we heard for it to get under way. we heard from advisers to the government last week, didn't we?— week, didn't we? that's right, we had a week _ week, didn't we? that's right, we had a week of _ week, didn't we? that's right, we had a week of scientific _ week, didn't we? that's right, we had a week of scientific evidence, i had a week of scientific evidence, if you like, last week, sir patrick vallance, the former chief scientific adviser, professor sir chris whitty, still the chief medical officer, and we had quite a lot from medical officer, and we had quite a lot from them, medical officer, and we had quite a lot from them, really, medical officer, and we had quite a lot from them, really, about medical officer, and we had quite a lot from them, really, about some key aspects of whether the science was listened to, was followed and the extent to which perhaps the government as politicians lent into the idea of saying they were following the science. saying they did not really like the phrase, that the government was following the science, hinting may be that the government should have been following a greater level of input, business, economic impacts as well, putting it all together, rather than just saying they were following the science. we also heard during last week that there were claims that

rishi sunak, now prime minister, then chancellor, had launched the eat out to help out scheme to get people back into restaurants and pubs over that first summer of covid in 2020. but he had not consulted them before launching that. clearly, they made it clear, they took something of a dim view of that. that was last week, that was the science, this week we are back with the politicians. today, starting this morning with sadiq khan, mayor of london, and we also have mayors from the north—west of england, steve rotherham, liverpool, greater manchester, andy burnham, couple of elements there, remember, there were restrictions brought in on a hot dry basis initially in the autumn of 2020 to effectively try to play wacko mole as hotspots popped up. that then gave way to a more structured tiers system which was supposed to solve some of the regularities and standardise the procedure across the country. i suspect we will get into a lot of

that, plus other questions like sadiq khan in his written evidence, some of which has emerged already submitted to this inquiry, has spoken about the fact he wasn't invited to some of the key meetings, the cobra emergency meetings, early in the pandemic, given the outbraked in the pandemic, given the outbraked in london he felt he should have, i suspect we will be getting into some of that with the evidence this morning. 3 of that with the evidence this morninu. �* , ., of that with the evidence this morninu. �* , . ., , morning. a big name that we will be heafina morning. a big name that we will be hearing from — morning. a big name that we will be hearing from later _ morning. a big name that we will be hearing from later in _ morning. a big name that we will be hearing from later in the _ morning. a big name that we will be hearing from later in the week- morning. a big name that we will be hearing from later in the week is - hearing from later in the week is the former health secretary matt hancock, we have heard a lot about him, not least from dominic cummings, who was chief adviser to borisjohnson at the time, that is going to be really critical to this inquiry, what matt hancock has to say? inquiry, what matt hancock has to sa ? ., �* , �* inquiry, what matt hancock has to sa ? . �* , ~ ., ., inquiry, what matt hancock has to sa? ,., say? that's right. a lot of those who given _ say? that's right. a lot of those who given evidence _ say? that's right. a lot of those who given evidence have - say? that's right. a lot of those - who given evidence have mentioned matt hancock, who was health secretary, mentioned his role throughout the pandemic. last week we heard some of the scientists talking in terms of perhaps he might have been overenthusiastic in terms of presenting things to meetings early on, that maybe he should not

have a mother has been criticism from the likes of dominic cummings, the former chief adviser to boris johnson, as prime minister, who has questioned both within and without of the inquiry, whether matt hancock should have kept hisjob. he is scheduled for the best part of a day and a half of evidence, obviously a crucial, key role during the pandemic being the health secretary, until the point that he lost his job over a breach of covid rules. but before that of course we will also have the likes of the former deputy prime minister dominic raab. we heard actually last week that when heard actually last week that when he had to step into the breach to run meetings when borisjohnson became seriously ill with covid, the meetings were run better, more efficiently. so that i am sure will be explored to some x8, too. tomorrow we have michael gove who of course runs the cabinet office, a key role in integrating all sorts of parts of government to ensure smooth running of the way things go across different departments. so, each of

them, key people at the heart of government during the time of the pandemic. government during the time of the andemic. ., ~ , ., government during the time of the andemic. ., ~' , ., ., government during the time of the andemic. ., ~ , ., ., ., government during the time of the andemic. ., ~ ., ., pandemic. thank you for that, matt. we can no pandemic. thank you for that, matt. we can go straight _ pandemic. thank you for that, matt. we can go straight to _ pandemic. thank you for that, matt. we can go straight to the _ pandemic. thank you for that, matt. we can go straight to the inquiry - we can go straight to the inquiry now, the mayor of london, sadiq khan, has been sworn in and is about to give his evidence. mi? khan, has been sworn in and is about to give his evidence.— to give his evidence. mp for tooting between 2005 _ to give his evidence. mp for tooting between 2005 and _ to give his evidence. mp for tooting between 2005 and 2016. _ to give his evidence. mp for tooting between 2005 and 2016. that's - to give his evidence. mp for tooting l between 2005 and 2016. that's right. and within _ between 2005 and 2016. that's right. and within that period you understood various ministerial, government roles between 2008 and 2010? _ government roles between 2008 and 2010? �* i: i: government roles between 2008 and 2010? �* z: z: ., if z: government roles between 2008 and 2010? �* :: :: ., ::' :: , ., 2010? between 2007 and 2010, yeah. thank ou 2010? between 2007 and 2010, yeah. thank you and — 2010? between 2007 and 2010, yeah. thank you and then _ 2010? between 2007 and 2010, yeah. thank you and then after _ 2010? between 2007 and 2010, yeah. thank you and then after the - 2010? between 2007 and 2010, yeah. thank you and then after the 2010 - thank you and then after the 2010 election— thank you and then after the 2010 election you had various shadow ministerial roles in opposition until— ministerial roles in opposition until you _ ministerial roles in opposition until you left parliament in 2016, and that— until you left parliament in 2016, and that was the year on which you were _ and that was the year on which you were first _ and that was the year on which you were first elected the mayor of london. — were first elected the mayor of london, and you're currently serving your second — london, and you're currently serving your second term in that post. thai's— your second term in that post. that's right douglas it's obvious from that phrenology that you were the mayor of london throughout the period of the pandemic of the

pandemic 2020—2022, and that is of course to be the focus of our questions this morning. before we move to the _ questions this morning. before we move to the events _ questions this morning. before we move to the events of _ questions this morning. before we move to the events of the - questions this morning. before we i move to the events of the pandemic, mr carney, _ move to the events of the pandemic, mr carney, i— move to the events of the pandemic, mr carney, i would like to ask you a few questions about the role of the mayor— few questions about the role of the mayor of— few questions about the role of the mayor of london, the powers, what the job— mayor of london, the powers, what the job entails and so on. and of course, — the job entails and so on. and of course, the _ the job entails and so on. and of course, the mayor of london is the senior— course, the mayor of london is the senior elected politician with territorial responsibility for london. _ territorial responsibility for london, and on our ready reckoner, we think— london, and on our ready reckoner, we think that — london, and on our ready reckoner, we think that there are something like 9 _ we think that there are something like 9 million people within the area _ like 9 million people within the area for— like 9 million people within the area for which you have responsibility, is that right? that's— responsibility, is that right? that's right. in london there are more than 9 million people who live and during the normal working day more than 10 billion come to london as tourists and visitors and workers and so forth. fiend as tourists and visitors and workers and so forth-—

and so forth. and using another ratio, that _ and so forth. and using another ratio, that 9 _ and so forth. and using another ratio, that 9 million _ and so forth. and using another ratio, that 9 million people - and so forth. and using another - ratio, that 9 million people equates to something like 13% of the uk population. to something like 1396 of the uk population-— to something like 1396 of the uk population._ let's i to something like 1396 of the uk i population._ let's look population. that's right. let's look at our population. that's right. let's look at your statement _ population. that's right. let's look at your statement at _ population. that's right. let's look at your statement at paragraph - population. that's right. let's look at your statement at paragraph 14| at your statement at paragraph 14 which is on page three, please. it is here that you give us a detailed explanation of the role and powers of the mayor. and we are not going to go into all of that detail but let's just try and summarise the position. as you state here, the powers of the mayor, in fact the mayoralty itself, is established is it not by the greater london authority act of 1999.- it not by the greater london authority act of 1999. that's right. and the act _ authority act of 1999. that's right. and the act creates _ authority act of 1999. that's right. and the act creates and _ authority act of 1999. that's right. and the act creates and then describes the powers of this institution called the greater london authority, which itself is formed of the mayor and the assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah. assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah- mayor— assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah. mayor has, _ assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah. mayor has, as _ assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah. mayor has, as we - assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah. mayor has, as we will - assembly, is that a fair summary? it is, yeah. mayor has, as we will see. is, yeah. mayor has, as we will see in a moment. _ is, yeah. mayor has, as we will see in a moment, some _ is, yeah. mayor has, as we will see in a moment, some strategic - is, yeah. mayor has, as we will see i in a moment, some strategic powers,

as well as other duties, and the principal role of the assembly is to hold the mayor to account. correct. if we look hold the mayor to account. correct. if we look at _ hold the mayor to account. correct. if we look at paragraph _ hold the mayor to account. correct. if we look at paragraph 15, - hold the mayor to account. correct. if we look at paragraph 15, and - hold the mayor to account. correct. | if we look at paragraph 15, and then we will go over the page in a moment to paragraph 16, we see that the power under section 30 of the act allows the mayor in the words of your statement to do anything which furthers one of its so—called principal purposes, which are then described as promoting economic development, wealth creation, social development, wealth creation, social develop man or the improvement of the environment in greater london. so, high—level powers, high—level purposes. and then, as you go onto make the point under section 31, that the act under that section expressly prevents the authority, the mayor, from providing any health or social services which could be

provided by a london borough council orany provided by a london borough council or any other public body. and just going on to paragraph 16, you make the point that the authority is there for limited to carrying out there for limited to carrying out the functions expressly conferred on it and that it is a strategic authority, quite different from, for example, the local authorities in london who have responsibility for the delivery of services. so, is it then, mr khan, a fair summary that then, mr khan, a fair summary that the role of the mayor is to perform these high—level, strategic functions rather than operational decisions which are more, which are the preserve, in london, of borough councils and other bodies? it is. councils and other bodies? it is, but it brings _ councils and other bodies? it is, but it brings with _ councils and other bodies? it is, but it brings with it _ councils and other bodies? it is, but it brings with it huge - but it brings with it huge convenient powers, so i do work very closely with those authorities that you're talking about. yes. closely with those authorities that you're talking about.— you're talking about. yes, and we will come to _ you're talking about. yes, and we will come to see, _ you're talking about. yes, and we will come to see, in _ you're talking about. yes, and we will come to see, in terms - you're talking about. yes, and we will come to see, in terms of - you're talking about. yes, and we will come to see, in terms of the | will come to see, in terms of the role of the mayors in an emergency

that that is a rather good description, it's about convening other people more than actually performing executive functions yourself. performing executive functions ourself. , performing executive functions yourself.- and - performing executive functions yourself.- and if - performing executive functions yourself.- and if we - performing executive functions | yourself.- and if we just yourself. exactly. and if we 'ust think aboutfi yourself. exactly. and if we 'ust think about the i yourself. exactly. and if we 'ust think about the pandemic, h yourself. exactly. and if wejust think about the pandemic, and l yourself. exactly. and if we just i think about the pandemic, and the npis that were adopted during the pandemic, we think, for example, of ordering people to stay at home, closing schools, closing hospitality venues and so on, these were not executive decisions for you to take during that time, where they? titer;r during that time, where they? they weren't. there _ during that time, where they? they weren't. there are _ during that time, where they? they weren't. there are some _ during that time, where they? tie: weren't. there are some pieces of legislation which we welcome too, i'm sure, the civil contingencies act, which states basically that the mayor is the voice of london, and so in civil emergencies he or she has an important role in being that voice, particularly when it comes to message carrying, for londoners to know what to do.— know what to do. china 'ust to be clear, i know what to do. china 'ust to be ceenl i am — know what to do. china 'ust to be clear, i am certainly _ know what to do. china just to be clear, i am certainly going - know what to do. china just to be clear, i am certainly going to - know what to do. china just to be | clear, i am certainly going to come to the civil contingencies act and that sort of facilitative role and you're absolutely right, in your statement, you used the term being

the voice of london, butjust to be clear, it is white isn't it that it wasn't actually your role to make those exact if decisions, closing schools... those exact if decisions, closing schools- - -_ those exact if decisions, closing schools. . .- ordering - those exact if decisions, closing - schools. . .- ordering people schools... correct. ordering people to sta at schools... correct. ordering people to stay at home. — schools... correct. ordering people to stay at home, and _ schools... correct. ordering people to stay at home, and all _ schools... correct. ordering people to stay at home, and all that. - to stay at home, and all that. correct. �* , , , ,, to stay at home, and all that. correct. , ,,, i. ,, correct. and as you say, with that in mind, the _ correct. and as you say, with that in mind, the mayor— correct. and as you say, with that in mind, the mayor does - correct. and as you say, with that in mind, the mayor does have - in mind, the mayor does have responsibility is, in an emergency, as what is known as a category one responder under the civil contingency that, that is a point you make, if we look at paragraph 19 of your statement, on page four. that's right, yeah. fiend of your statement, on page four. that's right, yeah.— that's right, yeah. and your statement _ that's right, yeah. and your statement then _ that's right, yeah. and your statement then goes - that's right, yeah. and your statement then goes on - that's right, yeah. and your statement then goes on to l that's right, yeah. and your - statement then goes on to provide some very useful detail about all of the different bodies that were established in order to perform your role and the role of the authority more generally in that civil contingencies context. that's right. and atain, contingencies context. that's right. and again, l'm _

contingencies context. that's right. and again, i'm not— contingencies context. that's right. and again, i'm not going _ contingencies context. that's right. and again, i'm not going to - contingencies context. that's right. and again, i'm not going to go - contingencies context. that's right. and again, i'm not going to go into | and again, i'm not going to go into all that in as much detail as there is in the statement, but shall we try and identify the critical parts of it? and if we go on to paragraph 20, we see there you refer to the gla being a member of something called the london resilience forum. and reading on in that paragraph, this london resilience forum you describe as being the vehicle required by statute to facilitate the co—operation of statutory responders in london. so, it's the high—level body performing that sort of bringing together, facilitative role. and you say in the next sentence that fiona trott across chaired the london resilience forum on your behalf. i think it is right, isn't it, that you have a sort of power or a duty either to chair that forum yourself or to nominate someone to do that, is that the position?

someone to do that, is that the osition? , �* , someone to do that, is that the osition? ,, �* , h, someone to do that, is that the osition? ,, �*, ,, ,, , position? that's right, so, fiona is the deputy — position? that's right, so, fiona is the deputy mayor _ position? that's right, so, fiona is the deputy mayor fourie _ position? that's right, so, fiona is| the deputy mayor fourie resilience, and i asked her in 2016 a month after i became mayor to chair the london resilience forum because obviously there is work to do not just in times of civil emergency but in other times as well.— just in times of civil emergency but in other times as well. yeah, so, as we will see. — in other times as well. yeah, so, as we will see, some _ in other times as well. yeah, so, as we will see, some of _ in other times as well. yeah, so, as we will see, some of these - we will see, some of these committees and groups that were operational during the pandemic had existed previously sometimes in peacetime, others were brought into being to perform a specific role during the pandemic, and the london resilience forum was one of those thatis resilience forum was one of those that is always sitting, it is always considering matters, and so, did you considering matters, and so, did you consider through taking over the chairmanship of the london resilience forum during the pandemic or not? this resilience forum during the pandemic or not? �* , , resilience forum during the pandemic or not? a , ,,, resilience forum during the pandemic ornot? m . , or not? as far as the lrf is concerned. _ or not? as far as the lrf is concerned, we _ or not? as far as the lrf is concerned, we appointed i

or not? as far as the lrf is concerned, we appointed a| or not? as far as the lrf is - concerned, we appointed a number or not? as far as the lrf is _ concerned, we appointed a number of co—chairs to work with fiona twycross, performing different roles, but i should explain, there is different furniture to do with different pieces of work. so, there is a strategic coordination committee, there is a london resilience protocol partnership, and so, a number of different chat, i chaired some of them and for continuity, fiona and others chaired others. 50 continuity, fiona and others chaired others. , ,, ,, continuity, fiona and others chaired others. ,, , others. so you did not become the chair of the _ others. so you did not become the chair of the london _ others. so you did not become the chair of the london resilience - others. so you did not become the i chair of the london resilience forum but you worked very closely with it and as you have said there are a number of other groups working alongside it. if we can go down to the next, please. if we look at paragraph 22. there is a reference to another of these groups which i think you mentioned a moment ago, the strategic coordination group, is this one of these groups which did not exist or at least was not up and running during peace time but which became operational during the

pandemic?— became operational during the andemic? ,, �*, ,, pandemic? that's right. so, on the 2nd of march. _ pandemic? that's right. so, on the 2nd of march, i _ pandemic? that's right. so, on the 2nd of march, i chaired _ pandemic? that's right. so, on the 2nd of march, i chaired a _ pandemic? that's right. so, on the 2nd of march, i chaired a mayor's l 2nd of march, i chaired a mayor's advisory group and we decided to do advisory group and we decided to do a number of things coming from our concerns from the media about the pandemic arriving, and this was one of the things that we set up. 50. of the things that we set up. so, that is the _ of the things that we setup. so, that is the strategic to ordination group, and we see in paragraph 22 the description of its role is, really the implementation of plans, would that be including the implementation of plans designed by the resilience forum?— the resilience forum? exact. so, it's the operational _ the resilience forum? exact. so, it's the operational arm - the resilience forum? exact. so, it's the operational arm of - the resilience forum? exact. so, it's the operational arm of that i it's the operational arm of that organisation? and in this case, specifically to do with coronavirus, rather than other issues that the forum has to deal with. stand rather than other issues that the forum has to deal with. and final oint on forum has to deal with. and final point on this, — forum has to deal with. and final point on this, we _ forum has to deal with. and final point on this, we can _ forum has to deal with. and final point on this, we can see - forum has to deal with. and final point on this, we can see in - forum has to deal with. and final point on this, we can see in this| point on this, we can see in this paragraph that the strrategic

co—ordination group measures its work against something called the strategic coordination protocol, again, was that a covert specific document or had it been designed before the pandemic? the programme had been designed _ before the pandemic? the programme had been designed before, _ before the pandemic? the programme had been designed before, the - had been designed before, the strategy regarding your relation to the governance, but the strrategic co—ordination group was set up because of coronavirus using the protocol as a basis of who should be on this and so forth. stand protocol as a basis of who should be on this and so forth.— on this and so forth. and so we are ttettin a on this and so forth. and so we are getting a picture — on this and so forth. and so we are getting a picture of— on this and so forth. and so we are getting a picture of this _ on this and so forth. and so we are getting a picture of this sort - getting a picture of this sort of network, hierarchy, of organisations, some of which were there all along, some of which were brought in to be in for the sake of the pandemic. you were very much involved one way or another in this system. and if we can look at paragraph 25, please, which is over the page, on page six, this is i think a the page, on page six, this is i thinka summary the page, on page six, this is i think a summary of this description, and picking it up four lines down, you say, and this is where we come

back to your point about the voice, you say, my role is to support the operational response to an emergency in london by providing a unified statement of information guidance acting as a voice for london. with that in mind, can you expand on your role in all of this structure of various committees and forums? 50. various committees and forums? so, to exlain, various committees and forums? so, to exolain. so, _ various committees and forums? 6r>, to explain, so, there are certain functional bodies i am in charge of, the police by the fire service, the transport system, there are others i'm not in charge of. this multiagency approach means that we can work together in a collegiate way, and that includes working with the councils, we got 32 councils in london plus the city of london corporation, cross—party, working incredibly collegiate lee, and i am essentially the chair, working really closely with colleagues. it means that we can pass on messages from the government, and i am deemed to be appointed with generally

speaking the voice of london, but also when we reach a decision i can channel it up to the government as well, so it is a two—way process being the voice, advocate, for london but also downwards from government down to london as well. we will come to see as we look at some of the documents and notes of meetings and so on that you were very much advocating, if you like, lobbying, government during the period of the pandemic, for them to take action that you regarded as being in london's interests, was that also part of this role? yeah, so, a lot of— that also part of this role? yeah, so, a lot of the _ that also part of this role? yeah, so, a lot of the information - that also part of this role? yeah, so, a lot of the information we i that also part of this role? yeah, i so, a lot of the information we had was from open source data, reading the newspapers, watching the news, and colleagues doing the same, and so, we decided to set up the strrategic co—ordination group in advance of any information from the government. i was writing to the government, we were contacting the government, we were contacting the government asking for information,

it was not coming january, february, first half of march, but notwithstanding, that is unusual, by the way, i can give examples of other emergencies where it hasn't happened, there has been co—operation, but in this case, we were doing this, getting the furniture set up, the architecture set up, because of legislation but also our experience from previous years, we knew this may be useful. let me just ask you about your experience of other emergencies, i think it's obvious that this particular emergency was unlike anything certainly anyone had come across before in their own career. but of course you had been involved in other emergencies both during your time as mayor and before that in government. as far as your time as the mayor is concerned, the grenfell tower disaster took place while you were mayor, and in the same year there were also the terrorist attacks at westminster and london bridge. we're going to come

to talk about cobra in the context of covid, but it's right, isn't it, that you had experience of cobra in those emergencies as well? there's nothin: those emergencies as well? there's nothing magic _ those emergencies as well? there's nothing magic about _ those emergencies as well? there's nothing magic about cobra, - those emergencies as well? there's nothing magic about cobra, it's - those emergencies as well? there's nothing magic about cobra, it'sjust| nothing magic about cobra, it's just the room where we meet, but cobra is really important, i was a minister when gordon brown was prime minister, on a couple of occasions, cobras were called and i was invited to an incredibly collegiate environment. when theresa may was prime minister in 2017, a number of cobras i was invited to to do with the terrorist attacks in london, to do with grenfell, it is a really useful forum for colleagues to come together, politicians, experts in their own field, people from different parts of the country, to provide their expertise, to discuss their ideas, and the chair, the prime minister, makes a decision. in fact post by demi emma willis trust was prior minister, i again attended cobras to do with operation london bridge.

cobras to do with operation london bride. , ,,, cobras to do with operation london bridte. . ., .,, . ., cobras to do with operation london bride. ,, ,, ,, ,, bridge. that was the operation that followed the _ bridge. that was the operation that followed the death _ bridge. that was the operation that followed the death of— bridge. that was the operation that followed the death of the _ bridge. that was the operation that followed the death of the queen. i bridge. that was the operation that i followed the death of the queen. the death of followed the death of the queen. ti2 death of her majesty cobbler you are going to say? because a lot of these things require coordination and working together, at the very least you can provide coalface experience, you can provide coalface experience, you can provide coalface experience, you can feed into the decision—makers, the prime minister in particular, but also you can... as the voice of london, with confidence you can explain to londoners what they should and should not be doing. so, cobra, in the past, and since, has worked incredibly well as of this place to discuss various responses, to prepare for civil emergencies. let’s prepare for civil emergencies. let's turn, prepare for civil emergencies. let's turn. then. — prepare for civil emergencies. let's turn, then, strrategic _ prepare for civil emergencies. let's turn, then, strrategic co—ordination group, to 2020, and initially your developing understanding of the pandemic. in your witness statement by mr khan, you say that you

offcourse initially gained an understanding injanuary simply, as with the rest of us, hearing about it on the news and so on. and it was late january, the 23rd of january, you give a description of a question time event that you were conducting in london and you actually, this was the first time you received a detailed briefing from your staff about covid, is that right? it is. about covid, is that right? it is, but i about covid, is that right? it is, but i should _ about covid, is that right? it is, but i should just _ about covid, is that right? it is, but i should just say, _ about covid, is that right? it is, but i should just say, my - about covid, is that right? it is, but i should just say, my staff's knowledge of this was from open source data, from newspapers, from world wide web and so forth. it wasn't from a briefing from the government. but at people's question time a member of the public had asked me about covid and my response was, to that question asked by members of the public, and so my knowledge was limited but it was being discussed clearly because it was raised at people's question time. , ,., ., was raised at people's question time. , ., ., time. yes, so that was your own ersonal time. yes, so that was your own personal knowledge _ time. yes, so that was your own personal knowledge and - time. yes, so that was your own personal knowledge and that - time. yes, so that was your own | personal knowledge and that was time. yes, so that was your own - personal knowledge and that was an occasion where you were briefed. the

london resilience forum, which we have already mentioned, was right from the start analysing the ongoing position, is that right?— position, is that right? that's ritht. position, is that right? that's right- again, _ position, is that right? that's right. again, the _ position, is that right? that's right. again, the job - position, is that right? that's right. again, the job of - position, is that right? that's right. again, the job of the i position, is that right? that's - right. again, the job of the london right. again, thejob of the london resilience forum is to prepare for any emergency, it could be worried about flash flooding, it could be about flash flooding, it could be about this, and so they again, using open source data, had realised this may be an issue, and to their credit, in february, they have started doing work to look into this virus. �* , , ., started doing work to look into this virus. �*, , ., ., ., virus. let's 'ust go to paragraph 59, if we virus. let'sjust go to paragraph 59. if we may. _ virus. let'sjust go to paragraph 59, if we may, on _ virus. let'sjust go to paragraph 59, if we may, on page - virus. let'sjust go to paragraph 59, if we may, on page 49. - virus. let'sjust go to paragraphj 59, if we may, on page 49. this picks up on the point you have been making, mr khan, and you say we, and itake it that you making, mr khan, and you say we, and i take it that you mean corporately, you, your office, the greater london authority, where heavily reliant on the information coming from poor plant at phe at this time, and again i think at this time, you mean early february, judging by the sequence of

events in your witness statement, as we were not receiving any information directly from government. first of all can you tell us please who paul plant was at the time? ,, ., ., the time? sure. so, one of the statutory _ the time? sure. so, one of the statutory requirements, - the time? sure. so, one of the| statutory requirements, duties, the time? sure. so, one of the i statutory requirements, duties, of the mayor, is to address health inequalities, and i have a statutory health advisor, but paul plant at the time, who works for public health england. it tends to be the regional director for london phe as it was known then who advises me in relation to health inequalities, and paul was a person who i would meet regularly to discuss a variety of issues. 50 regularly to discuss a variety of issues. , ., , regularly to discuss a variety of issues. , ., . ,, regularly to discuss a variety of issues. , ., ., , issues. so 'ust going back to this issues. so just going back to this sentence, paul— issues. so just going back to this sentence, paul plant _ issues. so just going back to this sentence, paul plant was - issues. so just going back to this| sentence, paul plant was himself issues. so just going back to this i sentence, paul plant was himself i think one of the directors of the phe. ., . think one of the directors of the phe-- what _ think one of the directors of the phe.- what is— think one of the directors of the phe.- what is wrong - think one of the directors of the l phe.- what is wrong with phe. correct. what is wrong with receivin: phe. correct. what is wrong with receiving information _ phe. correct. what is wrong with receiving information about - phe. correct. what is wrong with receiving information about a - receiving information about a developing infectious virus from phe, which was the very body that was supposed to monitor these things? was supposed to monitor these thin . s? ., ., was supposed to monitor these thins? ., ., ., ., things? nothing wrong at all, in fact i was asking _ things? nothing wrong at all, in fact i was asking paul _ things? nothing wrong at all, in fact i was asking paul about - things? nothing wrong at all, inj fact i was asking paul about this virus we had heard of, you will see,

i think we have disclosed to the agenda where this was discussed, it was one of a variety of issues that we discussed at phe. the point is in relation to, directly from government, you talked about the responsibility i have from the civil contingencies act, the greater london act, and bearing in mind what was to transpire, you would have expected the government speaking to me, by government, i mean, sensibly, downing street, because we now know in february, there were cobra meetings taking place, we knew nothing about these, and probably paul plant didn't, either, because it is above his pay grade. the point being that we are a capital city, we know what happened, had we been aware of some of the things that the government were concerned about in february or march, we could have taken preventative action. 50. february or march, we could have taken preventative action.- taken preventative action. so, to summarise, _ taken preventative action. so, to summarise, to _ taken preventative action. so, to summarise, to make _ taken preventative action. so, to summarise, to make sure - taken preventative action. so, to summarise, to make sure we'vel summarise, to make sure we've understood, phe, one of their functions, was to inform local authorities, like you and no doubt around the country, of their developing understanding of the

virus. i think what you're saying is that there would have come a time where, judging by the severity of the virus, the concerns about what may happen, you would have expected, in parallel to your exchanges with phe, to have started being briefed by central government, you say downing street come about that, as we welcome to see, did not happen at that time or in fact for some time later? ~ , ,., , that time or in fact for some time later?_ are _ that time or in fact for some time later?_ are you - that time or in fact for some time later?_ are you saying j later? absolutely. are you saying that on the _ later? absolutely. are you saying that on the basis _ later? absolutely. are you saying that on the basis of— later? absolutely. are you saying that on the basis of any _ later? absolutely. are you saying i that on the basis of any experience or on the basis of hindsight or simply a feeling you had at the time? ~ ., , ., time? well, without wishing to breach confidences, _ time? well, without wishing to breach confidences, for - time? well, without wishing to i breach confidences, for example, time? well, without wishing to - breach confidences, for example, we were in close contact with the government in advance of operation london bridge going live, i don't want it to be delicate, but so there are often conversations with the government about things in advance of them becoming, of having to press go on issues, and so that sort of stuff does happen, it can be off—line conversations, it can be

direct communications with me and my office. we were chasing the government for information i have shared correspondence with me writing to the government saying, we have heard about this thing happening, what we do? it i have heard about this thing happening, what we do? ifi can 'ust ask ou to happening, what we do? ifi can 'ust ask you to try — happening, what we do? ifi can 'ust askyou to try and i happening, what we do? ifi can 'ust ask you to try and slowi happening, what we do? ifi can 'ust ask you to try and slow down i happening, what we do? ifi can 'ust ask you to try and slow down a h ask you to try and slow down a little when you're answering questions. mr khan, where you chasing the government this early, in early february? we will come to see some of the exchange a few weeks later, in late february and march, and perhaps you didn't realise how serious the position was becoming at this stage? h0. serious the position was becoming at this state? ., , ., , �* this stage? no, in february i wasn't chasint this stage? no, in february i wasn't chasing the — this stage? no, in february i wasn't chasing the government, _ this stage? no, in february i wasn't chasing the government, i - this stage? no, in february i wasn't chasing the government, i wasn't i chasing the government, i wasn't aware how serious it was. 50. chasing the government, i wasn't aware how serious it was.- chasing the government, i wasn't aware how serious it was. so, to the extent you're _ aware how serious it was. so, to the extent you're criticising _ aware how serious it was. so, to the extent you're criticising the - extent you're criticising the government for not contacting you earlier, that is something, and observation you are making perhaps with hindsight, with that be fair? ., the government generally does give us information about a variety of things happening. i'm disappointed for common word giving us information in february about what they knew then courtney nevin what

you know now? knowing what we all know now, yeah. fiend you know now? knowing what we all know now. yeah-— know now, yeah. and of course it de-ends know now, yeah. and of course it depends on _ know now, yeah. and of course it depends on what _ know now, yeah. and of course it depends on what they _ know now, yeah. and of course it depends on what they knew - know now, yeah. and of course it | depends on what they knew then? know now, yeah. and of course it - depends on what they knew then? what i would sa depends on what they knew then? what i would say milady _ depends on what they knew then? i�*e'd�*ué�*if i would say milady is that depends on what they knew then? matt i would say milady is that we depends on what they knew then? m"isgt i would say milady is that we are talking about february and march, early march in particular, we were in contact with other cities around the globe, so we have not got a foreign office in city hall but we were speaking to mayors, i was speaking to them mayor of milan, we were speaking to colleagues in seoul, the mayor of seoul, and colleagues in china, from early march in advance of any information from the government. now, my international relations team is i think three people. i would have hoped that foreign office was speaking to colleagues in china or south korea or italy. we were, in late february, early march. moving onto march. _ late february, early march. moving onto march. l _ late february, early march. moving onto march, i think _ late february, early march. moving onto march, i think mr— late february, early march. moving onto march, i think mr o'connor. late february, early march. moving onto march, i think mr o'connor at| onto march, i think mr o'connor at the moment was dealing with february. the moment was dealing with februa . , �* , ., the moment was dealing with februa . , �*, ., ., ~ february. yes, let's move on, mr khan, february. yes, let's move on, mr khan. because — february. yes, let's move on, mr khan, because the _ february. yes, let's move on, mr khan, because the paragraph - february. yes, let's move on, mr khan, because the paragraph we| february. yes, let's move on, mr - khan, because the paragraph we were looking at was i think located in early february, but let's move forward a few weeks to the period

around the end of february and the beginning of march. as you say, there had been a number of cobra meetings during february, to which you had not been invited. we come then to friday 28th february and a request we know was made on that day for you to attend a cobra meeting that was due to take place at the beginning of the next week, on the 2nd of march, the monday. and we can for these purposes just look at an e—mail exchange, this is 11—89 97. and we see here sort of... of the lower half of this page, an e—mail being sent from someone in your office, whose name has been redacted, too, ithink office, whose name has been redacted, too, i think it is claire... claire brunton, in no 10. it says this... the mayor's chief of staff has asked whether on the weather intend to invite the mayor to the cobra meeting regarding

coronavirus on monday, that is the 2nd of march, given its large number of airports, hospitals and international visitors, london is of course potentially one of the most at risk places. and i am going to come back to that. butjust to finish off with this e—mail. we can see that in fact on the same day, on the friday, later on in the evening, the friday, later on in the evening, the reply comes back, no, spoken to those leading, the mayor will not be invited to the cobra on just going back to your e—mail, the proposition is london is one of the places most at risk because of its airports, airports and international visitors. that, of course, had been true since the beginning of the virus. did sending this e—mail on

this day reflect some sort of developing understanding on your part or not? the developing understanding on your part or not?— part or not? the conversation we were having. _ part or not? the conversation we were having, open _ part or not? the conversation we were having, open source - part or not? the conversation we were having, open source data i part or not? the conversation we - were having, open source data showed the troubles of the borough, we knew what was happening in northern italy, we knew it was half term and london has a number of airports. heathrow, gatwick, stansted and so forth, i wouldn't be surprised if london was the first place this virus came to. i was dealing with that in real time without the benefit of hindsight. it appears to me, if we knew this in city hall, we had at our disposal the expertise of the government, why didn't they? if we move on a week, we will see that something similar happened a week later. if we could go to 119