quirks live from bloomberg world headquarters in new york i am so najib razak. matt: i am matt miller. welcome to bloomberg crypto. sonali: we are also looking at

institutional investors. black rock, hamilton, and others. black rock, hamilton, and others. matt: thanks to an amazingly generous policy, here at bloomberg lp i have been on

paternity leave for the past six months. i thought it would be interesting to look at what fidler has done over that same time. no surprise, it has absolutely soared. up 70%. i get a lot of fun for that. but, there is an l.

trading volume as well. at least in terms of name, symbol, logo. crypto token and the company going from nearly zero to almost two cents. that's a lot. sonali: it is. we will discuss it with a reporter who reported on this. what happened this week? >> the names the same but are not actually affiliated with the projects or companies. in that case, if you were looking at the gmc token you

just had on screen, even if you bought right before the token jumped when the tweeter came out monday you would still be up compared to what people are getting in shares. matt: it seems to be worth more than it should be. there is no intrinsic value. you could say that about a lot of the assets we covered. is gamestop not angry about this? if somebody started a matt miller going used my logo i would be pretty angry about it. >> we have not asked gamestop to find out but in crypto anyone can make one of these coins in a matter of minutes. finding out who is responsible is difficult. crypto is a pretty anonymous environment. finding out who made the coins is difficult. the coin is still out there. you can still buy it. the main exchanges, you may find out who is behind the project. you won't see it on coin base

are the big ones. it will be in the tidy world of decentralized finance. >> -- sonali: what trust is there when you don't know who is behind it? when it came to buying the initial gamestop stock it was behind the return of rotering kitty -- roaring kitty. why did we see the crypto version get as much love? does that continue at this point? >> crypto investors love to speculate. the entire point of crypto is speculation. the fact that something does not have intrinsic value is nothing. that's how you interact with the whole industry. in this case the coin we were talking about, gmac -- gme was made in january. as a meme coins gain popularity, somebody thought, i will make a meme stock on a case it comes back again and it did. those buying the coin have no

recourse here. the project counter could easily take -- project founder could easily take all the money out of the projects and run away with it and you would be left with nothing but that is the fun of it. you could have massive return to that potentially make money if you sell at the right time and that there is the matter if there is the liquidity in the market to buy when you want to sell. it's a total free for massive returns or bumper pool. that is the fun of it. emily nicolle covers crypto for us. let's get away from the meme traded to real market institutional news. securitize a secured $47 million in funding led by blackrock helping blackrock push into private market tokenization. it has become the largest tokenized treasury fund in less than two months since its launch. we discussed with the ceo carlos domingo. set up your company for us. if you have actually received

over $100 million more funding than that. how does it look now? carlos: we have been doing this tokenization since 2018. it has been a long journey to get the technology right, to get the licenses, the regulatory licenses with the sec, etc., to operate. we have raised a lot of money. the particular project we are doing with blackrock is significant. it will be the largest tokenized fund in history and the fastest growing in less then two months. and the fact that it is issued by the largest asset manager that has also become a holder and board member of the company. it is an important step in our journey. sonali: how is demand looking for the fun right now? how quickly is it growing? how do you see future demand looking? carlos: we just started, so i think it will get a lot bigger

than it is. we spread the word about what the fund is and i talk to more people. we want more and more people in the company. i think that you will see acceleration. i think what we have done already is remarkable but we are just scratching the surface. >> i love the ticker. buidl. it is fun because it plays on hodl, but it's a serious fund. what kind of interest are you seeing? who is buying it and what are they using it for? carlos: i think it is great blackrock went with the ticker. because, as you say, it is a play on hodl, that crypto people use. we are seeing options in three ways. one is treasury management for companies like dallas or nation etc.. the second is building a lot of

products, tokenized treasuries, tokenized money market funds. the third is to use it as collateral for trading. people for the most part post a stable coins. now they can post something that earns a yield and improved their performance. there are three different actions. sonali: what are the regulatory application? the money part, the fund part, the regulatory part is not as fun to talk about. if you have an sec entity sec to some degree that have been critical of certain products, in the token space, why is it so easily allowed at this point for people to be building tokenized assets off of traditional financial services when the crypto universe tokenization is still under scrutiny? carlos: this is a security. there is no dispute about that.

this is a security issued by a transfer agent we owned, a registered transfer agent ended it is sold through proper -- through a property there that is also sec regulated. we follow all of the rules of how private securities are being issued and so on. matt: carlos, before the show sonali was explaining to me the efficiencies of tokenization. in her example she used her phone as an asset. i think a money market phone is a better asset. what are other assets you think are right for tokenization? where does it provide the best efficiency? carlos: you can think of any security more efficient when tokenized. tokenization brings you a better ledger when you track securities. it gives you securities and cash to trade on the same ledger

without all of the risks in capital markets. i do not think that one security is better. i think depending on market conditions some securities are more attractive to be tokenized than others. we are in a high interest rate environment. obviously money market funds, private credit, things like that are more interesting. matt: let me put it this way. when you are sitting in a boardroom or doing a white board with people from blackrock or other institutional investors, what are the products you are talking about organizing next? carlos: after the success we have had with money market funds and treasuries, private credit. we already have a product that is probably the next wave that will come. it is the second largest category of tokenized assets in crypto already. i think we can bring more institutional grade products to market.

the ones i mentioned and others from blackrock, kkr, or other partners into the crypto ecosystem that today don't really exist. >> who are the biggest buyers in the tokenized funds? talking about the tokenization of private credit you were talking about an illiquid asset, generally, that could put -- could be put into more retail hands through the vein of tokenization. there's a huge argument about how ready that market is for that. how quickly can tokenization facilitate movement retail? >> is semiliquid, like one with monthly liquidity. it's not like private equity or vc that is very liquid and it is hard to make them more liquid. look, it's not fair if you want retail customers do not have access to the same type of products institutional people have. look at the portfolio of an institutional investor.

they have a percentage of their assets in alternative assets were private credit is one of them. trying to democratize access to alternative assets through tokenization will bring value to retail investors. many products like etf's are very popular with retail. i believe this asset class will be popular with retail as well. sonali: that is securitize ceo carlos domingo on the partnership with blackrock and a new highly publicized tokenized fund. coming up we talk about event contracts under more regulatory scrutiny from the cftc. we discussed with one of the ceos of the leaders in their space. >> ftx plans to repay customers back all their money plus interest. but the customers, at least some of them, no matter about missing bitcoins record rally since bankruptcy. sonali: access the latest data

and news on crypto. check out cryp on the terminal.

at: ftx customers that lost their money during the collapse of the exchange missed out on her belly that quadruple the price of bitcoin. now they are getting paid back the money they lost it but they are getting paid interest because they missed out on the massive gain they could have

possibly had. first of all, jonathan, it is amazing that the victims of this giant bankruptcy are being paid back. i remember talking to a head for lunch a head-hedge fund manager that now looks very smart. >> he does. there are a lot of investors and even retail customers that bought up claims pretty soon after ftx filed bankruptcy i don't -- in november 2020 two. it was trading around $.10 on the dollar. you were saying $.20 on the dollar. now the expectation is most customers will get 118% back above par, incredible. sonali: i am not understanding why it is based on november 2022

pricing. why couldn't they do it more recently? jonathan: what the new ceo of ftx and advisors have said is it is a requirement of the bankruptcy law and how chapter 11 works. we have seen similar pricing done in other crypto bankruptcies, not just ftx. the theory behind it is you are locking in a price at the time of bankruptcy. it is a problem if you have a volatile asset that goes up substantially in value. that is what we have seen with bitcoins and other tokens since the bankruptcy. it is bankruptcy. it's not just about crypto. it protects downside. if you had a claim on the company filed bankruptcy and protects you in case the value of the claim deteriorates since the bankruptcy. really, why is this happening?

it is a function of whether bankruptcy is and how bankruptcy works and that has been -- what bankruptcy is and how bankruptcy works and that has been in conflict with how crypto works. we have seen that over and over again and this is the latest iteration. matt: i can understand with the price of it going -- of bitcoin going from 15 grand at the low point where the bankruptcy creditors want to market to 62,000, 64,000, 65,000. i get that is recovered. what are other assets ftx has or has had that make it possible to pay back creditors? jonathan: they have a ton of solana, and that has had a similarly enormous increase in price since the bankruptcy started. they had a large stake in anthropic, the ai startup. they sold a substantial amount of the shares they had in that.

those are two big sources of recovery. they have filed a number of lawsuits to recover money that ftx, while it was run by sam bankman-fried, was paying two different other companies, different nonprofit organizations. a lot of that litigation is outstanding. it is a combination of litigation. anthropic is a big component. and, holdings and so on. another big component. but, those are the three biggest. biggest. boring does. boring makes vacations happen,

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pop derivatives being used it to bed on political contests and sports games. we discussed whether the ceo of one of the firm that sound -- aims to deal with susquehanna to open a trading desk for event contracts. what a crazy time to face a dispute with the cftc before a major election cycle. how are you responding? how quickly can you have this resolved? >> thank you for having me. for little context on how we got here, this is the first and only legal prediction market in the u.s.. the committee of prediction market traders has been growing. it is simple. you predict the future and you make money. right now it is yes or no and we will progress into different

products. you imagine who will win elections, what will happen to the weather tomorrow, will tiktok be banned? the industry has seen explosive growth in the last year, incredible. we are doing millions of transactions every day. our community of traders is growing as we have seen crazy things like people making hundreds of thousands of dollars on weather this month alone. as you mentioned, susquehanna has committed the first dedicated market maker to trading on these products. >> they are on your board, right? >> no. they are just the first largest institution to set up a division ii trade prediction markets and events. what differentiates us as a company is we went to the legal route. we spent three years and a half with the cfc to be regulated upfront and we were approved by a bipartisan 5-0 votes and we have seen tremendous growth since then. matt: i have been following the

company since matt levine wrote about you in 2021. the question was how will regulators deal with this? you have gotten along with the regulators really well. but there are still issues. in terms of an election, what is the dispute resolution mechanism? how do you decide he was a winner? for example, former president donald trump may claim he won the 2020 election. how do you deal with somebody that agrees with him? tarek: any new financial technology comes with risk and difficulty. you always have to weigh the benefits and cost. the benefits are two things. one, you let people risk manage against elections. i used to work at goldman. if you go to goldman you can do it but it is not accessible to anybody tha --. you get accurate election

forecast. i believe it is important the next 10 years to bring more truth to the system. election markets can bring more truth to the process. >> we have a very little time left. i am worried about what a different administration would read the contract side. even if the current administration comes down hard on the project -- product you think i donald trump administration would treat it differently? tarek: there was a headline that there is no good reason for such a ruling. i leave politics alone. it's just not my job. i do know there is a lot of internal dissent in the commission. there is disagreement over what happened. some are calling this a blockage that is potentially illegal and against the first amendment and we are seeing a people in congress with letters sent by senators and representatives about this. you are banning categories of legitimate economic activity. potentially you are re-creating conditions for another ftx. you are pushing the activity

from onshore regulated companies to offshore illegal companies that can steal customer funds. >> it's a fascinating company. we hope to have you back. you also overlap with crypto. that is why we have you on the show. i think prediction markets are fascinating on their own. thank you for joining us. kalshi ceo. that does it for bloomberg crypto.

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sonali: welcome to bloomberg markets. i'm so sonali: sick and we are looking at record highs for u.s. stocks as u.s. inflation shows signs of cooling, a small step in the right direction for the federal reserve at its fight against price pressures. markets flying high above 5200, flirting with 5300, .8% higher.

the nasdaq 100 up more than 1%. the bid in the bond market significant, 474 on the two year, seven basis points lower more than 10 basis points meaningfully lower this week in the 10 year at 435. it was not long ago we were stable around 450. an eight basis point drop at the longer end of the curve. mid-day movers on the equity side, amc and gamestop. the meme stock rally starting to cool. the stocks more than doubled over the first two days of the week getting roughly $11 billion in combined market value. both stocks remained below their all-time highs. gamestop falling around 31% and amc down 23%. netflix has exclusive rights to stream two nfl games on christmas day. it will be the first time netflix has licensed the rights to one of the world's top premier sports competitions.

it is the first time it will air live football. the company will pay less than $150 million per game. netflix roughly flat on the day down around .3%. back to economic data. core cpi data slowed for the first time in six months. let's discuss further with t. rowe price chief u.s. economist. it is interesting to say -- see today's cpi data throwing water over concerns we saw about producer pricing yesterday. how do you take the information we got today and put it into perspective amid the figures we have had around choppy inflation marks here? lorena: it is important to highlight that we had and in line with expectations number. the market is reacting as if we got a lower than expected number and i guess what everybody is reacting to his deceleration in core inflation pressures in

april versus a spike we saw in price pressures during the first quarter and for me looking at the deceleration in price it's it's -- prices it's important to understand why inflation is slowing. i saw three key sources of slowing inflation momentum in the report. it was health care, transportation services, and shelter. we were concerned in q1 about the strength in core services prices and as they all came down during april. i think this is fairly encouraging. within this, we are seeing issue and cost both in health care and transportation, and an auto insurance come down. this is important looking at super core services, a key pillar of inflation the fed has been focusing on because it responds more to domestic demand pressures and domestic labor

markets. remember that the momentum in shelter inflation is not where it needs to be. we need to be close to .3% on both rent andoer for the fed to hit a two percent inflation target on a sustained basis. i think this is what the fed it needs to see before cutting interest rates this year. sonali: good point. i was just going to say your view is very balanced and you have a market reacting quite significantly today. i am wondering if the data today alone is enough to seal the deal on the idea of a rate cut before december? blerina: i think cutting rates at the july or september meeting is a very high bar to getting there. this kind of inflation report is not enough. we need down side surprises in inflation prints over the coming months for the fed to be concerned -- to be confident that they are on the right track

to hitting 2% next year and that is what they have another forecast. they aren't saying they will hit the target in 2024. looking at the components of inflation, i think that we can only get there if rent and oer component services decelerate in a meaningful way. this has been the wild card this year. all the private sector rent suggested we should be seeing softness on a process in the private-sector feed through to the bls data and we have not seen that. now we are in a situation where the housing market is improving. home prices are edging a little higher and sales and starts are picking up. so it is not clear if we will see the full pass-through of private-sector rent measures into the sector component of cpi. >> looking at the consumer story

here, but housing is a big pressure on the consumer over all. there was a point made online by constance hunter at macro policy perspective that even if you saw inflation starting to cool from the pace we have seen rises before we are still having consumers stuck with higher prices than they had been with over the last couple years. that burns to some degree, doesn't it? what role does the consumer play in the economy now? how much is the burn hitting the pocketbooks? blerina: the nominal price rigidity is there. it will stay with us. we hit a new price level and do think cognizant of that. it shows up in consumer competence measures. even though they have picked up every time we see inflationary pressures like we did in q1 of this year consumer confidence and sentiment takes a hit and move slower. consumers are still very

sensitive to prices. one way in which we are seeing this is in the consumption and prices of durable goods. we are talking about goods deflation in the report. it is clear and looking at core goods cpi. split that between durables and non-durables. nondurable goods prices are increasing. it is a durables that are in deflation. i think part of that is because big ticket items have become so expensive and consumers bought so much of that during the pandemic and year after that we are seeing demand soften and price pressures reflecting the softness in demand in my view. the thing is, what we are seeing in durable goods prices and demand we have not really seem translate into nondurables and services demand. these are pockets where the consumer, even if month-to-month there is softness and

volatility, consumer spending data remain in pretty good shape and i think as long as we have that, it can be difficult for the fed to bring inflation and price down significantly and at a fast pace. i think this is where the patient approach will have to play out. sonali: we are one day from walmart or earnings. we will get more from the consumer through corporate earnings. that is to row price chief u.s. taconic -- t. rowe price chief u.s. economist blerina uruci. coming up, we talk about cisco reporting after the bell today with details of its purchase and whether customers are still cautious. we talk about the business side of confidence next on bloomberg.

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sonali: its bloomberg markets. i'm sonali paszek. the stock of the hour. cisco investors await earnings after the bell. last month customers were showing greater caution. how is cisco a barometer on the confidence of businesses and their willingness to spend in this environment? jon: they are a great gauge of corporate spending. in technology circles they are a unique story. you have a lot of companies. we have been covering corporate earnings that are reasonably well cashed and right now when it comes to i.t. spending at the ai transition of a lot of companies in corporate america are willing to spend to be ready for that. what is unique about cisco now is when it comes to traditional networking gear a lot of their customers are sitting on too much inventory. it's not that we are saying we don't want the stuff.

they are still working it into their infrastructure. this was a key concern last quarter. analysts and investors will watch closely to see what they had to say about that logjam, whether they are working through it. cisco is a mature technology company. they can control what they can control. if that is cost. job cuts came in part because of lumpiness they are dealing with now. they can pay dividends or buy back stock. the bigger issue is one to watch. because a lot of customers have been sitting on a fair amount of networking gear in recent months. sonali: i love the idea that cisco has a $90 billion war chest for mna, of great interest to the street. this is the first quarter where we will get more information about what splunk needs for cisco. jon: to spend in an all cash

transaction that cisco did and to tap the debt market like they did talk -- did was very notable. the messaging overnight starts to change. we talked about a lumpiness with the networking gear side of the business. if you buy splunk and they are reputable software player there are nice complementary assets here. you have customers that want to make sure they are monitoring for cyber security risk. if they can sell more customers on that idea that is a win. in addition if you can increasingly see your business benefiting from saab for revenue or subscription revenue it changes the makeup of your financials. wall street will watch that closely. there is the possibility, some analysts are talking about guidance being updated to reflect splunk. we will have to watch that closely as well. sonali: jon erlichman we appreciate your expertise when it comes to everything

technology. coming up, we talk about technology from a different angle. data bridge is front and center fueling the ai boom. we talked to marc ganzi the ceo of digital bridge next.

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sonali: the ai revelation has the power to scale financial services businesses at a faster clip and that is what the cohead of goldman sachs global institute george lee told me at the company's annual leveraged finance conference in california. he is one of the more well-known technology dealmakers in the world. george: the exciting new developments in the industry now are remarkable and hard to keep pace with. equally, it is hard to imagine a sector not deeply influenced by this technology.

certainly, in the first instance, knowledge industries like ours are profoundly affected by a technology that can reckon with human language and context and so forth. that will be very very impactful for us. but any industry in which you have people that are trying to synthesize knowledge, create new ideas, and be creative, it will be impactful. sonali: where do you think the opportunity is most under appreciated today? ai investors around the world are already looking at semiconductors and data centers and you are seeing a high every industry. george: what is interesting about this technology revolution is it is a full stack revolution. the paradigm shift in the way computation is being performed for generative ai workflows influences everything from the fundamental player of the stack of energy and power through semiconductors, through networking and computational equipment through data to the

applications themselves. it is a fascinating time in which every player of the stack is being profoundly shifted by the technology. it creates enormous opportunities for investors and companies figuring out how to harness the technology to create change and advantages in their business. sonali: how is this changing how you do business in goldman sachs? goldman has been using ai a long time and has experimented a lot when it comes to emerging technologies. how do you see the genera -- difference now when it comes to generative ai and what you can do at goldman? george: we have a rich history of using technology, computation, and data science to create opportunities and advantage for clients. we have been using ai for many years. this new expression of the long journey of generative ai is unique because it has an ability to allow us to incorporate new data types, to reason around a data types. so, it i would divide it into

two dimensions. one is the advice business. the ability for our best people to ask and answer questions that have been prohibitively difficult in the past. to come up with more ideas for clients, to test more hypotheses. it's remarkable. i think it will reduce the cycle time from idea to transaction. now, we are also in a business where there is a lot of operational intensity. a lot of the operational intensity in our business has to do with documents and human language. the potential to use the technology. >> behind the ai boom is data centers. digital bridge is building one such center. joining us is mark ganzi the digital bridge ceo. dedicated to investing in digital infrastructure. a number of years ago made a massive pivot to this earlier

than many others. if you look at the industry and is the difference you see today, then maybe you even did two years ago, what does the forward pipeline look like for demand when it comes to ai and the logistics around ai driving so much wall street interest? marc: it is primarily driven by what you talked about in the previous segment. the workloads for ai are massively bigger than cloud and massively bigger than historic enterprise workloads. the market today is about 50 gigawatts of online capacity on a global basis. that's going to 100 gigawatts. that's hard to fathom. new york city turns on the five watts of power every day. imagine you have to build 10 in new york city's in 3-5 years. it is a daunting challenge and for every gigawatt we liked up it is billions in capital. this is a huge area of attraction under the alternative

asset management space and a big topic of discussion with investors today on a global basis. sonali: there is always a question around supportive ai. one reason is correlation. you aren't investing in a stock like nvidia, for example. but you are investing in hard real estate, doing better than other property values in the u.s. right now. big questions still remain over the power of grid. how do you see these issues playing out? marc: we have been tracking this the last two years and we have been very prescriptive with investors. the aging infrastructure in the u.s. and europe are inhibitors. there is about 8-9 gigawatts left of power on the u.s. grid in the next 24 months and another 2.7-3 .2 gigawatts of power left in europe. think about the 50 gigawatts we

are trying to light up as an industry. you can see structural challenges. we can certainly generate a power here and in europe. but, the bottleneck is transmission. we are working very hard on that thinking about alternative ways to bring power directly to the data center, creating our own transmission into structure, are owned microgrids, empowering the next generation of data center development. sonali: you are seeing record demand and record booking. there is a question about how correlated the industry is to the broader economy. what would slow the pace of growth here? marc: availability of power and availability of capital. those are the two fundamental challenges for the infrastructure industry in general. that is our ability to continue to form capital. our ability to have good land sites, access to power, and, don't go to sleep on the supply

chain. what we do is very specialized. having specialized components around cooling or backup power. we talked about developing microgrids and the backup batteries associated with that. there's a lot of infrastructure that gets billed. it is not just putting in high-powered racks. you need the ecosystem to support it. that is something we have been doing for 30 years here. getting in front of that is what we have been doing writing up over two gigawatts of capacity today with a pipeline of over seven gigawatts of new data centers plan to bring online over the next 2-3 years. to do that you have to raise capital. that is why we made the decision to move to an alternative asset management framework. now we have the ability to raise capital to scale on a global basis and it a ploy to capital to the world making sure they get great returns. that excites us. >> where is most of the money coming from if there are conversations in the private asset industry around the challenges of fundraising environments?

this has been a relative bright spot. who is investing to at this point? marc: really it is global allocators. large pension systems. think about sovereign wealth funds. we have seen a big pickup in the last 45 days in terms of fundraising capabilities. we saw a renewed investor interest. we have a cluster of lps looking at our various investor products. we have seen a significant turn in investor sentiment, particularly, as it relates to investing in private markets. as you know, the alternative asset management space today is $16 trillion of capital every day. infrastructure is only $1.4 trillion. global allocators, whether a pension fund, an insurance company, or a sovereign wealth fund, we know when we walk into a meeting pitching but we are doing in ai data centers, we know the investor is under allocated to infrastructure and

digital infrastructure. that is why we have a lot of optimism around the capital we are forming now. we see investors leaning in in a big way this quarter and we are optimistic about capital formation for the rest of the year. sonali: how much dry powder are you willing to put to work and how fast? marc: we laid out a plan to put to work about $16 billion of this year and we think we will exceed that putting to work somewhere between 21 billion dollars-22 billion dollars of capital. 50% of that will come with equities and 50% will come with data. we have a lot of dry powder to put to work in the sector and certainly more work to do for the balance of the year. we are completely capitalized for all data center capacity we are building this year. we are focused on raising capital for 25 and beyond. sonali: on another beaming area in the ai exuberant market. a quick check of the markets before we let you go.

record highs today. exciting in the markets. the s&p up nearly 1%. the nasdaq 100 up even more. the bid in the bond market sustained with an eight basis point move lower in the two year. i'm sonali basak. that does it for bloomberg markets today. stick with us through the close and a balance of power. is bloomberg.

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