will continue to work with a folks. i think we will stilltrong commitment to a process we are not finished with additional resources. we also put together a plan i a relenting plan so facilities that may be on the now have access to credit to get them to a better place a very way to be at the option is available to address whatever the epa is requiring. >> i appreciate that as well. we have three of big

processors in the state. there's also a big movement in to have more localized processingpr plans and the effect that has on a rural communities local communities, local producers ishk people are getting a little leery though. quick reach on that, thank you very much. >> thank you very much. now last but certainly not least the senator from new jersey. >> thank you very much mr. secretary, we wrote to you urging usda and to move quickly with a billion dollars purchase and shipment of u.s. commodities in response to the really unbelievable global hunger crisis tens of mind to b around the world are disproportionately women and children are on the brink of do you have any update you can share with us on that? >> senator we are reliant on usaid on instructions and

directions they are the ones who administer the distribution of those resources. i would be more than happy to reach out and find out what our thoughts are. we are anxious to move on this as quickly as they give us direction. >> i appreciate the process and has beenis been dragging on way too ols the funding so i really ask you makehing in your can to expedite this process. and i believe food aid is a perfect example we did that usda authority to utilize and not allow parts and writeo future. mr. secretary you know i disagree with this administration on their position on profit 122 it. we have discussed this before. beenur really glad the supreme court rejected it. and i disagree somewhat comments i heard you made out loud to allow to enact laws is prop 12 i

think you said the word was chaos. i don't think there's any evidence of this. hi an you can understand at least, maybe not agree with but why millions of voters like california and massachusetts the legislatures in michigan and new jersey are simply appalled by the way pigs and i chickens are treated in these large factory farms. when they are a mobilize immobilized in these tiny battery cages and these gestation crates. iop hope you can understand why they have taken action to ban these inhumane practices. if you don't understand greet their cruel practices this is really an issue about democracy. faith in our democracy president present by nissen time and time again it is that an all-time low he has rightfully declared i think democraciesdemocracy is withdemocracies were the central causes of his presidency. andso with this issue of democracy in my opinion i questioned more question

more than ever at least in myet lifetime hope we can exercise caution over running the will of people interfering with the from i don't always agree with the texas agricultural commission last we keep posted it up and supporting washingtond on states and rights. like to state this for the record. >> without objection. >> thank youer very much. you note small farmers who raise animals more humanely from around the country felt a brief with the supreme court in support of prop 12 theurt cited that brief from american small farmers in this decision. farmers argue humane laws like prop 12 create a lot of market opportunities. this is in light usda egg a census shows we have lost 9000 hog

farmers since 2017. these independent hog farmers many have been in for business for years or generations have been driven out of business. we should give these laws a chance to create the marketportunities for farmers that are willing to be humane and supports the small farming question really, mr. ville sucked billsack to put it simply is shouldn't we allow or at least give a chance to create the market opportunities for these for our small farmers in america. >> senator i have no problem with the state directing how the farmers in that state shoulduld have the right to dohe that. i think the challenge is when they extend that to other wproducers the court basically made the decision this was not going to to discriminate against hog producers because they had a choice.

i am not sure howis much of a choice they have in terms of markets. we are trying to create more choice by expanding local processing. so my concern is if every state does what california does there's not going to be any consistency at all in the marketplace it's going to be very difficult for producers in a process with the rules of the game are. >> my concern is a big bag is pursuing this as a way to squeeze out of the market. people who would benefit from prop 12. disagree about this but a better approach for the small and mid side multiple sources of income. there are today ways that we can put in place to allow them to do this. >> yet 9000 small farmers are moved out of business. >> made of discus to my point my time is getting low.

usda equity commission released its final report. i was glad to see one of those recommendaons was a creation of usda office of small farms. sat with families going back to the homestead act. this is one of the recommendations. i've recommended to create an office and insured has enough funding to help small farmers. we can push this to conclude in the farm bill. i want to know if you support? >> that would be helpful. that would be helpful. in addition owning the resources to provide cooperators outside of usda to provide assistance as well so it is both. >> independent family farmers face outrageous challenges as a of the corporations continue fighting

for salt small farmers is critical. steps prop 12 are supporting what small farmers are wanting to do. usda is making a new crop tinsurance products and changes to whole farm and micro farm to make them more attractive for producers. however i am learning and hearing from small farmers they're not able to purchase these products agents and companies just won't sell to those independent smallau farmers. thear weight we are incentivizing agents and compani service the largest farms. in many ways it seems to be more rigged against small farmers come independent family farmers. we need serious safeguards to ensure every farmer has the opportunity to purchase crop inrance usda already has the

authority to address some of these issues. and i know i need to wrap for the record on this topic. i appreciate the indulgence by the chair. >> senator could you give me details about the farmers you've talked to? i more than happy to look into this. >> i would love that not only for my statement across thetr >> thank you really important questions. thank you mr. secretary for being with us today. you can see the broad interest from who have been anticipating for it you know how important you and your agency are as we talk about supporting our farmers. and in rural communities we all agree we want to thrive be able to live in rural communities and have the fullness of opportunity. thank you for your partnership. your dedication over the we look forward to working with you as we go forward. the record will remain open for five business days and with that

the meeting is adjourned. [background noises] [inaudible conversations] [background noises]

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