>> after 240 years of existence, man group has a woman in charge for the very first time. she was promoted from president to chief executive last september, the high point of a 15 year career at the firm. the former barrister enter the world of finance three decades ago and never left. >> the speed of change, the impact, the global nature, the challenge of it just never stopped getting more and more infectious for me. francine: in this episode, i speak to robin group about diversity, purpose, and what the future holds in an ever-changing world. robin, thank you so much for joining us on leaders. the world is a bit strange. there are so many crises or whatever you want to call it. it's just difficult to get a handle of what comes next.

>> yes, that would be the shortest answer i could ever give. it is difficult. if this year has taught us anything it is that prediction is not our strongest suit, perhaps. and that isn't just in relation to markets, it in relation to the big geopolitical events that we are still living with. >> but it is quite incredible to think that we're any better place and i feel like every six months there if the doom and gloom crew saying this is it, interest rates of got too much, we need to reevaluate what happens next. and yet the economy holds. robin: i think that is right. when we have this conversation about higher for longer, which i still say out loud, cross my fingers in some ways that i'm going to be entirely wrong, but higher for longer, where the nuance is in that message is what we are unlikely to see is 0%, probably unlikely to see 2%. we may see some 50 basis points

adjustments for sure, but i think what we have been signaled clearly from central banks is that they are not frightened of using policy to control inflation or to try to respond to inflation, and i think that if the messaging we should all kind of get used to. last 10 years, 0% free money. next 10 years, higher for longer with that slightly nuanced in a way that i described. francine: and i imagine that 2024 could be difficult because of all the volatility, so it makes it harder to manage money. robin: i think it does. the denomination effect we saw because of the hiccups in the system with the banking crisis, that also put a premium back into liquidity. so what is the duration risk, had you manage these different economic cycles? and are you prepared or are you ready for hedging which means

that at times you're going to do well and the times you are not going to do well with the entirety of your portfolio, and that is ok. actually managing your portfolio for these different, changing economic cycles or behaviors is what you are supposed to be doing. francine: does it change how you lead man group? robin: changes because of the way we leave the organization. we are an organization that is diverse. we have different engines doing different things, being on-site or on the fundamental discretionary side. we have products that are in the macro space, product that are equities. we are long owning, we are long-short, but what we are seeing is our clients are interested in more customized solutions, solutions that actually enter the problem they've got for the challenge they have rather than here is a product, buy that or nothing

else. it changes the way you deliver an organization, the fact that the value you are driving toward is not just about here is a product, but here is a solution. francine: so what does that mean in how you are focusing your energy 2024? i do you want to be in the private credit face, but hiring is also something you need to think of carefully. robin: what we have are highly talented individuals who are focused on being the very best to compete in the workplace and delivering what they do, and mac in the in our engines for middle office department or in our legal department. it is about a talent. hiring the very best people, retaining, keeping most people, giving them opportunity, giving the space where they can be the very best they can be is incredibly important. so it is tech, it is talent, it is vision. it is about knowing that when people come to work every day,

every single person at man group adds value and is valued. that is important. if i could have everybody answer the same question, what do you come to work to do everyday, and the answer to that is because we are the custodians and we are responsible for the savings, pensions of real people like my mom and dad, and your mommy dad, then we would do a better job every day. francine: how do you hire? there is a battle to get the very best, so what are they want? robin: who doesn't want to be around really smart people? who doesn't want to be around a place which values your input? who doesn't want to be in a place that doesn't seek to be better today than it was yesterday and better tomorrow than it is today? who doesn't want to be around a place which is actually interested in you as a person and interested in being capable of making you better?

so where do we go? we go abroad, we go wide, we look for difference, energy and excitement. that person who is able to get energized. francine: you don't always hear that permit the finance chief executive. robin: i think finance has done as good a job as we might in explaining the value we bring to society more generally. i don't cure cancer, that is not what i do. i wish i could. i mean i wish i was that smart and capable, but what we do is protect and enrich the savings and the pensions of people, people who have worked incredibly hard as of their lives and diligently put their money aside in their 401(k) or wherever it may be, and we are entrusted with that and he can give them, if we do our job well, financial security. we can provide something that

enables legacy investing, it enables access to health care, to education, to a roof over your head to pay the bills, to all of those things. that is a pretty important thing to do. francine: you seem to be filled with a big sense of purpose, which you don't often get from hedge fund managers. robin: i have a vague sense of purpose, i run a firm that has a big sense of purpose and i think that energy is something we should put to work. when i sit down with big allocators and we talk about what it is we are both trying to do, it is the same. i think the day we forget that, the day that i think about our numbers in the institutional size number that we all talk about, we lose a bit of that sense of what we are here to do properly. francine: coming up, robin groupon adapting to change in an uncertain future. robin: i'm not good at

predicting what the next you're the next five years is going to be. what we need to do is to be flexible, to understand the dynamic, to think about the impact of markets and changes.

francine: from renewed geopolitical risks to climate change, new era for interest rate and a different working reality, the world of finance is also adapting to change. i continue the conversation with man group chief executive robin grew. do you worry about what the future economic footprint look like the road? robin: our job is to say how do we think about what could happen, how do you stress your portfolio, how do you think about what your outcomes are today? people join their pensions today vs. drawing their pensions 50 years or not? man group is 240 years old. we match the duration of some of our clients who are thinking

about just returned year from now, but i trying to think about what they are planning for 30 years from now. we are not good at predicting. i'm not good at predicting with the next year or the next five years is going to be. what we need to do is be flexible, is to understand that the dynamic, think about the impact of markets and changes. francine: are you more worried about geopolitics or market functioning? robin: i think the fact that we have changed geopolitics to geo-economics is something of an impact. as we think about what happened when russia invaded ukraine and the impact on our fossil fuel pricing, or you think about the worries and concerns around supply chains and the fact that these buffers when you think about corporate real estate and the refinancing is inevitable, it is not a 30 year mortgage, these are things coming up for refinancing within the next 3, 4, 5 years. that is a lot of money being put to it.

and we are in an environment where we look at office buildings in a different place and a different level of occupancy than we've seen before. these are big changes. geo-economics, francine: francine: these are things that we have to take into consideration. what do you worry about most, the you have a ranking or is it always one in the same? robin: is a transformational change. i think we're going to see credit markets playing a role. i don't think that is a short-term thing. i think you see lending tightening and you're going to see a stellar need for financing out there, but it isn't that all things are created equal. i'm a big proponent of active management, a big proponent of credit but not every active manager, not every credit expert is going to be able to deliver in these environments. there is expertise and skill needed. how do i think about prioritization? i think about priorities in terms of capabilities. i think about being a skilled as we can be in data, in analytics,

in tact, in credit, and multiple asset classes, and then being able to pivot those. i think that is where i think about things. but do i think that is the number one thing i'm focusing on? i don't have the luxury of that. francine: are you looking at acquisitions to be in certain spaces? >> we have a lease that we will grow the firm organically and we will always look for acquisitions between is our capability on content for clients. i think what is interesting as we completed our acquisition with private credit -- credit management in the u.s. what is interesting is that the multiples look more interesting. we've been talking about consolidation. we've been talking about consolidation since the gsc. this is one of those points i'm going to perhaps also laugh about a time from now, but i actually think as we look at the barriers to entry in this space,

if we look at the cost of running our businesses, if we think about the scale that we to operate at, and the multiples that we are starting to see coming down, i think this could be an interesting time for consolidation. francine: but why has it been a long time coming, is it regulation, with her just no appetite? robin: i think when cash is free it softens that. i think the moment were people need to deploy at scale in liquid markets has been something to soften. if you look at the trend, trend has been passive, it has been in private equity. you think about the number of asset that no longer sit in the public domain, that has been erythema over the last 10 years. when private equity doesn't have quite as much cash, and that raising is harder, when lending is harder, these opportunities for niche spaces and expertise to come about, they want scale. they need to be able to operate

at scale and having an organization can deliver the amount of scale we put in play, the bit that is perhaps less sexy and exciting, but that infrastructure, the ability to obtain businesses and grow them, that is what we do. francine: what do you think of the city of london, will it lose a bit of luster? robin: you're looking at a u.k.-listed co, so i could not be more interested in u.k. plc. i think we have held such an extraordinary position in financial markets and generally, so anything we can do to keep that shine i think is important. but competition is hard. we shouldn't sit on our hands and think that all of our history is going to count for long if we don't keep running. i'm a great believer that we drive and continue to drive u.k.

plc there is such a lot of innovation and creativity and growth here, such a lot of expertise that sits on these small shores. anything we can do to keep it alive and keep it at its top game, i am all for. but we operate as a global organization and i'm going to go where there is strong capability to invest, for the client status to be and where we can find opportunity, and i'm going to continue to look for that. a u.k.-listed co who can't help but want this to be great. francine: up next, robin grew on being a female leader in an industry traditionally dominated by men. robin: i'm hopeful we are going to see a better reflection of difference, yet financial services or broader than that. services or broader than that. ♪♪

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even from the first call. [graduate] my advisors consistently reached out and guided me along the way. - it was like i was talking to a friend, like someone that i had known for years. - the instructors were very helpful with everything that i was going through. [announcer] we'll be with you from day one to graduation to your dream job. ♪ it all starts the moment you find your program. [announcer] go to snhu.edu to get started. francine: women make up less than a quarter of employees at the thousands of hedge funds and other investment firms globally. they are even more of a minority in senior positions. so when man group appointed an all-female leadership team last year, it marked a massive shift for the company and a milestone for the industry. i continue the conversation with robin grew. francine: 240 years old. first female chief executive of

institution at 240 years old. should have been earlier? are you optimistic about the future for females and finance? robin: i am hopeful we are going to see a better reflection of different of the top of every organization, be it financial services or broader than that. has it been a long time coming? i can't help but say it would have been terrific if we could see more female ceos before me. i hope we are going to see a lot after me. the difference is important and i think anything that enables us to put the most talented people at the top of organizations and to lead those organizations with enthusiasm and capability is what we are after. so i'm hopeful that i'm knocking down some doors, barriers, ceilings. francine: the first time someone meets you, it is the infectious energy that people notice.

is that how you lead? robin: yes. it is one of those things, i have been accused of being many things over my time, but that slight duracell bunny, ever -ready, i am a bit that. i have an enthusiasm for what we do, a passion for what we do. it is sometimes like i am a big boom in the room but it is something i think is incredibly important. you don't do this job 98%. this is where my mathematicians hate me and i say anything larger than one hunter percent. you do this job 100% plus. francine: were you always like that? robyn: yes, and to some extent it is what forged my career, that willingness and that excitement to learn and be part of fixing things, doing things better has been somewhat of a hallmark. i have a ridiculous enjoyment for learning and doing things.

i walk into any organization or any of our offices and if there is somebody in the elevator with me, i am asking a thousand questions. they can't wait to get out in the end of it by some ways -- in some ways. i fundamentally and driven by the young interested in the people i work with and in the people who we are here to work for. francine: so you start robyn: something like that. francine: i loved being -- what made you switch? robyn: i loved being an advocate and perhaps i'm still an advocate in many ways. i was in the criminal and civil bar and i thought i would go do this commerce thing and i will go back and become a commercial barrister. and it sucked me in and i never

went back. the speed of change, the impact, the global nature, the challenge of it just never stopped getting more and more infectious for me. that legal training, has it been useful? yes. has the advocacy thing been more useful, probably. but it has been just the best journey. francine: do you have bad days and if you do, who do you call? robyn: who do you call, the ghostbusters. if i have a bad day, i've always been a half full kind of person. every belief i have is that you make the best out of those tough days. of course there are tough days, days when you put a challenge in front of you where performance isn't great or where i feel like we could have done a better job. those are moments where you got to move forward. to take the next step. i think it is resilience.

i think it is part and parcel of perhaps my makeup is to be resilient. who do i turn to? i turn to friends and family and i take a break. i take a breather. although normally not very long a breather because i get too excited by other things, but i fill my life with the things that are really positive around me. i have a great family around me. i have an extraordinary wife and a son and my parents and friends and i am enriched by that, so that enables me to take the next step. francine: do you think there is a difference being a leader in 2024 to what it was like even in 2010? do leadership for chief executive jobs need to come with more of a sense of purpose and morally leading? robyn: i don't know a different way of doing it then the way i do it, and that is with a sense of purpose for sure. when you speak and you are in charge of an organization, i think it is incumbent upon

leaders to be enthused and to be passionate and be engaged. i think when times are tough, when things are tricky in the world, i think it is important that you know that and that you acknowledge that in your organizations. and we have had some tough times in the world. beyond markets, and the world for people to live their lives. we run global organizations with people who come from places that are now in war zones, or that are too close to borders where there are war zones. where the challenges have been very real post-covid or when issues are being felt materially in politics. and not to acknowledge that i think feels inauthentic. francine: you're in charge of a bigger organization, it is tough

being close to your employees. robyn: yes. francine: how do you do that? robyn: it is about communication, being available and transparent. it is about setting your story out. who are we, what are we, and what are you here to do? how do we do that the best we can? my view is you do it by creating extraordinary and exceptional teams that have a focus that understand the humanity of that, and that that is important. to do that, you need different people. to do that, in the diversity because different people come with different backgrounds and different flavors of their experience of life. it isn't an easy thing to do, it is just a thing we should do. it's tough. francine: also i guess employing people that will say no to you. how much do you think of that? being surrounded by someone who is able to say no, that is not a great idea. robyn: i think it is spread. their excellence needs to be

something i hear. it is less likely -- my executive team might get cross with me, but it is really not the most likely port of people from which the next brilliant ideas going to sprout and germinate. it is going to be other people within the firm. we need to hear that and it is important that i am seen as capable of listening and changing my position. there are times when i am going to be less willing to change my position, having somebody who's going to come from any part of your organization to say hey, i feel this way about this issue and i don't think i am being heard is important. francine: where is robyn grew in five years? robyn: still duracell bunny-ing,. i am the best answer to every battery life. where am i? i hope still dating man group. looking back on the last five

years and thinking how i could do even better. i hope driving things with the same passion and enthusiasm, and i hope with the same brilliant people around me. francine: thank you so much. robyn: you are very welcome, takes for having me. -- thanks for having me. hi, i'm katie, i've lost 110 pounds on golo in just over a year. golo is different than other programs i had been on because i was specifically looking for something that helped with insulin resistance. i had had conversations with my physician indicating that that was probably an issue that i was facing and making it more difficult for me to sustain weight loss. golo has been more sustainable. i can fit it into family life, i can make meals that the whole family will enjoy. it just works in everyday life as a mom. her uncle's unhappy.

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